Am I having issues with my D600 vs D80?

[kelela1019]

Odd question, I know, but I was hoping maybe someone could point me in the right direction.

I learned how to shoot manually on my dad's old D80. I felt like I was getting pretty good at mastering all the knobs and how to use them. I decided to upgrade to FX and went with the new entry-level D600 (at the time). It seems like everything I learned makes my pictures bad. Don't get me wrong, if I shoot enough and with the help of Lightroom, they look awesome, but with my D80, I could shoot less, edit less, and I feel like they were the same.

Here's my Flickr account: https://www.flickr.com/photos/28199661@N08/
Everything in the beginning is my D600, from the orange on the keyboard on is my D80 (some of it's just random dog shots, so y'know, don't expect all that stuff to look great, whereas I picked the greatest from my D600 to upload).

From what I can tell, these are the issues I'm having with my D600 that I didn't have before.

1. My temps seem to always be off (even if I put it on auto or choose a temp for the day/shot)
2. Things always seem either out of focus or really harsh (like it's too sharp). I have tried all different kinds of settings, even to the point of resetting it all and putting it on auto, just to see the difference between the two, or manual with specific settings.
3. I have tried different lenses (I currently own a 50 prime and a 28-300 - both Nikon), and even tried my DX lenses and vice versa.
4. The colors never seem vibrant or rich regardless of the settings I choose. With the D80, no matter the lens, colors just popped before I touched them up at all.
5. With the D80, my LR edits consisted of temp (make it more warm) and maybe some black (make some things pop). With my D600, I have to adjust exposure, temp, a lot of the white/black/contrast, etc just to mimic what I see with my D80.

Unfortunately, I don't currently have side-by-side pictures, but can try to get some this weekend. Any thoughts on what I am doing wrong? Is it just me having to learn a whole new, more techy camera and I haven't gotten there yet?

Thank you for any feedback.

 

[Dyun27]

Odd question, I know, but I was hoping maybe someone could point me in the right direction.

I learned how to shoot manually on my dad's old D80. I felt like I was getting pretty good at mastering all the knobs and how to use them. I decided to upgrade to FX and went with the new entry-level D600 (at the time). It seems like everything I learned makes my pictures bad. Don't get me wrong, if I shoot enough and with the help of Lightroom, they look awesome, but with my D80, I could shoot less, edit less, and I feel like they were the same.

Here's my Flickr account: https://www.flickr.com/photos/28199661@N08/
Everything in the beginning is my D600, from the orange on the keyboard on is my D80 (some of it's just random dog shots, so y'know, don't expect all that stuff to look great, whereas I picked the greatest from my D600 to upload).
From what I can tell, these are the issues I'm having with my D600 that I didn't have before.

1. My temps seem to always be off (even if I put it on auto or choose a temp for the day/shot)
2. Things always seem either out of focus or really harsh (like it's too sharp). I have tried all different kinds of settings, even to the point of resetting it all and putting it on auto, just to see the difference between the two, or manual with specific settings.
3. I have tried different lenses (I currently own a 50 prime and a 28-300 - both Nikon), and even tried my DX lenses and vice versa.
4. The colors never seem vibrant or rich regardless of the settings I choose. With the D80, no matter the lens, colors just popped before I touched them up at all.
5. With the D80, my LR edits consisted of temp (make it more warm) and maybe some black (make some things pop). With my D600, I have to adjust exposure, temp, a lot of the white/black/contrast, etc just to mimic what I see with my D80.

Unfortunately, I don't currently have side-by-side pictures, but can try to get some this weekend. Any thoughts on what I am doing wrong? Is it just me having to learn a whole new, more techy camera and I haven't gotten there yet?
Thank you for any feedback.

The D600 produces excellent image quality for most users, so I have to assume that in this case it's user error. I had a D600, I have a D610 and a D750 now, and I've never had trouble getting what I want out of them.

1.) Do you have a problem with the white balance in-camera, or in Lightroom? Does the image look good on the back screen of the camera? If you don't like what you see on the back of the camera, learn to set a custom white balance. You can use a white napkin, or buy an expo disc to set it. Save it and use that setting for that particular light source like sunlight, or overcast, etc.

2.) The photos I checked on your flickr account have one thing in common.... narrow apertures and slow shutter speeds, which means motion blur. Use a faster shutter speed when hand-holding, at least 1/200s if you're not using VR. If you're using VR, be aware that when using slow shutter speeds, anything that moves during your exposure will probably have motion blur. To freeze the frame with moving elements, you need faster shutter speeds.

3.) The 50mm should be plenty sharp stopped down, whether it's the f/1.8 or f/1.4. The 28-300mm is not a stellar lens and on a 24 megapixel camera, it's weaknesses will be more apparent compared to when it's attached to the D80.

4.) The D600 has a lot more dynamic range compared to your older D80. That means contrast might look weak in the D600 images, because it records a lot more shadow and highlight detail. Have you tried adjusting the in-camera picture controls? You can even upload your own! You can create custom picture controls in Nikon's software: https://downloadcenter.nikonimglib.com/en/products/163/Picture_Control_Utility_2.html You can also find custom picture controls for download here: https://nikonpc.com/ If you want to shoot RAW, you can use Nikon's free software such as Capture NX-D or View NX-i to process your RAW files and these programs will apply your in-camera picture controls to your RAW files. Lightroom does not do this and personally I do not like the way Lightroom reads Nikon's RAW files. The white balance always seems off. I prefer using DxO PhotoLab Elite 2 for that, because it pulls better colors from my Nikons IMO.

5.) If you're set on using Lightroom to process your RAW files, create a custom profile with increased contrast, saturation and so on and set it to be applied to all your RAW files automatically upon import. However... I know that the white balance reading in Lightroom will displease you, and for this reason I think you should give DxO PhotoLab a try. Here's a free 30 day trial: https://www.dxo.com/dxo-photolab/

If you have to adjust the exposure all the time, maybe you're not using the proper metering mode, and maybe you need to adjust the overall EV. For example if you find your camera is overexposing everything in Matrix metering mode, set the EV to -0.3 or -0.7EV. If your camera is underexposing in Matrix metering mode, set the EV to +0.3 or +0.7EV.

These cameras have many settings that are meant to be explored and set to your preferences. It takes a long time for a photographer to figure out a new camera. Give it time, experiment, google it, and in time you'll start getting what you want out of the D600. It's always like that with new models.... we got used to the old model and the new one is different. It's better, but has a learning curve and its own idiosyncrasies.

-

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[lac111]

I've owned several Nikon bodies including the D80 and currently D750. The D750 and D600 share the same sensor. I find the D750 sensor rendering exceptional, auto white balance not perfect but quite good. As far as shooting "manually" the principles of exposure with the relationship of shutter speed, aperture and iso are the same for every camera body. The D600 has more features and more customization ability than the D80, but use shouldn't be radically different. Switching from DX to FX first thing you'll notice is DOF differences. Many people prefer the shallower DOF of FX and it's easy enough to stop down more to achieve comparable DX DOF.

I took a brief look at your gallery, particularly noting similar shots from D600 and D80, mostly the dog shots. As the other member noted it seems you are using slower shutter speeds with the D600 compared to D80. Maybe that's not universal, and just in the images I looked at. The average person can successfully handhold about 1/60 and maintain focus, many can do 1/30 sec, but slower than that it's dicey even with a VR lens. It requires excellent technique. The D600 has far better high iso capabilities than the D80, a few stops, so no reason not to bump up iso if necessary to get sufficient shutter speed.

The subject matter in many of your images is quite beautiful. I don't know how much PP you've done to the D600 images, but I don't find any particularly lacking in color, contrast etc. I tend to prefer a more natural look, but for those that don't it's easy enough to punch up in camera color, contrast.

Seems you've had your D600 for a few years. I do see focus issues going back to the D80 images. The D600 has a huge advantage of having AF Fine Tune. Have you ever tested your lenses to see if they require some adjustment? A lens can be fine on one body and back or front focus on another. It's about the specific body lens combination. It's important to eliminate yourself (your technique) from the equation and test with a tripod or body on a stable surface using timer delay. It's possible the camera body itself might need adjustment if all lenses are incapable of achieving sharp focus. That's where I'd start for sure. Check out the DOT TUNE METHOD. I noticed from EXIF you have high in camera sharpness set. It's a matter of opinion, but many including myself would recommend a lower setting and doing major sharpening in PP.

You have some very nice images in your gallery. The D600 is a very capable camera with one of the best sensors Nikon has ever produced. If you're unhappy with it, I hope you'll continue to explore the reasons why. It might be worthwhile to buy one of the books about the D600 that specifically explains each setting and how to adjust the camera. They go far more in detail than the manual, Thom Hogan's are excellent.

 

[kelela1019]

Thank you for the feedback (sorry for the delayed response).

Before I respond to any of it, I'm going to go home and see how things look on my camera vs what I was seeing on the computer. And try a few things that you suggested?

But one question first, as for the shutter speed and aperture, I'm usually at f5-ish - is that considered wide?

The D600 produces excellent image quality for most users, so I have to assume that in this case it's user error. I had a D600, I have a D610 and a D750 now, and I've never had trouble getting what I want out of them.

1.) Do you have a problem with the white balance in-camera, or in Lightroom? Does the image look good on the back screen of the camera? If you don't like what you see on the back of the camera, learn to set a custom white balance. You can use a white napkin, or buy an expo disc to set it. Save it and use that setting for that particular light source like sunlight, or overcast, etc.

2.) The photos I checked on your flickr account have one thing in common.... narrow apertures and slow shutter speeds, which means motion blur. Use a faster shutter speed when hand-holding, at least 1/200s if you're not using VR. If you're using VR, be aware that when using slow shutter speeds, anything that moves during your exposure will probably have motion blur. To freeze the frame with moving elements, you need faster shutter speeds.

3.) The 50mm should be plenty sharp stopped down, whether it's the f/1.8 or f/1.4. The 28-300mm is not a stellar lens and on a 24 megapixel camera, it's weaknesses will be more apparent compared to when it's attached to the D80.

4.) The D600 has a lot more dynamic range compared to your older D80. That means contrast might look weak in the D600 images, because it records a lot more shadow and highlight detail. Have you tried adjusting the in-camera picture controls? You can even upload your own! You can create custom picture controls in Nikon's software: https://downloadcenter.nikonimglib.com/en/products/163/Picture_Control_Utility_2.html You can also find custom picture controls for download here: https://nikonpc.com/ If you want to shoot RAW, you can use Nikon's free software such as Capture NX-D or View NX-i to process your RAW files and these programs will apply your in-camera picture controls to your RAW files. Lightroom does not do this and personally I do not like the way Lightroom reads Nikon's RAW files. The white balance always seems off. I prefer using DxO PhotoLab Elite 2 for that, because it pulls better colors from my Nikons IMO.

5.) If you're set on using Lightroom to process your RAW files, create a custom profile with increased contrast, saturation and so on and set it to be applied to all your RAW files automatically upon import. However... I know that the white balance reading in Lightroom will displease you, and for this reason I think you should give DxO PhotoLab a try. Here's a free 30 day trial: https://www.dxo.com/dxo-photolab/

If you have to adjust the exposure all the time, maybe you're not using the proper metering mode, and maybe you need to adjust the overall EV. For example if you find your camera is overexposing everything in Matrix metering mode, set the EV to -0.3 or -0.7EV. If your camera is underexposing in Matrix metering mode, set the EV to +0.3 or +0.7EV.

These cameras have many settings that are meant to be explored and set to your preferences. It takes a long time for a photographer to figure out a new camera. Give it time, experiment, google it, and in time you'll start getting what you want out of the D600. It's always like that with new models.... we got used to the old model and the new one is different. It's better, but has a learning curve and its own idiosyncrasies.

-

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[kelela1019]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm starting to think some of the focus issue is my vision. I'm farsighted in my shooting eye and 20/20 in my non-shooting eye. Ugh. I may have to adjust as it throws me off a lot, especially when it comes to focusing (my eyes, not the camera).

I don't think I realized I was at such a slow shutter speed, but I tend to use the meter to help me with exposure. Hmmm...let me look into this when I get home.

Most of the PP done on my photos is white balance and exposure with some adjustment to the blacks (I like the feel it gives my photos). Very little color adjustment. seriously, once I fix the exposure/white balance, for the most part, my pictures look pretty darn good.

As for the lenses. Actually, the 28-300 and 50mm are both for my D600 and I've never used them on the D80. The D80 I have a 35mm and I think I had an 18-300mm? I can't recall. The lens went with another camera to my ex. So, I've never swapped the lenses or even tried them on the other camera. I was also learning how to use a (d)slr for the first time on my D80, so I don't expect those to look any good, lol. However, I was thinking I could transfer what I learned from that to the D600 and I can't. Sooo...time to re-learn.

And trust me, I know the issue is me, lol, that's why I was wondering what I was missing and felt if others have used both cameras, or ones that are similar, they'd have suggestions. Like what you and the other poster have suggested. You two have given me a lot to look at. I think I might go back to my prime and work with that until I am comfy and getting what I want before going back to my telephoto (granted, that one works great at the gardens when I visit).

I'll be back with some more commentary and questions I'm sure. Thanks!

I've owned several Nikon bodies including the D80 and currently D750. The D750 and D600 share the same sensor. I find the D750 sensor rendering exceptional, auto white balance not perfect but quite good. As far as shooting "manually" the principles of exposure with the relationship of shutter speed, aperture and iso are the same for every camera body. The D600 has more features and more customization ability than the D80, but use shouldn't be radically different. Switching from DX to FX first thing you'll notice is DOF differences. Many people prefer the shallower DOF of FX and it's easy enough to stop down more to achieve comparable DX DOF.

I took a brief look at your gallery, particularly noting similar shots from D600 and D80, mostly the dog shots. As the other member noted it seems you are using slower shutter speeds with the D600 compared to D80. Maybe that's not universal, and just in the images I looked at. The average person can successfully handhold about 1/60 and maintain focus, many can do 1/30 sec, but slower than that it's dicey even with a VR lens. It requires excellent technique. The D600 has far better high iso capabilities than the D80, a few stops, so no reason not to bump up iso if necessary to get sufficient shutter speed.

The subject matter in many of your images is quite beautiful. I don't know how much PP you've done to the D600 images, but I don't find any particularly lacking in color, contrast etc. I tend to prefer a more natural look, but for those that don't it's easy enough to punch up in camera color, contrast.

Seems you've had your D600 for a few years. I do see focus issues going back to the D80 images. The D600 has a huge advantage of having AF Fine Tune. Have you ever tested your lenses to see if they require some adjustment? A lens can be fine on one body and back or front focus on another. It's about the specific body lens combination. It's important to eliminate yourself (your technique) from the equation and test with a tripod or body on a stable surface using timer delay. It's possible the camera body itself might need adjustment if all lenses are incapable of achieving sharp focus. That's where I'd start for sure. Check out the DOT TUNE METHOD. I noticed from EXIF you have high in camera sharpness set. It's a matter of opinion, but many including myself would recommend a lower setting and doing major sharpening in PP.

You have some very nice images in your gallery. The D600 is a very capable camera with one of the best sensors Nikon has ever produced. If you're unhappy with it, I hope you'll continue to explore the reasons why. It might be worthwhile to buy one of the books about the D600 that specifically explains each setting and how to adjust the camera. They go far more in detail than the manual, Thom Hogan's are excellent.

 

[Dyun27]

Thank you for the feedback (sorry for the delayed response).

Before I respond to any of it, I'm going to go home and see how things look on my camera vs what I was seeing on the computer. And try a few things that you suggested?

But one question first, as for the shutter speed and aperture, I'm usually at f5-ish - is that considered wide?

f/5 is not really wide. F/1.2-f/2.8 would be considered a wide aperture. I consider f/5 and up as narrow. I usually use f/5.6 for most sunny situations and I'll go more narrow if I'm on a tripod shooting landscapes where I want lots of depth of field.