Lightroom DXO Raw vs TIFF

[Time4Oly]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

 

[Zeee]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

Great question as I'm doing the same and I must admit I don't really know what I'm doing. Currently I export back to LR as a 16 bit TIFF.

I still use the Auto feature in LR and do the final tweaks. Other adjustments like Lens Correction are blanked out as that is done in DXO. I also use the brush, radial and graduated filters. I seem to be getting great IQ after export in LR.

I have been wondering about bit size and format. 8 bit cuts the file size in half which is not a major concern to me. DNG makes it a bit bigger and since I don't really understand it I just export as a TIFF. That is what PS does when you edit an LR file and save it back to PS.

 

[Time4Oly]

We are using the same work for low !

 

[Time4Oly]

Workflow, I meant .(fingers too fat for phone keyboard)

 

[myotisone]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

Look up the DXO help on integrating with Lightroom, where it suggests exporting DNGs back into Lightroom if you want to maximise the editing capability in Lightroom.

That way you only lock in the noise reduction and lens correction data into the exported file.

Cheers,

Graham

 

[Time4Oly]

Thanks Graham !

 

[lokatz]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

No offense, but that flow sounds needlessly complex.

I always start in DxO, using ClearView, PRIME and DxO's lens corrections, all of which are better than Adobe's corresponding technologies, before exporting into DNG rather than TIFF. Even renaming individual images is easier in DxO.

Unlike TIFF, DNG is still a RAW format (AND smaller!), so when importing these into LR, I still have all editing options available, including white balance adjustments. TIFF is a 16-bit format, which means it is much better than JPEG, but not a RAW format. To my knowledge, it loses some image information, such as white balance.

 

[Ysarex]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

No offense, but that flow sounds needlessly complex.

I always start in DxO, using ClearView, PRIME and DxO's lens corrections, all of which are better than Adobe's corresponding technologies, before exporting into DNG rather than TIFF. Even renaming individual images is easier in DxO.

Unlike TIFF, DNG is still a RAW format (AND smaller!),

Dx0 is exporting a linear DNG. It's no longer a raw file as Dx0 has already demosaiced the raw data. A linear DNG is an RGB image file (basically a TIFF file) in a DNG wrapper.

so when importing these into LR, I still have all editing options available, including white balance adjustments. TIFF is a 16-bit format, which means it is much better than JPEG, but not a RAW format. To my knowledge, it loses some image information, such as white balance.

 

[myotisone]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

No offense, but that flow sounds needlessly complex.

You can run DXO as a Plugin from LR, make the changes you suggest and save as a DNG, back to LR from DXO.

I find that easier than starting in DXO as all files are already catalogued in LR, and that is where I would normally be working (actually that isn't true, as I now only very occasionally use LR or DXO, but that is what I did, as I just followed the DXO integration with LR guidance)

Cheers,

Graham

 

[sankos]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

No offense, but that flow sounds needlessly complex.

I always start in DxO, using ClearView, PRIME and DxO's lens corrections, all of which are better than Adobe's corresponding technologies, before exporting into DNG rather than TIFF. Even renaming individual images is easier in DxO.

Unlike TIFF, DNG is still a RAW format (AND smaller!),

Dx0 is exporting a linear DNG. It's no longer a raw file as Dx0 has already demosaiced the raw data. A linear DNG is an RGB image file (basically a TIFF file) in a DNG wrapper.

Yes, the DxO-produced DNG is actually three times larger than the original raw file. There are two basic advantages of going the Lr>DxO>Lr route with the DNG format (rather than tiff):

a) you can still use a custom camera profile when you open the linear DNG in Lr (if you don't like the DxO colours).

b) while the file is demosaiced, it is not encoded into a working space profile. DxO's internal working space is smaller than what Lr uses, so you don't throw away colours by going with the linear DNG out of DxO.

A disadvantage when working with a DxO-produced linear DNG as opposed to the original raw in Lr is that you don't have as much room to recover tonality (highlights, shadows). And you need to pay attention to white balance in DxO in order not to produce weird artefacts later on when working on highlights in Lr.

 

[Zeee]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

No offense, but that flow sounds needlessly complex.

It only takes a few seconds to export to DXO. I only export a few files so everything is in LR's DAM. It is the export back to LR that is brutally slow and is because of Prime. I tried staring from DXO and export time is the same.

I always start in DxO, using ClearView, PRIME and DxO's lens corrections, all of which are better than Adobe's corresponding technologies, before exporting into DNG rather than TIFF. Even renaming individual images is easier in DxO.

Unlike TIFF, DNG is still a RAW format (AND smaller!), so when importing these into LR, I still have all editing options available, including white balance adjustments. TIFF is a 16-bit format, which means it is much better than JPEG, but not a RAW format. To my knowledge, it loses some image information, such as white balance.

 

[Zeee]

I import my raw files to Lightroom then exporteto DXO as my raw converter and then exporting a TIFF back to Lightroom.

My question is with Lightroom, is the TIFF file as maleable as a raw file for additional editing. Are there any shortcomings in terms of using Lightroom features in TIFF versus raw?

No offense, but that flow sounds needlessly complex.

I always start in DxO, using ClearView, PRIME and DxO's lens corrections, all of which are better than Adobe's corresponding technologies, before exporting into DNG rather than TIFF. Even renaming individual images is easier in DxO.

Unlike TIFF, DNG is still a RAW format (AND smaller!),

Dx0 is exporting a linear DNG. It's no longer a raw file as Dx0 has already demosaiced the raw data. A linear DNG is an RGB image file (basically a TIFF file) in a DNG wrapper.

Yes, the DxO-produced DNG is actually three times larger than the original raw file. There are two basic advantages of going the Lr>DxO>Lr route with the DNG format (rather than tiff):

I see. It just says colour and I can't change it back in LR as a TIFF. Now I know why.

a) you can still use a custom camera profile when you open the linear DNG in Lr (if you don't like the DxO colours).

b) while the file is demosaiced, it is not encoded into a working space profile. DxO's internal working space is smaller than what Lr uses, so you don't throw away colours by going with the linear DNG out of DxO.

A disadvantage when working with a DxO-produced linear DNG as opposed to the original raw in Lr is that you don't have as much room to recover tonality (highlights, shadows). And you need to pay attention to white balance in DxO in order not to produce weird artefacts later on when working on highlights in Lr.

I don't use WB in DXO. I still like to use the LR's basic tab at the end. In DXO I just choose the no correction preset. I'm really there for Prime but apply Smart Lighting, Lens sharpness, distortion and CA as these are shut off when the TIFF comes back. I use clear view as needed. Sometimes I don't like the results.

So I'm still a little confused what would be the best format or my needs.

 

[sankos]

I don't use WB in DXO.

The White Balance needs to be done before DxO produces the linear DNG -- it's connected with the demosaicing of the raw data (values in each RGB channel need to be multiplied by a factor). If you don't change WB in DxO, it'll use the default value which it reads from the Exif data encoded by your camera.

I still like to use the LR's basic tab at the end. In DXO I just choose the no correction preset. I'm really there for Prime but apply Smart Lighting, Lens sharpness, distortion and CA as these are shut off when the TIFF comes back. I use clear view as needed. Sometimes I don't like the results.

So I'm still a little confused what would be the best format or my needs.

Basically do your lens corrections and detail work in DxO (e.g. PRIME and Lens Sharpness); don't change tonality and colours in it, leave it for Lr. Have a look at this discussion to learn more. And remember not to double-apply NR and input sharpening in both applications (Lr by default applies Chroma NR and some sharpening, which you'll need to switch off).

 

[Zeee]

I don't use WB in DXO.

The White Balance needs to be done before DxO produces the linear DNG -- it's connected with the demosaicing of the raw data (values in each RGB channel need to be multiplied by a factor). If you don't change WB in DxO, it'll use the default value which it reads from the Exif data encoded by your camera.

I still like to use the LR's basic tab at the end. In DXO I just choose the no correction preset. I'm really there for Prime but apply Smart Lighting, Lens sharpness, distortion and CA as these are shut off when the TIFF comes back. I use clear view as needed. Sometimes I don't like the results.

So I'm still a little confused what would be the best format or my needs.

Basically do your lens corrections and detail work in DxO (e.g. PRIME and Lens Sharpness); don't change tonality and colours in it, leave it for Lr. Have a look at this discussion to learn more. And remember not to double-apply NR and input sharpening in both applications (Lr by default applies Chroma NR and some sharpening, which you'll need to switch off).

Yes with a TIFF it shuts off. I wouldn't double apply any of those settings. Thanks for the link.

 

[Lacko]

This is what DXO writes on their website:

If you choose to export your image in DNG format, you will probably perceive a difference between how it is in DxO OpticsPro vs. Lightroom. Also:
If you want to work on light and color in DxOOptics Pro, we recommend that you export your image in TIFF format so as to avoid any surprises in the rendering.
If you prefer doing light and color work in Adobe Lightroom and want to use DxO OpticsPro only for corrections tied to details and geometry, the DNG format will allow you greater flexibility.

.. and in some forum:

We can suggest two things from here:
- Use DxO OpticsPro only for PRIME & lens correction, export to DNG and do exposure/contrast/WB/saturation/etc in Adobe Lightroom.
- Do everything in DxO OpticsPro and export to TIFF, which ensures perfect fidelity between DxO OpticsPro and Adobe Lightroom.

 

[JoachimStrobel]

I tried Tiff(16bit) and DNG outputs from DXO many times. It seem true that the Tiff does transport the colors, as I balance them in DXO, better back into LR. And that seems important because

I also do WB in DXO for that reason. In LR I do local enhancement as I view the local enhancements introduced in PL as not very practical when compared to LR.

The real trouble for me with that workflow is, that there is no automated way to stack DXO's Tiffs and the original Raws from LR automatically. DXO does not return its output into the same collection from where it received the data. So I do the cataloging always after the DXO loop.

 

[myotisone]

The real trouble for me with that workflow is, that there is no automated way to stack DXO's Tiffs and the original Raws from LR automatically. DXO does not return its output into the same collection from where it received the data. So I do the cataloging always after the DXO loop.

I haven't used DXO for months, but when I used the LR plugin to send the file to DXO, and then use the save to Lightroom option in DXO, the DNG appears beside the original RAW.

It may not appear beside any virtual copies in smart collections etc (not tried that) but it does appear in the main catalogue beside the original raw.

Maybe its changed, but maybe its not set up correctly. Have you looked at the DXO/Lightroom integration guidance on the DXO site that I mentioned in another post

https://www.dxo.com/us/photography/community/tutorials/optimizing-your-dxo-opticspro-10-and-lightroom-workflow

Cheers,

Graham

 

[JoachimStrobel]

Graham,

I did all according to the guidelines My DXO Tiffs/Dngs are being send back to a freshly created DXO collection, beating the date in the name. Sure, in folder view they are next to each other, but not in my collection. Strange that it works for you, wish I find the problem .

 

[myotisone]

Graham,

I did all according to the guidelines My DXO Tiffs/Dngs are being send back to a freshly created DXO collection, beating the date in the name. Sure, in folder view they are next to each other, but not in my collection. Strange that it works for you, wish I find the problem .

 

[JoachimStrobel]

Graham,

I think you see all sub-collections when viewing the main collection. So you see the Dxo Subcollection together with youre sub-collection where the raw is from ( if you had one). But if you click on this subcollection, then you do not see the DXO file.

And you can not stack these photo pairs within that main collection.

So what is needed is a smart way of placing a set off photos with identical names except the DXO Suffix together in a collection. I tried all plugins I found so far but have not found one that does that.