D'image 7 dead?

Thanks, Mike. I can't wait till somebody actually reviews this and has full specs. Kinda funny how it won the innovation award when it was under glass. Makes you wonder if you carved a camera shape out of wood and let the people here on dpreview's forums loose on the specs what kind of award you could win... ;-)



http://www.tdphoto.com

-Tony Donaldson
 
Just popped over to your web site. You've got some great stuff in your book. That high-speed shot of the water-splash is sensational.

Maybe the world is much changed since the time I shot photos for a living (unsuccessfully ). But I don't recall camera manufacturers back then rolling out products that they knew perfectly well would be vaporware for a long time. A short time, maybe, but not a long time. Considering the advances in production, you'd think the turnaround time from concept to completion would have gone down quite a bit. But perhaps Minolta's strategy is simply to let all of those eager mouths water for a while...

If so it's a gamble. In the time between the first Trade-Show Salivation Experience to the actual release date, a lot of people might become frustrated enough, waiting, that they go off and buy themselves an E-10, get to like it...and decide not to bother switching. This would not exactly work in Minolta's favor. From the sound of it, Minolta has not been gushy with information since the initial buzz (their web site's "sneak preview" really is pathetic). Not a formula for making friends and influencing people.

But then, perhaps they are so confident that the Dimage 7 will take over the market that they don't care if a few potential customers are irritated at them right now. (They can hope that someone else doesn't come along with an equally or more impressive camera in the meantime...a new Olympus E-10-like model, or some kind of stripped-down D30...whatever.)

Are the camera manufacturers feeling insecure about all this? The digital market is exploding . What the HELL are they waiting for? Permission from their mothers? An autographed copy of marching-orders from God? Canon, for instance...has that great RAW format and excellent algorithms for smoooooothing out the image...and what do they produce? The G1, a nice little camera with no grip and a horrible "viewfinder". Are they afraid that if they made an E-10-like prosumer camera, they'd cut into their D30 sales? Ok, there's the Pro90, with a lens not designed (so I hear) for that CCD and a junky focus-by-wire mechanism. I'm sure it takes fine pictures. But what a weird combination of "sophisticated" and "cheesy."

Will there be seventeen new generations of digital cameras with the tripod sockets off the lens axis, no eyecups, no cable-release capability, and sometimes-it-works, sometimes-it-doesn't focusing mechanisms (when the auto-focus mechanisms in Nikon and Canon film cameras right now are superb?) What a bizarre business altogether.

Hello, Minolta. Are you listening? I will try to be content for a while with this C2100. And when 2.x mpx no longer interests me, and you haven't come forth with that Dimage at least for review purposes, I might just find myself with an E-10. Get to market, folks. Time's a-wasting. (Or stop announcing vaporware...)
Thanks, Mike. I can't wait till somebody actually reviews this and
has full specs. Kinda funny how it won the innovation award when it
was under glass. Makes you wonder if you carved a camera shape out
of wood and let the people here on dpreview's forums loose on the
specs what kind of award you could win... ;-)
 
Hello, Minolta. Are you listening?...
...Time's a-wasting. (Or stop announcing vaporware...)
I'm more interested in seeing what they produce in the way of a digital SLR. That Maxxum 7 looks like an absolutely beautiful camera! The big LCD on the back smacks of digital... and apparently Minolta lead Phil to believe that they were actually going to MAKE a digital SLR. This behavior isn't consistent with one of a camera manufacturer that wants to stay in business and win new customers.

JCDoss
 
Whatever the company plans to make . . . judging by various forum participants' accounts, Minolta has not been behaving in a way guaranteed to make friends. It would be one thing to say 'the system is still under development, so we're not going to talk yet about the entire feature-set'. Even if it were a lie, it would be better than the black-hole treatment people who call Minolta have apparently been receiving. (I would guess that Minolta employees are under orders From On High to keep quiet and not even to talk about why they are keeping quiet. Some of them must be frustrated about it; some enterprising soul should find a disaffected Minolta employee and persuade him or her to speak off-the-record. :-)

In light of a million 'vaporware' announcements in the software business over the last 'x' years, consumers have become jaded about PR-department-generated 'buzz' (even though I must admit this camera's features do sound interesting).

Then again, perhaps Minolta can rely upon consumers' fickleness. If the camera turns out to be sensational, folks who are feeling irritated right now will probably begin salivating horribly when the camera finally hits the market.
apparently Minolta lead Phil to believe that they were actually
going to MAKE a digital SLR. This behavior isn't consistent with
one of a camera manufacturer that wants to stay in business and win
new customers.
 
Initially the specs are impressive and it's got me very interested esp. the 28-200 mm lens on the dimage 7.

However, I suspect I may be disappointed somewhat when it does arrive like I was with the Pro 90.

Firstly I'm hoping that the lens (although not interchangeable) will at least be a true manual zoom (none of this motorised rubbish that was presented on the pro 90).
in addition a true manual focus ring would be welcome.

Finally, after being permanently scarred by experiences with Fuji's 4900, the Pro 90 and Olympus' 2100 I hope it's a true prism viewfinder and not some low res LCD screen jammed into a tiny compartment.

If these 3 come up okay then I couldn't help but think seriously about such a camera.
 
The viewfinder is electronic (sigh). The pre-introduction hype has it that Minolta's EVF will have twice the resolution of EVFs seen to date. I will believe this only when I've seen it (I wish that at the very least they were willing to create an illustration depicting the differences...something, anything...).

It doesn't appear as if there's a manual focusing ring, unless they have figured out some way to make the zoom ring do double-duty, as it were. The most complete set of pictures I've seen appear here:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/EVENTS/PMAS01/981927576.html

In some of the pictures you can see the focal length marked on the (apparently rubberized) zoom ring. I don't see anything looking like a focusing ring, though. (Are these manufacturers EVER going to get it right?)

If there are web sites with more information than that, I have yet to find them--or at least to be able to read them. A number of them (found via a search on google.com) are in languages I don't speak, alas.

Minolta's Dimage 7 page on its own web site is pathetic. Someone in their marketing department should be permanently embarrassed about that (and probably isn't).
Firstly I'm hoping that the lens (although not interchangeable)
will at least be a true manual zoom (none of this motorised rubbish
that was presented on the pro 90).
in addition a true manual focus ring would be welcome.
 
Having looked at the photos on that site, I would suggest that the knurled metal ring at the base of the lens could be a manual focus ring as it resembles those found on the Fuji 4900/6900 and on Sony camcorders. If so it will almost certainly be of the focus-by-wire type and not the helical cam type found on manual focus lenses for film cameras.
 
The same thought occurred to me about the knurled ring. But then in looking at another of the photos, I noticed small screws in the ring at the base of the lens. That suggested attachment, rather than something that turns. Hard to say, however. If you're right--it seems an odd position for the manual-focus ring...I mean, that close to the camera body (touching the camera body, it would appear).

The review (such as it was) made no mention of the metal ring. It might be that the stars in the reviewer's eyes clouded his judgment [block that metaphor!]--and he forgot to check.

One of these days the makers of the 'prosumer' cameras will (I do hope!) have it figured out. It isn't for no reason that, even in low-end film SLR equipment, they have always placed all three critical manual-control rings on the lenses themselves (zoom; focus; f/stop)--what better place? Change f/stop by pressing a little "jog" button on the back of the camera? What a weird business. If that's "ergonomic," what's "inconvenient"? (Likewise, manufacturers' choices of manual-focus controls on camcorders. Tiny thumbwheels on the sides of the cameras? Bloody useless. What have they been thinking-- have they been thinking? Previous lens designs have not been broken. Why "fix" them?)

That said, I have grumbled but have become accustomed to using the buttons on the back of the digital camera I now use. I do wish it were more SLR-like but--wondering all the while on what planet digital camera designers themselves are designed--I have learned to live with its features.
Having looked at the photos on that site, I would suggest that the
knurled metal ring at the base of the lens could be a manual focus
ring as it resembles those found on the Fuji 4900/6900 and on Sony
camcorders. If so it will almost certainly be of the focus-by-wire
type and not the helical cam type found on manual focus lenses for
film cameras.
 
I've been having a poke around and have come up with some stuff from imaging-resource. They seem to have more info than Minolta and even have a sample print. Maybe we'll see more of this soon.Take a peek at:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/EVENTS/PMAS01/981927576.html
Dave Roberts
Looks like they've pulled the links from the minolta.com sites.

Anybody know anything different? I was interested in that camera as
a possible next digital cam...
--



http://www.tdphoto.com
-Tony Donaldson
 
MikeA,

On the lower right of the camera's left side there is a button marked AF/MF. I would take that to possibably mean Auto Focus/Manual Focus. Could mean something else though.

Ralph W.
It doesn't appear as if there's a manual focusing ring, unless they
have figured out some way to make the zoom ring do double-duty, as
it were. The most complete set of pictures I've seen appear here:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/EVENTS/PMAS01/981927576.html
 
If you look at the bottom photo of the D'image 5 and the top one of the 7 (They show the roughly same image of both cameras) you can see that the screw is lower down on the 7 compared with the 5. Since the bodies are almost certainly identical and therefore any fixed screws would be in the same place for both cameras, this would suggest that the ring can turn.

PS use the large images as the screw on the 7 is almost lost in a highlight.
 
I just had a look again--I see what you mean. It's difficult to see the screw in the photo of the D7--it has all but disappeared (specular highlight, overexposed shot...strange that the photographer didn't either take a better shot or use whatever better shot he had taken). It's difficult to know if indeed the ring has been turned or if, for some reason, Minolta placed the screw in different places on the two cameras. I looked for (text) indicators of some kind that might give away the purpose of the ring--can't see anything. I also noticed a small thumbwheel near the shutter button--hadn't noticed that before...wonder what it is used for (not manual focus, I hope...I've had enough of that kind of crude control on camcorders). Rumor has it the specs will be released at the end of this month, and if so, perhaps we'll find out.
If you look at the bottom photo of the D'image 5 and the top one of
the 7 (They show the roughly same image of both cameras) you can
see that the screw is lower down on the 7 compared with the 5.
Since the bodies are almost certainly identical and therefore any
fixed screws would be in the same place for both cameras, this
would suggest that the ring can turn.
 
I assumed it was an auto/manual focus-selection switch. But it is possible that they have used the "jog" buttons for manual focusing, as it done (alas) on some digital cameras. If I speculate too much about this, I might start losing sleep. :)
MikeA,

On the lower right of the camera's left side there is a button
marked AF/MF. I would take that to possibably mean Auto
Focus/Manual Focus. Could mean something else though.
 
News (maybe). Disclaimer: I'm passing along this "information" without having seen with my own eyes what I describe below. The forum has rules against spreading rumors, as I recall, and I want to be clear that as I have no way to verify the following I consider it second-class information, at best . (Second disclaimer: I have no affiliation with Minolta.)

A friend of mine in another state, a professional photographer who often shops at a particular camera store in his city, almost went to that store a few days ago -- but decided against it at the last minute. Later, the store's employees told him what he'd missed by having changed his mind: a Minolta rep showing a non-working Dimage 7 camera body. Everyone ooooohed and aaaaaahed over it but couldn't do anything with it. If they asked him any intelligent questions about it or got any intelligent answers, I haven't heard one way or the other.

Take the story with a big grain of salt; the guy relating it to me didn't get to see the non-working camera body, either.

If the mini-demonstration they told him about was correct, it's odd: why would Minolta send a sales rep to camera stores with a non working model of a product they are just about to ship?
 
FWIW, Minolta has a full page advertisement for the Dimage 7 in the new Outdoor Photogrpaher magazine.
News (maybe). Disclaimer: I'm passing along this "information"
without having seen with my own eyes what I describe below. The
forum has rules against spreading rumors, as I recall, and I want
to be clear that as I have no way to verify the following I
consider it second-class information, at best . (Second
disclaimer: I have no affiliation with Minolta.)

A friend of mine in another state, a professional photographer who
often shops at a particular camera store in his city, almost went
to that store a few days ago -- but decided against it at the last
minute. Later, the store's employees told him what he'd missed by
having changed his mind: a Minolta rep showing a non-working Dimage
7 camera body. Everyone ooooohed and aaaaaahed over it but couldn't
do anything with it. If they asked him any intelligent questions
about it or got any intelligent answers, I haven't heard one way or
the other.

Take the story with a big grain of salt; the guy relating it to me
didn't get to see the non-working camera body, either.

If the mini-demonstration they told him about was correct, it's
odd: why would Minolta send a sales rep to camera stores with a
non working model of a product they are just about to ship?
 
Would you be able to scan and post it?

Just curious.
News (maybe). Disclaimer: I'm passing along this "information"
without having seen with my own eyes what I describe below. The
forum has rules against spreading rumors, as I recall, and I want
to be clear that as I have no way to verify the following I
consider it second-class information, at best . (Second
disclaimer: I have no affiliation with Minolta.)

A friend of mine in another state, a professional photographer who
often shops at a particular camera store in his city, almost went
to that store a few days ago -- but decided against it at the last
minute. Later, the store's employees told him what he'd missed by
having changed his mind: a Minolta rep showing a non-working Dimage
7 camera body. Everyone ooooohed and aaaaaahed over it but couldn't
do anything with it. If they asked him any intelligent questions
about it or got any intelligent answers, I haven't heard one way or
the other.

Take the story with a big grain of salt; the guy relating it to me
didn't get to see the non-working camera body, either.

If the mini-demonstration they told him about was correct, it's
odd: why would Minolta send a sales rep to camera stores with a
non working model of a product they are just about to ship?
 
I just had a look at the 'current issue' page of Outdoor Photographer's web site but was unable to find the ad. I will see if I can find a copy of the issue at a nearby book store.

The Dimage 7 page of Minolta's own web site is still entirely pathetic. Their marketing department might wish to administer some 'wake-up' medication to Minolta/USA's webmaster. ... so, what shall we pilgrims do if there turn out to be not minor shortcomings, but severe ones, in the D7? Heave a collective sigh after all this time, I suppose. (And then buy an E-10...or, for the fiscally adventurous among us, a D30. Or a D1x. Or...)
FWIW, Minolta has a full page advertisement for the Dimage 7 in the
new Outdoor Photogrpaher magazine.
 

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