at-a-glance way to check exposure?

[pipituni]

hi all, new L mount user here (Lumix S9) coming from m43 mainly for video, or at least to begin with...

i've been getting used to the new camera and for the most part am enjoying the experience and the video quality but one thing i'm struggling with is how to identify when a scene is over/under exposed

is there an at-a-glance way to see this? i know there's the waveform but the screen is too small to display it when filming and still be able to see the subject (for my eyes at least)

this is mainly an issue when the correct exposure is not possible with the auto ISO range i've set, so for example i might be out on a bright day f4 1/60 shutter and auto iso. auto ISO will choose 640 but there's no indication i'm over exposed, which i would be if not using an ND filter

on the OM5 for example, in the same scenario the ISO no. on the display would start to blink, alerting me there's an overexposure issue. there's also a simple but effective exposure meter i can check, which takes up very little screen space

anything i'm missing on the S9?

 

[John Vickers]

hi all, new L mount user here (Lumix S9) coming from m43 mainly for video, or at least to begin with...

i've been getting used to the new camera and for the most part am enjoying the experience and the video quality but one thing i'm struggling with is how to identify when a scene is over/under exposed

is there an at-a-glance way to see this? i know there's the waveform but the screen is too small to display it when filming and still be able to see the subject (for my eyes at least)

this is mainly an issue when the correct exposure is not possible with the auto ISO range i've set, so for example i might be out on a bright day f4 1/60 shutter and auto iso. auto ISO will choose 640 but there's no indication i'm over exposed, which i would be if not using an ND filter

on the OM5 for example, in the same scenario the ISO no. on the display would start to blink, alerting me there's an overexposure issue. there's also a simple but effective exposure meter i can check, which takes up very little screen space

anything i'm missing on the S9?

Menus: [Custom] -> [Monitor/display] -> [Zebra Pattern]

Try enabling [Zebra1+2]

 

[pipituni]

thanks, i already have those on but they don't always give the whole picture

sometimes a scene is overexposed without blown highlights

 

[John Vickers]

thanks, i already have those on but they don't always give the whole picture

sometimes a scene is overexposed without blown highlights

What levels are they set to?

Usually, folk set one for blown, or nearly blown areas, say at 100% or 105%.

And the other at a useful reference level, such as maybe 70-75% for caucasian skin tones.

Or are you saying that sometimes you want a dark scene to be recorded as dark ?

 

[pipituni]

i'm just trying to keep the exposure reasonably consistent for the duration of a football (soccer) match. i'm the designated guy for the local team and i used to spend a lot of time fixing exposure when panning from one side of the pitch to the other, or when the sun goes in or out the clouds

i also like to watch the game while i'm filming so i don't want to have to spend too much time thinking about technicalities...

so with the OM5 i'm normally in M mode and log profile, i set aperture to f4 (f8 ff equiv), ss to 1/60 and leave ISO in auto. if it's too bright to get a good exposure with the ISO range i've specified then the ISO no. on the display will blink, alerting me there's a problem. there's also a very simple exposure bar on screen

then all i have to do is turn the VND until ISO is at base value (400 for the OM5) and expose for the brightest side of the pitch. sometimes there's a stop or more difference panning from one side to the other

at some point the sun/sky might get a bit brighter without me noticing, in which case the ISO 400 graphic on the screen will start to blink. if that happens i just make the VND a bit darker and that will keep the exposure consistent enough so i don't have to fix it in post, which is very time consuming

on the S9 though in the same situation there's no indication that the exposure is brighter. the ISO display just stays on 640 and if the sky gets a bit brighter the image will get brighter too as there's no way for the camera to compensate and i haven't realised there's more light

hope i've explained that well enough?

 

[pipituni]

maybe i just expose for 800 iso and then at least i know that if autoISO drops to 640 i know i need to adjust

 

[John Vickers]

maybe i just expose for 800 iso and then at least i know that if autoISO drops to 640 i know i need to adjust

Auto-ISO might just do what you want. You can set upper and lower limits in Menu->[Video]->[Image Quality]->[ISO sensitivity (video)]

Except there isn't any warning when the ISO the camera wants goes beyond your chosen range.

At the start, you need to set the VND for an ISO near the lower limit of your ISO range.

...

BTW, what format and framerate are you shooting ?

 

[pipituni]

maybe i just expose for 800 iso and then at least i know that if autoISO drops to 640 i know i need to adjust

Auto-ISO might just do what you want. You can set upper and lower limits in Menu->[Video]->[Image Quality]->[ISO sensitivity (video)]

yes, that's what i currently do

Except there isn't any warning when the ISO the camera wants goes beyond your chosen range.

this is what my OP was getting at

is it any different on the larger bodies? strange omission on an otherwise well featured camera

At the start, you need to set the VND for an ISO near the lower limit of your ISO range.

...

BTW, what format and framerate are you shooting ?

C4k 30p 420 10bit

for now

 

[John Vickers]

maybe i just expose for 800 iso and then at least i know that if autoISO drops to 640 i know i need to adjust

Auto-ISO might just do what you want. You can set upper and lower limits in Menu->[Video]->[Image Quality]->[ISO sensitivity (video)]

yes, that's what i currently do

Except there isn't any warning when the ISO the camera wants goes beyond your chosen range.

this is what my OP was getting at

is it any different on the larger bodies? strange omission on an otherwise well featured camera

The most recent model I have is S5M2X, which behaves the same way in this case. If anything, the S9 has better (more recent) firmware.

At the start, you need to set the VND for an ISO near the lower limit of your ISO range.

...

BTW, what format and framerate are you shooting ?

C4k 30p 420 10bit

I'd go with "1/50" shutter speed, to reduce the risk of flicker/banding from mains-powered lighting. [See: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/67990580 ]

...

One thing I'd be worried about with an S9 is using a long, heavy lens with the camera on a tripod, without a lens support: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/68019638

 

[pipituni]

maybe i just expose for 800 iso and then at least i know that if autoISO drops to 640 i know i need to adjust

Auto-ISO might just do what you want. You can set upper and lower limits in Menu->[Video]->[Image Quality]->[ISO sensitivity (video)]

yes, that's what i currently do

Except there isn't any warning when the ISO the camera wants goes beyond your chosen range.

this is what my OP was getting at

is it any different on the larger bodies? strange omission on an otherwise well featured camera

The most recent model I have is S5M2X, which behaves the same way in this case. If anything, the S9 has better (more recent) firmware.

sounds like this would be such an easy thing to 'fix'

in stills mode if you're out of exposure range f no. and shutter temporarily flash red, so the function is already there, just needs to be enabled

At the start, you need to set the VND for an ISO near the lower limit of your ISO range.

...

BTW, what format and framerate are you shooting ?

C4k 30p 420 10bit

I'd go with "1/50" shutter speed, to reduce the risk of flicker/banding from mains-powered lighting. [See: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/67990580 ]

thanks, noted

...

One thing I'd be worried about with an S9 is using a long, heavy lens with the camera on a tripod, without a lens support: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/68019638

i noticed that when i tested the 70-300 recently. it's no match for the Oly 40-150 2.8 though, so i won't be getting it

 

[John Vickers]

maybe i just expose for 800 iso and then at least i know that if autoISO drops to 640 i know i need to adjust

Auto-ISO might just do what you want. You can set upper and lower limits in Menu->[Video]->[Image Quality]->[ISO sensitivity (video)]

yes, that's what i currently do

Except there isn't any warning when the ISO the camera wants goes beyond your chosen range.

this is what my OP was getting at

is it any different on the larger bodies? strange omission on an otherwise well featured camera

The most recent model I have is S5M2X, which behaves the same way in this case. If anything, the S9 has better (more recent) firmware.

sounds like this would be such an easy thing to 'fix'

in stills mode if you're out of exposure range f no. and shutter temporarily flash red, so the function is already there, just needs to be enabled

That is a good point.

At the start, you need to set the VND for an ISO near the lower limit of your ISO range.

...

BTW, what format and framerate are you shooting ?

C4k 30p 420 10bit

I'd go with "1/50" shutter speed, to reduce the risk of flicker/banding from mains-powered lighting. [See: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/67990580 ]

thanks, noted

...

One thing I'd be worried about with an S9 is using a long, heavy lens with the camera on a tripod, without a lens support: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/68019638

i noticed that when i tested the 70-300 recently. it's no match for the Oly 40-150 2.8 though, so i won't be getting it

I haven't tried one, but it looks like the Smallrig cage for the S9 might take some of the twisting torque off the camera mount.

Do you use a lens with a tripod collar ?

 

[pipituni]

sounds like this would be such an easy thing to 'fix'

in stills mode if you're out of exposure range f no. and shutter temporarily flash red, so the function is already there, just needs to be enabled

That is a good point.

i've emailed Panasonic and suggested this as a firmware update

not holding my breath though

...

One thing I'd be worried about with an S9 is using a long, heavy lens with the camera on a tripod, without a lens support: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/68019638

i noticed that when i tested the 70-300 recently. it's no match for the Oly 40-150 2.8 though, so i won't be getting it

I haven't tried one, but it looks like the Smallrig cage for the S9 might take some of the twisting torque off the camera mount.

Do you use a lens with a tripod collar ?

had one on order which just arrived and the 2nd fixing point definitely helps

the only lens i use that has a tripod collar is the Oly 40-150 2.8 (80-300 ff equiv). difficult to find a replacement for that one...

right now i only have the 18-40 for general use but the 28-200 is on its way for video use

tested the latter against the 24-105 and 70-200 f4 and was pleasantly surprised by the performance of the 28-200

also the zoom ring is much smoother than the 20-60 and with the focal range it makes a pretty good general video lens