GX-8 and Voigtlander 17.5 - first evening outing (C&C welcome)

[S. Miller]

I took my new toys out for a spin yesterday on what I call the Bob Tullis Brooklyn Bridge tour. A few notes:

• It's been a while since I've used a true manual focus lens. This one's a beauty, obviously made easier by the stationary subjects.
• I got a late start and had few opportunities to shoot in good light. No worries, I was looking to see how the camera and lens would function in this type of setting.
• Oh yeah, I wanted to travel light (one camera, one lens) so I didn't have a tripod.

If you pixel peep, all but the first image will either have issues with noise, camera shake, or focus/DOF (given that there was a limit to how far I could stop down to increase DOF). For those who have experience with this lens, I'd love to hear what settings you use for cityscapes like these. Wide open keeps the noise lower but of course DOF is very shallow. I guess the solution is to forego the "travel light" exercise and use a tripod if I really want evening shots with with a deep DOF.

Anyway, fire away with any C&C.

Steve









[ATTACH alt="Couldn't resist "borrowing" this staged proposal "]media_3291325[/ATTACH]
Couldn't resist "borrowing" this staged proposal














Paying homage to Bob Tullis (minus the tripod)








I think this was 1/4 second, braced against the shaking bridge structure

 

[aljudy]

Beautiful! I sure like this camera-lens combination

 

[cameron2]

Nice.

Did you use any filters for some of those shots?

 

[howardfuhrman]

Very nice, well composed and sharp photos.

 

[berni29]

Hi

Very nice indeed. Apart from your own skills, this is one of those lenses that has a certain "something" which sets it above the ordinary.

 

[Sitting Duck Photos]

Great compositions no matter the camera. I'd like to have seen these same shots taken with other top M43 cameras just to see the edge the GX8 has. I could have done without the "paying homage" comment because no one owns any composition in a public place...though the NY area has many scenes that are replicated and posted daily either on DPR, flickr or both, and that's tiresome.

 

[addlightness]

I like the 2nd pic most, followed by the 5th - high ISO yet clear, usable shots. Looks like a very good combo. I don't think you'll need a tripod given how good the shots are already. Congrats!

 

[S. Miller]

Nice.

Did you use any filters for some of those shots?

Thanks everyone for your comments and compliments.

Cameron, I didn't use any filters and if I recall correctly, didn't make any major adjustments to WB. The one with the orange-ish tint on the bridge was primarily from the lights and yellow taxis.

The one thing I wasn't pleased with was the rendering of fine detail (building edges) in the cityscape shots but I don't think it's fair to expect better results without a tripod. It was very dark outside aside from street/bridge/building lights, which required that I pushed the ISO up into the 5000 range for some shots since I couldn't shoot lower than 1/4 second. FYI, I stopped down the lens a bit to increase DOF but probably didn't get smaller than 2.8-4 for any of these. Compounding the issue, shooting without a tripod at shutter speeds slower than 1/30 is hardly a recipe for crisp shots, especially when you consider the magnified impact the slightest movement can have on buildings 1/2 mile away.

Griping aside, for all I know though these could still possibly print well up to A3 or 13x19 size (viewed at appropriate distance).

One of these days I'll post a mini-review of the GX-8. What I can say so far is that I LOVE the EVF (and I'm coming from a solid E-M1 EVF) and hands down my favorite feature is using Touch AF on the LCD while viewing through the EVF. LOVE IT!!! Re: the Voigt...I'm already comfortable shooting stationary objects, handling movement is next on the list. Early conclusion: beautiful lens capable of equally beautiful images when used in the right hands. Oh yeah, it feels right on the GX-8. For me, I think it would feel awkward on a smaller m43 body.

Regarding high ISO noise compared to the E-M1, I have ZERO scientific proof but I feel like the advantage goes to the GX-8. My rule of thumb with the E-M1 was color up to 3200 and if I needed 6400, I'd convert the image to B&W. I've shot some 12,800 images with the GX-8 for friends outside at night that I felt comfortable sending to them in color. I don't want to post my friends' photos without their permission but here's an ISO 6400 shot of my daughter taken on an outdoor dining patio at night. I could have gone with a lower shutter speed so you could say that I could have easily used ISO 3200, but rest assured, there wasn't a ton of light. Oh yeah, this low light discussion relates to shooting in RAW and adjusting the luminance noise in LR (to 40 in this photo).

Steve




Having the PL Nocticron 42.5 certainly didn't hurt! A pretty decent lens.

 

[George Spencer]

Very nice!

 

[Michael L NYC 99]

Regarding high ISO noise compared to the E-M1, I have ZERO scientific proof but I feel like the advantage goes to the GX-8. My rule of thumb with the E-M1 was color up to 3200 and if I needed 6400, I'd convert the image to B&W. I've shot some 12,800 images with the GX-8 for friends outside at night that I felt comfortable sending to them in color.

Steve

I don't have either the GX-8 or E-M1, so I have no opinion on which has better high ISO performance. I do have the E-M5 MK II and I find that camera's IBIS makes a big difference by shooting at low shutter speeds (reliably in the 1/4 sec range) to keep ISO from going too high. I try to keep ISO at 1600 max, but I'll go higher if necessary. I imagine the IBIS on your E-M1 is better than on your GX-8, so you can shoot at lower shutter speeds and lower ISO with your E-M1, especially since there's no OIS in the Nokton for dual IS.

Have you tried opening the shadows in your GX-8 shots? You kept them very dark, but I'm curious about the noise that would be visible if pushed.

I think some of the lack of sharpness you see in your cityscape shots is due to the lens, which is inherent softness on the left and right sides. I shoot the Nokton 17.5 at f5.6 and the edges still are soft, but that's just something that comes with that lens.

Michael

 

[S. Miller]

Regarding high ISO noise compared to the E-M1, I have ZERO scientific proof but I feel like the advantage goes to the GX-8. My rule of thumb with the E-M1 was color up to 3200 and if I needed 6400, I'd convert the image to B&W. I've shot some 12,800 images with the GX-8 for friends outside at night that I felt comfortable sending to them in color.

Steve

I don't have either the GX-8 or E-M1, so I have no opinion on which has better high ISO performance. I do have the E-M5 MK II and I find that camera's IBIS makes a big difference by shooting at low shutter speeds (reliably in the 1/4 sec range) to keep ISO from going too high. I try to keep ISO at 1600 max, but I'll go higher if necessary. I imagine the IBIS on your E-M1 is better than on your GX-8, so you can shoot at lower shutter speeds and lower ISO with your E-M1, especially since there's no OIS in the Nokton for dual IS.

Have you tried opening the shadows in your GX-8 shots? You kept them very dark, but I'm curious about the noise that would be visible if pushed.

I think some of the lack of sharpness you see in your cityscape shots is due to the lens, which is inherent softness on the left and right sides. I shoot the Nokton 17.5 at f5.6 and the edges still are soft, but that's just something that comes with that lens.

Michael

--
See my Flickr photostream here Michael.Lee.Pics.NYC
See my gallery on Getty Images here

Hi Michael,

You make some very good points. I haven't tested it but can only assume the IBIS on the E-M1 is better than that on the GX-8. And yes, with the Voigtlander, I don't get Dual IS (but I do with the PL Nocticron!). The bottom line is that if I really cared about ultimate IQ, I should have brought a tripod but when I set out for a few hours of shooting, I didn't even think I'd end up by the bridge (I guess my internal compass naturally draws me there).

Totally agree that IBIS lets you shoot at lower speeds and as a result, lower ISO and noise. However, my issue without a tripod was that I had to balance the desire for a decently deep DOF (ideal would have been f/4 or smaller) with the shutter speed not going too low (with ISO taking its cue from the other two). Some of the shots were as low as 1/4 to 1/13 second. Even with the best IBIS, the slightest movement for far away buildings is exaggerated and I wouldn't have wanted to go with a slower shutter speed.

Interesting point about the edges on the Voigt being soft even at f/5.6. I've never been one of those to get in a tizzy if my lens doesn't perform spectacularly at the edges but I definitely notice it here. That said, I didn't buy this lens for these types of shots, so I don't think this is a major issue for me. Also, part of the blame comes from the narrow DOF I was shooting at that night.

Per your request, I opened the shadows in the two images below. I have luminance noise in LR bumped up to 50 and I think the shadows look a bit mushy to me. It then becomes a trade-off between keeping the shadows dark or recovering the light and living with a bit more noise. I think I like your suggestion in both images (definitely the second).

It's been a while since I've printed semi-large (13x19). Maybe I'll give it a try and see how they look on paper.

Steve




Pulled shadows




Original




Pulled shadows - I definitely like this version better




Original