E-M10 mark II or G7

[Croky]

Wish to move from an ASP-C dSLR to M4/3 camera. I got my mind set on either the Olympus E-M10 II or Panasonic G7. The GX7 style doesn't appeal much to me. I come to realize that both cameras got their strengths and weaknesses. Wish to make a decision so I can start shooting some photos.

I've absorbed little bits of information from numerous user experiences, skimmed through a few reviews and read some blogs such as those by Robin Wong. Best of all, I went to a store to handle both cameras for a while. Even managed to try the E-M10 II with add-on grip for improved ergonomics. Both cameras felt good... would have been easier if one disappointed a lot LOL.

Reading posts such as this one , I get the impression that the E-M10 II will give me plenty keepers when it comes to my young kids being playful. Eventhough that specific post concerns mark I.

So what's got me doubting?

Olympus got in-body stabilisation so no stabilisation required in the lenses. Olympus got neat features such as Live composite which sound interesting to me. And from what I read Olympus deals better with shutter shock.

Panasonic offers DFD and 4K video which can be used for action shots; extracting the better 8MP stills.

I'm not at all a professional. I take photos mostly, both family and personal interest. Of course I will also shoot some video. Home videos, just to capture those spontaneous moments with my family. I won't be doing a lot (or any) post processing afterwards. Mostly JPEG, only some RAW.

Lots of people are praising the G7. What is it about this camera? Might be due its ergonimics, DFD and the 8MP stills from 4K video. Is the feature with the stills from video really good? I may fair better with family action shots, but I wonder if it will give me that many more keepers and fun. Choosing G7 DOES mean I need to resort to lenses with in-lens stabilisation...

Choosing E-M10 will give me in-body stabilisation. My perception is that I can choose from a broader range of lenses without losing stabilisation. This and its apparent better shuttter shock fix. Olympus menu isn't a deal breaker for me coz it got its SCP.

G7 and E-M10 II both cost 799 euro with a 14-42 kit lens. However, E-M10 II will be available this week with a 130 euro discount. This may make it a no-brainer, but...

Am I missing something with the G7? Is it better in Low Light? IQ and AF wise?

Both winners?! Both more than sufficient for daddies with a hobby?

I don't want to keep doubting and reading and reading. I do value good user experiences though. Just don't want to waste too much time that can be used for photography (and minor video shooting) and having fun instead of missing beautiful moments.

Not sure if it helps in terms of answering, but I am considering to buy a cheap tele lens and nice prime. For example the $99 M.Zuiko 40-150 R and a 17mm or 25mm prime.

 

[Astrotripper]

Choosing E-M10 will give me in-body stabilisation. My perception is that I can choose from a broader range of lenses without losing stabilisation.

The question is, how often would that be useful to you? I use legacy manual lenses and I sometimes shoot at night or in lousy lighting conditions. And that's where IBIS is very useful even with fast, wider primes. But how often will you find yourself needing that stabilisation?

This and its apparent better shuttter shock fix. Olympus menu isn't a deal breaker for me coz it got its SCP.

Menus aren't a problem once you get used to them.

G7 and E-M10 II both cost 799 euro with a 14-42 kit lens. However, E-M10 II will be available this week with a 130 euro discount. This may make it a no-brainer, but...

When it comes to kit lenses, I'd take Panasonic over Olympus. The bigger Oly 14-42 R II is an annoying collapsible design, and the pancake power-zoom has a rather bad rep when it comes to sample variation and image quality. And is a collapsible design as well which makes it longer for camera to be ready for action when you turn it on. I use the Panasonic 14-42 II on my E-M10, and like it a lot more than the lens that came with the camera (the R II version).

Am I missing something with the G7? Is it better in Low Light? IQ and AF wise?

I would expect it would be better in terms of AF, when paired with a Panasonic lens that supports DFD.

Not sure if it helps in terms of answering, but I am considering to buy a cheap tele lens and nice prime. For example the $99 M.Zuiko 40-150 R

If you want this particular lens, an Olympus camera will be a better match for it, due to IBIS. Panasonic has teles of their own, with OIS, but they are usually a bit more expensive. 45-150 is about €230, 45-200 about €280, a tiny 35-100 is around €300 and 45-175 is over 350 EUR. The last one is the best of the bunch.

and a 17mm or 25mm prime.

IBIS will make it possible to shoot with those at really low shutter speeds. But that would mostly be useful when shooting at night or something. If you don't plan on doing that, it's not a big deal and you can use Oly lenses on G7 without any problems. And about night shooting, G7 is not the best choice if you plan on doing really long exposures, as it has that limited to 2 minutes I believe.

To be honest, it looks to me that whichever of the two you choose, it will be a good choice. The fact that you are not like "I really have to have IBIS" or "4K is a must" just shows that you don't really have a strong preference towards the strong points of each camera, in which case both should work perfectly fine for you. They'll just give you a bit different set of features to play with.

 

[Henry Richardson]

You seem to have a pretty good handle on the differences and you have also held them both. Sounds like either one would be okay for you. I can't tell you which features are more important for you so you will just have to decide that for yourself. If you still can't decide then just go for the one with the best price.

 

[e_kjellgren]

I also handled them both and found the G7 to be very plasticy and cheap feeling. I would never prefer it to my GX7. How did you experience the Olympus in this regard? Swedish site cyberphoto.se gives the E-M10II gold and G7 a silver award, basically complaining about build quality, bad implementation of focus peaking and not so good eye sensor for shifting between the screen and EVF.

 

[Trevor Carpenter]

I can only comment on the G7 although I'd quite like an EM10-II even though the comfort factor in my hands is much less than the G7. Which is what makes the G7 so good in my eyes, I have never owned any camera or piece of electronic equipment that fits me so comfortably and which despite being a very complex beast is so easy to use.

If I could have any m4/3s camera today I would pick the G7 over all the other models across the range purely because it is what is best for me. My second choice would be an EM1.

The comment above on build quality is yet another throw away statement from someone who doesn't understand what build quality means. There are for more problems identified on this forum concerning Olympus cameras than there are for Panasonic. That's not a dig at Oly, it wouldn't stop me buying one.

Feature wise you win some and you lose some but I am a big 4K photo fan and it will be a superb feature for someone with a young family (out of doors).

IQ wise . I doubt that in 'normal' conditions you will see much difference between any m4/3s cameras. You can see my efforts in my albums at the link below.

 

[Croky]

Choosing E-M10 will give me in-body stabilisation. My perception is that I can choose from a broader range of lenses without losing stabilisation.

The question is, how often would that be useful to you? I use legacy manual lenses and I sometimes shoot at night or in lousy lighting conditions. And that's where IBIS is very useful even with fast, wider primes. But how often will you find yourself needing that stabilisation?

I will be using the camera in different scenes.

• Family photos outside by broad daylight; be it the zoo, backgarden, beach, hockey field or forest (with squirrels ).
• Family photos inside on cloudy days, Christmas (Tree string lights and candles), evenings with light bulbs (LED)
• Personal interest close-up / macro inside and outside
• Personal interest street photography, evening/night photography
• Personal interest light painting
• Some landscape between things

This and its apparent better shuttter shock fix. Olympus menu isn't a deal breaker for me coz it got its SCP.

Menus aren't a problem once you get used to them.

My point exactly. That's why I named it as it's irrelevant in my decision.

G7 and E-M10 II both cost 799 euro with a 14-42 kit lens. However, E-M10 II will be available this week with a 130 euro discount. This may make it a no-brainer, but...

When it comes to kit lenses, I'd take Panasonic over Olympus. The bigger Oly 14-42 R II is an annoying collapsible design, and the pancake power-zoom has a rather bad rep when it comes to sample variation and image quality. And is a collapsible design as well which makes it longer for camera to be ready for action when you turn it on. I use the Panasonic 14-42 II on my E-M10, and like it a lot more than the lens that came with the camera (the R II version).

Exactly for your reasons I don't want the Oly 14-42 R II. I don't like it. I was thinking of the Oly EZ powerzoom for reasons of compactness. Otherwise I would have considered the 14-150 travel zoom.

I figured that if it's a bad copy, I return it to the shop to get a proper one. Wasn't it mostly a thing of early batches?

The advantage of buying the Oly body + Oly lens as a set is the massive discount I get. If I chose to buy an Oly body and a Pana lens seperately I pay full price.

Am I missing something with the G7? Is it better in Low Light? IQ and AF wise?

I would expect it would be better in terms of AF, when paired with a Panasonic lens that supports DFD.

All kit lenses now sold with a new body support DFD, no? At least that was my understanding.

Not sure if it helps in terms of answering, but I am considering to buy a cheap tele lens and nice prime. For example the $99 M.Zuiko 40-150 R

If you want this particular lens, an Olympus camera will be a better match for it, due to IBIS. Panasonic has teles of their own, with OIS, but they are usually a bit more expensive. 45-150 is about €230, 45-200 about €280, a tiny 35-100 is around €300 and 45-175 is over 350 EUR. The last one is the best of the bunch.

Bit more expensive yes. $99 (roughly €120 with shipping, tax/customs) or > €250.

and a 17mm or 25mm prime.

IBIS will make it possible to shoot with those at really low shutter speeds. But that would mostly be useful when shooting at night or something. If you don't plan on doing that, it's not a big deal and you can use Oly lenses on G7 without any problems. And about night shooting, G7 is not the best choice if you plan on doing really long exposures, as it has that limited to 2 minutes I believe.

I take it shooting indoors on cloudy autumn days, home parties and evenings counts as low light as well. Not just pitch dark or city light trips in the evening. And true, I can use the flash, but there's also times that I don't want to ruin the ambience of the room or disturb my 1 year old with a bright flash.

To be honest, it looks to me that whichever of the two you choose, it will be a good choice. The fact that you are not like "I really have to have IBIS" or "4K is a must" just shows that you don't really have a strong preference towards the strong points of each camera, in which case both should work perfectly fine for you. They'll just give you a bit different set of features to play with.

I'm about stabilisation. Money wise it'd seem Olympus got an edge coz of in-body stabilisation. I can buy cheaper lenses. 4K is indeed not a must. I was just very curious what 4K and stills taken from 4K video can offer me when my 6-year old is playing outside. I don't need 4K for a TV or so.

 

[Henry Richardson]

The comment above on build quality is yet another throw away statement from someone who doesn't understand what build quality means. There are for more problems identified on this forum concerning Olympus cameras than there are for Panasonic. That's not a dig at Oly, it wouldn't stop me buying one.

Actually, I see about as many posts about Panasonic problems here as I do about Olympus problems and that is even though I suspect there are more Olympus users here. For example, see this current post about multiple problems with multiple Panasonic products:

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www.dpreview.com

 

[Croky]

I can only comment on the G7 although I'd quite like an EM10-II even though the comfort factor in my hands is much less than the G7. Which is what makes the G7 so good in my eyes, I have never owned any camera or piece of electronic equipment that fits me so comfortably and which despite being a very complex beast is so easy to use.

If I could have any m4/3s camera today I would pick the G7 over all the other models across the range purely because it is what is best for me. My second choice would be an EM1.

The comment above on build quality is yet another throw away statement from someone who doesn't understand what build quality means. There are for more problems identified on this forum concerning Olympus cameras than there are for Panasonic. That's not a dig at Oly, it wouldn't stop me buying one.

Feature wise you win some and you lose some but I am a big 4K photo fan and it will be a superb feature for someone with a young family (out of doors).

IQ wise . I doubt that in 'normal' conditions you will see much difference between any m4/3s cameras. You can see my efforts in my albums at the link below.

--
My Galleries are at
my albums are at https://picasaweb.google.com/115423645123114525430

I'm not a fan nor a no-fan of 4K. I'm just not sure what kind of superbness it can offer me. Got a hard time giving it a proper weigh-factor.

4K video didn't trigger me with the Panasonic until I found out that I can take stills from it and as such have an advantage with action. So far I always use single AF point, single shot photos when my kid is playing. Some keepers, some not.

And is 4K that great? Last night I read a post that it can be great, but it's not perfect. Apparently one can shoot with 30FPS, but still end up with many frames/stills with incorrect focus. I also read something on anti-shutter shock in combination with 4K video/photo. That it's not possible in combination with 30FPS. (I try to find the post where it was mentioned).

I'm not prejudiced. I really hope that 4K is truly great! I'm just not sure what it can do for me. If it can do a lot for me and works like a charm it may pull me towards the G7. I just want to avoid disappointment if I am misled by good marketing talk.

:-S

And yes, I got a more complete idea of what the E-M10 has to offer for me. It's why I am leaning more towards Olympus. I shouldn't be blind for less-known alternatives though

 

[Croky]

I also handled them both and found the G7 to be very plasticy and cheap feeling. I would never prefer it to my GX7. How did you experience the Olympus in this regard? Swedish site cyberphoto.se gives the E-M10II gold and G7 a silver award, basically complaining about build quality, bad implementation of focus peaking and not so good eye sensor for shifting between the screen and EVF.

My first impression with the G7 was that it was plasticy, but at the same time it scored in terms of ergonomics. The plasticy feel shouldn't bother so much; it's a getting used to. It's more important to know if the camera handles nicely coz if not it won't be fun to use and without fun it won't be used as much as it should be.

But true, E-M10 II looks better. It handles nicely (though admitedly less than a G7 without a grip). Then again, I shoot with a dSLR and a small brick-shaped compact. The compact doesn't score best ergonomically, but it's fun to use. Best isn't everything. Second-best doesn't mean bad.

I didn't like using GX7's EVF. I didn't favour its left position but it was more the EVF itself that didn't do it for me.

So yeah, G7 and E-M10 II both qualify; good first impression on handling.

 

[tt321]

I can only comment on the G7 although I'd quite like an EM10-II even though the comfort factor in my hands is much less than the G7. Which is what makes the G7 so good in my eyes, I have never owned any camera or piece of electronic equipment that fits me so comfortably and which despite being a very complex beast is so easy to use.

If I could have any m4/3s camera today I would pick the G7 over all the other models across the range purely because it is what is best for me. My second choice would be an EM1.

The comment above on build quality is yet another throw away statement from someone who doesn't understand what build quality means. There are for more problems identified on this forum concerning Olympus cameras than there are for Panasonic. That's not a dig at Oly, it wouldn't stop me buying one.

Feature wise you win some and you lose some but I am a big 4K photo fan and it will be a superb feature for someone with a young family (out of doors).

IQ wise . I doubt that in 'normal' conditions you will see much difference between any m4/3s cameras. You can see my efforts in my albums at the link below.

 

[Croky]

I can only comment on the G7 although I'd quite like an EM10-II even though the comfort factor in my hands is much less than the G7. Which is what makes the G7 so good in my eyes, I have never owned any camera or piece of electronic equipment that fits me so comfortably and which despite being a very complex beast is so easy to use.

If I could have any m4/3s camera today I would pick the G7 over all the other models across the range purely because it is what is best for me. My second choice would be an EM1.

The comment above on build quality is yet another throw away statement from someone who doesn't understand what build quality means. There are for more problems identified on this forum concerning Olympus cameras than there are for Panasonic. That's not a dig at Oly, it wouldn't stop me buying one.

Feature wise you win some and you lose some but I am a big 4K photo fan and it will be a superb feature for someone with a young family (out of doors).

IQ wise . I doubt that in 'normal' conditions you will see much difference between any m4/3s cameras. You can see my efforts in my albums at the link below.

 

[Aberaeron]

I've got an E-M10 Mk1 and a G7. I love both. If forced to choose only one, it would have to be the G7. It just handles better over a long period of holding and shooting. It also has the 4k pre-burst and other features, such as in-camera stitching of panoramas that the Olympus lacks.

Yes, the Olympus has a significant advantage with its in-body image stabilisation but I don't find that to be an issue with the lenses I've got, apart from maybe the Oly 45mm in dark environments. Even so I seem to work around it.

The Olympus id the most stylish, there's no denying, and that must count for something in the ownership satisfaction stakes.

I shot a short 4k video with the G7 the other day and was somewhat underwhelmed when it was played back on my 21"iMac. It was certainly inferior to what I would have expected from the standard 1080p mp4 or avchd videos I normally shoot. It was jittery when panning and rather soft. What I do notice is that it isn't jittery when viewed on the camera screen, so I put its failings down to the viewing medium and not the quality of the recorded file. Anyhow, I'm happy with 1080 50p video. Which the Panasonic is excellent at compared to the E-M10 Mk1 only being very good.

As far as standard profile jpeg images are concerned, the Olympus has a short lead, but both are very customisable. Object follow focus is far better on the Panasonic and I tried it this morning on a seagull and was very impressed.

 

[SwedishPhoto]

I also handled them both and found the G7 to be very plasticy and cheap feeling. I would never prefer it to my GX7. How did you experience the Olympus in this regard? Swedish site cyberphoto.se gives the E-M10II gold and G7 a silver award, basically complaining about build quality, bad implementation of focus peaking and not so good eye sensor for shifting between the screen and EVF.

I've owned many a camera built like tanks, and I still don't find the G7 plasticky.. It feels sturdy, but very light (which could be why some find it "cheap feeling"). It has tons of great controls, the ergonomics are way ahead (I still haven't figured out why Olympus build their cameras to feel like Tetris "L and I-blocks....).

i also think the G7 stills and continuous AF is a bit better (especially with DFD). It's very very fast. I also prefer the Panasonic menu UI. With that said, I still like what Olympus are doing.

The G7 is a perfect combo for me, I got it very cheap, it takes amazing video and great stills, plus it has amazingly fast AF. I also like the Pana lenses. Sure, I would like IBIS, but I intend to buy Pana OIS lenses anyway.

 

[Astrotripper]

Choosing E-M10 will give me in-body stabilisation. My perception is that I can choose from a broader range of lenses without losing stabilisation.

The question is, how often would that be useful to you? I use legacy manual lenses and I sometimes shoot at night or in lousy lighting conditions. And that's where IBIS is very useful even with fast, wider primes. But how often will you find yourself needing that stabilisation?

I will be using the camera in different scenes.

• Family photos outside by broad daylight; be it the zoo, backgarden, beach, hockey field or forest (with squirrels ).
• Family photos inside on cloudy days, Christmas (Tree string lights and candles), evenings with light bulbs (LED)

Just a little note. With people and other living things, IBIS is not all that useful. It's just that only your subjects will be blurry, instead of everything.

• Personal interest close-up / macro inside and outside

This is where focus bracketing of E-M10 Mark II would be nice to have. Although if we're not talking about true macro near 1:1 magnification (which the kit lenses are not capable of achieving), it's not as crucial as it's usually possible to get enough DoF at f/4 or f/5.6. And for most ground level shots for example, it's usually pretty easy to stabilise the camera yourself.

I actually do quite a lot of shots like that (not really macro, but something like this , this , this or this ) and what I often miss is a fully articulating screen that would allow me to comfortably shoot in portrait orientation. On many occasions I would switch IBIS for a screen like that :-D

As for true macro, there are three macro lenses for MFT, two of which have OIS. So whether IBIS is important in this context would depend if you would ever get one of those lenses, and if so, which one.

• Personal interest street photography, evening/night photography

For truly night photography (like this ), you'll need a tripod.

But I've took my Panasonic 25/1.7 for a night walk around my neighbourhood (see here ). And IBIS was a very nice thing to have for this.

• Personal interest light painting

Well, you'll need a tripod for that. But the Live Composite mode on Oly is perfect for this kind of stuff. And is plenty fun to use and play with.

• Some landscape between things

You'll probably be using the 14-42 kit lens for this, which is stabilized, so it wouldn't make much of a difference which camera you get. For night-time landscapes, a tripod is a must anyway.

G7 and E-M10 II both cost 799 euro with a 14-42 kit lens. However, E-M10 II will be available this week with a 130 euro discount. This may make it a no-brainer, but...

When it comes to kit lenses, I'd take Panasonic over Olympus. The bigger Oly 14-42 R II is an annoying collapsible design, and the pancake power-zoom has a rather bad rep when it comes to sample variation and image quality. And is a collapsible design as well which makes it longer for camera to be ready for action when you turn it on. I use the Panasonic 14-42 II on my E-M10, and like it a lot more than the lens that came with the camera (the R II version).

Exactly for your reasons I don't want the Oly 14-42 R II. I don't like it. I was thinking of the Oly EZ powerzoom for reasons of compactness. Otherwise I would have considered the 14-150 travel zoom.

I figured that if it's a bad copy, I return it to the shop to get a proper one. Wasn't it mostly a thing of early batches?

Might be. But yeah, you're right, you can always exchange it, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The advantage of buying the Oly body + Oly lens as a set is the massive discount I get. If I chose to buy an Oly body and a Pana lens seperately I pay full price.

Indeed, those lenses are always so much cheaper when bundled with a camera.

Am I missing something with the G7? Is it better in Low Light? IQ and AF wise?

I would expect it would be better in terms of AF, when paired with a Panasonic lens that supports DFD.

All kit lenses now sold with a new body support DFD, no? At least that was my understanding.

Yes, I think so, too. I think there are only one or two lenses that do not support it (but I might be wrong on that).

and a 17mm or 25mm prime.

IBIS will make it possible to shoot with those at really low shutter speeds. But that would mostly be useful when shooting at night or something. If you don't plan on doing that, it's not a big deal and you can use Oly lenses on G7 without any problems. And about night shooting, G7 is not the best choice if you plan on doing really long exposures, as it has that limited to 2 minutes I believe.

I take it shooting indoors on cloudy autumn days, home parties and evenings counts as low light as well. Not just pitch dark or city light trips in the evening. And true, I can use the flash, but there's also times that I don't want to ruin the ambience of the room or disturb my 1 year old with a bright flash.

As mentioned before, IS might not be of much use for stuff like that, unless you want to have motion blur. And with fast primes you should be fine indoors and in the evenings anyway. As for the flash, a proper one that you could use to bounce off the walls and ceiling goes a long way in improving the quality of in-door shots. So I would still recommend you get one at some point in the future. The built-in flash is mostly useless, I would say. I pretty much only use it to trigger off-camera flash :-D

To be honest, it looks to me that whichever of the two you choose, it will be a good choice. The fact that you are not like "I really have to have IBIS" or "4K is a must" just shows that you don't really have a strong preference towards the strong points of each camera, in which case both should work perfectly fine for you. They'll just give you a bit different set of features to play with.

I'm about stabilisation. Money wise it'd seem Olympus got an edge coz of in-body stabilisation. I can buy cheaper lenses. 4K is indeed not a must. I was just very curious what 4K and stills taken from 4K video can offer me when my 6-year old is playing outside. I don't need 4K for a TV or so.

Yeah, if you can get Oly for less money, I'd say go for it. The video on Olympus sucks compared to Panasonic (and that's beside 4K), but for occasional family stuff should be enough. Big plus is that IBIS also works for video. And that's pretty neat, I must say. If only video quality was better that what was available in Panasonic compacts 5 years ago :-D

 

[Croky]

I've got an E-M10 Mk1 and a G7. I love both. If forced to choose only one, it would have to be the G7. It just handles better over a long period of holding and shooting. It also has the 4k pre-burst and other features, such as in-camera stitching of panoramas that the Olympus lacks.

As I don't do much in terms of post-processing (so far) it's fair to say that I may be best of with a G7. I've only used the panorama mode as a creative gadget so far though. Still, creativity is key.

Hmm.. do you use a neck strap when you're out shooting for a long time? With my dSLR I am used to a neck strap. It does have a nice grip, but when I'm out for a longer period of time I resort to the neck strap. Got the feeling I won't be troubled so much by it. But you are correct if you mean that a neck strap is optional with G7 and a must-have with an E-M10.

Yes, the Olympus has a significant advantage with its in-body image stabilisation but I don't find that to be an issue with the lenses I've got, apart from maybe the Oly 45mm in dark environments. Even so I seem to work around it.

I will be shooting indoors and with tele lenses as well (f.i. 40-150).

The Olympus id the most stylish, there's no denying, and that must count for something in the ownership satisfaction stakes.

I shot a short 4k video with the G7 the other day and was somewhat underwhelmed when it was played back on my 21"iMac. It was certainly inferior to what I would have expected from the standard 1080p mp4 or avchd videos I normally shoot. It was jittery when panning and rather soft. What I do notice is that it isn't jittery when viewed on the camera screen, so I put its failings down to the viewing medium and not the quality of the recorded file. Anyhow, I'm happy with 1080 50p video. Which the Panasonic is excellent at compared to the E-M10 Mk1 only being very good.

I won't be shooting much video. Got a Sony camcorder which I use sometimes when there's a school performance or memorable event happening at home (party). From what I understand video has been improved with E-M10 mark II. Still, not the same level as Panasonic though.

As far as standard profile jpeg images are concerned, the Olympus has a short lead, but both are very customisable. Object follow focus is far better on the Panasonic and I tried it this morning on a seagull and was very impressed.

Your point regarding follow focus (C-AF with tracking?) may proof vital though. I'm used to shooting single point, single shot S-AF though, panning where panning is necessary. Having options thanks to useful C-AF might be handy though. Hmm.

 

[Croky]

Choosing E-M10 will give me in-body stabilisation. My perception is that I can choose from a broader range of lenses without losing stabilisation.

The question is, how often would that be useful to you? I use legacy manual lenses and I sometimes shoot at night or in lousy lighting conditions. And that's where IBIS is very useful even with fast, wider primes. But how often will you find yourself needing that stabilisation?

I will be using the camera in different scenes.

• Family photos outside by broad daylight; be it the zoo, backgarden, beach, hockey field or forest (with squirrels ).
• Family photos inside on cloudy days, Christmas (Tree string lights and candles), evenings with light bulbs (LED)

Just a little note. With people and other living things, IBIS is not all that useful. It's just that only your subjects will be blurry, instead of everything.

I don't fully understand Why would my subjects be blurry as a result of IBIS? I know that IBIS doesn't solve movement of the subjects. It only helps with the problem who is operating the camera (me). Appropriate shutter speed helps with movement of my subjects.

• Personal interest close-up / macro inside and outside

This is where focus bracketing of E-M10 Mark II would be nice to have. Although if we're not talking about true macro near 1:1 magnification (which the kit lenses are not capable of achieving), it's not as crucial as it's usually possible to get enough DoF at f/4 or f/5.6. And for most ground level shots for example, it's usually pretty easy to stabilise the camera yourself.

I actually do quite a lot of shots like that (not really macro, but something like this , this , thisor this ) and what I often miss is a fully articulating screen that would allow me to comfortably shoot in portrait orientation. On many occasions I would switch IBIS for a screen like that :-D

As for true macro, there are three macro lenses for MFT, two of which have OIS. So whether IBIS is important in this context would depend if you would ever get one of those lenses, and if so, which one.

With macro I was thinking of Oly's 60mm macro. I realize now that I have little idea of what Panasonic got to offer in terms of (OIS) lenses and prices. It's due to the fact that I narrowed my search to Olympus bodies after excluding Panasonic's stabilized GX7. I know Panasonic got a good travel zoom and a 20mm lots of people love (though slow AF). Anyway, off-topic. Macro it was.

• Personal interest street photography, evening/night photography

For truly night photography (like this ), you'll need a tripod.

But I've took my Panasonic 25/1.7 for a night walk around my neighbourhood (see here ). And IBIS was a very nice thing to have for this.

Panasonic 25mm is without OIS?

• Personal interest light painting

Well, you'll need a tripod for that. But the Live Composite mode on Oly is perfect for this kind of stuff. And is plenty fun to use and play with.

Got a tripod though I may replace it in time. It's kinda heavy, same as the dSLR I used it with.

• Some landscape between things

You'll probably be using the 14-42 kit lens for this, which is stabilized, so it wouldn't make much of a difference which camera you get. For night-time landscapes, a tripod is a must anyway.

G7 and E-M10 II both cost 799 euro with a 14-42 kit lens. However, E-M10 II will be available this week with a 130 euro discount. This may make it a no-brainer, but...

When it comes to kit lenses, I'd take Panasonic over Olympus. The bigger Oly 14-42 R II is an annoying collapsible design, and the pancake power-zoom has a rather bad rep when it comes to sample variation and image quality. And is a collapsible design as well which makes it longer for camera to be ready for action when you turn it on. I use the Panasonic 14-42 II on my E-M10, and like it a lot more than the lens that came with the camera (the R II version).

Exactly for your reasons I don't want the Oly 14-42 R II. I don't like it. I was thinking of the Oly EZ powerzoom for reasons of compactness. Otherwise I would have considered the 14-150 travel zoom.

I figured that if it's a bad copy, I return it to the shop to get a proper one. Wasn't it mostly a thing of early batches?

Might be. But yeah, you're right, you can always exchange it, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The advantage of buying the Oly body + Oly lens as a set is the massive discount I get. If I chose to buy an Oly body and a Pana lens seperately I pay full price.

Indeed, those lenses are always so much cheaper when bundled with a camera.

Am I missing something with the G7? Is it better in Low Light? IQ and AF wise?

I would expect it would be better in terms of AF, when paired with a Panasonic lens that supports DFD.

All kit lenses now sold with a new body support DFD, no? At least that was my understanding.

Yes, I think so, too. I think there are only one or two lenses that do not support it (but I might be wrong on that).

and a 17mm or 25mm prime.

IBIS will make it possible to shoot with those at really low shutter speeds. But that would mostly be useful when shooting at night or something. If you don't plan on doing that, it's not a big deal and you can use Oly lenses on G7 without any problems. And about night shooting, G7 is not the best choice if you plan on doing really long exposures, as it has that limited to 2 minutes I believe.

I take it shooting indoors on cloudy autumn days, home parties and evenings counts as low light as well. Not just pitch dark or city light trips in the evening. And true, I can use the flash, but there's also times that I don't want to ruin the ambience of the room or disturb my 1 year old with a bright flash.

As mentioned before, IS might not be of much use for stuff like that, unless you want to have motion blur. And with fast primes you should be fine indoors and in the evenings anyway. As for the flash, a proper one that you could use to bounce off the walls and ceiling goes a long way in improving the quality of in-door shots. So I would still recommend you get one at some point in the future. The built-in flash is mostly useless, I would say. I pretty much only use it to trigger off-camera flash :-D

I'd use the built-in flash as fill-in flash. In places where I can't bounce the light I guess it will do too. For anything more I'd resort to a Nissin i40 or something of the kind.

To be honest, it looks to me that whichever of the two you choose, it will be a good choice. The fact that you are not like "I really have to have IBIS" or "4K is a must" just shows that you don't really have a strong preference towards the strong points of each camera, in which case both should work perfectly fine for you. They'll just give you a bit different set of features to play with.

I'm about stabilisation. Money wise it'd seem Olympus got an edge coz of in-body stabilisation. I can buy cheaper lenses. 4K is indeed not a must. I was just very curious what 4K and stills taken from 4K video can offer me when my 6-year old is playing outside. I don't need 4K for a TV or so.

Yeah, if you can get Oly for less money, I'd say go for it. The video on Olympus sucks compared to Panasonic (and that's beside 4K), but for occasional family stuff should be enough. Big plus is that IBIS also works for video. And that's pretty neat, I must say. If only video quality was better that what was available in Panasonic compacts 5 years ago :-D

Video will be MUCH better than my dSLR already

Yup. The money bit does make it qute interesting. And even if I make a mistake... it's M4/3 so I can always go for another M4/3 body in the future.

 

[TruckTurner]

It's a tough call, but for me I'd go with the G7. The primary reasons are: ergonomics and video quality. I just liked the way the G7 handled (external controls, grip, etc.). The video quality differences speak for themselves (as many reviews have pointed out). I think that for the needs of the OP neither camera is an absolute head and shoulders choice above the other.

At a minimum the OP may want to make a choice sooner rather than later. I can't speak for other areas of the world, but in the U.S. the price of the G7 has gone up considerably in the last two weeks. The holiday season pricing is gone. The G7 was $597 new and now it's up to $797 new (Amazon and B&H pricing).

 

[Astrotripper]

Just a little note. With people and other living things, IBIS is not all that useful. It's just that only your subjects will be blurry, instead of everything.

I don't fully understand Why would my subjects be blurry as a result of IBIS? I know that IBIS doesn't solve movement of the subjects. It only helps with the problem who is operating the camera (me). Appropriate shutter speed helps with movement of my subjects.

I meant it like that: Indoors, you will most likely shoot 25mm and wider (I personally find 25mm a bit too tight indoors for my taste, but that will also depend on the type of venue). Anyway, to freeze your subjects, you will probably want to shoot at 1/60s or faster depending on situation. At those focal lengths, you don't need any IS to be able to get sharp hand-held shots at those kind of shutter speeds. So any advantage IBIS (or OIS for that matter) has here is not as significant as in some other use cases.

As for true macro, there are three macro lenses for MFT, two of which have OIS. So whether IBIS is important in this context would depend if you would ever get one of those lenses, and if so, which one.

With macro I was thinking of Oly's 60mm macro. I realize now that I have little idea of what Panasonic got to offer in terms of (OIS) lenses and prices. It's due to the fact that I narrowed my search to Olympus bodies after excluding Panasonic's stabilized GX7. I know Panasonic got a good travel zoom and a 20mm lots of people love (though slow AF). Anyway, off-topic. Macro it was.

Panasonic has 30mm and 45mm, both stabilised. The 45mm is a Leica branded lens and I think it is very expensive. The 30mm is a bit of an unusual beast, with a relatively short focal length for a macro.

• Personal interest street photography, evening/night photography

For truly night photography (like this ), you'll need a tripod.

But I've took my Panasonic 25/1.7 for a night walk around my neighbourhood (see here ). And IBIS was a very nice thing to have for this.

Panasonic 25mm is without OIS?

Unfortunately this is the case. They came up with an affordable 42.5mm that is stabilized and goes up against Olympus 45mm. But with 25mm, they just went for the cheap, and did not try to differentiate with OIS.

Yup. The money bit does make it qute interesting. And even if I make a mistake... it's M4/3 so I can always go for another M4/3 body in the future.

Nah, I think you're safe here. You said you've had a chance to handle both of them and liked them, so it's gonna be ok. Good feel for a camera is a pretty big deal I think. If you don't enjoy using a camera, it doesn't matter how good it might be.

 

[Fotoke]

It's a tough call, but for me I'd go with the G7. The primary reasons are: ergonomics and video quality. I just liked the way the G7 handled (external controls, grip, etc.). The video quality differences speak for themselves (as many reviews have pointed out). I think that for the needs of the OP neither camera is an absolute head and shoulders choice above the other.

At a minimum the OP may want to make a choice sooner rather than later. I can't speak for other areas of the world, but in the U.S. the price of the G7 has gone up considerably in the last two weeks. The holiday season pricing is gone. The G7 was $597 new and now it's up to $797 new (Amazon and B&H pricing).

The OP stated that the G7 and EM10-Ii kit bundles both cost €799. The Olympus apparently can be had temporarily for €670. That is a significant price difference if OP wants to make his choice now. I'd go with Olympus.

I do not know if the risen US price means Europe will follow.Maybe Panasonic is more expensive in parts of Europe anyway.

 

[e_kjellgren]

In Sweden the G7 has gone from €860 to €420 in six months, while the EM10II stays at €620.