I called Nikon USA for firmware updating Z7 II custom controls

monte12345

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Feature list. Not having the release setting assignable to the front function buttons is flat out STUPID. At present we have to press and hold the rear button while turning the command dial, a task that I simply cannot do with the camera at my eye in shooting position. I suspect that lack of ability is common for those of us with only two hands.

That lead me into considering the feature lists for the custom controls on the Z7 II, compared to my Zf they are quite limited and compared to the Z5II or Z50II they are even more limited. So I asked that Nikon do a Firmware Update to bring the Custom Controls Feature lists up to date with the newer Expeed 7 models. This has not effect on the CPU as it's a simple program addition so it is something that can be addressed with Firmware if enough of us ask for it. Point here is we need to actually get on the phone and ask for it.

My second request was that the Pinpoint AF setting be made available in the AF-C mode. Because those of us wise enough to use Back Button Focus do use the AF ON button for Single Focus grabs.

The third point of discussion is the Z7 III. I pointed out that the Z7 II is currently the ONLY two thousand dollar 40mp plus camera on the market and is currently drawing new users who want a high megapixel camera. Sony, Canon, Fuji, Olympus, and Panasonic don't offer anything that can match this profile. I also pointed out that 46mp has enough resolution to produce tack sharp 6 x 9 FOOT prints so there really isn't a need for more megapixels and the current sensor has a wider Dynamic Range than the Z8 or Z9. Where it is lacking is in AF capabilities and subject tracking feaures which is CPU related. Logic leads to the conclusion that the only thing the Z7 III needs to have is the Expeed 7 CPU's. This could be a simple "board change" and if so producing a new Z7 II would require only minor product line change and would also make it possible to offer an upgrade of the current camera to the Z7 III configuration for a fee. This would allow the Z7 III to retain the current market position and I am pretty certain current Z7 II owners would be quite willing to pay 600-800 dollars to upgrade their camera to the Z7 III profile. Anyone who agrees to this should get on the phone and ask for it.
 
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Feature list. Not having the release setting assignable to the front function buttons is flat out STUPID. At present we have to press and hold the rear button while turning the command dial, a task that I simply cannot do with the camera at my eye in shooting position. I suspect that lack of ability is common for those of us with only two hands.
Does f6 Release Button to Use Dial not resolve the hold and turn issue for you?


Not to mention making full use of User Modes to avoid fiddling around. Mentioning what settings you're having trouble changing would help. The Z7II was a bit of an improvement compared to the Z7, and the latest releases (Z6III/Z5II/Z50II) sure are knocking it out of the park with the layout and similar features.
That lead me into considering the feature lists for the custom controls on the Z7 II, compared to my Zf they are quite limited and compared to the Z5II or Z50II they are even more limited. So I asked that Nikon do a Firmware Update to bring the Custom Controls Feature lists up to date with the newer Expeed 7 models. This has not effect on the CPU as it's a simple program addition so it is something that can be addressed with Firmware if enough of us ask for it. Point here is we need to actually get on the phone and ask for it.
This is the norm these days. The Z8 doesn't even let you assign Fn1 directly to spot focusing yet, and my Z6III is missing cycle-AF and dedicated bird AF. The D5600 and D500 got firmware updates last year, so there's always a chance. The D750 also got a rather substantial update in 2019, especially compared to when I first owned it. They do a much better job with firmware, full stop.
My second request was that the Pinpoint AF setting be made available in the AF-C mode. Because those of us wise enough to use Back Button Focus do use the AF ON button for Single Focus grabs.
Pinpoint is by design a slower focusing system. It would not make sense to couple (hinder) it with AF-C. Why doesn't the single point box (the one I never use and would like to hide) work for you? I also say, let us do it anyway. I would at least like to be able to select it from AF-C and switch to AF-S automatically, now that would be something useful! It is the only AF-S mode I use, and usually with spot focusing.

This is why we need a mode button or replace the "i" menu with custom modes that save every setting. It could even have custom text or the scene/effects modes icons from consumer cameras. So many usability problems would be solved, at least for my needs.
The third point of discussion is the Z7 III. I pointed out that the Z7 II is currently the ONLY two thousand dollar 40mp plus camera on the market and is currently drawing new users who want a high megapixel camera. Sony, Canon, Fuji, Olympus, and Panasonic don't offer anything that can match this profile.
I don't think you can ignore the used market, and Nikon would rather sell the Z8 for $3,000. I'd still be hard pressed to pick a Z7II over a Z8 or Z9 as my primary camera. I used the Z7II for the first year, and was glad I sold it before the Z8 was released. I do think a good 2.x refresh would breath some new life into it.

I plan on buying one after the next high resolution camera release (?ZfR?) drops the used price a bit more. Then again, if it has recall settings or user modes, I could see a ZfR as my primary camera.
I also pointed out that 46mp has enough resolution to produce tack sharp 6 x 9 FOOT prints so there really isn't a need for more megapixels and the current sensor has a wider Dynamic Range than the Z8 or Z9. Where it is lacking is in AF capabilities and subject tracking feaures which is CPU related. Logic leads to the conclusion that the only thing the Z7 III needs to have is the Expeed 7 CPU's. This could be a simple "board change" and if so producing a new Z7 II would require only minor product line change and would also make it possible to offer an upgrade of the current camera to the Z7 III configuration for a fee. This would allow the Z7 III to retain the current market position and I am pretty certain current Z7 II owners would be quite willing to pay 600-800 dollars to upgrade their camera to the Z7 III profile. Anyone who agrees to this should get on the phone and ask for it.
I think you're right, but I just don't see that happening either. There's a reason they just swap out the entire circuit board instead of troubleshooting most gear. It requires much more skilled labor, and that is getting harder and harder to come by these days.

Those firmware engineers should be focusing on the emerging technology now that Nikon has finally caught up.
 
Feature list. Not having the release setting assignable to the front function buttons is flat out STUPID. At present we have to press and hold the rear button while turning the command dial, a task that I simply cannot do with the camera at my eye in shooting position. I suspect that lack of ability is common for those of us with only two hands.
Does f6 Release Button to Use Dial not resolve the hold and turn issue for you?
This is the factory default. If you have a Z7 II then pick the camera up, hold it to your eye and try to push that release button while turning the command dial. Take note, you must hold the camera to your eye and maintain your index finger at the shutter release. Please report back how you accomplished that and be specific on how you did it.
That lead me into considering the feature lists for the custom controls on the Z7 II, compared to my Zf they are quite limited and compared to the Z5II or Z50II they are even more limited. So I asked that Nikon do a Firmware Update to bring the Custom Controls Feature lists up to date with the newer Expeed 7 models. This has not effect on the CPU as it's a simple program addition so it is something that can be addressed with Firmware if enough of us ask for it. Point here is we need to actually get on the phone and ask for it.
This is the norm these days. The Z8 doesn't even let you assign Fn1 directly to spot focusing yet, and my Z6III is missing cycle-AF and dedicated bird AF. The D5600 and D500 got firmware updates last year, so there's always a chance. The D750 also got a rather substantial update in 2019, especially compared to when I first owned it. They do a much better job with firmware, full stop.
I was a Manufacturing Engineer for 42 years until I retired. During that time one of my primary jobs was to always search for areas that could be improved. So I am NOT someone who accepts "the Norm".
My second request was that the Pinpoint AF setting be made available in the AF-C mode. Because those of us wise enough to use Back Button Focus do use the AF ON button for Single Focus grabs.
Pinpoint is by design a slower focusing system. It would not make sense to couple (hinder) it with AF-C. Why doesn't the single point box (the one I never use and would like to hide) work for you? I also say, let us do it anyway. I would at least like to be able to select it from AF-C and switch to AF-S automatically, now that would be something useful! It is the only AF-S mode I use, and usually with spot focusing.
This is why we need a mode button or replace the "i" menu with custom modes that save every setting. It could even have custom text or the scene/effects modes icons from consumer cameras. So many usability problems would be solved, at least for my needs.
You kink of missed that mention of Back Button Focus. I find it odd that you want a camera that switches to AF-S automatically. Because if you use Back Button Focus you have AF-S, AF-C, and Manual Focus simultaneously available all depending on how you use that one single AF ON button. I would suggest you take the time to watch some videos on BBF and then reset your camera for this method of controlling focus and spend two weeks making it a habit. Because once you have that habit built you will never use the standard shutter release for AF and Release because it's just too unwieldy. BTW that AF ON button on your D750 was placed there specifically to provide Back Button Focus.
The third point of discussion is the Z7 III. I pointed out that the Z7 II is currently the ONLY two thousand dollar 40mp plus camera on the market and is currently drawing new users who want a high megapixel camera. Sony, Canon, Fuji, Olympus, and Panasonic don't offer anything that can match this profile.
I don't think you can ignore the used market, and Nikon would rather sell the Z8 for $3,000. I'd still be hard pressed to pick a Z7II over a Z8 or Z9 as my primary camera. I used the Z7II for the first year, and was glad I sold it before the Z8 was released. I do think a good 2.x refresh would breath some new life into it.
You need to study some college level Economics. For many companies "Loss Leaders" are the primary means of bringing new customers into the "fold". By maintaining the Z7 III at an Entry level price Nikon has a means of attracting new users who desire a high resolution camera. This means new users who will be purchasing lenses, perhaps extra cameras, and other gear that has the Nikon brand name on it. It's something that any company needs to do to insure the long term survival of the company. Because human beings do have this nasty habit of "aging out".

As for ignoring the used market, which would you purchase, a used Sony A7R IV with a high "shutter count" for 2000 dollars or brand spanking new Z7 III for 2400 dollars? Take note that the only real difference between the Z7 II and the Z7 III is the upgraded camera has dual Expeed 7 CPU's to insure an extremely responsive AF system and all the Subject modes on the Z8.
I plan on buying one after the next high resolution camera release (?ZfR?) drops the used price a bit more. Then again, if it has recall settings or user modes, I could see a ZfR as my primary camera.
I also pointed out that 46mp has enough resolution to produce tack sharp 6 x 9 FOOT prints so there really isn't a need for more megapixels and the current sensor has a wider Dynamic Range than the Z8 or Z9. Where it is lacking is in AF capabilities and subject tracking feaures which is CPU related. Logic leads to the conclusion that the only thing the Z7 III needs to have is the Expeed 7 CPU's. This could be a simple "board change" and if so producing a new Z7 II would require only minor product line change and would also make it possible to offer an upgrade of the current camera to the Z7 III configuration for a fee. This would allow the Z7 III to retain the current market position and I am pretty certain current Z7 II owners would be quite willing to pay 600-800 dollars to upgrade their camera to the Z7 III profile. Anyone who agrees to this should get on the phone and ask for it.
I think you're right, but I just don't see that happening either. There's a reason they just swap out the entire circuit board instead of troubleshooting most gear. It requires much more skilled labor, and that is getting harder and harder to come by these days.

Those firmware engineers should be focusing on the emerging technology now that Nikon has finally caught up.
They also need to maintain their customer base and having the Z5II with more custom control settings than the flagship Z8 is not a good way to do that. Nikon really does need to spend time insuring uniformity in both features and placement of buttons and controls on the various models. One thing that really shocks me is the placement of the image review button on some of the new models. My D70 had that button positioned at the top of the left side button stack by the rear screen, on the D300 and every Nikon DSLR since that camera it's been top left. Now all of the sudden it's bottom right. IMO whoever made that decision should now be assigned to washing and detailing the Executive cars. Good news is both are assignable so it's easy to correct that oversight but it certainly falls into the "what were they thinking" trash bin.
 
You kink of missed that mention of Back Button Focus. I find it odd that you want a camera that switches to AF-S automatically. Because if you use Back Button Focus you have AF-S, AF-C, and Manual Focus simultaneously available all depending on how you use that one single AF ON button. I would suggest you take the time to watch some videos on BBF and then reset your camera for this method of controlling focus and spend two weeks making it a habit. Because once you have that habit built you will never use the standard shutter release for AF and Release because it's just too unwieldy. BTW that AF ON button on your D750 was placed there specifically to provide Back Button Focus.
Back in 1990 there was no such thing as "back button" focusing, one used the shutter release or focused manually. Six years of that creates muscle memory and is somewhat hard to overcome. Even when the F5 came out the AF On buttons were small and difficult to use, specifically the vertical one. Thus I used shutter button focusing for 15 years before getting a D2 with a decent sized and well placed AF button. However, it wasn't until 2018 that I had both lens and camera that were sufficiently responsive to make continuous AF worthwhile for my purposes. I was still mostly using the shutter button for focusing.

Only when I bought a D5 in 2022 did I find a use for the AF on buttons, I configured the buttons to select Dynamic area AF and AF on. This proved very satisfactory for moving subjects. Unfortunately, I then found I was trying to trigger the shutter with the AF On button. I don't always want dynamic area AF, often I only want single point AF, being able to select those modes simply by pressing different buttons works for me, even if it doesn't work for you. My wife uses the AF on buttons because she has difficulty in holding down the shutter button with her finger but can hold the back button with her thumb.

Best, I think, to explain why BBF works for you and leave it to others to determine what works for them. We don't all work the same way nor do we all want our cameras configured the same.
 
The playback button is on the back bottom right on EVERY other camera, including point and shoots. It is for smoother right-handed operation. I also assign it to lens function buttons because not all of my lenses have buttons, and the focus recall is limited to one orientation, the opposite of what I'd like. I think the FTZ's should have had Fn and Ln buttons on them as well. The best part with the last three bodies, is that you can remap the release and playback buttons back (traditional) the way you want them. I couldn't quite setup the Zf the way I wanted due to limitations.

I really liked turning off image review going mirrorless, but it was also due to the image re-read flicker that was distracting.

Nikon still isn't up to Sony, Canon, or Panasonic customization, as we can't remap the redundant with the joystick (cough not-a-dial) multi-pad, which would essentially be four more Fn buttons. I'm not going to debate the other topis mentioned, but I support improvements to the Z7II, and I'm not one to say "just get a Z8." LOL

Happy shooting!
 
I don't want to start a discussion on BBF. My first SLR was a Yashica TL Electro X back in 1969, so I've been around a while. Old habits can be broken. I also agree with you concerning the limitations of AF with Nikon cameras until recently, I basically operated my D750 as an AF-S camera shooting focus and re-compose for nearly every shot.

The point I was trying to make is that it just isn't possible to shift the Z7 II from Single to Burst while holding the camera at eye level. It is Physically Impossible because Nikon didn't place the setting for Release Mode in either the FN1 or FN2 Feature List. So are you for asking for this to be changed or against it?
 
.Point here is we need to actually get on the phone and ask for it.
Maybe yes – maybe know about phoning.

There seems a little doubt that Nikon consider feedback and suggestions.

I expect Nikon consider who is providing feedback and their skill level relative to the product before deciding whether or not to prioritise a specific comment.

There is always a risk telephone information may not be accurately recorded by the person at Nikon, or some contacts at Nikon not being recognised as important influencers within the Nikon organisation.
 
Regarding the Z7 II, I find it hard to imagine that Nikon is looking to invest significant development resources upgrading this almost 5-year old camera, and one that is running a no longer state of the art image processing engine.
 
I don't want to start a discussion on BBF. My first SLR was a Yashica TL Electro X back in 1969, so I've been around a while. Old habits can be broken. I also agree with you concerning the limitations of AF with Nikon cameras until recently, I basically operated my D750 as an AF-S camera shooting focus and re-compose for nearly every shot.

The point I was trying to make is that it just isn't possible to shift the Z7 II from Single to Burst while holding the camera at eye level. It is Physically Impossible because Nikon didn't place the setting for Release Mode in either the FN1 or FN2 Feature List. So are you for asking for this to be changed or against it?
I accept that there's a problem but, I don't live in the USA, I don't have a Z anything and therefore my opinion isn't going to carry much weight. If I were going to buy a Z camera it would be something for me to check.

Discussion on BBF is a side track on this occasion. but I just use it differently from you.
 
Feature list. Not having the release setting assignable to the front function buttons is flat out STUPID. At present we have to press and hold the rear button while turning the command dial, a task that I simply cannot do with the camera at my eye in shooting position. I suspect that lack of ability is common for those of us with only two hands.

That lead me into considering the feature lists for the custom controls on the Z7 II, compared to my Zf they are quite limited and compared to the Z5II or Z50II they are even more limited. So I asked that Nikon do a Firmware Update to bring the Custom Controls Feature lists up to date with the newer Expeed 7 models. This has not effect on the CPU as it's a simple program addition so it is something that can be addressed with Firmware if enough of us ask for it. Point here is we need to actually get on the phone and ask for it.

My second request was that the Pinpoint AF setting be made available in the AF-C mode. Because those of us wise enough to use Back Button Focus do use the AF ON button for Single Focus grabs.

The third point of discussion is the Z7 III. I pointed out that the Z7 II is currently the ONLY two thousand dollar 40mp plus camera on the market and is currently drawing new users who want a high megapixel camera. Sony, Canon, Fuji, Olympus, and Panasonic don't offer anything that can match this profile. I also pointed out that 46mp has enough resolution to produce tack sharp 6 x 9 FOOT prints so there really isn't a need for more megapixels and the current sensor has a wider Dynamic Range than the Z8 or Z9. Where it is lacking is in AF capabilities and subject tracking feaures which is CPU related. Logic leads to the conclusion that the only thing the Z7 III needs to have is the Expeed 7 CPU's. This could be a simple "board change" and if so producing a new Z7 II would require only minor product line change and would also make it possible to offer an upgrade of the current camera to the Z7 III configuration for a fee. This would allow the Z7 III to retain the current market position and I am pretty certain current Z7 II owners would be quite willing to pay 600-800 dollars to upgrade their camera to the Z7 III profile. Anyone who agrees to this should get on the phone and ask for it.
You can get on the phone if you want but for me, I wouldn't bother. Nikon may "listen" to you but nothing will be done. Nikon will do what Nikon wants to do. Period. Kind of a waste of time if you ask me. Now a more appropriate route might be to mention these in comments on social media, because others will see it and either up-vote it (like it) or comment and Nikon may use that more than just phone calls to gauge what they may want to consider doing. I just feel calling Nikon is a bit of a waste of time for anything, whether it's suggestions or getting support/service (I just do everything online).
 
Why would you buy a camera that was so stupidly designed and implemented and unfit for your needs? Aren't there any other cameras out there that more closely match what you need or want in a camera? It can't be good to continuously have to deal with such inconveniences. I would be looking for a replacement if I were in such a bad situation.
 
Feature list. Not having the release setting assignable to the front function buttons is flat out STUPID. At present we have to press and hold the rear button while turning the command dial, a task that I simply cannot do with the camera at my eye in shooting position. I suspect that lack of ability is common for those of us with only two hands.

That lead me into considering the feature lists for the custom controls on the Z7 II, compared to my Zf they are quite limited and compared to the Z5II or Z50II they are even more limited. So I asked that Nikon do a Firmware Update to bring the Custom Controls Feature lists up to date with the newer Expeed 7 models. This has not effect on the CPU as it's a simple program addition so it is something that can be addressed with Firmware if enough of us ask for it. Point here is we need to actually get on the phone and ask for it.

My second request was that the Pinpoint AF setting be made available in the AF-C mode. Because those of us wise enough to use Back Button Focus do use the AF ON button for Single Focus grabs.

The third point of discussion is the Z7 III. I pointed out that the Z7 II is currently the ONLY two thousand dollar 40mp plus camera on the market and is currently drawing new users who want a high megapixel camera. Sony, Canon, Fuji, Olympus, and Panasonic don't offer anything that can match this profile. I also pointed out that 46mp has enough resolution to produce tack sharp 6 x 9 FOOT prints so there really isn't a need for more megapixels and the current sensor has a wider Dynamic Range than the Z8 or Z9. Where it is lacking is in AF capabilities and subject tracking feaures which is CPU related. Logic leads to the conclusion that the only thing the Z7 III needs to have is the Expeed 7 CPU's. This could be a simple "board change" and if so producing a new Z7 II would require only minor product line change and would also make it possible to offer an upgrade of the current camera to the Z7 III configuration for a fee. This would allow the Z7 III to retain the current market position and I am pretty certain current Z7 II owners would be quite willing to pay 600-800 dollars to upgrade their camera to the Z7 III profile. Anyone who agrees to this should get on the phone and ask for it.
I really liked it when Pentax did this, you could send your current K5 in and they'd install the accelerator board to make it a K5II. What a great idea in terms of saving on resources and reducing e-waste. If I could have sent my Fuji X-H1s in for a refit with faster CPU board I would have done so.
 
I don't want to start a discussion on BBF. My first SLR was a Yashica TL Electro X back in 1969, so I've been around a while. Old habits can be broken. I also agree with you concerning the limitations of AF with Nikon cameras until recently, I basically operated my D750 as an AF-S camera shooting focus and re-compose for nearly every shot.

The point I was trying to make is that it just isn't possible to shift the Z7 II from Single to Burst while holding the camera at eye level. It is Physically Impossible because Nikon didn't place the setting for Release Mode in either the FN1 or FN2 Feature List. So are you for asking for this to be changed or against it?
I got used to using the "i" menu to change the release mode. It is possible to press the "i" button and navigate the "i" menu with the multi-pad without removing the EVF from your eye. The "i" menu remembers the last used/selected feature. Once you press the "i" button, rotate the rear dial to select another mode, half-press, and shoot. It isn't ideal, but it is manageable.

I actually went through many of the same frustrations as you did, but I had spent full MSRP on it. As much as we agree with you, you're always better considering using the camera how it is today, rather than how it could be.
 
Now all of the sudden it's bottom right. IMO whoever made that decision should now be assigned to washing and detailing the Executive cars. Good news is both are assignable so it's easy to correct that oversight but it certainly falls into the "what were they thinking" trash bin.
In an interview with a Nikon engineer, they explained "what they were thinking".

They worked with a press agency and one point of feedback was from photographers who used long lenses. To hit the playback button on the left, you need 2 hands - you hold the camera with the right hand and have to move your left hand off the lens and to the back of the camera to press the playback button.

Moving it to the right side means you can press it with your right thumb without moving your left hand. Seems like a reasonable thing to do.

I hated it at first - mostly because the Z9 was my only Nikon with the playback button on the right side. So I re-mapped the playback button to the left side. But now that I added a Z8 and a Z6iii I have become used to it and changed my Z9 back to the right side button. Now my Zf feels odd, since it has the playback button on the left.

So not an oversight at all. It was a well-considered design change.
 
Now all of the sudden it's bottom right. IMO whoever made that decision should now be assigned to washing and detailing the Executive cars. Good news is both are assignable so it's easy to correct that oversight but it certainly falls into the "what were they thinking" trash bin.
In an interview with a Nikon engineer, they explained "what they were thinking".

They worked with a press agency and one point of feedback was from photographers who used long lenses. To hit the playback button on the left, you need 2 hands - you hold the camera with the right hand and have to move your left hand off the lens and to the back of the camera to press the playback button.

Moving it to the right side means you can press it with your right thumb without moving your left hand. Seems like a reasonable thing to do.

I hated it at first - mostly because the Z9 was my only Nikon with the playback button on the right side. So I re-mapped the playback button to the left side. But now that I added a Z8 and a Z6iii I have become used to it and changed my Z9 back to the right side button. Now my Zf feels odd, since it has the playback button on the left.

So not an oversight at all. It was a well-considered design change.
When I first bought a Nikon camera it didn't have a playback button, or image review, For the next 16 years no Nikon camera I woned had either feature. Thus when I bought one that did I disabled image review as it would have been a distraction but embraced the playback button on the top left. I never playback images whilst still shooting. As long as I have DSLRs I would reconfigure my cameras to have that arrangement, it suits the way I work. Of course when the playback is in the viewfinder having the button on the right might make some sense.

Of far more importance is the fact that such reconfiguration is possible. From a purely personal point of view, I dislike the button arrangement necessitated by the installation of either a tilting or articulated screen. I won't say that it is stopping me from buying into the Z system but several features are not encouraging me. The further the controls of Z cameras diverge from the later F mount cameras the less inclined I become to change..

monte12345 has a valid argument that ergonomics on the Z system aren't as good on the, mature, F mount system. As an example, research showed that having the command and sub-command dials horizontal wasn't ideal and in the D4, D5 and D6 they are angled to improve user comfort. With the Z system that research was binned and the dials are horizontal again, it's probably cheaper that way. The AF mode button on the later DSLRs was on the side of the lens mount, the Z cameras have a flush lens mount so the button isn't as conveniently located.

It's probably best to treat the Z cameras as a completely new tool rather than try to emulate the DSLR controls. The construction of the bodies prevents many things from being similar, let alone the same, so it's probably time to relearn.
 
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Because if you are Chimping you are missing the opportunities for some great shots, because instead of shooting you were Chimping. Probably a good thing I never ran a Press Room because I'd probably have been doing a Barry White and yelling at the reporters and photographers.
 

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