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EM-1 uses Panasonic sensor per Chipworks
- Thread starter madzazulu
- Start date
Zensu11
Senior Member
I've always thought the sensors in the OM-D series were all made by Sony. Guess I was wrong.
Martin.au
Forum Pro
Now that's quite a surprise. I wonder if we now know the chip that will be in the GH4?
Wow!!!
For many forum activists this would be unbearable to admit this. Olympus has to be assembled with very best from Sony
FrankParis
Senior Member
Um, big deal.
Um, doubtful. You must be a Panasonic fan boy or fan girl. I have an E-M1 and all I care about is performance.
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drj3
Forum Pro
I am not sure why I should care about which company produced the sensor, the lenses and as well as many of the other components are often designed and produced by other companies . As long as I am satisfied with the performance of the product it really is not important. Actually if it means that Olympus is not just tied to Sony for sensors, that would be a good thing, since Sony may not always produce the best sensor.
Gregm61
Forum Pro
There you go. It's on the internet, so we all know it has to be true....
--
"There's shadows in life, baby.." Jack Horner- Boogie Nights
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pedroboe100
Forum Enthusiast
And you can buy a one page document for $5000?
Gregm61
Forum Pro
Probably even includes a certificate of authenticity!
Fredrik Glckner
Senior Member
I remember interviews with Panasonic engineers saying that they would not be using on sensor PDAF. But the EM-1 does. So this appears to not add up well.
http://m43photo.blogspot.com
http://m43photo.blogspot.com
exdeejjjaaaa
Veteran Member
so it is this one... the same as in GH4 = http://www.semicon.panasonic.co.jp/ds8/c3/IS00006AE.pdf
MN34230PL
that is a big surprise in fact... so Sony after all was not able to edge Panasonic out
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Fredrik Glckner
Senior Member
The specifications say that it can do 1080p @ 60fps and 4k @ 30fps. So no chance of a high speed full HD video output from GH4.
Also, it says that the full scan can be done at 22.5 fps. This means that the electronic shutter readout speed is about twice that of the GH3. The GH3 has an electronic shutter readout speed of about 1/10s, leading to big rolling shutter effects:
http://m43photo.blogspot.com/2013/03/gh3-electronic-shutter.html
Also, it says that the full scan can be done at 22.5 fps. This means that the electronic shutter readout speed is about twice that of the GH3. The GH3 has an electronic shutter readout speed of about 1/10s, leading to big rolling shutter effects:
http://m43photo.blogspot.com/2013/03/gh3-electronic-shutter.html
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exdeejjjaaaa
Veteran Member
see carefully - that sensor (it might be a mod of it specifically for GH4 though - that is why it is "MN34230PL" and not simply "MN34230") can do "4k2k movie mode (30fps)"
also that sensor is 1.9 crop
Actual imaging area dimensions 17.6472 (H) mm x 13.3228 (V) mm (active pixel area) = 4656 (H) x 3518 (V)
and as "Number of effective pixels" = 4644 (H) x 3506 (V), we have :
((17.6472 * 13.3228) / (4656*3518)) * (4644*3506) = 233.7 mm^2
E-M1 has 4608 x 3456, so it is unfortunately does not reach 1.9 though, but rather 1.944 crop (228.6 mm^2)
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Jon555
Veteran Member
What you're buying is a bunch of X-Rays and Scanning Electron Microscope (SEM) photographs of the chip, including cross-sections of the devices, so competitors can see what Panasonic did to make it.
"The Device Essentials deliverable for imaging devices comprises a one page summary of observed device metrics and salient features. The summary is supported by the following unannotated image folders: • Downstream product teardown • Package X-rays, die photograph, non-invasive optical photos of die features • SEM imaging of the pixel array delayered to the metal, transistor, and diffusion levels • Exploratory cross-section SEM imaging of the general pixel array and peripheral structures This deliverable provides basic competitive benchmarking information and enables cost-effective tracking of multiple competitors’ technology."
E.g. see the second picture here:
...or this:
Here's another example of what they do:
BTW it's very interesting Panasonic did them a custom one with PDAF, I guess they much think very highly of their defocus technique to use it on the GH4 instead of PDAF. As I plan to get a GH4 then hopefully it's the business...
"The Device Essentials deliverable for imaging devices comprises a one page summary of observed device metrics and salient features. The summary is supported by the following unannotated image folders: • Downstream product teardown • Package X-rays, die photograph, non-invasive optical photos of die features • SEM imaging of the pixel array delayered to the metal, transistor, and diffusion levels • Exploratory cross-section SEM imaging of the general pixel array and peripheral structures This deliverable provides basic competitive benchmarking information and enables cost-effective tracking of multiple competitors’ technology."
E.g. see the second picture here:
Loading…
www.macrumors.com
...or this:
Loading…
www.i-micronews.com
Here's another example of what they do:
Loading…
chipworksrealchips.blogspot.co.uk
BTW it's very interesting Panasonic did them a custom one with PDAF, I guess they much think very highly of their defocus technique to use it on the GH4 instead of PDAF. As I plan to get a GH4 then hopefully it's the business...
exdeejjjaaaa
Veteran Member
only Canon has PDAF that is really "in silicone", the rest are using just various tricks with CFA on top of the sensor
exdeejjjaaaa
Veteran Member
the same sensor can be supplied with different CFAs on top of it to accomplish the PDAF... so you are talking about camera engineers, not sensor engineers... Olympus paid for a different CFA (with some locations dedicated to PDAF use) on top of sensors for E-M1 and got what they paid for...
cameron2
Senior Member
Yup, that is an unexpected turn of events ..
exdeejjjaaaa
Veteran Member
OM-D series != (only) E-M1... E-M5 might as well have Sony sensor...
https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=SON-IMX109
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This surely is a joke? Otherwise your fanboy detector is set to too high a sensitivity.
The way the Sony sensor was embraced probably led to s_grins' remark.
However, the enthusiasm then was fully justified given that Olympus was perceived as being given second-rate old sensors by Panasonic up to that time, and the entrance of Sony represented good competition.
So logically those who enthusiastically greeted Sony should also enthusiastically greet this turn of events as this shows now valid competition with almost equal merits. The best possible situation. Sony has kicked Panasonic out of complacency, and Olympus gets to pick what they want on their own terms.
micksh6
Senior Member
All die markings say is that the sensor was manufactured at Panasonic fab. It might as well be designed by Sony and then they could outsource production to Panasonic.
Just like Panasonic produces flashes designed by Olympus or Foxconn produces iPhones designed by Apple.
If Panasonic had access to this sensor they would certainly have used PDAF for video in GH4, like Canon does in 70D. Instead, Panasonic had to develop their Depth-From-Defocus technology.
So, if this is Panasonic sensor why don't they use PDAF in GH4?
Just like Panasonic produces flashes designed by Olympus or Foxconn produces iPhones designed by Apple.
If Panasonic had access to this sensor they would certainly have used PDAF for video in GH4, like Canon does in 70D. Instead, Panasonic had to develop their Depth-From-Defocus technology.
So, if this is Panasonic sensor why don't they use PDAF in GH4?
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