More girls basketball with 200 f2

[gnagel]

Captured the following images last night with my D700 and 200 f2 along with three SB flash units:

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Thanks for looking...
Glenn
--
http://gnagel.zenfolio.com/

 

[PHXAZCRAIG]

How did you set up the flashes? Like the strobist site examples? (Radio controlled? Sited...?)

 

[gnagel]

One flash left of baseline clamped to post and positioned to bounce off ceiling; Second flash right of baseline clamped to post and positioned to bounce of ceiling; Third fllash next to second flash...but set at low power and positioned to feather direct flash over court.

First to flash units set to 1/4 power with third set to 1/32 power.

All flash units triggered via Radiopoppers using SU-800.

Glenn

How did you set up the flashes? Like the strobist site examples? (Radio controlled? Sited...?)

--
http://gnagel.zenfolio.com/

 

[PHXAZCRAIG]

Those flashes sure help! (And of course the 200F2.)

You like the Radiopoppers? Been strongly considering them, except for the high startup cost to get enough for 3 or 4 flashes.

 

[EJF]

These are great, Glenn. I love #7 - the pigtails, the nail polish, the look of concentration. Adorable! What a great position you were in to get this shot.
Ellen

 

[gnagel]

I like the Radiopoppers. In the past seven games, they have never failed to trigger the flash units.

For basketball, I think the Juniors would do the job for a fraction of the cost--since I shoot in Manual for indoor sports. The PX version supports iTTL and high speed sync...but I don't usually use those features for indoor basketball. What I like most about the Radiopoppers is the ability to change the power of the flash right from the camera. My flash units are not easily accessible...and I tend to need to make adjustments once they are positioned.

Glenn

Those flashes sure help! (And of course the 200F2.)

You like the Radiopoppers? Been strongly considering them, except for the high startup cost to get enough for 3 or 4 flashes.

 

[gnagel]

Thanks Ellen...

The girls are fun to photograph. I have three games tonight...and I'm looking forward to seeing if I can capture more photos like that one.

Glenn

These are great, Glenn. I love #7 - the pigtails, the nail polish, the look of concentration. Adorable! What a great position you were in to get this shot.

 

[Lou Tent]

Again - great shots Glenn. It's difficult to come
up with a suggestion for improvement, but after looking
over the shots several times it looks like maybe an on-camera
flash to provide a "catch light"? I can see the lights in
the kids eyes as they look up, but not so much when
they are head on.

Looks like fun - parents must really like these!

--
Lou

http://loutent.smugmug.com/

 

[gnagel]

Thank you Lou!

Unfortunately, flash is not allowed in the gym! If my flash was noticeable, the refs would make me turn them off. By bouncing the light off the ceilings (and positioning the flash units high off the floor), nobody realizes that I'm using flash.

Otherwise, the catch lights would really help.

Thanks,
Glenn

Again - great shots Glenn. It's difficult to come
up with a suggestion for improvement, but after looking
over the shots several times it looks like maybe an on-camera
flash to provide a "catch light"? I can see the lights in
the kids eyes as they look up, but not so much when
they are head on.

Looks like fun - parents must really like these!

 

[alasta]

Well done, Glenn. I really love the last shot - it really captures the atmosphere brilliantly.

 

[ecxs]

...would the light distract the players? Isn't that why pro sport photographers don't use flashes during games?

E

 

[1971_M5]

Not fair, Glenn! You have this nailed-down -- and are making it look easy. One of the first TV commercials I vividly remember (1967 or 1968... I was 8 or 9 years old) was during an early Super Bowl (Packers-Raiders or Packers-Chiefs). We were at our neighbor's house (they had a color TV) and a limo pulls up to the curb. Paul Hornung steps out with three babes in-tow and says "Practice, practice, practice." I can't remember what the ad was for and as a kid I had no idea that Hornung was a poster boy for "livin-large" athletes. But I do remember what he said when he stepped out of the car with the beautiful girls on his arm. You are doing very well with this endeavor! I am sure the parents appreciate it, too. And hopefully it is fun and satisfying. I am tempted to head down to Galzer's (pro photo shop in Seattle) and rent a 200/2 -- just for fun. Uhhh... mayne not. Because it would be trouble if I liked it... $$$$

--
JF

 

[Revision]

The major constraints you are shooting under result in flat lighting, 1 stop underexposed shots, frozen/static pictures, unflattering facial expressions, out-of context no depth images.

What about restaging some of the shots after the game? Then you would be in control of the lighting, timing of the shots, posing, perspective.

You are doing the best that can be done under these circumstances, but the rules are forcing you to play with your right hand tied behind your back. This setup is stifling your creativity.

--
Best Regards,
Renato

'The world is going to pieces and people like Adams and Weston are photographing rocks.' Henri Cartier Bresson, in the 1930's

 

[gnagel]

Thank you

Well done, Glenn. I really love the last shot - it really captures the atmosphere brilliantly.

 

[gnagel]

The players can't tell that the flash is firing. I asked the referee last night if he could see any flashes during the game--and he said no.

The flashes are bouncing off the ceiling...and the flash units are positioned quite high...so the burst of light can't be seen.

Pro sports photographers do use flash. All those Sports Illustrated cover shots are strobed...from the rafters.

Glenn

...would the light distract the players? Isn't that why pro sport photographers don't use flashes during games?

 

[gnagel]

Thanks...

I'm afraid that you'll ending up purchasing a 200 f2 if you start looking at one!

Glenn

Not fair, Glenn! You have this nailed-down -- and are making it look easy. One of the first TV commercials I vividly remember (1967 or 1968... I was 8 or 9 years old) was during an early Super Bowl (Packers-Raiders or Packers-Chiefs). We were at our neighbor's house (they had a color TV) and a limo pulls up to the curb. Paul Hornung steps out with three babes in-tow and says "Practice, practice, practice." I can't remember what the ad was for and as a kid I had no idea that Hornung was a poster boy for "livin-large" athletes. But I do remember what he said when he stepped out of the car with the beautiful girls on his arm. You are doing very well with this endeavor! I am sure the parents appreciate it, too. And hopefully it is fun and satisfying. I am tempted to head down to Galzer's (pro photo shop in Seattle) and rent a 200/2 -- just for fun. Uhhh... mayne not. Because it would be trouble if I liked it... $$$$

 

[gnagel]

Sure it would be nicer if I could stage the shots after the game. But, these are intended to be live action shots...and it isn't like the court is sitting empty before or after the games--or that people will want to wait around while I try to get action photos of 16 different girls.

The lighting is a little flat...but I've been trying to combat that by feathering a SB-600 over the court...for some side lighting. According to my histogram, the shots are not underexposed--looking at the zones of exposure for skin and so forth. My goal is to freeze the action (just as Sports Illustrated has done for years). And, I'm trying to isolate the players by looking for solid, plain backgrounds (which often means moving objects out of the background).

Glenn

The major constraints you are shooting under result in flat lighting, 1 stop underexposed shots, frozen/static pictures, unflattering facial expressions, out-of context no depth images.

What about restaging some of the shots after the game? Then you would be in control of the lighting, timing of the shots, posing, perspective.

You are doing the best that can be done under these circumstances, but the rules are forcing you to play with your right hand tied behind your back. This setup is stifling your creativity.

 

[RBudding]

It looks as if the ambient light is the dominant light source. I'd expect much better colors if the flash were set to overpower ambient. And you'd eliminate the flat ceiling light. That's why I've gone to mono lights triggered with PocketWizards. Lots of power (at least 2 stops over ambient), fast recycle times, and no motion blurr.

 

[gnagel]

No question about it. There's no way that a SB900, SB800 and SB600 are going to light up a dark gymnasium to the extent of two stops OVER ambient. At 1/2 power, I get the exposure to two stops UNDER ambient.

I should probably look into some lighting that would be more powerful that the SB units. The SB's do a great job of supplementing ambient light. To your point, more powerful lights would provide better color and no motion blur.

Thanks,
Glenn

It looks as if the ambient light is the dominant light source. I'd expect much better colors if the flash were set to overpower ambient. And you'd eliminate the flat ceiling light. That's why I've gone to mono lights triggered with PocketWizards. Lots of power (at least 2 stops over ambient), fast recycle times, and no motion blurr.

 

[gnagel]

I don't know what I was thinking when I wrote this!

I read the ambient and the underexpose the ambient by 2 stops. Then, I set the power on the SB units until the flash properly exposes the subject. So, the flash is set for 2 stops over the ambient--not under the ambient.

If I reduce the ambient exposure much more (let's say three or four stops underexposed before flash), then the backgrounds start to go black and I end up with that flash look. My flash units simply don't have enough power to light the entire gym without using the ambient to assist them.

Glenn

No question about it. There's no way that a SB900, SB800 and SB600 are going to light up a dark gymnasium to the extent of two stops OVER ambient. At 1/2 power, I get the exposure to two stops UNDER ambient.

I should probably look into some lighting that would be more powerful that the SB units. The SB's do a great job of supplementing ambient light. To your point, more powerful lights would provide better color and no motion blur.

Thanks,
Glenn

It looks as if the ambient light is the dominant light source. I'd expect much better colors if the flash were set to overpower ambient. And you'd eliminate the flat ceiling light. That's why I've gone to mono lights triggered with PocketWizards. Lots of power (at least 2 stops over ambient), fast recycle times, and no motion blurr.

--
http://gnagel.zenfolio.com/