Need some tips for a lighting rookie...are Alien Bees a good start?

[Smiller4128]

Hello All,

I am just starting off in the flash photography world and basically know next to nothing. I currently shoot with a Fujifilm X-T2 and X100F. I've had lots of fun with the Fujifilm brand but I've been wanting something "More"...something a bit more professional looking I guess. I do a lot of Cosplay shooting and decided that I might want to start taking a look at flash systems. Both for outside when at conventions, and for home use for private studio type sessions.

So I just pulled the trigger on ordering the Godox V860II-F Flash and the XPro-F flash trigger. I also bought a bunch of other things like a stand for the flash, flash box, backdrop setup, canvas for the backdrop....can't believe it only came out to $350 for it all...seems cheap but I'm happy. Now, with this setup I know that I'll be able to learn on camera flash techniques, as well as, off camera flash for different effects. However, I have an opportunity to buy a basically brand new Alien Bees B800 for $200. Seems like a good deal but I'm not sure if its good to purchase that or hold off and wait to buy a Godox AD200 to stick with an all Godox System. I would prefer an Alien Bees because it can be used as constant lighting and not just as a flash right? I think that would benefit me more since I already purchased a decent flash right?

And I know a lot of people are going to tell me to take it slow and learn with what I have first. I can both understand and appreciate that, however, when I get into learning something new, I prefer to just dive right into all of it and figure it out as I go. It's just my way of doing things.

Anyways, any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

 

[flatpicknut]

Hello All,

I am just starting off in the flash photography world and basically know next to nothing. I currently shoot with a Fujifilm X-T2 and X100F. I've had lots of fun with the Fujifilm brand but I've been wanting something "More"...something a bit more professional looking I guess. I do a lot of Cosplay shooting and decided that I might want to start taking a look at flash systems. Both for outside when at conventions, and for home use for private studio type sessions.

So I just pulled the trigger on ordering the Godox V860II-F Flash and the XPro-F flash trigger. I also bought a bunch of other things like a stand for the flash, flash box, backdrop setup, canvas for the backdrop....can't believe it only came out to $350 for it all...seems cheap but I'm happy. Now, with this setup I know that I'll be able to learn on camera flash techniques, as well as, off camera flash for different effects. However, I have an opportunity to buy a basically brand new Alien Bees B800 for $200. Seems like a good deal

A brand new AB800 is $279, so a decent deal, but not a killer deal (at least not to me). The new purchase from PCB would come with a warranty, and that would be worth at least $50 to me.

I like Paul C Buff gear and have two Einsteins, but I would encourage you to wait till you can afford more of the Godox gear. Your interest in Cosplay would seem to make a battery-powered light important (yes, you can buy battery packs for the AB800, but the packs aren't cheap or light weight), and TTL and HSS could also be handy for Cosplay shooting. The AB800 won't do TTL or HSS, will require a power source, and will be limited on remote control unless you buy extra stuff to control it. I personally use an XPLOR 600 for location work and highly recommend it as a versatile tool in the studio and on location but the AD200's are very popular as well.

but I'm not sure if its good to purchase that or hold off and wait to buy a Godox AD200 to stick with an all Godox System. I would prefer an Alien Bees because it can be used as constant lighting and not just as a flash right?

Modeling lights in general aren't great for constant light sources. The AB800 has a 150 W modeling lamp which isn't all that bright but will drag down a battery very quickly (you generally wouldn't use this modeling lamp away from an ac power source). The Paul C Buff Digibee has a 75W LED modeling lamp ("400 W equivalent") and could be more useful as a constant light source, but the Digibee is more expensive and still would need an ac power source (and doesn't have TTL or HSS).

I think that would benefit me more since I already purchased a decent flash right?

And I know a lot of people are going to tell me to take it slow and learn with what I have first. I can both understand and appreciate that, however, when I get into learning something new, I prefer to just dive right into all of it and figure it out as I go. It's just my way of doing things.

There are definite advantages to working with one tool at a time and really learning that tool. You can do excellent work with nothing more than what you already have on order. Many photogs stick with a flash or two and love the convenience.

It is way too common for folks to buy so much gear that they don't really learn to use any of it very well. Then we find the gear on Craigslist, lol.

--
Doug Brock

 

[photolando]

I'm a little bias but I've also been a full time professional photographer for over 30 years. Been shooting portraiture for about 24 of those years. Along with some corporate events in there as well.

I bought my still current set of Alien Bee 800s 14 years ago. I still use them everyday. And Ih ave shot literally 10s of thousands of portrait and head shots with them. Too many to even count. But they have fired off hundreds of thousands of times with no problems whatsoever.

Not only are they great to start with, they are also great to use professionally. In the past three days I have shot 18 sittings and doing about $11,000 in business. So yes, they are very capable of being used in a professional setting.

Now, Godox looks really good to me as well. I also own the 860. I use it for my event work. I could not be happier. I love the rechargeable battery.

I do have a colleague who bought the AD200s and loves them. Not sure how bright the modeling light is but they seem to work well. I do like the compactness of them. But that is not the reason I look for in lights. Durability and consistency is why. And I personally have had no problems.

I probably will get the new DigiBees only because I want some new lights. These AB's have served me well but I like the digital control of the Digibees. And three of them for a little over $1000 is pretty darn good.

No, the molding light in ABs are not that bright. 150 watt at the most. BUT, the modeling light in the DigiBees is VERY bright and some say can be used with video. However I don't do video so I cannot comment. But maybe with stills if you want to shoot wide open and use constant lighting.

Hope this helps.

 

[Smiller4128]

I like Paul C Buff gear and have two Einsteins, but I would encourage you to wait till you can afford more of the Godox gear. Your interest in Cosplay would seem to make a battery-powered light important (yes, you can buy battery packs for the AB800, but the packs aren't cheap or light weight), and TTL and HSS could also be handy for Cosplay shooting. The AB800 won't do TTL or HSS, will require a power source, and will be limited on remote control unless you buy extra stuff to control it. I personally use an XPLOR 600 for location work and highly recommend it as a versatile tool in the studio and on location but the AD200's are very popular as well.

i should have clarified things better, my apologies. The Godox V860II-F is the only light I plan to bring with me out on shoots at cosplay conventions.

The Alien Bees is something that I would have just for my studio setting at home when I have cosplay clients come in for a more professional shoot. Thus, the AlienBee would remain at home and not go mobile at all. I'm just not interested in carrying a super big setup to conventions. A camera and flash is all I need for that.

 

[BAK]

RE >> I would prefer an Alien Bees because it can be used as constant lighting and not just as a flash right? <<

Yeah, but you can cook a roast of beef by wrapping it in foil and putting it on your car's engine.

Possible, but not advised.

The new Paul C Buff Digibee flash has a bright enough modeling light for reasonable use as a so-called constant light, under selected circumstances.

Using a AB800 model is another kettle of fish.

BAK

 

[flatpicknut]

I like Paul C Buff gear and have two Einsteins, but I would encourage you to wait till you can afford more of the Godox gear. Your interest in Cosplay would seem to make a battery-powered light important (yes, you can buy battery packs for the AB800, but the packs aren't cheap or light weight), and TTL and HSS could also be handy for Cosplay shooting. The AB800 won't do TTL or HSS, will require a power source, and will be limited on remote control unless you buy extra stuff to control it. I personally use an XPLOR 600 for location work and highly recommend it as a versatile tool in the studio and on location but the AD200's are very popular as well.

i should have clarified things better, my apologies. The Godox V860II-F is the only light I plan to bring with me out on shoots at cosplay conventions.

The Alien Bees is something that I would have just for my studio setting at home when I have cosplay clients come in for a more professional shoot. Thus, the AlienBee would remain at home and not go mobile at all. I'm just not interested in carrying a super big setup to conventions. A camera and flash is all I need for that.

Oh, ok. That does change things!

Paul C Buff gear would be very good for a home studio. I love the Godox gear, but at home,TTL and HSS wouldn't be something I'd need, and ac power wouldn't be an issue (in fact, ac power would be a benefit in that situation).

I would still recommend buying new over that $200 AB800, and I'd personally suggest at least considering the Einsteins. More power, and they have two modes, one for better color consistency and one for shorter flash duration to stop motion. Changing lights manually (especially when they're up on a light stand) is a pain, so you'll likely want to something like the Cyber Commander. The Cyber Commander is a bit confusing at first, but very convenient and works as a light meter for the Einsteins, too.

One Einstein and a reflector or two can take you a long way. A second Einstein and then a couple smaller lights (like the Alien Bee's, or even flash units) for hair/rim/background lights would have you set.

 

[photolando]

I like Paul C Buff gear and have two Einsteins, but I would encourage you to wait till you can afford more of the Godox gear. Your interest in Cosplay would seem to make a battery-powered light important (yes, you can buy battery packs for the AB800, but the packs aren't cheap or light weight), and TTL and HSS could also be handy for Cosplay shooting. The AB800 won't do TTL or HSS, will require a power source, and will be limited on remote control unless you buy extra stuff to control it. I personally use an XPLOR 600 for location work and highly recommend it as a versatile tool in the studio and on location but the AD200's are very popular as well.

i should have clarified things better, my apologies. The Godox V860II-F is the only light I plan to bring with me out on shoots at cosplay conventions.

The Alien Bees is something that I would have just for my studio setting at home when I have cosplay clients come in for a more professional shoot. Thus, the AlienBee would remain at home and not go mobile at all. I'm just not interested in carrying a super big setup to conventions. A camera and flash is all I need for that.

I haven't owned a studio in over 20 years. I do all my portraits in location. Right now I am in Naples FL doing a project that will last least two months. I basically have a mobile studio. It includes 3 lights (AB800s) with modifiers, three light stands and an 8 ft. wide backdrop that is held up with one stand. I also shoot a lot of head shots at corporate events I use the same lighting setup but usually a white or grey seamless.

My point being, you can be very portable with small moonlights like the AB 800. I've been hauling them around for years. Another reason I love Paul Buff. Not only do they take the punishment of being used but also the setting up and tearing down constantly for years.

 

[BAK]

Stuck in Naples for a couple of months. My sympathies.

I have relatives there, and my father used to spend the winters in St. Petes, and then Fort Myers. For the last two weeks he'd go to stay with the family in Naples, and I'd come down to fetch him, and sped a week or so in Naples.

I think it's a wonderful town.

Try to keep the sand out of the cameras.

Enjoy.

BAK

 

[photolando]

Stuck in Naples for a couple of months. My sympathies.

I have relatives there, and my father used to spend the winters in St. Petes, and then Fort Myers. For the last two weeks he'd go to stay with the family in Naples, and I'd come down to fetch him, and sped a week or so in Naples.

I think it's a wonderful town.

Try to keep the sand out of the cameras.

Enjoy.

BAK

It’s a tough job but someone has to do it. It is nice. Growing like crazy. All the wealthy retiring baby boomers are moving in. Good for me. That’s our target market! They still appreciate a nice, classic fine portrait.

 

[Sailor Blue]

I use flash on location, usually outdoors. Some things you simply can't do with hot-shoe flash units so you have to know their limits and how to work within those limits.

In the studio I want my strobes. The reasons are simple - more power means base ISO for maximum image quality and the modeling light lets me see what the lighting is on the subject.

Sailorblue - Why Studio Strobes, not Hot-Shoe Flash for Portraiture

I have to be frank, I don't recommend you buy a used AB800 as your first light. Buy a brand new DB800 - it is worth the added cost in my opinion.

The DB800 gives you a 6-stop range (full to 1/64) vs the 5-stop range (full to 1/32) of the AB800 and it gives you quick and easy 1/10th stop changes in power. Combine remote control over the DB800's power and a flash meter built-into the Cyber Commander and you have a world class light for portraiture.

Start with a single studio strobe.

Digital Photography Review - Thomas Park - The One-Light Studio

Experiment with your single strobe until you understand what happens when you move the light in any direction. You can see this with the modeling light but you will get slightly different results from the strobe so take photos and good notes so you can tell why something changes in your images.

For instance, the difference between having short loop lighting and Rembrandt lighting is moving the light only an inch or two or just changing the pose a tiny bit.

Clay Blackmore - How to Find Rembrandt Lighting When Posing Portraits - YouTube

Short loop lighting is the first portrait lighting setup to learn. Learn it with just the light and a diffuser in the 1500-2000 in² range (e.g. a 43" white reflection umbrella with a black backing) then add a reflector.

The first lighting setup to learn is short loop lighting. Short loop lighting (look at the loop of shadow from the noise) is called Short lighting in this reference. Save Broad loop lighting for the thinnest subjects.

Portrait Lighting - Project 3 - Portrait Lighting Set-Ups

Next learn butterfly lighting then split lighting.

When you start finding things you want to do that you can't do with a single light then expand the system with more lights.

Sailorblue - Equipment Guide for Setting up a Small Home Portrait-Glamor Studio

 

[Nikonparrothead]

They're STILL moving in? I thought they'd overrun the city a decade ago. Naples is a wonderful city. Enjoy your time there.

 

[Nikonparrothead]

As many others here, I'd counsel against the Alien Bee. The tech is too long in the tooth. Also, if memory serves, the AD 200 comes with swappable bulbs -- one of which is a constant light source.

That would be a better route. Plus, if you suddenly become enamored of HSS you'll be all ready to go.

 

[The Mad Kiwi]

Save up for the AD200. Wireless battery powered is the way to go. Even in a studio being wireless makes life so much easier. Avoid anything with cords, old tech that's dying.

Plus you want your lights to be as flexible as possible otherwise you eventually end up doubling up.

 

[historianx]

Besides, if you're shooting with the X100F, you need not rely on gimmicky HSS; the camera's leaf shutter will allow you to sync up to 1/2000 sec (which I have done on numerous occasions with an X100S).

--
http://jamesmbailey.com
Stop Whining, Start Shooting

 

[Brian Heys]

Personally, I would stick to your current setup to start with. You can learn a massive amount shooting with just one speedlite, and you have the stand and trigger to allow you to take it off camera, which is great.

Get some different modifiers for it, like a reflector umbrella, a shoot-through umbrella, and a beauty dish. Experiment with those and see what different effects you can create. It's amazing what you can do with just the one little flash.

One thing I really like about using speedlites is the lack of a modelling light. It gets you really thinking about the behaviour of light because you have to visualise and try to predict what it is going to do when it fires. That can really help with the learning process.

Brian

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