Alright Nikon, when is the 200-600?

[ghostfox_1]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).

It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

 

[Lasse p]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

"The Answer to the Ultimate Question of Life, the Universe, and Everything is 42"

― Douglas Adams

 

[JasonTheBirder]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

If you want stuff people can afford, you should first ask Nikon for a camera that people can afford and will actually do the 200-600 justice.

 

[PLShutterbug]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

Well, you may not have asked for it, but companies research R&D projects before pulling the trigger on their investment. Obviously someone does indeed want it.

No one here knows why they haven’t launched the 200-600 yet.

 

[PLShutterbug]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

If you want stuff people can afford, you should first ask Nikon for a camera that people can afford and will actually do the 200-600

?? Eight months later and B&H is only into their second month of pre-orders for a camera that costs $5,500. I bet most purchasers left at this point are not pros so I imagine there are a lot of amateurs who can afford that. This amateur was excited to drop $3,300 on the Z7 and I still do good work with it.

Nikon already makes cameras that people interested in a 200-600 lens can afford.

 

[RWN Photo]

.....and we need stuff that more people can afford....

And the mystical Nikon 200-600 is that? Think it will be under $800...?

 

[ghostfox_1]

.....and we need stuff that more people can afford....

And the mystical Nikon 200-600 is that? Think it will be under $800...?

If you can't afford 1500-2k, then buying a z camera and expecting to buy new lenses on the z mount was a bad life choice for you.

2k is a fantastic price for a 200-600, and in line with sony.

If you want lenses under 800, congrats, the ftz exists and you can adapt old glass.

Meanwhile, the rest of us can afford it and have been waiting, but can't justify 3k+.

 

[shuncheung]

Since the roadmaps indicate the 200-600 won't be an S lens, most likely it will be a consumer/prosumer tele similar to the Sony 200-600, which is a $2000 lens. I think Nikon will withhold this type of more mass-market lens until the supply-chain issues and IC chip shortage are in better shape. Otherwise, once it is announced, the demand will be very high and Nikon will have a hard time supplying sufficient quantity, leading to even more frustration.

The F-mount 200-500mm/f5.6 is made in China. Most likely the 200-600 will also be made in China. The Zero-Covid policy over there will lead to more uncertainty for any mass-market products. For whatever parts available, Nikon would rather make higher-end products, e.g. the 800mm/f6.3 PF, but that is another lens Nikon is struggling to produce.

 

[RWN Photo]

.....and we need stuff that more people can afford....

And the mystical Nikon 200-600 is that? Think it will be under $800...?

If you can't afford 1500-2k, then buying a z camera and expecting to buy new lenses on the z mount was a bad life choice for you.
2k is a fantastic price for a 200-600, and in line with sony.

If you want lenses under 800, congrats, the ftz exists and you can adapt old glass.

Meanwhile, the rest of us can afford it and have been waiting, but can't justify 3k+.

But you said we need stuff more people can afford....

And I'd guess that more people can afford $800 than can afford $2000

I agree they need to ramp up production of their lenses... same as someone ramping up production of chips for cars so people with way more money than camera lens snobs can actually go buy one and get it the same day.

 

[ZapperVT]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

If you want stuff people can afford, you should first ask Nikon for a camera that people can afford and will actually do the 200-600

?? Eight months later and B&H is only into their second month of pre-orders for a camera that costs $5,500. I bet most purchasers left at this point are not pros so I imagine there are a lot of amateurs who can afford that. This amateur was excited to drop $3,300 on the Z7 and I still do good work with it.

Nikon already makes cameras that people interested in a 200-600 lens can afford.

Yeah but you chopped off the end of his sentence: "and will actually do the 200-600 justice."

I presume he means a body with advanced AF capabilities, such as wildlife subject recognition and eye tracking. The Z9 is the only Nikon with that, but the Canon R5 and R6 have had it for 2 years, and now the $1500 R7 has it too. As does the $2500 Sony A7iv, the $2500 Fujifilm X-H2S, and the $2200 OM Systems OM-1. These all have the advanced AF that a buyer of the 200-600 will likely want - and can afford.

I just ordered an R7 because I've been waiting 2 years for Nikon to catch up and I've lost patience. My Z7 is great for most things but I want some of that bird eye tracking AF magic and I don't want to wait 2 more years for Nikon.

 

[Droster]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

Firstly the Z30 is literally something that's affordable.

Secondly it's something a lot of people want. Cameras of this class forms the volume of cameras sold. Sony and Canon's market share today is built on cameras like these. It should surprise no one that Nikon's going to not only try and compete there, but to rebuild their base from there too.

Thirdly the 200-600 being the budget option, one would expect them to be one of the last few teles to come out. It makes more business sense to milk the more expensive ones for all you can before you let loose the budget option. Like you said, it's "one off". You don't get the opportunity again once you let it pass.

It sucks but you gotta wait for your turn. Maybe you'll see it when we get the Z7iii.

 

[z2122]

From marketing point of view it's logical...

First you bring out the expensive lenses , then the mid range lenses and those who bought then already a lens will most likely buy also a 200-600 for 1800,- if it is there.

If you do it the other way round and the 200-600 is really good, Nikon wouldn't sell so many 100-400, 400 4.5 and maybe also 800pf. But people who have already a 100-400 and a 800pf will not think too long, before they order the 200-600, because it's relatively low price, compared to that what they already invested .

Unfortunately I cannot justify a 800pf or a 400f2.8, but I am considering the 100-400. Maybe I wouldn't do that, if the 200-600 is already on the market. At the end I could end up with the 100-400 with a TC and the 200-600 :-D :-D

So it's a win win situation ;-) .. Nikon make more revenue and I have 2 lenses (I have sometimes GAS and I like to support Nikon since 30years and I hope that they are successful in the future )

--
catch the light - explore emotions

 

[anycolourfloyd]

I'm not sure I believe there's a deep strategy behind releasing the 200-600 last, as it has caused some potential Nikon customers to move to other brands.

If Nikon released an R7 clone with a Sony 200-600 clone then that's good enough for me.

 

[six34sigma]

Nobody but Nikon knows.

That's why I purchased the 400/4.5 and will buy a 1.4TC for native birding. So 560/6.3 and hope IQ is good. The 800/6.3 is going to be too long. It won't make it out to travel locations.

Expect there to be a mini-Z9 latter half of this year that will give those patiently waiting for a smaller Z9 an option. a Z6iii or. Z7iii equivalent.

 

[CAP2904]

Nobody asked for the z30, and we need stuff that more people can afford, rather than one off hyper expensive lenses (and one which is basically a duplicate of an existing lens, looking at you 400 4.5).
It's been on the roadmap since the literal start.

I've got fed up waiting and have bought a Tamron E mount 150-500 (£200 discount in UK at the moment) and Megadap ETZ21 adapter. The adapter is due to late this week. If it doesn't perform as hoped I'll just get a used Sony A6500 body and use that instead. I do wish Nikon would open up more and allow Sigma, Tamron etc. to produce Z lenses but I know they won't.

 

[ZapperVT]

Since the roadmaps indicate the 200-600 won't be an S lens, most likely it will be a consumer/prosumer tele similar to the Sony 200-600, which is a $2000 lens. I think Nikon will withhold this type of more mass-market lens until the supply-chain issues and IC chip shortage are in better shape. Otherwise, once it is announced, the demand will be very high and Nikon will have a hard time supplying sufficient quantity, leading to even more frustration.

The F-mount 200-500mm/f5.6 is made in China. Most likely the 200-600 will also be made in China. The Zero-Covid policy over there will lead to more uncertainty for any mass-market products. For whatever parts available, Nikon would rather make higher-end products, e.g. the 800mm/f6.3 PF, but that is another lens Nikon is struggling to produce.

All your points are valid. On the other hand, Nikon's competition is currently shipping this type of lens, along with superior bodies to use them on. So the supply chain excuses only go so far.

I see a Sony 200-600, Tamron 150-500, Sigma 150-600 (all FE mount) currently shipping, the Fujifilm 150-600 almost shipping, and the Canon 100-500, which kind of splits the difference between a 100-400 and a 150-600, also shipping.

Also shipping are bodies with advanced subject recognition AF (particularly bird eye tracking AF) under $2500 from Sony, Canon, and Fujifilm - with Fuji adding a fast stacked sensor. Since amateur birders and wildlife enthusiasts are likely the primary customers for this type of lens, subject AF is a key feature that Nikon lacks in all but their flagship body.

Nikon has chosen to fortify their high end sport and wildlife position with a superior selection of mirrorless telephoto primes, but risks the defection of its midrange sports and wildlife customers who currently have superior options elsewhere

 

[shuncheung]

Since the roadmaps indicate the 200-600 won't be an S lens, most likely it will be a consumer/prosumer tele similar to the Sony 200-600, which is a $2000 lens. I think Nikon will withhold this type of more mass-market lens until the supply-chain issues and IC chip shortage are in better shape. Otherwise, once it is announced, the demand will be very high and Nikon will have a hard time supplying sufficient quantity, leading to even more frustration.

The F-mount 200-500mm/f5.6 is made in China. Most likely the 200-600 will also be made in China. The Zero-Covid policy over there will lead to more uncertainty for any mass-market products. For whatever parts available, Nikon would rather make higher-end products, e.g. the 800mm/f6.3 PF, but that is another lens Nikon is struggling to produce.

All your points are valid. On the other hand, Nikon's competition is currently shipping this type of lens, along with superior bodies to use them on. So the supply chain excuses only go so far.

I see a Sony 200-600, Tamron 150-500, Sigma 150-600 (all FE mount) currently shipping, the Fujifilm 150-600 almost shipping, and the Canon 100-500, which kind of splits the difference between a 100-400 and a 150-600, also shipping.

Those Sony mount lenses were announced a long time ago, prior to Covid 19. The initial demands were fulfilled years ago and they are only sustaining production. The Canon 100-500 was announced in 2020 in the early day of the pandemic. Last year (2021) I kept checking and it was never in stock for months.

If Nikon announces the 200-600, there is absolutely no way they can meet the demand and will even affect their high-end lens production, which Nikon is also struggling to meet. I ordered the 800/6.3 S within the first minute when order was open, and I have been waiting for three months. Meanwhile, Nikon discounted their F-mount 200-500/5.6 to $1050. That lens has been out for 7 years and is in sustaining mode. People could have easily taken advantage of that bargain and adapt that to Z.

Also shipping are bodies with advanced subject recognition AF (particularly bird eye tracking AF) under $2500 from Sony, Canon, and Fujifilm - with Fuji adding a fast stacked sensor. Since amateur birders and wildlife enthusiasts are likely the primary customers for this type of lens, subject AF is a key feature that Nikon lacks in all but their flagship body.

Nikon has chosen to fortify their high end sport and wildlife position with a superior selection of mirrorless telephoto primes, but risks the defection of its midrange sports and wildlife customers who currently have superior options elsewhere.

When there are resource constraints, you have to choose where your priorities are. Everybody knows the high end is where the money is and where the remaining market is. If Canon, Fuji, and Sony meet your need better, by all means move to those brands. Keep whining here is not going to change the reality that Covid is not over and the supply chain is very tight. There is no silver bullet to fix those problem overnight. But also keep in mind that Canon has not introduced any pro DO lens in over 10 years. The Canon 400mm/f4 DO lens is $6900, more than twice as the new Nikon 400mm/f4.5. Sony has never introduced any PF lens. If you are interested in PF lenses, Nikon is the only way to go, but if what you want is a 200-600 zoom, Sony has had one for several years and it seems to be very good.

 

[bsinc1962]

There might be some marketing strategy going on but it's probably more related to the expected demand versus the expected supply.

Nikon really can't win here.

If they wait until there's enough supply the forums get lit up with the "where's the 200-600" threads. Release what's available and the forums lite up with the "why did Nikon release this lens if few can get it" threads.

First world problems for sure.

 

[msu79gt82]

I think we need some more threads asking Nikon "Where is [insert wishlist here]"?

Where is the Z50ii, Z70, Z90, ...

Where is the 200-600, where are Z DX lenses, ...

Where are the firmware updates for older cameras, ...

Where is the Z6/7iii, Z8, ...

There are clearly not enough threads asking these vital questions!

I seem to recall reading about global parts shortages, supply chain issues, manufacturing delays, staffing and procurement concerns, etc which apparently are related to a rumored pandemic or something like that. I even heard such challenges are particularly impacting the technology and electronics sectors (possibly even causing automobile shortages). Of course I’m not personally familiar with the business ramifications to know if any of these difficulties do in fact impact the camera industry.

In any event I suspect companies like Nikon are making do with what they have and doing whatever they can to deliver maximum returns on shareholders equity. I am somewhat amazed at the number of threads from people who seem to believe that Nikon is deviously ignoring all customer expectations in an attempt to purposefully commit industrial suicide.

 

[ZapperVT]

Since the roadmaps indicate the 200-600 won't be an S lens, most likely it will be a consumer/prosumer tele similar to the Sony 200-600, which is a $2000 lens. I think Nikon will withhold this type of more mass-market lens until the supply-chain issues and IC chip shortage are in better shape. Otherwise, once it is announced, the demand will be very high and Nikon will have a hard time supplying sufficient quantity, leading to even more frustration.

The F-mount 200-500mm/f5.6 is made in China. Most likely the 200-600 will also be made in China. The Zero-Covid policy over there will lead to more uncertainty for any mass-market products. For whatever parts available, Nikon would rather make higher-end products, e.g. the 800mm/f6.3 PF, but that is another lens Nikon is struggling to produce.

All your points are valid. On the other hand, Nikon's competition is currently shipping this type of lens, along with superior bodies to use them on. So the supply chain excuses only go so far.

I see a Sony 200-600, Tamron 150-500, Sigma 150-600 (all FE mount) currently shipping, the Fujifilm 150-600 almost shipping, and the Canon 100-500, which kind of splits the difference between a 100-400 and a 150-600, also shipping.

Those Sony mount lenses were announced a long time ago, prior to Covid 19. The initial demands were fulfilled years ago and they are only sustaining production.

Not true! The Tamron was announced on 21 April 2021 . The Sigma was announced on 4 August 2021 . Only the Sony lens, announced on 11 June 2019 predates Covid 19. The Tamron and Sigma were launched and put into volume production during the middle of the Covid 19 pandemic, with all the associated supply chain disruptions.

The Canon 100-500 was announced in 2020 in the early day of the pandemic. Last year (2021) I kept checking and it was never in stock for months.

If Nikon announces the 200-600, there is absolutely no way they can meet the demand and will even affect their high-end lens production, which Nikon is also struggling to meet. I ordered the 800/6.3 S within the first minute when order was open, and I have been waiting for three months. Meanwhile, Nikon discounted their F-mount 200-500/5.6 to $1050. That lens has been out for 7 years and is in sustaining mode. People could have easily taken advantage of that bargain and adapt that to Z.

The 200-500 is not compelling compared to the new mirrorless native long zooms.

The fact remains that while Nikon has been trying (successfully) to establish leadership at the high end of the sports & wildlife market, they are forfeiting the midrange to competitors with better lenses and bodies in that segment. This may be Nikon's best play considering resource constraints and supply chain disruption, but that doesn't make it a strong hand. It is a consequence of being behind.

Also shipping are bodies with advanced subject recognition AF (particularly bird eye tracking AF) under $2500 from Sony, Canon, and Fujifilm - with Fuji adding a fast stacked sensor. Since amateur birders and wildlife enthusiasts are likely the primary customers for this type of lens, subject AF is a key feature that Nikon lacks in all but their flagship body.

Nikon has chosen to fortify their high end sport and wildlife position with a superior selection of mirrorless telephoto primes, but risks the defection of its midrange sports and wildlife customers who currently have superior options elsewhere.

When there are resource constraints, you have to choose where your priorities are. Everybody knows the high end is where the money is and where the remaining market is.

I am not arguing that point.

If Canon, Fuji, and Sony meet your need better, by all means move to those brands.

I'm keeping my Z kit but I've ordered an R7 to try out. Changing brands is annoying (everything is backwards!) and expensive. I'd much rather have Nikon produce a competitive midrange product - the 200-600 and a Z70/Z90 with Expeed 7 AF.

Keep whining here is not going to change the reality that Covid is not over and the supply chain is very tight.

Once again, this is not just a supply chain issue, as illustrated by the competition releasing products during the pandemic. It is also a result of Nikon's product planning failures that led to a late entry to the mirrorless market, declining sales, loss of 2nd place market share, negative profits, and resource cuts. While Nikon's business has stabilized, they are now behind Sony and Canon in the midrange products, and maybe also Fuji and OM Systems. The supply chain difficulties just make it harder to get out of the hole they put themselves in.

There is no silver bullet to fix those problem overnight. But also keep in mind that Canon has not introduced any pro DO lens in over 10 years. The Canon 400mm/f4 DO lens is $6900, more than twice as the new Nikon 400mm/f4.5. Sony has never introduced any PF lens. If you are interested in PF lenses, Nikon is the only way to go, but if what you want is a 200-600 zoom, Sony has had one for several years and it seems to be very good.

Like I said:

Nikon has chosen to fortify their high end sport and wildlife position with a superior selection of mirrorless telephoto primes,

I don't know how Nikon could do better given where they're at, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy about it either