The future of tools like Disk Warrior?

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wklee

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I have run into a problem of my MicroSDXC card being corrupted. Disk Utility from Catalina cannot repair the disk. I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?

I have tried to format/erase the card. Partition is grayed out in Disk Utility. The card had been in continuous use in a car dash cam.

--
Never buy version 1.0 of anything.
Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got
Till it's gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot
Joni Mitchell's Big Yellow Taxi
 
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I don't think such apps have much of "a future" with the way the Mac OS is going -- which may end up more and more like the "locked up world" of iOS.

How many "DiskWarrior-like" apps are found there...?
 
I don't think such apps have much of "a future" with the way the Mac OS is going -- which may end up more and more like the "locked up world" of iOS.

How many "DiskWarrior-like" apps are found there...?
There are as far as I know, DiskWarrior, Drive Genius, TechTools Pro, SubRosaSoft (which appears to overlap with Drive Genius when I owned both software).

There is DriveDX and SMART Utility for disk health monitoring. TechTools Pro does this too.

Onyx by Titanium Software?

--
Never buy version 1.0 of anything.
Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got
Till it's gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot
Joni Mitchell's Big Yellow Taxi
 
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I have run into a problem of my MicroSDXC card being corrupted. Disk Utility from Catalina cannot repair the disk. I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?

I have tried to format/erase the card. Partition is grayed out in Disk Utility. The card had been in continuous use in a car dash cam.
A car dash cam would be probably in an extreme temperature environment. Plus the 'continuous use' might have done over the number of rewrites on the SSD or flash drive. So, it might be just a fried SSD (flash drive) for that type of use and no disk recovery application would be of any help. How old is this card and when was it manufactured and what is the initial cost of it?
 
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I have run into a problem of my MicroSDXC card being corrupted. Disk Utility from Catalina cannot repair the disk. I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?

I have tried to format/erase the card. Partition is grayed out in Disk Utility. The card had been in continuous use in a car dash cam.
A car dash cam would be probably in an extreme temperature environment. Plus the 'continuous use' might have done over the number of rewrites on the SSD or flash drive. So, it might be just a fried SSD (flash drive) for that type of use and no disk recovery application would be of any help. How old is this card and when was it manufactured and what is the initial cost of it?
The card a 64GB SanDisk model cost $30 to $40. I don’t recall if it was SanDisk Extreme or Extreme Pro. It was under 1 year old.
 
I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?
Whether a disk utility tool can repair a particular file system has little to do with whether a Mac is Intel- or ARM-based. It is easy to recompile source code. The issue is whether the tool supports the file system in the first place.
 
I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?
Whether a disk utility tool can repair a particular file system has little to do with whether a Mac is Intel- or ARM-based. It is easy to recompile source code. The issue is whether the tool supports the file system in the first place.
I've tried to format to the Apple File System (presuming APFS) from Disk Utility and it will either fail or be successful but nothing that I can see actually happens. I've dragged the folders out to the Mac. I didn't notice any lock from looking at the disk icon. MicroSDXC cards don't have a lock switch.

--
Never buy version 1.0 of anything.
Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got
Till it's gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot
Joni Mitchell's Big Yellow Taxi
 
Last edited:
I've tried to format to the Apple File System (presuming APFS) from Disk Utility and it will either fail or be successful but nothing that I can see actually happens. I've dragged the folders out to the Mac. I didn't notice any lock from looking at the disk icon. MicroSDXC cards don't have a lock switch.
For cards that you're going to use in a digital camera, you don't want to use APFS or HFS+ (or NTFS, for that matter). Cameras don't understand any of those file systems.

The SD Association defines FAT32 as the standard file system for a SDHC card, and exFAT as the standard filesystem for a SDXC one.

SD Association – Capacity (SD/SDHC/SDXC/SDUC)

They also recommend that if you are going to format SD-family cards on a computer, you should not use the standard Windows or Mac OS X formatting utility, but should, instead, use their special memory card formatter.

SD Association – SD Memory Card Formatter
 
I've tried to format to the Apple File System (presuming APFS) from Disk Utility and it will either fail or be successful but nothing that I can see actually happens. I've dragged the folders out to the Mac. I didn't notice any lock from looking at the disk icon. MicroSDXC cards don't have a lock switch.
For cards that you're going to use in a digital camera, you don't want to use APFS or HFS+ (or NTFS, for that matter). Cameras don't understand any of those file systems.

The SD Association defines FAT32 as the standard file system for a SDHC card, and exFAT as the standard filesystem for a SDXC one.

SD Association – Capacity (SD/SDHC/SDXC/SDUC)

They also recommend that if you are going to format SD-family cards on a computer, you should not use the standard Windows or Mac OS X formatting utility, but should, instead, use their special memory card formatter.

SD Association – SD Memory Card Formatter
Thanks. I'm using the SD Memory Card Formatter now. I thought formatting with Disk Utility would work but it didn't.
 
I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?
Whether a disk utility tool can repair a particular file system has little to do with whether a Mac is Intel- or ARM-based. It is easy to recompile source code. The issue is whether the tool supports the file system in the first place.
My understanding is that Apple have still not released the necessary info for these apps to rebuild APFS directories, which they had done for HFS+.

Because of this TechTool and Drive Genius use the same fsck routine to verify and repair that Disk Utility First Aid uses. Disk Warrior just says it can't repair as I remember.

Whether Apple ever intends to release the APFS info is anyones guess. Meanwhile, in my opinion, these apps are not worth having as they are unable to do the main thing I ever bought them for, ie directory repair and rebuild, which has to be done by fsck.

Of course they do many things that Disk Utility doesn't do, so up to you whether they are worth it. DriveDx does the SMART things and is a lot cheaper than Techtool.
 
I tried it on my card and I am seeing the same result as Disk Utility after an Overwrite format.

I'll try formatting it on my Android phone. Nothing seems to be working and I don't have a working PC now.
 
Nothing worked. I dropped the MicroSDXC card and cannot find it now. Thanks all for your replies.

--
Never buy version 1.0 of anything.
Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got
Till it's gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot
Joni Mitchell's Big Yellow Taxi
 
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Nothing worked. I dropped the MicroSDXC card and cannot find it now. Thanks all for your replies.
Well, I was going to suggest dropping it in the trash, but that'll work ;-)

They have a lifespan, and I've toasted more than one in a dashcam. It's good it didn't reformat, since it would probably have corruption that you might not have noticed when it was in the cam.

And as to the future of programs, Micromat now has version of TechTool Pro 13 out, which does work with APFS and can even manage the APFS shapshots for recovering files. And bunches of other stuff.

Whether it's worth it, I don't know. I've found it useful on occasion after I switched from DiskWarrior (not sure they're even developing now). Many of the thing TT does, like some repair, formatting, cloning, etc, can be done with Disk Utility or via the Terminal. But that's true of lot of other utilities like other cloners and synchers. I have been using it so long it pays off just for the ease of making say custom bootable thumb drives and such, but others might not find that so. But I imagine a change in processors won't change it much going forward.
 
Nothing worked. I dropped the MicroSDXC card and cannot find it now. Thanks all for your replies.
Well, I was going to suggest dropping it in the trash, but that'll work ;-)

They have a lifespan, and I've toasted more than one in a dashcam. It's good it didn't reformat, since it would probably have corruption that you might not have noticed when it was in the cam.

And as to the future of programs, Micromat now has version of TechTool Pro 13 out, which does work with APFS and can even manage the APFS shapshots for recovering files. And bunches of other stuff.

Whether it's worth it, I don't know. I've found it useful on occasion after I switched from DiskWarrior (not sure they're even developing now). Many of the thing TT does, like some repair, formatting, cloning, etc, can be done with Disk Utility or via the Terminal. But that's true of lot of other utilities like other cloners and synchers. I have been using it so long it pays off just for the ease of making say custom bootable thumb drives and such, but others might not find that so. But I imagine a change in processors won't change it much going forward.
Yes but...

From Micromat:

"It is understandable to conclude that Mojave, or Catalina support and APFS support would mean the same thing. However, the operating system and the file system are, in fact, distinct from one another. While the operating system serves as the 'window' for interacting with drives in many ways, there is no API for dealing with the disk directly.

The current documentation from Apple does not include sufficient information to write a tool to defragment APFS volumes. The extent of the documentation on the subject so far is a feature flag labeled NX_FEATURE_DEFRAG which indicates whether an APFS container supports defragmentation.

If Apple releases additional documentation that provides sufficient information for manipulating the data directly on disk, we will explore whether a defragmentation feature is feasible for *rotational* APFS drives. Defragmentation on Solid State Drives in the traditional sense will not be supported, as organizing data on solid state devices only serves to increase wear, and provides no performance benefit.

Likewise, while the Volume Rebuild can repair many drives with volume structures problems, a full rebuild that reorganizes the volume structures can only be implemented once Apple provides further documentation.

It is important to note as well that Techtool Pro uses a low-level API to test, repair, rebuild, and defragment Mac OS Extended volumes. No such API yet exists for APFS, and it is unclear if Apple will make one available."
 
Nothing worked. I dropped the MicroSDXC card and cannot find it now. Thanks all for your replies.
Well, I was going to suggest dropping it in the trash, but that'll work ;-)

They have a lifespan, and I've toasted more than one in a dashcam. It's good it didn't reformat, since it would probably have corruption that you might not have noticed when it was in the cam.

And as to the future of programs, Micromat now has version of TechTool Pro 13 out, which does work with APFS and can even manage the APFS shapshots for recovering files. And bunches of other stuff.

Whether it's worth it, I don't know. I've found it useful on occasion after I switched from DiskWarrior (not sure they're even developing now). Many of the thing TT does, like some repair, formatting, cloning, etc, can be done with Disk Utility or via the Terminal. But that's true of lot of other utilities like other cloners and synchers. I have been using it so long it pays off just for the ease of making say custom bootable thumb drives and such, but others might not find that so. But I imagine a change in processors won't change it much going forward.
Yes but...

From Micromat:

"It is understandable to conclude that Mojave, or Catalina support and APFS support would mean the same thing. However, the operating system and the file system are, in fact, distinct from one another. While the operating system serves as the 'window' for interacting with drives in many ways, there is no API for dealing with the disk directly.

The current documentation from Apple does not include sufficient information to write a tool to defragment APFS volumes. The extent of the documentation on the subject so far is a feature flag labeled NX_FEATURE_DEFRAG which indicates whether an APFS container supports defragmentation.

If Apple releases additional documentation that provides sufficient information for manipulating the data directly on disk, we will explore whether a defragmentation feature is feasible for *rotational* APFS drives. Defragmentation on Solid State Drives in the traditional sense will not be supported, as organizing data on solid state devices only serves to increase wear, and provides no performance benefit.

Likewise, while the Volume Rebuild can repair many drives with volume structures problems, a full rebuild that reorganizes the volume structures can only be implemented once Apple provides further documentation.

It is important to note as well that Techtool Pro uses a low-level API to test, repair, rebuild, and defragment Mac OS Extended volumes. No such API yet exists for APFS, and it is unclear if Apple will make one available."
That is the Micromat confirmation of what I said earlier.

In HFS+ days, ie pre High Sierra, Alsoft, Micromat and Prosoft each had their own special directory repair and rebuild tools. Sometimes one would work better than another and DiskWarrior earned a special reputation. Now they all (except DW which does make any claim to support APFS) use the same low level API that Disk Utility First Aid uses ie fsck.
 
I have run into a problem of my MicroSDXC card being corrupted. Disk Utility from Catalina cannot repair the disk. I wonder about Apple Silicon and how will Alsoft and ProSoft Engineering respond to the new ARM based Macs?

I have tried to format/erase the card. Partition is grayed out in Disk Utility. The card had been in continuous use in a car dash cam.
1. Disk Utility has never been much good with serious problems, not just in Catalina.

2. I'm not sure of the relevance of Apple Silicon to developers like Alsoft and TTP, etc? Those apps work at deep down levels, but the chip medium isn't relevant. To give you a case in point, they work on both HD and SSD but the software doesn't care what kind of chip is there, just as long as MacOS is running.

3. Therefore, try Disk Warrior to see if that solves the issue. The silicon is, I repeat, not relevant .
 
Nothing worked. I dropped the MicroSDXC card and cannot find it now. Thanks all for your replies.
Well, I was going to suggest dropping it in the trash, but that'll work ;-)
My initial reaction was that unless the card has data relevant to an insurance claim or traffic citation, it does not seem worth going to a lot of trouble trying to fix it. Losing the card is actually a blessing because now the OP can focus on something more worthwhile or at least fun. ;-)
They have a lifespan, and I've toasted more than one in a dashcam. It's good it didn't reformat, since it would probably have corruption that you might not have noticed when it was in the cam.
This comment got me to wondering just how much memory cards in dashcams are prone to corruption and/or failure. If I owned a dashcam I would spend some time researching the question. . . It would help in making decisions about replacing/buying memory cards in the future.
And as to the future of programs, Micromat now has version of TechTool Pro 13 out, which does work with APFS and can even manage the APFS shapshots for recovering files. And bunches of other stuff.

Whether it's worth it, I don't know. I've found it useful on occasion after I switched from DiskWarrior (not sure they're even developing now). Many of the thing TT does, like some repair, formatting, cloning, etc, can be done with Disk Utility or via the Terminal. But that's true of lot of other utilities like other cloners and synchers. I have been using it so long it pays off just for the ease of making say custom bootable thumb drives and such, but others might not find that so. But I imagine a change in processors won't change it much going forward.
DiskWarrior was once my go-to disk utility. . . I've seen it literally raise the dead, fixing a hard drive that otherwise was toast. It was also great for maintaining directories so I didn't need to perform Mac CPR at some inconvenient place and time.

But around the time DW made the move to thumb-drives the company seemed to lose its way. I had trouble getting drives to boot and updating the utility was a royal pain. I finally gave up on it. . .

Drive DX doesn't fix anything but it seems to be a fine tool for monitoring the health of my mechanical drives and SSDs. The level of S.M.A.R.T. monitoring it provides depends on the drive and enclosure. Many external enclosures offer very limited S.M.A.R.T. monitoring. OWC told me that only one of their enclosures is compatible with full S.M.A.R.T. monitoring.
 
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No one can say except the company selling the stuff. There are some technical hurdles to overcome so they might stop selling it or recompile for the latest silicon MacOS (which won't always be trivial).
 
Just thrilled that Carbon Copy Cloner can still work. I imagined years ago that Apple would eventually make the boot system unclonable.
 

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