Washed out skin tone. Is there an in camera fix?

[Billie]

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2 had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

 

[Russell Stewart]

Colour Balance.

For best results set a custom white balance (CWB) by shooting a Kodak Grey/White card as the sample...... or use an Expodisk to create your WB sample.

The in-camera AWB feature is not always accurate, nor are the WB presets.... in shade areas like this you can get wild variations in colour temp and it is only a CWB that will be truely accurate.

Russell

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

 

[Billie]

I picked up the Kodak Grey/White cards just last week. I've not had a chance to experiment with them. Thanks for the tip. I'll give it a try today

Kind Regards
Billie

For best results set a custom white balance (CWB) by shooting a
Kodak Grey/White card as the sample...... or use an Expodisk to
create your WB sample.

The in-camera AWB feature is not always accurate, nor are the WB
presets.... in shade areas like this you can get wild variations in
colour temp and it is only a CWB that will be truely accurate.

Russell

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

 

[Elizabeth Nelson]

I just started a photography class and asked the instructor about this and he said:

use the white card to set white balance in the camera.

Then, shoot your first picture in the light you're in and capture a picture including the gray card. Shoot the rest of the pictures and when you bring them in photoshop use the grey eye dropper to grab the gray card. Apply that profile to all the pictures and this will take care of skin tones.

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

 

[Vlad63918]

Cameras are not tuned enough very often. I had very similar blue cast on all my pictures from Fuji S2 pro with any WB, with gray card, with expo disk. I replaced it with 10D and although I did not change my style of shooting skin tones are much better directly from the camera.
My opinion you got a bad copy of the camera.
Vlad

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[HowieB]

I realize this is just your opinion, but how can you reach such a conclusion based on the content of this thread? To say he's got a bad camera is just too ridiculous. If you expect your opinions to count, you need to apply them more judiciously. Just my opinion.

Howie

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[Billie]

Howie

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[Vlad63918]

After I sold my Fuji S2 I had a chance to play with Fuji s602, Canon d60, Canon 1D and Canon 1Ds. Sometimes I had 2 cameras at the same time at the same place for shooting the same object. I used to get different results. I tested this way D60 and D1, then the same D1 and another D1 (different result!!!), D1 and 2 1Ds. All of them were different. Go into TV store with many TVs on and you'll see how different colors on many of them. I think the same is applied to digital cameras.
Vlad

Howie

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[Billie]

Elizabeth

I found these instructions to be helpful: http://www.camerabugdigital.com/instructions.htm

However, when I opened in Photoshop Elements, I realized under Image menu, level wasn't listed as an option.

Do you by any chance know how to do this in Photoshop Elements?

Kind Regards
Billie

use the white card to set white balance in the camera.

Then, shoot your first picture in the light you're in and capture a
picture including the gray card. Shoot the rest of the pictures and
when you bring them in photoshop use the grey eye dropper to grab
the gray card. Apply that profile to all the pictures and this will
take care of skin tones.

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

 

[Leon Wittwer]

Did you carefully set the WB on each camera before you took a shot? What did you do regarding WB? If you did not, then the results will be a more or less random draw. If the cameras are not defective, they should be similar (although not exactly the same) regarding color.

Howie

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[HowieB]

In particular, I would imagine comparing a camera with a CCD (1D) to a camera with a cmos (10D, 1Ds) might be different under even the identical testing methods.

Howie

Howie

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[Vlad63918]

Doesn't mean using gray card and expo disk that I took care about WB?

I also said I did not change my shooting style with 10D and get now good skin tones.
Vlad

Howie

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--
http://www.vchapran.com

--
http://www.vchapran.com

--
http://www.vchapran.com

 

[Russell Stewart]

Sorry, but you are getting some pretty silly suggestions about your skin tone problem.

FIRSTLY: "Grey Card in shot".... yep that's what you need to do, LAST CENTURY!! Shooting film, and using a densitometer it was handy to shoot a grey card in one shot as this would allow colour correction at the printing stage. But we have kinda moved on from there....

Yes the old technique can still be applied for PS, but WB can be done "in-camera" and this removes a HEAP of post processing time. Simply shoot the white side (grey side works too although some will argue) of the Kodak card in the same position/lighting conditions as your subject with the camera in AWB. Then via your cameras menu apply this shot as your CWB and select CWB as your WB for the rest of your shots under this lighting condition.

You can also use the grey side to set the exposure if you want to be picky.

Your shots out of camera WILL be good... you may like to adjust the final colour output in PS if you wish, but I think you will find that a CWB is pretty darn good and require no modification at all.

SECONDLY: "Dud Camera" ....it is almost not worthy of a response at all! To jump to "your camera is stuffed" from a simple matter of using a correct colour balance is ridiculous. AWB is NOT always accurate, nor are the presets... there are simply too many variables ie subject in shade... is she being lit by blue sky? cloudy sky? is the shade being provided by a building or something translucent? if it is a building, what colour is it...is it reflecting colour back from it's paint? what are the background colours and are they dominant? is the WB being set for the dominant background and ignoring the subject? etc etc etc

So.... your camera is fine! Try using CWB in the way that I described (see manual for full detail) and give it another go.... You will be surprised!

 

[Michael Long]

you may find this helpful:

http://www.warmcards.com/digital_camera.html

(Not affiliated with company, no commission, don't own stock, and it's not run by my brother's sister's cousin. Just like the product.)

As the site explains, you could w/b on white, but in many cases a somewhat warmer look is more flattering.

 

[torakki]

Elizabeth

I found these instructions to be helpful:
http://www.camerabugdigital.com/instructions.htm

However, when I opened in Photoshop Elements, I realized under
Image menu, level wasn't listed as an option.

Do you by any chance know how to do this in Photoshop Elements?

Kind Regards
Billie

Billie

In Photoshop Elements the levels are under: Enhance. Adjust Brightness/Contress. Levels.
Dean

 

[Elizabeth Nelson]

I suggested using the white card for white balance and the gray card for exposure (for the skin tones). This is what a photographer recommended to me. Not everyone wants to run out and pay 70 bucks (or however much it is) for an expodisc. I fail to see why you have to insult people who are trying to help. Are you that desperate to feel better about yourself? Yeah. I guess you are.

And who cares if the method is 'Last Century'?? If it works, it works.

Sorry, but you are getting some pretty silly suggestions about your
skin tone problem.

FIRSTLY: "Grey Card in shot".... yep that's what you need to do,
LAST CENTURY!! Shooting film, and using a densitometer it was
handy to shoot a grey card in one shot as this would allow colour
correction at the printing stage. But we have kinda moved on from
there....

Yes the old technique can still be applied for PS, but WB can be
done "in-camera" and this removes a HEAP of post processing time.
Simply shoot the white side (grey side works too although some will
argue) of the Kodak card in the same position/lighting conditions
as your subject with the camera in AWB. Then via your cameras menu
apply this shot as your CWB and select CWB as your WB for the rest
of your shots under this lighting condition.

You can also use the grey side to set the exposure if you want to
be picky.

Your shots out of camera WILL be good... you may like to adjust the
final colour output in PS if you wish, but I think you will find
that a CWB is pretty darn good and require no modification at all.

SECONDLY: "Dud Camera" ....it is almost not worthy of a
response at all! To jump to "your camera is stuffed" from a simple
matter of using a correct colour balance is ridiculous. AWB is NOT
always accurate, nor are the presets... there are simply too many
variables ie subject in shade... is she being lit by blue sky?
cloudy sky? is the shade being provided by a building or something
translucent? if it is a building, what colour is it...is it
reflecting colour back from it's paint? what are the background
colours and are they dominant? is the WB being set for the
dominant background and ignoring the subject? etc etc etc

So.... your camera is fine! Try using CWB in the way that I
described (see manual for full detail) and give it another go....
You will be surprised!

 

[Russell Stewart]

I suggested using the white card for white balance and the gray
card for exposure (for the skin tones). This is what a photographer
recommended to me.

I understand that this is what a photographer has told you and it was not my intention to direct my comments at you, rather direct them at the photographer. Does this photographer use digital? Does he/she understand the capabilities of the 10D and the CWB function? To suggest the "grey card in shot" method implies that the photographer is still using the traditional film based process.

I too suggested the use of a grey card ("or" Expodisk)... personally I use the grey card method myself. (Although the expo disk does allow for setting CWB from a distance... ie a stage show, there is no need to run up under the stage lights with a grey card, simply shoot an image with the Expodisk from where ever you are and apply that as your CWB)

Not everyone wants to run out and pay 70 bucks
(or however much it is) for an expodisc.

Me included.... because I don't shoot stage stuff, if I did it would be well worth the 70 bucks!

I fail to see why you have to insult people who are trying to help. Are you that desperate to feel better about yourself? Yeah. I guess you are.

Actually I am not desperate at all and I apologise, my wording could have been better.

And who cares if the method is 'Last Century'?? If it works, it works.

Yes it will work, but why not use the equipment to it's full potential. Digital is digital and it changes the way we do things. Why do we shoot digital? I would suggest that most of us do because it is instant gratification and an improved workflow.

To shoot with grey card in shot and apply WB corrections to every image later in PS makes for a greatly increased workflow and kinda puts the gratification back a bit too. I shoot events and often come home with 1000 images... I much rather use the camera to apply WB to all the images at the time of shooting and spend the extra time with the kids and not sitting looking at PS.

 

[Chris Clark]

I spent much of yesterday taking photos with the 10D I picked up
Friday.

For some reason, the skin tone looks somewhat washed out. This is
just one of many examples. I can't figure out if I need to adjust
in camera or not, as the photos I took in the same spot with my G2
had much better skin tone by comparison.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

Kind Regards
Billie

--were you shooting in raw or jpeg?
Chris Clark

 

[Elizabeth Nelson]

Russell,

Thanks you for your kind reply. It sounds like I misunderstood your tone. And yes, indeed, this instuctor is still using film. I'm still a bit confused. He insinuated that white balance is not what affects skin tones. He specifically said that only a gray card will improve skin tone. So is your point that white balance in digital cameras is so advanced that it will correct both white balance and exposure? Thank you in advance for your reply and I'm sorry that I jumped to the wrong conclustion regarding your post. This forum can make a person paranoid.

Elizabeth

I suggested using the white card for white balance and the gray
card for exposure (for the skin tones). This is what a photographer
recommended to me.

I understand that this is what a photographer has told you and it
was not my intention to direct my comments at you, rather direct
them at the photographer. Does this photographer use digital?
Does he/she understand the capabilities of the 10D and the CWB
function? To suggest the "grey card in shot" method implies that
the photographer is still using the traditional film based process.

I too suggested the use of a grey card ("or" Expodisk)...
personally I use the grey card method myself. (Although the expo
disk does allow for setting CWB from a distance... ie a stage show,
there is no need to run up under the stage lights with a grey card,
simply shoot an image with the Expodisk from where ever you are and
apply that as your CWB)

Not everyone wants to run out and pay 70 bucks
(or however much it is) for an expodisc.

Me included.... because I don't shoot stage stuff, if I did it
would be well worth the 70 bucks!

I fail to see why you have to insult people who are trying to help. Are you that desperate to feel better about yourself? Yeah. I guess you are.

Actually I am not desperate at all and I apologise, my wording
could have been better.

And who cares if the method is 'Last Century'?? If it works, it works.

Yes it will work, but why not use the equipment to it's full
potential. Digital is digital and it changes the way we do things.
Why do we shoot digital? I would suggest that most of us do because
it is instant gratification and an improved workflow.

To shoot with grey card in shot and apply WB corrections to every
image later in PS makes for a greatly increased workflow and kinda
puts the gratification back a bit too. I shoot events and often
come home with 1000 images... I much rather use the camera to apply
WB to all the images at the time of shooting and spend the extra
time with the kids and not sitting looking at PS.

 

[Russell Stewart]

Russell,

Thanks you for your kind reply. It sounds like I misunderstood your
tone.

No... my first post was a bit trashy, I was early morning here when I sent that and I must not have slept well last night :-( (but that is no excuse)

And yes, indeed, this instuctor is still using film. I'm
still a bit confused. He insinuated that white balance is not what
affects skin tones.

White balance effects all tones and does not simply apply to whites. It is a term that would probably be better changed to "Neutral Balance"... basically cameras set WB and exposure by jumbling up everything in the image and trying to make that an 18% grey (although some manufacturers have shifted the % a bit I think)

So by creating a "neutral" balance you remove any colour casts that are present in the light. Once this cast is removed your whites would be white, your greys grey and your blacks black (colour wise)... all other colours should fall into line and look natural. (however this is where the 10D saturation settings come into play and they need to be dealt with separately, as do the contrast and tone settings)

Also, there are times when "cross casts" exist and these are from multiple lights with different colour temps... in these situations you will often need to cater for the dominant cast and let the others be, or simply look for the middle ground and this is what a CWB will try and achieve.

With regard to skin tones, you may find that many portrait/wedding photographers prefer a "warmer" look, as this gives the image a warm and cosey feel. So when shooting these situations they will often set the WB "by the numbers" or shoot for the "neutral" and adjust the images in PS to create this effect.... I shoot neutral and run a quick "warm-up" script in PS for this purpose (if needed).

So use the white card to set CWB and the grey to set manual exposures, (but as I said earlier the grey works quite well for CWB also, although some will argue) the main thing to remember using the white is to avoid "clipping"... if you blow out the white it will be of no use for setting CWB as it will contain no tonal data.

Russell

PS 2 cups of coffee later and I feel better now.