They noticed. Finally.

[Chato]

Well, this has diverted substantially from the original topic, so I
won't comment further on it. My main take away from your
"contribution" is that... you must be a H* of a
boss/husband/parent. ;-)

I started to learn about the proper use of arms at the age of eight. Strangely enough when I pick up a gun, I don't think about killing the neighbors. Go figure?
Dave

 

[Michael_J]

I'm sure the Czechs agreed when Chamberlain sold them out for peace.
There aren't many happy slaves.

If the peaceniks really wanted peace and not war - they'd all travel
to congregate in dictatorship countries and dedicate their lives
trying to convince those leaders and fanatics to "come on people now,
smile on your brother, everybody get together, and try to love one
another right now." How many are boarding the "peace train" to North
Korea or Iran to spread peace and love? None, instead they cower in
free countries - countries that have already fought and paid the
price for peace.

Rid the world of dictators and fanatics and there would be no need
for war. But do that FIRST, then come back and we'll talk.

You don't achieve peace by disarming the peace keepers.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

Only this last sentence of yours makes sense. The rest is junk.

See? Most reasonable people can find common ground. We can work on the junk later.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

 

[G. Gray]

Interesting, We have always had rifles in a closet when I was Very young and I would never take them without permission.

30% of households in Canada have firearms and yet it is the illegal guns that gangs and drug enforcers use that the general public focus on. Go figure.

Well, this has diverted substantially from the original topic, so I
won't comment further on it. My main take away from your
"contribution" is that... you must be a H* of a
boss/husband/parent. ;-)

I started to learn about the proper use of arms at the age of eight.
Strangely enough when I pick up a gun, I don't think about killing
the neighbors. Go figure?
Dave

--

If you go into Home Depot and someone offers to help you and he is not an employee, you are in Canada

Since we can't keep crime in check, why don't we legalize it and tax it out of business?

 

[Soenda]

May I ask in all honesty where the illegal guns come from? Are they made by companies here in the US? IOW, are they legal guns until they're purchased through some illegal channel? Or are the illegal guns in the US mainly imports, smuggled in from other countries?

I have this notion in my head that thousands of arms are bought by gangs and organized crime come from the gun shows, where background checks are less rigorous.

I know that firearms used in crimes often began life as legal guns until they were stolen and introduced into criminal channels. That would seem to me to be one more argument for making some kinds of weapons illegal. However, I don't know what percentage of guns used for illegal purposes arrive via the various possible avenues. That's something that would be useful to know in trying to get one's hands around the issue.

--
http://www.pbase.com/soenda

 

[Soenda]

I'm sure the Czechs agreed when Chamberlain sold them out for peace.
There aren't many happy slaves.

If the peaceniks really wanted peace and not war - they'd all travel
to congregate in dictatorship countries and dedicate their lives
trying to convince those leaders and fanatics to "come on people now,
smile on your brother, everybody get together, and try to love one
another right now." How many are boarding the "peace train" to North
Korea or Iran to spread peace and love? None, instead they cower in
free countries - countries that have already fought and paid the
price for peace.

Rid the world of dictators and fanatics and there would be no need
for war. But do that FIRST, then come back and we'll talk.

You don't achieve peace by disarming the peace keepers.

I always interpreted those sentiments---wishing for peace---to be aimed at both sides of armed conflicts.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

--
http://www.pbase.com/soenda

 

[James Arnold 1971]

You are a dreamer. Politicions and yourself use firearm controls as a
DIVERTION from the really important issues. All gun control measures
only effect legally owned guns. They do not effect the bad guys who
have illegal guns. The bad guys like gun control laws as it makes
their job easier.
Canada spent 2 billion dollars on a gun control system and it did
nothing except give money for expenses to a well chosen few. For
those who do not know, handguns have been registered in Canada since
the 1930s. Did the registration or the laws get rid of any illegal
firearms. NO !
So the people who attempt to use gun control as a means of divertion
are either making money at it or want you to not look at matters that
are important.

 

[G. Gray]

This link may give you something to think about.
http://www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org/downloads/pdf/trace_report_final.pdf

It appears that many "Illegal" guns (handguns) that may be used for criminal activity in Canada are smuggled into Canada from the USA.

As you have said background checks in the USA may be responsible for guns hitting the streets and across state lines. Many handguns are manufactured in the USA and Canada . They only become illegal if they fall into the wrong hands. In Canada , all handguns are registered since the 1930s. Its only the smuggled in guns that are not. In the USA without a background check or waiting period it is easier to move guns from state to state or Canada.

As you know, drugs are brought in from the outside and with them come the guns to enforce the trade.

My whole point is... I am not against gun control or registration, but don't treat me like a criminal just because you cannot enforce the same rules on the bad guys.

May I ask in all honesty where the illegal guns come from? Are they
made by companies here in the US? IOW, are they legal guns until
they're purchased through some illegal channel? Or are the illegal
guns in the US mainly imports, smuggled in from other countries?

I have this notion in my head that thousands of arms are bought by
gangs and organized crime come from the gun shows, where background
checks are less rigorous.

I know that firearms used in crimes often began life as legal guns
until they were stolen and introduced into criminal channels. That
would seem to me to be one more argument for making some kinds of
weapons illegal. However, I don't know what percentage of guns used
for illegal purposes arrive via the various possible avenues. That's
something that would be useful to know in trying to get one's hands
around the issue.

--
http://www.pbase.com/soenda

--

If you go into Home Depot and someone offers to help you and he is not an employee, you are in Canada

Since we can't keep crime in check, why don't we legalize it and tax it out of business?

 

[mamallama]

Michael_J wrote:
[snip]

Rid the world of dictators and fanatics and there would be no need
for war. But do that FIRST, then come back and we'll talk.

It's junk if you think that wars are only caused by dictators and fanatics, unless you include religious dictators and fanatics. Evidence include the Crusades of the 11th to 13th centuries, a war between Christians and Islam (Muslims). It was one of the most violent periods in the history of mankind. Even Christian fanatics fight amongst themselves and happened in the hundred years of war in Northern Ireland between the Protestants and Catholics.

Not all wars are caused by dictators like Hitler and Kim Jong-Il.

--mamallama

 

[G. Gray]

http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Talk/talk.politics.guns/2009-03/msg00759.html
--

If you go into Home Depot and someone offers to help you and he is not an employee, you are in Canada

Since we can't keep crime in check, why don't we legalize it and tax it out of business?

 

[Debbie Renae]

want to stop terrorism? then the first thing you have to do is to
come up with the truth about religion and all the different fanatical
beliefs that have been brainwashed into every ones head.

time to be blantantly honest. religion is the cause of all evil in
this world right now, not money, or photography.

think about it.

Hey, Debbie, I thought about it and It's not religion, per se.
Rather, it's the intolerance between religions. It's too often, "My
religion is better than your religion, it's the ONLY religion and
it's always right". When I hear that, I run the other way.

With that being preached, it's no wonder the world's in turmoil.
Think about that.

I think multi-religions and factions and sects at best illustrate
there is no single "Word of God". The Word of God is whatever the
believers want it to be.

God gave us a brain. Primitive man wrote the Bible. Take your pick
and do with it as you please.

God did not give us a brain. See, that is my problem with all of this. My brain was given to me by my parents who conceived me. If one wants to believe in God, that is fine, but if he gave us anything, it was his ideas for a better life, and that is it, period.

There is no proof whatsoever that God gave us anything, and as soon as we start being honest with ourselves, the better. It is well know to Doctors worldwide that prayer has no affect on saving lives, it is only the belief that is does. We are all brainwashed into that thought process, when in reality, it is not up to God to determine whether or not someone is going to make it through a surgery, it is not up to prayer either. It is up to the Doctors training and expertise and maybe a little luck, but their is NO PROOF that God ever saved any human life.

Call me whatever you like, but everyone knows it deep down inside of your brain that I am telling the truth, and the sooner we stop brainwashing people into believing some of these ridiculous religous beliefs the better.

There is not going to be some magical place with 71 virgins waiting for us when we die. Nor are suicide bombers going to be rewarded for their sick views. They are going to die, and never come back.

So, stop this insanity and teach the values of human decency and family values instead. And last but not least, enjoy life while you are here, because when it is over, it is over. Everything else is pure speculation with absolutely no proof to support those religious views.

The arguement "My religion is better than yours." is no different
than my camera is better than yours.

--
WSSA Member #281 on 04-23-09

--
Debbie Renae

 

[Michael_J]

I'm sure the Czechs agreed when Chamberlain sold them out for peace.
There aren't many happy slaves.

If the peaceniks really wanted peace and not war - they'd all travel
to congregate in dictatorship countries and dedicate their lives
trying to convince those leaders and fanatics to "come on people now,
smile on your brother, everybody get together, and try to love one
another right now." How many are boarding the "peace train" to North
Korea or Iran to spread peace and love? None, instead they cower in
free countries - countries that have already fought and paid the
price for peace.

Rid the world of dictators and fanatics and there would be no need
for war. But do that FIRST, then come back and we'll talk.

You don't achieve peace by disarming the peace keepers.

I always interpreted those sentiments---wishing for peace---to be
aimed at both sides of armed conflicts.

Cute, but both sides of armed conflicts are not wishing for peace, they are fighting for victory. Peace is a byproduct of victory.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

 

[Chato]

God did not give us a brain. See, that is my problem with all of
this. My brain was given to me by my parents who conceived me. If
one wants to believe in God, that is fine, but if he gave us
anything, it was his ideas for a better life, and that is it, period.

There is no proof whatsoever that God gave us anything, and as soon
as we start being honest with ourselves, the better. It is well know
to Doctors worldwide that prayer has no affect on saving lives, it is
only the belief that is does. We are all brainwashed into that
thought process, when in reality, it is not up to God to determine
whether or not someone is going to make it through a surgery, it is
not up to prayer either. It is up to the Doctors training and
expertise and maybe a little luck, but their is NO PROOF that God
ever saved any human life.

Call me whatever you like, but everyone knows it deep down inside of
your brain that I am telling the truth, and the sooner we stop
brainwashing people into believing some of these ridiculous religous
beliefs the better.

There is not going to be some magical place with 71 virgins waiting
for us when we die. Nor are suicide bombers going to be rewarded for
their sick views. They are going to die, and never come back.

So, stop this insanity and teach the values of human decency and
family values instead. And last but not least, enjoy life while you
are here, because when it is over, it is over. Everything else is
pure speculation with absolutely no proof to support those religious
views.

The problem I have with blaming everything on religion is that Wars existed long before religions were used for the excuse. The big proselytyining religions are a reflection of human nature and not the cause of human nature.

I would not dispute for a moment the countless millions killed in the name of God - But so what? Ghenghis Khan didn't need God to justify killing millions, and neither did Stalin or Hitler. Religion is just one of Many tools to justify war. And yes, from time to time, as in the Crusades or todays Jihadists, Religion plays a more diminant role. But if the Crusaders had come from a wealthy society, they never would have left home. And if the wealth of Saudi Arabia was fairly distributed, there wouldn't have been a 9/11. It doesn't matter that Humphrhey of Bourgogne was a wealthy man, as is Osama. Their fellowers are tools to be led, and religion is just the patina masking deeper causes.

Dave

 

[Chato]

Cute, but both sides of armed conflicts are not wishing for peace,
they are fighting for victory. Peace is a byproduct of victory.

Can you give me a list of wars that resulted in "peace?"

Mind you, I'm Not a pacifist, but if you're going to redicule the "naive," better check a mirror first.

Dave

 

[Michael_J]

Rid the world of dictators and fanatics and there would be no need
for war. But do that FIRST, then come back and we'll talk.

It's junk if you think that wars are only caused by dictators and
fanatics, unless you include religious dictators and fanatics.

Sorry, I should have been more specific:

dictators and fanatics
religious dictators and religious fanatics
short dictators and short fanatics
tall dictators and tall fanatics
boy dictators and boy fanatics
girl dictators and girl fanatics
white dictators and white fanatics
black dictators and black fanatics
conservative dictators and conservative fanatics
liberal dictators and liberal fanatics
redheaded dictators and redheaded fanatics
right-handed dictators and right-handed fanatics
left-handed dictators and left-handed fanatics
carnivore dictators and carnivore fanatics
vegetarian dictators and vegetarian fanatics

Do you get my drift yet?

Evidence include the Crusades of the 11th to 13th centuries, a war
between Christians and Islam (Muslims). It was one of the most
violent periods in the history of mankind. Even Christian fanatics
fight amongst themselves and happened in the hundred years of war in
Northern Ireland between the Protestants and Catholics.

Not all wars are caused by dictators like Hitler and Kim Jong-Il.

No kidding - that's not what my words said.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

 

[Michael_J]

Nothing wrong with corny - corny is often true.
HEY!, wait a minute, you were trying to "redicule" me weren't you? \;-D

Cute, but both sides of armed conflicts are not wishing for peace,
they are fighting for victory. Peace is a byproduct of victory.

Can you give me a list of wars that resulted in "peace?"
Mind you, I'm Not a pacifist, but if you're going to redicule the
"naive," better check a mirror first.

Thanks, I check a little later.

US Revolutionary war - we are at peace with the British
US Civil War - the North and South are at peace with each other.
WWII - we are at peace with Germany and Japan

Can you list wars that were ended by simply wishing for peace?

I checked the mirror and I'm looking gooood! thanks again.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

 

[mamallama]

Rid the world of dictators and fanatics and there would be no need
for war. But do that FIRST, then come back and we'll talk.

It's junk if you think that wars are only caused by dictators and
fanatics, unless you include religious dictators and fanatics.

Sorry, I should have been more specific:

dictators and fanatics
religious dictators and religious fanatics
short dictators and short fanatics
tall dictators and tall fanatics
boy dictators and boy fanatics
girl dictators and girl fanatics
white dictators and white fanatics
black dictators and black fanatics
conservative dictators and conservative fanatics
liberal dictators and liberal fanatics
redheaded dictators and redheaded fanatics
right-handed dictators and right-handed fanatics
left-handed dictators and left-handed fanatics
carnivore dictators and carnivore fanatics
vegetarian dictators and vegetarian fanatics

Do you get my drift yet?

Evidence include the Crusades of the 11th to 13th centuries, a war
between Christians and Islam (Muslims). It was one of the most
violent periods in the history of mankind. Even Christian fanatics
fight amongst themselves and happened in the hundred years of war in
Northern Ireland between the Protestants and Catholics.

Not all wars are caused by dictators like Hitler and Kim Jong-Il.

No kidding - that's not what my words said.

OK. How do you suggest we get rid of religious dictators?

Your words are so general, you may as well to have said get rid of people. That'll catch them all.

--mamallama

 

[Michael_J]

God did not give us a brain. See, that is my problem with all of
this. My brain was given to me by my parents who conceived me.

Maybe they can give you a different one. :-D

There is no proof whatsoever that God gave us anything

I don't completely disagree, but there's no proof that "he" didn't either, other than there's an awful lot of stuff in the universe that came from somewhere. And no body knows where it came from.

Call me whatever you like, but everyone knows it deep down inside of
your brain that I am telling the truth

No kidding? How do you know that "everyone" knows that?

There is not going to be some magical place with 71 virgins waiting
for us when we die.

Even if there were, how long would they stay virgins? What are you supposed to then?

So, stop this insanity and teach the values of human decency and
family values instead.

Now THAT'S a hoot - WHO'S human decency and WHO'S family values?! :'-D

And last but not least, enjoy life while you
are here, because when it is over, it is over.

Thank GOD! So why (on God's green earth) are you here on this stupid internet?!!

Everything else is
pure speculation with absolutely no proof to support those religious

Sorry to stop you mid thought, but that's why they call it "faith."

You can see why arguing religion is futile - you either take a leap of faith or you don't.

If you take the leap (and they call it a leap for good reason) all the other things fall into place. If you don't, they just kinda fall.

So keep the faith sister and keep preaching against religion!! :-D

BTW - this is nothing personal against you - I'm just trying to enjoy life before my dirt nap. So try to lighten up a little and laugh once in a while. ;-)

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

 

[Michael_J]

OK. How do you suggest we get rid of religious dictators?

Show them the light?

Your words are so general, you may as well to have said get rid of
people. That'll catch them all.

That would work.

Are you seriously looking to solve the problems of the world on a photography forum?
That's NUTS!!

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.

 

[mamallama]

OK. How do you suggest we get rid of religious dictators?

Show them the light?

That would be contributing to the problem, not offering a solution. What create these fanatics is that want to show others the light as they know it. Therein lies the problem.

I don't want anyone trying to change my beliefs, so I don't try to change others.

Your words are so general, you may as well to have said get rid of
people. That'll catch them all.

That would work.

Are you seriously looking to solve the problems of the world on a
photography forum?
That's NUTS!!

I'm not trying to solve anything, except trying to keep nuts from promoting hair brain ideas on a public forum. And yes, yours are included.

--mamallama

 

[Michael_J]

And I'm not being sarcastic, I will not even dispute whatever your opinion is, nor assert mine.

"If the wealth of Saudi Arabia was fairly distributed"

1. What would you considerer "fairly distributed?"

2. Would there be class levels, achievement levels, or would everyone get the same amount?

3. Is it even possible without tyranny or dictatorship? Who gets to distribute the wealth and of those who distribute, how much is THEIR "fair" share?

4. Do you see any flaws in a society that "fairly distributes" it's wealth?

5. Would it take a leap of faith on "the peoples" part?

I have more questions, but this is probably too many already for this forum, TIA for any reply - serious or otherwise.

--
People who claim to be open minded never see it my way.