Helios-44 2/58mm 13 blades worth it?

[Prince Harbinger]

Hey everyone! I'm really interested in this lens for it's famous swirly bokeh. From your experience is it worth adapting and using? I will be using it on a APS-C sensor. The price will be about $100.00. From what I have heard the early 13 blade version has the best bokeh. Plus, I love that shiny finish! If you have any examples please feel free to post them. Thanks for your time.

 

[John Knuhtsen]

One can google that it can be found with 8, 13 or even 16 blades. Some says that it does not matter so much. Can it be any cheaper. I have one, but I have not counted the blades. It is extremely sharp.

 

[Milken]

I'd not pay extra for the 13 blades. You'll mostly shoot wide open to get that swirly bokeh. The lens is trash anyway. Don't get me wrong, I really like it but I'd definitively not pay more than 30-40 for it.

 

[Suave]

It feels like with a $100 budget you could shopping for a Biotar.

 

[Prince Harbinger]

It feels like with a $100 budget you could shopping for a Biotar.

I'd like to spend no more than $194.00 I already brought $2000.00 worth of lenses. The Biotar better than the Sonnar Contax 135mm f2.8?

 

[Prince Harbinger]

I'd not pay extra for the 13 blades. You'll mostly shoot wide open to get that swirly bokeh. The lens is trash anyway. Don't get me wrong, I really like it but I'd definitively not pay more than 30-40 for it.

If only I could find a excellent copy from a honest seller for that price. Why do you feel it is trash?

 

[Milken]

The interest for this lens is:

1. Swirly bokeh
2. Cheap

To obtain the Swirly bokeh, you must shoot @ 2/2.8. At such wide aperture, having 13 instead of 8 blades will make little to no difference. The only interest of having more blade is when you stop down, you want to keep ball bokeh of wider aperture.

This lens is not quite good. The design is decade old, the coating is bad and the sharpness is really nothing to be impressed with. You don't use this lens for the sharpness anyway. You want that weird eerie bokeh. There are no situation where you'll use this lens as your flagship, ever on your camera. You just said you got 2k$ worth of lens. Why spend again more for a crappy lens that will never replace the quality of your current lens?

I really like my Helios 44-2 but as a special lens for a specific purpose, i.e., close subject to get that swirly background bokeh. For that, I think 40$ is really awesome for the quality of the lens and the picture it creates. It's good for such an inexpensive lens and for that time but a lot have changed since, especially when it comes to flare resistance. So it's a very nice lens to have but just don't overpay for this thing... Just take one cheap and then decide if you really want a model that's in better condition and a better version.

 

[SLN001]

1. There are millions of Helios-44 lenses in the world, with patience it shouldn't be difficult to find an excellent copy at significantly less than $100.

2. The 'swirly bokeh...

a. This lens does produce swirly bokeh, but only under the right conditions. The subject needs to be at the correct distance from the photographer. The background needs to be the correct distance from the subject. The make-up of the background needs to be of the right type (brick walls don't work, backlit trees with lots of branches generally do). It takes lots of practice, and often a series of posed/re-posed shots to get that 'spontaneous' swirl. If you expect to get the lens, mount it on your camera and go out shooting swirly images you are likely to be disappointed.

b. An APS-C camera will primarily be using the middle of the lens, most of the light from around the edges of the lens will not fall on the sensor. This will reduce the overall swirl effect that the lens is capable of.

c. The swirly bokeh is generally most evident when the lens is used wide open. Closing down the aperture converts the Helios to it's alter ego, a beautifully sharp normal lens. Shooting wide open it really doesn't matter if the lens has 16, 13 or 8 blades in the aperture because the blades aren't in the light path.

3. My recommendation is that you buy a cheap, serviceable Helios and practice with it before you decide to spend big dollars (and for the Helios $100 IS big dollars) on one.

 

[Suave]

It feels like with a $100 budget you could shopping for a Biotar.

I'd like to spend no more than $194.00 I already brought $2000.00 worth of lenses. The Biotar better than the Sonnar Contax 135mm f2.8?

Biotar is 58mm f/2, completely different focal range, it and 135/2.8 would complement each other, not compete.

 

[DAVID MANZE]

Helios 58mm F2 M44-2 ....8 blades [email protected]'ve no idea why people say this lens isn't sharp.........what's not sharp about that?..............and nice eight point stars!

Absolutely no need to pay good money for this hyper common lens....any sort of car boot/jumble sale will turn one up for peanuts.

I bought the M44-2 and the M44-4 for eight euros for both at a flea market...... I lathe modified the M44-2 for the Nikon F mount with cheap M42 K mount to Nikon F adapter to get infinity focus......the M44-4 has the front element reversed to give that veiled dreamy look.


Helios M44-4 with front element reversed.......just reversing the element enables infinity focus.

Swirly bokeh is there when wide open on a FF body, APSc sensored cameras will not have a lot of this swirl though.

So a Helios should always be a deal-------ios!

--
Dave's clichés

 

[Prince Harbinger]

Helios 58mm F2 M44-2 ....8 blades [email protected]'ve no idea why people say this lens isn't sharp.........what's not sharp about that?..............and nice eight point stars!

Absolutely no need to pay good money for this hyper common lens....any sort of car boot/jumble sale will turn one up for peanuts.

I bought the M44-2 and the M44-4 for eight euros for both at a flea market...... I lathe modified the M44-2 for the Nikon F mount with cheap M42 K mount to Nikon F adapter to get infinity focus......the M44-4 has the front element reversed to give that veiled dreamy look.


Helios M44-4 with front element reversed.......just reversing the element enables infinity focus.

Swirly bokeh is there when wide open on a FF body, APSc sensored cameras will not have a lot of this swirl though.

So a Helios should always be a deal-------ios!

--
Dave's clichés

Wonderful examples! I had a theory that they were buying them dirt cheap at flea markets and thrift stores. I probably could use a focal reducer. I do plan to buy a FF in two years. I might just go for the 44-2 since it is cheaper.

 

[Tom Caldwell]

A good assessment. One not often spoken of attribute of all Helios-44 lenses is that because they are cheap and of relatively simple construction they are a good lens to practice your lens repair skills by pulling apart, cleaning and rebuilding.

Some other lenses are monsters of complication and weird construction. Hard to know how to start getting inside and full of odd springs and levers, little ball bearings that pop out as if fired by a cannon and flea size slot head screws whose lugs break off and tend to dance around and disappear on to the floor without any provocation.

Pull lenses apart on a tray - you will be glad you did.

But doing up a Helios-44 can almost be fun ....

--
Tom Caldwell

 

[Prince Harbinger]

A good assessment. One not often spoken of attribute of all Helios-44 lenses is that because they are cheap and of relatively simple construction they are a good lens to practice your lens repair skills by pulling apart, cleaning and rebuilding.

Some other lenses are monsters of complication and weird construction. Hard to know how to start getting inside and full of odd springs and levers, little ball bearings that pop out as if fired by a cannon and flea size slot head screws whose lugs break off and tend to dance around and disappear on to the floor without any provocation.

Pull lenses apart on a tray - you will be glad you did.

But doing up a Helios-44 can almost be fun ....

 

[Proplus888]

A good assessment. One not often spoken of attribute of all Helios-44 lenses is that because they are cheap and of relatively simple construction they are a good lens to practice your lens repair skills by pulling apart, cleaning and rebuilding.

Some other lenses are monsters of complication and weird construction. Hard to know how to start getting inside and full of odd springs and levers, little ball bearings that pop out as if fired by a cannon and flea size slot head screws whose lugs break off and tend to dance around and disappear on to the floor without any provocation.

Pull lenses apart on a tray - you will be glad you did.

I can recommend getting one of these repair mats:

Loading…

www.aliexpress.com

...holds tools and small parts, and has run-off areas for screws to slide into if they slip out of your fingers/tools.

But doing up a Helios-44 can almost be fun ....

 

[Lightshow]

A good assessment. One not often spoken of attribute of all Helios-44 lenses is that because they are cheap and of relatively simple construction they are a good lens to practice your lens repair skills by pulling apart, cleaning and rebuilding.

Some other lenses are monsters of complication and weird construction. Hard to know how to start getting inside and full of odd springs and levers, little ball bearings that pop out as if fired by a cannon and flea size slot head screws whose lugs break off and tend to dance around and disappear on to the floor without any provocation.

I agree, the 44-2 is a great lens to learn lens construction, it's relativity simple construction and it's built like a tank, you really have to try to mess one up.

Pull lenses apart on a tray - you will be glad you did.

I can recommend getting one of these repair mats:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/ESD...lgo_pvid=564d1801-d85f-4a36-b45e-d9c03322ddb9

...holds tools and small parts, and has run-off areas for screws to slide into if they slip out of your fingers/tools.

But doing up a Helios-44 can almost be fun ....

I use a microfiber cloth as the base for my repair work, so that if a lens element falls out it will land on the cloth and prevent scratches or chips, also, small screws don't bounce as much and typically stay close, that doesn't stop me from dropping them, that where a magnet comes in handy to find the smallest parts when they hit the floor.

 

[Lightshow]

It feels like with a $100 budget you could shopping for a Biotar.

I'd like to spend no more than $194.00 I already brought $2000.00 worth of lenses. The Biotar better than the Sonnar Contax 135mm f2.8?

Just look for a nice 44-2, they're nearly at the same level of a 58/2 Biotar but 1/3 the price.

I have the 58/2 Biotar, Helios 44(f22), Helios 44 13blade, and Helios 44-2, I use the 44-2 the most. I also have the CZJ 80/2.8 Tessar which is a nice match to the 58/2 Biotar and 135/4 Sonnor and 35/2.8 Flek.

I will say that the 58/2 Biotar I have(Exakta) is a couple orders of magnitude harder to service than my 44-2, it took me 2-3 days to service the Biotar, I can service the 44-2 in an hour.

--
A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/
[My Lens list](http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/viewprofile.php?Action=viewprofile&username=LightShow)
####Where's my FF NEX-7 ?????

https://flic.kr/p/Q2b9mq

https://flic.kr/p/PgwEjs

Firmware request:
-A button map for toggling the EVF & LCD
-Still waiting for the minimum shutter speed with auto ISO for my NEX-7 and A7r. I know it will never happen.
-Customize the display screen layout, I'd love to have both Histogram and level at the same time.
-More peaking options, being able to set peaking sensitivity and a threshold level.
-An RGB overlay on the histogram

https://flic.kr/p/wQd7zp

-An option to return the focus assist zoom to one button press
-An option to return to how the NEX-7 handled playback, ie. center button to zoom, then you could use the control dial to zoom in and out, then center button to exit the zoom mode.

 

[Proplus888]

A good assessment. One not often spoken of attribute of all Helios-44 lenses is that because they are cheap and of relatively simple construction they are a good lens to practice your lens repair skills by pulling apart, cleaning and rebuilding.

Some other lenses are monsters of complication and weird construction. Hard to know how to start getting inside and full of odd springs and levers, little ball bearings that pop out as if fired by a cannon and flea size slot head screws whose lugs break off and tend to dance around and disappear on to the floor without any provocation.

I agree, the 44-2 is a great lens to learn lens construction, it's relativity simple construction and it's built like a tank, you really have to try to mess one up.

Pull lenses apart on a tray - you will be glad you did.

I can recommend getting one of these repair mats:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/ESD...lgo_pvid=564d1801-d85f-4a36-b45e-d9c03322ddb9

...holds tools and small parts, and has run-off areas for screws to slide into if they slip out of your fingers/tools.

But doing up a Helios-44 can almost be fun ....

I use a microfiber cloth as the base for my repair work, so that if a lens element falls out it will land on the cloth and prevent scratches or chips, also, small screws don't bounce as much and typically stay close, that doesn't stop me from dropping them, that where a magnet comes in handy to find the smallest parts when they hit the floor.

I have a repair mat that is magnetic, so any screws that fall out adhere to it.

 

[Tom Caldwell]

A good assessment. One not often spoken of attribute of all Helios-44 lenses is that because they are cheap and of relatively simple construction they are a good lens to practice your lens repair skills by pulling apart, cleaning and rebuilding.

Some other lenses are monsters of complication and weird construction. Hard to know how to start getting inside and full of odd springs and levers, little ball bearings that pop out as if fired by a cannon and flea size slot head screws whose lugs break off and tend to dance around and disappear on to the floor without any provocation.

Pull lenses apart on a tray - you will be glad you did.

But doing up a Helios-44 can almost be fun ....

Very large links can play Jack Hobb with my iPad screen formatting (I have discovered).

But in any case: responding to the magnetic posts here:

I lost a tiny (very essential) steel ball bearing “somewhere” on a tiled floor once. Solved the problem with a strong magnet on a length of string which was then waved over the whole possible floor area. It found the miscreant eventually.

Necessity is the mother of invention ....

 

[ItsMeSB]

Hello all...

I'm new to the forum and relatively new to photography. I've recently become interested in experimenting with inexpensive vintage lenses. I recently purchased a very nice Kenko fisheye conversion lens and a 40-80mm Pentax to go along with it (once the canon adapter arrives) to get the full diameter of the fisheye... hopefully )

My latest curiosity is in the Helios 44 series of lenses for that beautiful/fun bokeh effect. I have found two 13 blade, one 44 and one 44-3 MC each for $170. They look amazing with CLA. The problem is mainly the price, but the 44-3 does not resemble any other 44-3 I've found online anywhere. Every one I've seen are encased in aluminum, but the $170 one is black with silver accents; the seller does mention "very rare Zebra made by BOMA". The 44 is glossy black and low SN from KMZ.

Can someone give me the skinny on these and help me avoid getting ripped off? I see in much older threads here that these lenses were in the past very inexpensive and for the most part still are, but they're usually quite dusty and/or noticeably imperfect in several areas. And these 2 seem to be more rare models and are beautifully clean.

I've read most of the Helios posts and narrowed my choices to either of the above models. That said, there are so many details regarding each version and many opinions as well here on DPReview I am overwhelmed. I like the idea of 13 blades to ensure the beautiful round bokeh effect. Not sure of any other benefit. I also think the multicoating has some important benefits as well. I'm leaning toward the 44-3 for that as well as 52mm filter threads, but not sure why I'd ever want to use filters unless shooting for BW.

Thanks in advance for any advice and/or comments.

ItsMeSB

ps If this should be posted as a new post rather than a reply, I'd appreciate if a Mod would move to appropriate thread.

 

[moedius]

Hello all...

I'm new to the forum and relatively new to photography. I've recently become interested in experimenting with inexpensive vintage lenses. I recently purchased a very nice Kenko fisheye conversion lens and a 40-80mm Pentax to go along with it (once the canon adapter arrives) to get the full diameter of the fisheye... hopefully )

My latest curiosity is in the Helios 44 series of lenses for that beautiful/fun bokeh effect. I have found two 13 blade, one 44 and one 44-3 MC each for $170. They look amazing with CLA. The problem is mainly the price, but the 44-3 does not resemble any other 44-3 I've found online anywhere. Every one I've seen are encased in aluminum, but the $170 one is black with silver accents; the seller does mention "very rare Zebra made by BOMA". The 44 is glossy black and low SN from KMZ.

Can someone give me the skinny on these and help me avoid getting ripped off? I see in much older threads here that these lenses were in the past very inexpensive and for the most part still are, but they're usually quite dusty and/or noticeably imperfect in several areas. And these 2 seem to be more rare models and are beautifully clean.

I've read most of the Helios posts and narrowed my choices to either of the above models. That said, there are so many details regarding each version and many opinions as well here on DPReview I am overwhelmed. I like the idea of 13 blades to ensure the beautiful round bokeh effect. Not sure of any other benefit. I also think the multicoating has some important benefits as well. I'm leaning toward the 44-3 for that as well as 52mm filter threads, but not sure why I'd ever want to use filters unless shooting for BW.

Thanks in advance for any advice and/or comments.

ItsMeSB

ps If this should be posted as a new post rather than a reply, I'd appreciate if a Mod would move to appropriate thread.

Well it's fairly on topic and I don't think the adapted lens forum minds old threads being revived, considering the products in question are often so old.

Unfortunately I can't help you much on your question, other than to wish you good luck in your quest. I've had a couple 44M, none of the ones you're interested in. I've tried to learn some of the general Helios knowledge, and I guess some has stuck, but the history and the models are so convoluted I gave up trying to acquire anything more than a passing general grasp, and I'll likely stick to the most common models - I'd be too easy of a mark if I went looking for one of the rarer ones.