Sony loses over $3 billion on PS3, wonder how Alpha is doing?

[Vois]

I was one of the people that decided on a PS3 because of blu-ray. I wanted it more as a blu-ray player and media server which it does pretty well. BUT some of the games that are coming out for it now are preety sweet as well as some old-school games that are cheap that you can buy online for less than 10 dollars.

When you way the capabilities of a PS3 with media server, game machine and blu-ray with the cost not being but $100 more than a standard player, It was a no brainer for me. The other thing is that the blu-ray players need a lot firmaware update and have e-net ports on them but it is far easier for the PS3 to update itself via wireless networking and is painless. The PS3 also decompresses on-the-fly not using dedicated chips that standard blu-ray players use...

--
Vois

 

[Lawrencew]

17 billion sold in 2008, compared to 10.6 billion sold in 2007
= +60.4% growth in that division

17m forecast , not sold.
--
Regards
Lawrence
My Flickr http://www.flickr.com/photos/lozwilkes/

 

[Sonn Franken]

In the Netherlands they remove the kitlens a lot, since a great number of people buy the @ body only and chose different lenses, Tamrons and Sigmas go well.

 

[bobfloyd]

And that's why Sony put the Alpha line in the 'premium' catagory, and
covered by the SURE program, so that the Sony Style stores wouldn't
have to worry about competition forcing prices down on the lenses and
accessories.

It won't do them any good if they don't start carrying those lenses in the store, at least not with me. I like to touch and try something out before buying it when it costs that much money so last week I went to the Sony store just 6 miles from me. They had one Zeiss lens, the 16-80, and everything else was consumer grade glass.

When I asked they said I could order it from them and they would ship directly to me so I did not have to come back in. I said I wanted to try them out before buying. They looked at me like I was stupid and directed me local camera shops.

I can tell you that I am not likely to go back there now. No reason to and once I have used my 15% off coupon that I got for registering my A700, I doubt I do much shopping at Sony online either. They maybe making good stuff but they have a lot to learn about marketing to me at this point.

Bob
--
http://www.pbase.com/bobfloyd

 

[Sonn Franken]

Did you have too much spare time, so you thought how to get some negative things about Sony? I am sure you missed some articles, yours being pretty old already. Sony has a lot more people hating the company, so there must be much more dirt out there to dig up and bring into this forum....

Geezzz get a life, and bring things back to this forum what belongs here; that is photography... Talk about cams, show some photo's. And if you feel so neglected as a true Sony customer, change to another brand and stop nagging altogether.

 

[Eleson]

That was a bad day for me as well owning a HD DVD player. Oh well I
lived through Beta, Laserdisc and MiniDisc. I have decided to not buy
anything anymore until it is full established....that is after I
bought the Alpha camera. LOL!

Nothing to cry for, You can by lots of chap HD-DVD's now, and the discs don't care what Toshiba have or haven't done.

What I find a bit sad is that when the war stopped, the market also seemed to have stopped and Bluray also seems to be idling.

Darrin
--
ださかわ

No, HD-DVD and Blu-Ray were neck to neck in the HD player market,
until Warner Brothers made the announcement in earlier this year at
Winter CES that they were planning on dropping support of HD-DVD and
exclusively support Blu-Ray only. Within 1 hour of this
announcement, HD-DVD canceled their major PRESS event at the CES show
and had no available comment to the media. Within two days of this
bombshell, Blockbuster and Walmart announced that they would drop
HD-DVD support and be Blu-Ray exclusive.

But wasn't the simple reason for the big guys to drop HD-DVD that they where well aware of the sales figures for players. It seems to simple not to think that that made these decisions based on good information.

I'd say it is very likely that top mgmt within Toshiba informed Warner about their plans to drop HD-DVD , but it would make Warner look bad, so they where given a chance by Toshiba to take the initiative and drop the format, and in the same moment Toshiba was given the excuse they needed to declared that the war was over.

• It's a chess game for the big guys.

Wasn't it revealed that Toshiba wasn't really selling any players (compared to Bluray) after the war was over?

--
Cheers
Erland

 

[Alfred Molon]

I have to wonder, just how the Alpha division is doing? And, are they
selling the DSLR bodies below cost, and trying to make it up with the
sale of the lenses?

Well, just think about the following: the A350 which It ordered costs 512 Euro after rebate, but the CZ16-80 lens which I'll order as well will cost 623 Euro. I might get also 70-300 G SSM for 747 Euro. Good profit for Sony...

But what is more important - a cheap body and a good lens or a cheap lens and an expensive body? I'd say the former.
--

Alfred

 

[Geir Eivind Mork]

What I find a bit sad is that when the war stopped, the market also
seemed to have stopped and Bluray also seems to be idling.

Blu-ray is for sure not idle. Just not on the front page of gadget blogs ever day anymore.

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/releasedates.html

Coming out in a steady stream
--
Past: 700si, Present: α100, Who knows the future - Equipment in profile

 

[ck3]

In the Netherlands they remove the kitlens a lot, since a great
number of people buy the @ body only and chose different lenses,
Tamrons and Sigmas go well.

Be that as it may, wouldn't you agree that the great majority of DSLR buyers won't spend much money on lenses, especially the more expensive ones? Especially if we are talking about the target group for the entry level models. When Canon recently announced how many EOS-mount lenses they had sold since 1988 (1987?) someone pointed out that that number was only slightly higher than the number of EOS-bodies sold in that period.

I think many people (I don't mean to include you here) wrongly think that photographers posting in this forum are representative of the typical A-mount user.

Carsten

 

[Jogger]

IMO one biggest mistake is to drop backward compatibility with PS2
games, in order to launch online downloadable PS2 games.
I was about to buy PS3 but canceled due to this matter. One shouldn't
re-invest anymore in games.

buy the 80gb version, it works fine on ps2/p21 games

Imagine tomorrow Sony launch Axxx camera with different mount? And
expecting existing users will switch to the new one and re-invest all
the lenses? No, it won't work. Bad strategy.

wth.. you buy a new console to play new games.. if you want to play old games, there is no reason to buy a new console.. if you want the best of both worlds, buy the 80gb version

I came across this article on Yahoo!, about how Sony has lost over
$3,000,000,000, on the PlayStation 3. This is due to Sony having to
sell the game console below the actual, production costs.

http://videogames.yahoo.com/feature/sony-has-lost-over-3-billion-on-the-ps3/1223467

I have to wonder, just how the Alpha division is doing? And, are they
selling the DSLR bodies below cost, and trying to make it up with the
sale of the lenses?

(PhotoTraveler, this is know as the razor-&-blade marketing approach,
which I know you don't believe in.) : )

 

[Cyrus84]

That win came mostly by the PS3.

No, HD-DVD and Blu-Ray were neck to neck in the HD player market,
until Warner Brothers made the announcement in earlier this year at
Winter CES that they were planning on dropping support of HD-DVD and
exclusively support Blu-Ray only. Within 1 hour of this
announcement, HD-DVD canceled their major PRESS event at the CES show
and had no available comment to the media. Within two days of this
bombshell, Blockbuster and Walmart announced that they would drop
HD-DVD support and be Blu-Ray exclusive.

Warner Brothers was the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back,
it wasn't the PS3 sales that sealed the coffin for HD-DVD. Rumors
and speculations were running rampant across the major Home Theater
internet forums about WHY Warner decided to drop HD-DVD support,
everything from backdoor deals, to $$$ bribes from Sony, to WB having
secret shares to Blu-ray, yada yada yada...

Bottomline it wasn't PS3 that did it, because honestly the PS3 has
been selling quite poorly... However, with Metal Gear Solid 4 being
and EXCLUSIVE title and a few other major titles coming out, the PS3
has picked up a bit of steam and picqued my interest as well... I'll
be picking up PS3 shortly...

--
-Alex

This ignores the fact that the reason they were neck and neck was because of the Blu-Ray being included in the PS3. I honestly think that without that move, HD-DVD would have prevailed. As far as features and all of that go, both are good (I have an Xbox 360 with the HD-DVD player)... but it was the politics that made Blu Ray win. Sony studios, for example, and having the Blu-Ray in the PS3.

You are confusing cause and effect in this argument. Warner Brothers, in this case, was the effect.
--
Gear:
A700, 5D, 50 f/1.7, Sigma 10-20, Tamron 28-75, Beercan, 3600

 

[pako]

A game console is a different beast and the main profit will indeed
come from selling games.

Carsten

Exactly

--
Pako Dominguez
-----------------------
http://www.phototeka.net

 

[josefnemecek]

They sold 26 billion digital still cameras in 2008, compared to 23.5
billion in 2007. That's a growth of +10.6%, exceeded by Sony's
growth in LCD TVs (+60.4%!!!) and Walkmans (+20.7%).

My professor always told me, that the general scientific publication order is "think, build, publish". But unfortunately, most use the order "publish, build, think, repair" instead.

26 billion equals to 26'000'000'000. That's about 4 times the whole population of this planet. So selling 26 billion cameras is indead a big thing. But I assume that 26 million cameras would match the reality better...

Regards, Josef.

 

[xty]

same thing with camera. you got lenses from your old sony/minolta camera. and when the new model comes, you expect to UPGRADE right (without re-investing the lenses)?

supposed you were minolta user, IF sony wasn't choosing to continue minolta A-mount, will you switch from minolta to sony?

and i don't live in US nor Japan, so can't find the PS3 80GB version. even if i could import it, it would be difficult for me to buy the new games anyway with NTSC/PAL system and DVD region differences.

Imagine tomorrow Sony launch Axxx camera with different mount? And
expecting existing users will switch to the new one and re-invest all
the lenses? No, it won't work. Bad strategy.

wth.. you buy a new console to play new games.. if you want to play
old games, there is no reason to buy a new console.. if you want the
best of both worlds, buy the 80gb version

 

[Sonn Franken]

In the Netherlands they remove the kitlens a lot, since a great
number of people buy the @ body only and chose different lenses,
Tamrons and Sigmas go well.

Be that as it may, wouldn't you agree that the great majority of DSLR
buyers won't spend much money on lenses, especially the more
expensive ones? Especially if we are talking about the target group
for the entry level models. When Canon recently announced how many
EOS-mount lenses they had sold since 1988 (1987?) someone pointed out
that that number was only slightly higher than the number of
EOS-bodies sold in that period.

You are right in that regard that many entry DSLR owners have not (yet) spend a great deal on lenses. But the kitlens in The Netherlands is often left out; people buy the body and look for another lens but that kitlens. But the buying of lenses goes gradually, according need and budget. There aint much people that go and buy a cam, with whole range of lenses. They save their money and buy on the long term. So it is nothing but logical that when at the moment a whole new flock of DSLR buyers is sticking to one or a couplew of lenses. THey are just getting started, in the coming years you will see these newcomers get used to the DSLR and will buy more and more suiting lenses.

Another thing is the walk around lens. Lenses like a tamron 18-250 provides you with long angle and reasonable zoom. So it covers the need for a lot of people. Lenses that are being bought and offer even more than the P&S cams they had before.

I think many people (I don't mean to include you here) wrongly think
that photographers posting in this forum are representative of the
typical A-mount user.

Carsten

Sgtop thinking too much,.. like things about targetgroup etcetera.... There was a time only the professional photographers could afford an expensive SLR cam, with the lenses, and the dark room etcetera.

Even the enthusiasts, just shooting for a hobby, were often limited by budget. Everything was expensive, and the developping of films took time and money. With the digital revolution a whole new breed of photographers has come up. With different needs and different budgets. As the technology becomes more affordable new people will step into this segment (talking about DSLR). A great number of them will eventually go the same path we all did; they fall more in love with their hobby, will get more demands, and spend more money to fullfill their needs.

So what....??? Sometimes people in here talk about those new comers as if it is a group that is only there for the marfketing of brands, and they have nothing to do with "serious" photographing. I would say to those 'come of your high horse'. What does it matter where someone comes from or what he or she uses. If people show pictures in this forum and I happen to like them, I will say WOW. If people have questions, like newbies always have, I hope forums like this one offer them the possibility to ask questions and learn. IN the end it all comes down to liking what you do. And if one brand does not fit ya for one or more reason, leave it and go elsewhere. There are enough other brands with the same good cams. But stop thinking too much about what Sony has in mind when it does certain things, and stop coming up with consiracy theories, or always questioning the marketing policy of brands. pffff.... just had to say this
Cheers and enjoy shooting
Sonn