Question to White Lightning users

[digitalguy]

I am looking at purchasing some AlienBees as well as White Lightnings, so i have some questions for you White Lightning guys out there.

Besides normal studio use, how and for what lighting scenarios do you use your white lightnings?

And what lighting scenario would you prefer using the White Lightning instead of the AlienBees?
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digitalguy

 

[Joseph S Wisniewski]

I am looking at purchasing some AlienBees as well as White Lightnings, so i have some questions for you White Lightning guys out there.

Besides normal studio use, how and for what lighting scenarios do you use your white lightnings?

And what lighting scenario would you prefer using the White Lightning instead of the AlienBees?

I'll answer in the context of what I own already, and what I'd do with what's available now.

I would almost never prefer the Bees. I have enough money for the White Lightnings (the difference is typically $80-100 per light) and I have a Detroit native's appreciation for things made of metal and having just a little more "heft" to them. The White Lightning line (whether the current X or my older Ultras) will take a 250W modeling lamp, which puts out twice as much light as the 150W rated limit of the Bees. I like lots of light in my modeling lamps.

The only context where I'd prefer a Bee is with fast action.

• The Bee 400 (200 watt-seconds) has a 1/2000 sec t.1 (motion stopping) time, half that of the White Lightning X800 and 1/4 that of my older Ultra 600 (same power as the X800). So, for $225, it has a lot of motion stopping ability, great for leaps, racquet swinging shots, blowing hair, etc. Until Einstein came along, the Bee 400 was the fastest Paul Buff light, and faster than just about anything from any other manufacture. (Einstein is better at stopping motion than a Bee 400, but a Bee 400 is less than half the price of an Einstein. Action on a budget).
• Einstein - I only have 2 of them. I prefer them in essentially any situation I'd use any other light in, except when I need the power of the X3200. They have constant color temperature, while any conventional monolight from any other manufacturer drops 60-80K for every stop you turn down power. The Einsteins recycle quicker, their flash duration is shorter, their controls are more sophisticated than anything else on the market. I believe that they are the best monolights on the market.
• White Lighting X3200 - I have one of these. It comes along when I know I'm going to need flat out power, because at 1320 w-s, it's twice as powerful as my old White Lightning Ultra 1200 (600 w-s) units or my new Einstein 640 (640 w-s) units. Indoor sports, or really big products. It doesn't get used as often these days, due to how well the D3 works at ISO 200, 400, or 800.
• White Lightning X1600 - I don't own any, but the have the same power as my older White Lightning Ultra 1200 units. There is absolutely no reason to buy an X1600 today . It's $440, and when you add the $90 CSR+ receiver, the total is $530. The Einstein 640 is $500 and its receiver is just $30, so for the same $530, you get a light that is superior to the X1600 in every possible way. That aside, I tend to use a 600 w-s as my main much of the time.
• White Lightning Ultra 600 units. I have at least 6 of them. They're my workhorses, especially in these days of ISO 800 in the studio. They're equivalent to an X800 or Bee 800.

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

 

[digitalguy]

Does anybody use the white lightning for weddings or fashion?
If you do, why would you prefer the white lightnings over the AlienBees?
--
digitalguy

 

[Joseph S Wisniewski]

Does anybody use the white lightning for weddings or fashion?

Yes

If you do, why would you prefer the white lightnings over the AlienBees?

1. Modeling light power: This is the most important reason for me, especially for fashion. The White Lightnings have twice the modeling light power of Alien Bees. 4100 lumens from a 250W ETD quartz bulb, vs 2100 lumens from the 150W EDT in the Bees. Paul C. Buff says that trying to use 250W bulbs in the Bee will melt them, and I choose to believe him. With 250W bulbs, even in soft boxes, the modeling lights are sufficient.
2. Raw power: my biggest White Lightning is an X3200, twice the power of the biggest Bee 1600 or my Einstein 640 lights.
3. Dual umbrella shafts. This is a feature of the new White Lightnings X series. It lets you make a "clamshell" light by facing the light away from the subject, putting a silver umbrella in the normal position, and putting a satin "shoot through" umbrella in the reverse position. It's a handy trick at a wedding because it's got a quality of light that's comparable to a soft box, but it's totally stable, the center of gravity of the light and 2 umbrella is directly over the center of the light stand. And it's less obtrusive than a soft box. That's not as important for fashion, where I use soft boxes. Apparently, Paul Buff though it wasn't important, either, because he left it off the new Einsteins.
4. Modeling light control: the White Lightnings have separate slider controls for modeling light power and flash power, so you could do something like having one flash at 1/2 power with the modeling light at full, and another at 1/4 power with its modeling light at 1/2 power, and now you've got a 2:1 ratio on the flash and a 2:1 on the modeling lights. But instead of that 2:1 being 1/2 and 1/4 like the flash, it's full and 1/2, so you get twice the modeling light power.

There are ways around number 2 and 4. The new "PLM" is similar in quality of light and stability to a 2 umbrella clamshell (and you can make a clamshell using a PLM and a shoot-through umbrella on an Einstein or an Alien Bee).

And the Cyber Commander and CSR+ receivers give Alien Bees the ability to control modeling lights like the White Lightning X lights do.

Once again, White Lightning X is basically a "dead" line. You should be looking at Einstein instead, unless you want the really big light, the X3200.

• The workhorse, the X1600, costs exactly the same as an Einstein, $530, if you get a receiver for each (CSR+ for X1600, CSXCV for Einstein). Einstein so outclasses the X1600 that, unless you already have some X1600 and X3200 lights and feel some sort of weird compulsion to have everything look the same, there's no reason to stick with White Lightning.
• The smaller X, the X800, is only $50 cheaper than Einstein ($480 vs. $530, with receivers) but it's so lacking in versatility that I'd still say "skip it". With the older "Ultra" series, it made sense to have a mix of smaller and larger lights, the smaller Ultra 600 lights were better for action, they had shorter durations and faster recycle times than the larger Ultra 1200. And they're better for direct lighting like hair lights and rim lights, where the larger units are too powerful. But X1600 and X3200 have a "quarter power" feature, press a button and they have the lower power, shorter duration, and faster recycling of the smaller X800 (X1600 actually matches the Bee 400 in that respect).

So, at least to my way of thinking X800 has been "obsolete" even when it was first introduced, and Einstein makes X1600 obsolete. The only White Lightning "left" is the X3200.

--
Rahon Klavanian 1912-2008.

Armenian genocide survivor, amazing cook, scrabble master, and loving grandmother. You will be missed.

Ciao! Joseph

http://www.swissarmyfork.com

 

[digitalguy]

Thanks Joseph for your info but i was hoping i could get some feedback on other users.

--
digitalguy

 

[digitalguy]

this is the kind of info i'm looking for
Thanks Joseph

Many Thanks, i think i may have some more questions for you but i'll do some more research and get back to you
--
digitalguy

 

[R Neil]

Joseph,

GREAT post ... a ton of information and the reasoning behind it explained cogently ... and since our last light purchases were our Ultra 1800's a few years (ahem) back followed a bit later by a couple of the "Zap ? (1000?)" units for a traveling kit ... we were wondering what to get when we do finally add some more.

We recently had our old Speedotron Brownline power-pack die past rebuild-ability after having had it re-built 3 times or so. All we'd been using it for was the background lighting for the white seamless cyc, so we've been using our "travel" Zaps for that. I'd been wondering what to get, and you certainly gave me all the info I needed.

Einstein it shall be ...
--
Neil
MyPhotoMentor.com
rNeilPhotog.com

 

[Scott Smith Photography]

I have both Alien Bees B800's and the older Ultra Zap 800's. In the past I've owned B400's, 800's and 1600's. Same as previous answer - the modelling maps are more powerful in the zaps, though I prefer the separate modelling lamp control on the Bees.

I find them to be very similar to work with, and almost completely interchangeable otherwise, except that the zaps have a 1/4" trigger jack and the bees have the 1/8th inch. I also prefer the metal/solid/hefty feel of the zaps, at least until I'm lugging them very far for on-site work.

The zaps do seem to have a slightly higher output, so I tend to use them behind softboxes and use the bees on shoot-thru umbrellas or to light up white vinyl backdrops.

I bought the zaps used on CL for almost nothing, and if I ran across more at a good price, I'd buy more.

 

[Reubal]

[I didn't realize someone had resurrected such an old thread.]