I am a longtime member of DPReview (Sep 6, 2002). I have been a professional photographer for most of my life making my dime mostly doing motorsport and studio work. I mostly post in the Nikon Forums as that has been my system of choice for most of my film and digital days.
I frequently get asked by friends, "What kind of camera should I buy?" Sometimes they add something like, I want to shoot flowers or I am going to Greece or whatever. More and more, my advice has been simply...just upgrade your smartphone and learn how to use it. I haven't brought a camera, other than my phone on vacation for years and have rarely regretted the decision.
A week or so ago I upgraded to the new iPhone 17 ProMax. This new phone cam has solved one of the remaining issues I have had with past gen iPhones which is getting a decent macro. It's not perfect yet but it is so much better and though I can't figure out why yet it just is. Before this gen the type and other fine detail on the dial of a watch would look jaggy and even AI generated. Now it looks respectable.
There are still some things an iPhone camera won't yet do. It wouldn't be a great safari cam or a sports action cam or a birds in flight cam...but for most folk this new phone cam is all you need.
This photo was taken outdoors in the shade with the 2x lens. (I still hate the fact that Apple wants you to use the wide lens as the default macro lens.)
For many people a phone is fine for a lot of things. I’m on vacation shooting fall leaves and other things in Vermont, New Hampshire, and Maine. All I can say is thank goodness I don’t have to rely on a phone. It’s also nice to see how many people there are here with actual cameras shooting.
I’m shooting with an A7RIVa, and a 20-70/4 (which I got recently). Prior to that I shot with an Olympus EM1.3 and 8-25/4 & 12-100/4 zooms (I had a couple of primes that I used less often). Phones are just so limiting… but they are pocketable, which makes them handy in a pinch. I could post dozens of examples but I think each has their place. Phone can never replace cameras for people like me. But cameras aren’t what matters to people like my wife - she takes things for memories only not max quality (I do both), and uses my photos for her Facebook.
A good compromise for some is small cameras like a RX100VII, XM5, OM5, etc.
And what do you do with your max quality photos? I guess you print them really big? I don't and I don't think most people do.
You don’t…”think”…most people do. So you don’t take the time to talk about needs, you just give blanket advice of buy a more expensive phone that’s more incremental than innovative (my opinions) and that solves all their reasons for looking for an upgrade. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that maybe you aren’t this bad, but by just guessing as to what you think people do, you sound like an old curmudgeon that knows nothing of photography and thinks everyone should shoot with phones. For fun and to help pay for my hobby, I did photography sales along with teaching photography classes. When someone came in and asked what they should get, I spent a lot of time listening and asking ‘find out questions’. I still do that today with friends and family. Everyone has different wants, needs, and things they hope to be able to do when getting a camera. AS I SAID, a phone might be right for some, it isn’t for everyone and I stand by what I said that another phone is not a great recommendation when someone asks what to get instead of a phone.
And as for prints, I made a nice 16x20 of Thors Well recently, for a co-worker who’s battling cancer. I have 3 photos from this vacation that I’m currently on that I will print either 20x30” or 24x36” and hang in my office.
I get paid a lot to take photos and I haven't made a single print in years.
What you do is not what everyone does. Recen
I never said that any phone would take max quality photos. I have Nikon Z9s for work and I bought a Z6-III to fart around with. Even the Z6-III takes a quantitatively better photo than the phone. I didn't say any phone would take the place of a good mirrorless or DSLR camera for people who "need max quality" or who did some of the work I mentioned in my OP though I did do a picture of a watch movement which printed full size on a magazine cover with my old iPhone. All I am saying is that the new phones are more than adequate for most of the people who call me up asking what kind of camera should I buy.
And I think that’s a disservice. And we can disagree about that.
Most people just want to document...to post to social media or make a travel book at one of the digital printing companies.
If that’s what most people do, although you admit you don’t know, you’re just guessing, a new phone is of no consequence. If people are using their phone as their medium, having the latest 48MP phone doesn’t really matter when viewing things on a 3mp screen that’s 1000-1500px wide. What is a new phone going to really do? My iPhone 15 has the same main camera as the IPhone 17pro. Same sensor, same resolution, same glass, … I paid $500 for my phone when I upgraded from the iPhone 13mini and only did that because the battery was going out and I got sick of typing on a tiny keyboard. Upgrading again would cost a ton and still be decades behind my micro four thirds gear let alone my 60mp A7RIVa and the amazing 20-70mm lens I chose to pair with it.
An experienced "max quality" photographer like you will be able to take better photos with a phone than they can take with what you call a "real camera."
I’ve proven this wrong more times than I can count. It was super easy to prove this wrong just by handing my EM1.3 with either of my zooms on it to my youngest daughter. She likes photography just not carrying cameras, but anytime I hand her my gear and I pull out my phone, her images blow my iPhone away. I’m not surprised given that the sensor in my old EM1.3 is 9x the size of the largest iPhone sensors and that I had an optical zoom range (using both lenses) of 16-200mm - far more useful than 13mm and 26mm on my phone. She could compose better, zoom in on her subject more, etc, etc, etc.
Most great photos aren't about the camera anyway. They are about light and what is going on in the mind of the photographer.
And that statement proves your previous statement wrong.
I took a great shot of Bass Harbor Head Lighthouse and took a similar one with my phone and the images are night and day. What I did to get the shot wasn’t rocket science, but my phone utterly failed in comparison. Good gear and a little time practing and learning make large differences in real cameras.
