Do GFX have an overheating issues?

[samsst]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.


Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

 

[JimKasson]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.

Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

I've never seen this failure mode in any GFX. This is the first I've heard of it. Sounds very strange to me. What was the ambient temp?

 

[Rodenmg]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.

Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

I’ve had my 100S give me a high temp warning when shooting 100+ stacked images in direct sun on 90+ degree days. But never a shutdown.

 

[samsst]

I am not the OP, i should have posted the link. here is the discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/FujifilmGFXcameras/permalink/1726110867832795/

 

[JimKasson]

I am not the OP, i should have posted the link. here is the discussion: https://www.facebook.com/groups/FujifilmGFXcameras/permalink/1726110867832795/

Seems to be light on specifics.

 

[jerseyinHK]

Hi guys...I am the OP on the FB post.

The situation is as follows: I was on a photo hike on a mild day in the mid 70s, switching back and forth between a GF50 and a Pentax 67 300mm lens. I returned the camera to my bag (a LowePro camera backpack) and headed home. It took about 45 minutes to get home.

When I took the camera out of the bag, it was turned on and warm (not hot). This has happened a few times in another bag, so I switched bags to prevent it. I am also in the habit of turning the camera off when not actively shooting to save battery life. I am 99% certain I turned the camera off before putting it in the bag, but it is a possibility.

I turned the camera off and back on, and took two photos. It worked fine. After the second shot, the screen turned purple. No amount of troubleshooting would rectify the problem. In retrospect, I should have let the camera cool down before doing this.

I sent it to Fuji Hong Kong for repair. They gave me a quote of ~$2500 without explaining what was wrong or what would be changed. They did not seem to like that the camera was purchased in the USA and made that very clear in our interactions.

I then shipped it to Fuji USA, where it was purchased. I also asked to replace the eyepiece, as it has some wear if possible. They also gave me a quote but no diagnosis and sent the camera back.

*READ CUSTOMER NOTES*
ESTIMATE: EYE PIECE / FRONT CONST.
LABOR: $ 240.00
PARTS: $ 2,677.48
<SHUTTER RELEASE COUNT: 19,678 (Z / 26,985 (H) >

I sent them back a reply that the level of service did not meet my expectation considering it is professional-level gear and I am heavily invested with 4 native lenses and 6 adapted lenses. They requested to send it back in, and they will re-evaluate and potentially offer a trade-in on a reconditioned unit.

In short, I don't know if a manufacturing defect or mishandling caused the failure. The failure is not as much a concern as the high cost and lack of transparency with service. This is giving me pause to invest in another GFX. I have no reassurances this will not happen again, or that it will be cost-effective to repair.

I love the images; however, I have been shooting with my Nikon J5 (a 1" sensor consumer-grade camera) and the adapted lenses, and am enjoying it tremendously. I may go back to Nikon, depending Fuji's response.

 

[JimKasson]

Hi guys...I am the OP on the FB post.

The situation is as follows: I was on a photo hike on a mild day in the mid 70s, switching back and forth between a GF50 and a Pentax 67 300mm lens. I returned the camera to my bag (a LowePro camera backpack) and headed home. It took about 45 minutes to get home.

When I took the camera out of the bag, it was turned on and warm (not hot). This has happened a few times in another bag, so I switched bags to prevent it. I am also in the habit of turning the camera off when not actively shooting to save battery life. I am 99% certain I turned the camera off before putting it in the bag, but it is a possibility.

I turned the camera off and back on, and took two photos. It worked fine. After the second shot, the screen turned purple. No amount of troubleshooting would rectify the problem. In retrospect, I should have let the camera cool down before doing this.

I sent it to Fuji Hong Kong for repair. They gave me a quote of ~$2500 without explaining what was wrong or what would be changed. They did not seem to like that the camera was purchased in the USA and made that very clear in our interactions.

I then shipped it to Fuji USA, where it was purchased. I also asked to replace the eyepiece, as it has some wear if possible. They also gave me a quote but no diagnosis and sent the camera back.

*READ CUSTOMER NOTES*
ESTIMATE: EYE PIECE / FRONT CONST.
LABOR: $ 240.00
PARTS: $ 2,677.48
<SHUTTER RELEASE COUNT: 19,678 (Z / 26,985 (H) >

I sent them back a reply that the level of service did not meet my expectation considering it is professional-level gear and I am heavily invested with 4 native lenses and 6 adapted lenses. They requested to send it back in, and they will re-evaluate and potentially offer a trade-in on a reconditioned unit.

In short, I don't know if a manufacturing defect or mishandling caused the failure. The failure is not as much a concern as the high cost and lack of transparency with service. This is giving me pause to invest in another GFX. I have no reassurances this will not happen again, or that it will be cost-effective to repair.

I love the images; however, I have been shooting with my Nikon J5 (a 1" sensor consumer-grade camera) and the adapted lenses, and am enjoying it tremendously. I may go back to Nikon, depending Fuji's response.

The camera has an overtemp sensor. Having the photographic sensor fail due to self heating should not happen. I don't think this is a design issue. Sounds like a component failure to me. But I can't tell what failed to start the chain that led to the sensor failure. The failure may not be related to the heat at all.

It sounds like the service you are getting is not what it should be. I would escalate if I were you. I wouldn't be overly concerned about this happening again with another body.

 

[themediocreenthusiast]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.

Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

Sorry to hear your story and I feel your pain.

Forgot to power off; left in bag, auto-off didnt work and camera component was "burnt" from overheating / overworking - all sounds pretty familiar for me too - which happened to my first X100 in 2020 during a work trip.

Im not sure for your case but I concluded the main culprit which prevented Auto-Off from working and overheated my camera was the "eye-sensor" view mode..

Due to constant moving around and some extra space inside my shoulder bag, I guess the camera was auto switching (and auto-focusing) between EVF mode and LCD mode for about 6hours which resulted in overheating the AF motor or sensor (not sure). And yes, I remember the camera was quite hot when I took it out from my bag in the evening time.

Fuji said they cant repair the camera due to lack of parts, so I bought another X100 shortly, and tested the "eye sensor" function again (for example, hanging on my neck with Power and Eye sensor ON on purpose) and confirmed Auto-Off will not work when your camera is switching constantly between LCD <-> EVF due to the Eye sensor chip. The camera does get uncomfortably hot on my belly after auto switching for 5-10mins.

I try not to use "Eye-sensor" function anymore on all my cameras nowadays. Unfortunately, I still dont know how to deactivate/ turn it off on my Sony a7s and a7rii.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

--
Just another average Joe from Asia

 

[jerseyinHK]

Thanks Jim. I greatly respect your opinion, which makes me feel better about sticking with Fuji. Let's see what they say this next go around.

 

[samsst]

Hi guys...I am the OP on the FB post.

The situation is as follows: I was on a photo hike on a mild day in the mid 70s, switching back and forth between a GF50 and a Pentax 67 300mm lens. I returned the camera to my bag (a LowePro camera backpack) and headed home. It took about 45 minutes to get home.

When I took the camera out of the bag, it was turned on and warm (not hot). This has happened a few times in another bag, so I switched bags to prevent it. I am also in the habit of turning the camera off when not actively shooting to save battery life. I am 99% certain I turned the camera off before putting it in the bag, but it is a possibility.

I turned the camera off and back on, and took two photos. It worked fine. After the second shot, the screen turned purple. No amount of troubleshooting would rectify the problem. In retrospect, I should have let the camera cool down before doing this.

I sent it to Fuji Hong Kong for repair. They gave me a quote of ~$2500 without explaining what was wrong or what would be changed. They did not seem to like that the camera was purchased in the USA and made that very clear in our interactions.

I then shipped it to Fuji USA, where it was purchased. I also asked to replace the eyepiece, as it has some wear if possible. They also gave me a quote but no diagnosis and sent the camera back.

*READ CUSTOMER NOTES*
ESTIMATE: EYE PIECE / FRONT CONST.
LABOR: $ 240.00
PARTS: $ 2,677.48
<SHUTTER RELEASE COUNT: 19,678 (Z / 26,985 (H) >

I sent them back a reply that the level of service did not meet my expectation considering it is professional-level gear and I am heavily invested with 4 native lenses and 6 adapted lenses. They requested to send it back in, and they will re-evaluate and potentially offer a trade-in on a reconditioned unit.

In short, I don't know if a manufacturing defect or mishandling caused the failure. The failure is not as much a concern as the high cost and lack of transparency with service. This is giving me pause to invest in another GFX. I have no reassurances this will not happen again, or that it will be cost-effective to repair.

I love the images; however, I have been shooting with my Nikon J5 (a 1" sensor consumer-grade camera) and the adapted lenses, and am enjoying it tremendously. I may go back to Nikon, depending Fuji's response.

that’s very unfortunate.


Is the camera is under warranty and they are not willing to cover it under warranty?

 

[samsst]

Hi guys...I am the OP on the FB post.

The situation is as follows: I was on a photo hike on a mild day in the mid 70s, switching back and forth between a GF50 and a Pentax 67 300mm lens. I returned the camera to my bag (a LowePro camera backpack) and headed home. It took about 45 minutes to get home.

When I took the camera out of the bag, it was turned on and warm (not hot). This has happened a few times in another bag, so I switched bags to prevent it. I am also in the habit of turning the camera off when not actively shooting to save battery life. I am 99% certain I turned the camera off before putting it in the bag, but it is a possibility.

I turned the camera off and back on, and took two photos. It worked fine. After the second shot, the screen turned purple. No amount of troubleshooting would rectify the problem. In retrospect, I should have let the camera cool down before doing this.

I sent it to Fuji Hong Kong for repair. They gave me a quote of ~$2500 without explaining what was wrong or what would be changed. They did not seem to like that the camera was purchased in the USA and made that very clear in our interactions.

I then shipped it to Fuji USA, where it was purchased. I also asked to replace the eyepiece, as it has some wear if possible. They also gave me a quote but no diagnosis and sent the camera back.

*READ CUSTOMER NOTES*
ESTIMATE: EYE PIECE / FRONT CONST.
LABOR: $ 240.00
PARTS: $ 2,677.48
<SHUTTER RELEASE COUNT: 19,678 (Z / 26,985 (H) >

I sent them back a reply that the level of service did not meet my expectation considering it is professional-level gear and I am heavily invested with 4 native lenses and 6 adapted lenses. They requested to send it back in, and they will re-evaluate and potentially offer a trade-in on a reconditioned unit.

In short, I don't know if a manufacturing defect or mishandling caused the failure. The failure is not as much a concern as the high cost and lack of transparency with service. This is giving me pause to invest in another GFX. I have no reassurances this will not happen again, or that it will be cost-effective to repair.

I love the images; however, I have been shooting with my Nikon J5 (a 1" sensor consumer-grade camera) and the adapted lenses, and am enjoying it tremendously. I may go back to Nikon, depending Fuji's response.

The camera has an overtemp sensor. Having the photographic sensor fail due to self heating should not happen. I don't think this is a design issue. Sounds like a component failure to me. But I can't tell what failed to start the chain that led to the sensor failure. The failure may not be related to the heat at all.

It sounds like the service you are getting is not what it should be. I would escalate if I were you. I wouldn't be overly concerned about this happening again with another body.

 

[Discombobulated]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.

Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

I am curious how long to battery can heat up the camera for? For whatever reason the camera heated up but it uses a lot of energy to generate heat, I guess the battery will be completely drained after few hours. Is that enough to damage the sensor... interesting.

 

[areallygrumpyoldsod]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off

YES - all digital tools do.

But whether you notice it depends on the use and the environment.

A sensor being read generated heat,an EVF/LCD generate heat, power being drawn from a battery generates head, a processor being used generates head AND finally writing data to a card generates heat -- all these thermal adds can be offset by the ability of the body to distribute and radiate heat -- but here is the rub when using gear in direct sunlight and in high ambient temperature the effectiveness of thermal radiation reduces and can stop.

All components have optimal operating temps and good devices have both thermal monitoring and thermal protection -- so YES one receives hot card, hot camera warnings; RED warnings and then a countdown to shut down which if not corrected by the user turning the camera off and allowing it to cool will lead to shut down. HOPEFULLY without damage, but this is never guaranteed.

The case of someone shooting a lot of images very quickly simply drives up the use of sensor, processor and cards and all the pipes that connect them. None have time too cool. Ask any CINE or Hybrid camera shooter about heat.

You should understand the operating limits of your gear BEFORE you move it to another environment or use it in a different way -- then you can plan your shoot -- maybe take 3 bodies not just one; definitely take sunshades; cool areas and even coolboxes and gel packs -- again ask any RED shooter. Take the fastest cooling running cards. Use Power Delivery rather than in camera batteries. Use off camera monitoring rather than the EVF or LCF and so on. AND TURN OFF the camera between set-ups and give it time to cool - change out cards/batteries etc. Add active cooling -- FANS being a start - silent fans if noise matters and os on.

 

[JimKasson]

Is this overheating issue happened more in mirrorless cameras?

MILCs have to read the sensor over and over to keep the EVF or LCD refreshed. SLRs don't have to do that, unless they're in live view mode.

 

[jerseyinHK]

Hi guys...I am the OP on the FB post.

The situation is as follows: I was on a photo hike on a mild day in the mid 70s, switching back and forth between a GF50 and a Pentax 67 300mm lens. I returned the camera to my bag (a LowePro camera backpack) and headed home. It took about 45 minutes to get home.

When I took the camera out of the bag, it was turned on and warm (not hot). This has happened a few times in another bag, so I switched bags to prevent it. I am also in the habit of turning the camera off when not actively shooting to save battery life. I am 99% certain I turned the camera off before putting it in the bag, but it is a possibility.

I turned the camera off and back on, and took two photos. It worked fine. After the second shot, the screen turned purple. No amount of troubleshooting would rectify the problem. In retrospect, I should have let the camera cool down before doing this.

I sent it to Fuji Hong Kong for repair. They gave me a quote of ~$2500 without explaining what was wrong or what would be changed. They did not seem to like that the camera was purchased in the USA and made that very clear in our interactions.

I then shipped it to Fuji USA, where it was purchased. I also asked to replace the eyepiece, as it has some wear if possible. They also gave me a quote but no diagnosis and sent the camera back.

*READ CUSTOMER NOTES*
ESTIMATE: EYE PIECE / FRONT CONST.
LABOR: $ 240.00
PARTS: $ 2,677.48
<SHUTTER RELEASE COUNT: 19,678 (Z / 26,985 (H) >

I sent them back a reply that the level of service did not meet my expectation considering it is professional-level gear and I am heavily invested with 4 native lenses and 6 adapted lenses. They requested to send it back in, and they will re-evaluate and potentially offer a trade-in on a reconditioned unit.

In short, I don't know if a manufacturing defect or mishandling caused the failure. The failure is not as much a concern as the high cost and lack of transparency with service. This is giving me pause to invest in another GFX. I have no reassurances this will not happen again, or that it will be cost-effective to repair.

I love the images; however, I have been shooting with my Nikon J5 (a 1" sensor consumer-grade camera) and the adapted lenses, and am enjoying it tremendously. I may go back to Nikon, depending Fuji's response.

that’s very unfortunate.

Is the camera is under warranty and they are not willing to cover it under warranty?

No, out of warranty by 2 years...

 

[Batdude]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.

Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

Sorry to hear your story and I feel your pain.

Forgot to power off; left in bag, auto-off didnt work and camera component was "burnt" from overheating / overworking - all sounds pretty familiar for me too - which happened to my first X100 in 2020 during a work trip.

Im not sure for your case but I concluded the main culprit which prevented Auto-Off from working and overheated my camera was the "eye-sensor" view mode..

Due to constant moving around and some extra space inside my shoulder bag, I guess the camera was auto switching (and auto-focusing) between EVF mode and LCD mode for about 6hours which resulted in overheating the AF motor or sensor (not sure). And yes, I remember the camera was quite hot when I took it out from my bag in the evening time.

Fuji said they cant repair the camera due to lack of parts, so I bought another X100 shortly, and tested the "eye sensor" function again (for example, hanging on my neck with Power and Eye sensor ON on purpose) and confirmed Auto-Off will not work when your camera is switching constantly between LCD <-> EVF due to the Eye sensor chip. The camera does get uncomfortably hot on my belly after auto switching for 5-10mins.

I try not to use "Eye-sensor" function anymore on all my cameras nowadays. Unfortunately, I still dont know how to deactivate/ turn it off on my Sony a7s and a7rii.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

 

[themediocreenthusiast]

I am shocked that the camera would overheat just because it wasn’t switched off.

Reposting from Facebook GFX group:

So my beloved 50R is officially dead. Fuji USA gave me an estimate of $3250 to repair the camera. Apparently, it needed a new sensor after being left on (or inadvertently turned on) in my bag and overheating. Yes, auto-off was set to 2 minutes, but didn't work for some reason.

Sorry to hear your story and I feel your pain.

Forgot to power off; left in bag, auto-off didnt work and camera component was "burnt" from overheating / overworking - all sounds pretty familiar for me too - which happened to my first X100 in 2020 during a work trip.

Im not sure for your case but I concluded the main culprit which prevented Auto-Off from working and overheated my camera was the "eye-sensor" view mode..

Due to constant moving around and some extra space inside my shoulder bag, I guess the camera was auto switching (and auto-focusing) between EVF mode and LCD mode for about 6hours which resulted in overheating the AF motor or sensor (not sure). And yes, I remember the camera was quite hot when I took it out from my bag in the evening time.

Fuji said they cant repair the camera due to lack of parts, so I bought another X100 shortly, and tested the "eye sensor" function again (for example, hanging on my neck with Power and Eye sensor ON on purpose) and confirmed Auto-Off will not work when your camera is switching constantly between LCD <-> EVF due to the Eye sensor chip. The camera does get uncomfortably hot on my belly after auto switching for 5-10mins.

I try not to use "Eye-sensor" function anymore on all my cameras nowadays. Unfortunately, I still dont know how to deactivate/ turn it off on my Sony a7s and a7rii.

This was a registered, 3 year old camera that was carefully maintained and kept in a drybox. Very disappointed in Fuji. The repair should not cost more than a new factory refurb on the same site.

But, since I am heavily invested in the glass (GF23, GF32-64, GF50, GF110, PP67 200mm, P67 300mm, P645 120 macro, and P645 150-300), it looks like I have no option but another GFX?

Advice on getting a 50sii with the BH Photo added 4 year insurance, or sell all this stuff and go back Nikon? I never had a single issue with any of my Nikon gear, and many of which have been brutally abused.

I find all these information very good and interesting and will definitely keep this in mind for future use. These camera now days is REALLY expensive so I think this is a really good thread.

All my cameras are attached and carried with a shoulder strap and I believe that often the eye sensor is against my body on the side towards my hip/leg area the way I carry it, so this is something to remember and I guess I should pay more attention to the camera and make sure im not damaging it by burning something

Very good input here and im really sorry about you guy’s cameras going bad and those repairs costs and customer service suck that is really disappointing indeed.

I feel Power ON + Eye Sensor EVF <-> LCD + Pre-AF + auto-aperture dancing is extremely lethal and damaging to our cameras.

Oh yes, plus GFX 50s has constant aperture dancing bizzare behaviour like X100 too, though I'm not sure 50r and other GFXx.

You can stop the aperture dancing easily by fixed shutter speed or press AE-lock button. I do that most of the time now just to protect my old Canon lenses like 85/1.2 usm or noisy AF lenses.

I guess im also protecting the camera hardware in a way too?

 

[Stan Disbrow]

Hi,

Yep. They are actually video cameras all the time, these MILCs. So always running their sensors and processors. That turns electrons in the battery into heat. And that heat has to dissipate. Then it gets left doing all this and stuffed into an insulated bag.

I can think of few better ways to kill one.

So the lesson here is to power it off prior to putting it into the bag. I think perhaps the best way to be absolutely sure about that is to yank the battery then bag the body. That'll greatly reduce the likelihood of needing a body bag, so to speak.

Stan