tscheese
Active member
That's afull noise for ISO 400. Are you sure that those were your settings.
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Low light slow shutter speed question
- Thread starter TrendyGuy
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Ed Yamanaka
Forum Enthusiast
I looked at the images you provided and my guess is that you tripped the shutter manually by pressing the shutter release button like you normally would. When you did that you moved the camera slightly. The mirror in the camera also caused some movement. The IS may have made the problem worse, but I don't think it was the real cause. Your best image was also at ISO 400 so there is some electronic noise (grainy looking).
Here's my suggestion:
Turn off the IS. Probably isn't necessary, but it's just a flick of a switch, so why not.
Use the self timer to release the shutter. (You could buy a remote, but for just one shot it isn't worth it. If you plan to do low light photography often then it is a good item to have.)
Use the mirror lock up. It's in the custom function menu, far right tab on the menu screen. Choose Custom Functions (C.Fn). The one you want is number 7. Set it to ON.
While you're there you can set number 2 (Long exp. noise reduction) to Auto or On. It might help a little. What this does is take a second shot of basically just the sensor's output without opening the shutter. It should be completely black, but it probably has some noise. The processor then subtracts this noise from the actual picture. Sorry if this sounds confusing.
Use ISO 100. Since you're using a tripod, the length of the exposure isn't a big deal, so you might as well use the lowest ISO.
Shoot the image in RAW or RAW+JPG. It's easier to fix any white balance problems in RAW using DPP or Photoshop.
You might even consider focusing manually if the autofocus doesn't lock on the part of the image you want in focus. You could also change the focus point using the focus point selector on the back of the camera. Small button on the top right. Push the button and turn the wheel next to the shutter button to select the focus point.
Please forgive me if I'm telling you things that you already know. I teach 3rd grade and I tend to have to explain things in simple terms to my students. I hope this helps you with your problem. You have a gorgeous Christmas tree. I can see why you want to take pictures of it.
Happy shooting.
Here's my suggestion:
Turn off the IS. Probably isn't necessary, but it's just a flick of a switch, so why not.
Use the self timer to release the shutter. (You could buy a remote, but for just one shot it isn't worth it. If you plan to do low light photography often then it is a good item to have.)
Use the mirror lock up. It's in the custom function menu, far right tab on the menu screen. Choose Custom Functions (C.Fn). The one you want is number 7. Set it to ON.
While you're there you can set number 2 (Long exp. noise reduction) to Auto or On. It might help a little. What this does is take a second shot of basically just the sensor's output without opening the shutter. It should be completely black, but it probably has some noise. The processor then subtracts this noise from the actual picture. Sorry if this sounds confusing.
Use ISO 100. Since you're using a tripod, the length of the exposure isn't a big deal, so you might as well use the lowest ISO.
Shoot the image in RAW or RAW+JPG. It's easier to fix any white balance problems in RAW using DPP or Photoshop.
You might even consider focusing manually if the autofocus doesn't lock on the part of the image you want in focus. You could also change the focus point using the focus point selector on the back of the camera. Small button on the top right. Push the button and turn the wheel next to the shutter button to select the focus point.
Please forgive me if I'm telling you things that you already know. I teach 3rd grade and I tend to have to explain things in simple terms to my students. I hope this helps you with your problem. You have a gorgeous Christmas tree. I can see why you want to take pictures of it.
Happy shooting.
Thank you for your advice. I didn't not lock the mirror or use the long exposure noise reduction feature that you mention. But, on all the shots I did use the 10sec self-timer function so there is no way the problem could be from me hitting the shutter button. The camera did not move at all and the tripod was very steady. The only think it could be is the the IS was set to on which I will try turning off tonight.
Hank3152
Forum Pro
What are you focusing on? The angel is way out of focus compared to some of the ornaments which are much clearer. This indicates a narrow DoF and since you're using a tripod why not tighten up the aperture to widen the DoF and increase your distance if possible.
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Regards,
Hank
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Regards,
Hank
Ed Yamanaka
Forum Enthusiast
That is very interesting. It very well might be the IS is introducing some blur.
I would also take Hank's suggestion and use an aperture that will give you greater depth of field. I think for your lens f/8~f/11 are probably the best choices.
Do you have a wooden floor? If so, any movement can cause the tripod to move slightly. I'm on a concrete slab here, so my biggest concern would be an earthquake.
As for the IS, it is really designed for use when hand holding. The best test is to shoot something with the IS on and off at a low speed. For the 18-55mm I would suggest tests at 1/8, 1/15, 1/30, 1/60. You should notice a big difference at 1/8 to little or no difference at 1/60.
Hope your shots come out better.
Happy shooting.
I would also take Hank's suggestion and use an aperture that will give you greater depth of field. I think for your lens f/8~f/11 are probably the best choices.
Do you have a wooden floor? If so, any movement can cause the tripod to move slightly. I'm on a concrete slab here, so my biggest concern would be an earthquake.
As for the IS, it is really designed for use when hand holding. The best test is to shoot something with the IS on and off at a low speed. For the 18-55mm I would suggest tests at 1/8, 1/15, 1/30, 1/60. You should notice a big difference at 1/8 to little or no difference at 1/60.
Hope your shots come out better.
Happy shooting.
kathleen clayton
Forum Enthusiast
I have a question...can you leave the mirror lockup on all the time or just for these kinds of shots?
Thanks
Thanks
Hank3152
Forum Pro
........the vibrating angel. By jove, Watson, .......I think we're onto something....
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Regards,
Hank
Ed Yamanaka
Forum Enthusiast
You only want to use mirror lock up for shots on a tripod when you set up the shot in advance. When the mirror is locked up you don't have any way of focusing or framing your shot. (You won't be able to see anything because the mirror redirects the light to your viewfinder only when its down.) The more expensive 40D has a LiveView mode that will allow you to focus, but you still need the mirror down for metering.
You also might have given us a clue to another of your problems. As Hank pointed out the angel moving is significant. It might shake the tree enough to blur the image. If you can turn off any motion ornaments it might be better.
Happy shooting.
You also might have given us a clue to another of your problems. As Hank pointed out the angel moving is significant. It might shake the tree enough to blur the image. If you can turn off any motion ornaments it might be better.
Happy shooting.
dsjtecserv
Senior Member
I don't think so, unless the angel also shook the entire room. See especially the third example picture. That would have to be one massive Christmas angel.
Dave
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http://www.pbase.com/dsjtecserv
Dave
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http://www.pbase.com/dsjtecserv
Ed Yamanaka
Forum Enthusiast
If you look at his best shot, the room is actually fairly sharp considering that it's a long exposure at 400 ISO. Most of the blur seems to be the noise from using ISO 400 and possible not having enough depth of field. But there are still some areas of the tree that are not quite sharp. In a 1 second exposure the angel could have moved enough to slightly blur the tree. It is on the unsupported end of the tree and its motion could be amplified. Not saying that it is what is causing his problem, but it probably isn't helping any.
Besides, the angel might be made of plutonium. I have one that is made of depleted uranium and it weighed a good 4 pounds. ;-)
Happy shooting.
dsjtecserv
Senior Member
Ed:
My point is, pictures 2 and 3 clearly show movement of objects in the room. The angle may or may not be shaking the tree, but since itproably isn't shaking the room, the angel is NOT the soource of his basic problem. something is causing the camera and/or tripod to move during the exposure. He needs to focus (pun intended) on that!
Dave
http://www.pbase.com/dsjtecserv
My point is, pictures 2 and 3 clearly show movement of objects in the room. The angle may or may not be shaking the tree, but since itproably isn't shaking the room, the angel is NOT the soource of his basic problem. something is causing the camera and/or tripod to move during the exposure. He needs to focus (pun intended) on that!
Dave
http://www.pbase.com/dsjtecserv
Yes, the rest of the room is blurred as well as the tree in those shots so it can't be the angel making everything blurry. I am so certain though that the tripod is not moving. Also, no one else is home so it can't even come from vibrations of someone walking. I am going to try turning off the IS when I get home from work in about 2 hours.
Ed Yamanaka
Forum Enthusiast
Sorry if I'm confusing you. The shot I'm talking about is his first shot. The basic image is fairly sharp, but parts of the tree still show a bit of blur. I got tired of looking at them on the web and I downloaded them. His first shot is actually his third shot when I have them arranged in my file folder. So, I might not be taliking about the same image as you.
Anyways, the tips that Hank, others, and I have already given the OP should eliminate the gross motion blur of his worst two shots. (Apologies to the OP, I don't mean gross as in ugly, I mean gross as in large)
The first image is the one that I'm trying to give tips about improving.
I would be very surprised if he had the same problem after following the advice that he's been given.
To the OP: I know that you did, but just make sure that you lock down the controls on the tripod. I've actually had mine slip a fraction when I tripped the shutter. If you've got a rug that slides on the floor, make sure you move it and have the tripod on the actual floor. Again, I'm sure you did that, but I'm just trying to think of any possible causes.
Happy shooting.
Anyways, the tips that Hank, others, and I have already given the OP should eliminate the gross motion blur of his worst two shots. (Apologies to the OP, I don't mean gross as in ugly, I mean gross as in large)
The first image is the one that I'm trying to give tips about improving.
I would be very surprised if he had the same problem after following the advice that he's been given.
To the OP: I know that you did, but just make sure that you lock down the controls on the tripod. I've actually had mine slip a fraction when I tripped the shutter. If you've got a rug that slides on the floor, make sure you move it and have the tripod on the actual floor. Again, I'm sure you did that, but I'm just trying to think of any possible causes.
Happy shooting.
Hank3152
Forum Pro
.......but not the main problem. I agree with Ed that trying the suggested settings will make a world of difference.
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Regards,
Hank
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Regards,
Hank
Again, thanks to all of you for helping me out. I have taken a few new pictures now with the IS turned off and the mirror lock on. I am much much happier with the results. It seems like the IS is the reason why all my tripod shots were coming out like that. Take a look at the first two shots with no IS and the third with it turned on.
This shot is ISO 100, 3.2sec exposure, f/10, no IS
This shot is ISO 100, 15sec exposure, f/20, no IS
This shot is ISO 100, 6sec exposure, f/14, with IS
This shot is ISO 100, 3.2sec exposure, f/10, no IS
This shot is ISO 100, 15sec exposure, f/20, no IS
This shot is ISO 100, 6sec exposure, f/14, with IS
Ed Yamanaka
Forum Enthusiast
I am glad you were able to get a good shot. I'm also pleased that I learned something valuable. I didn't know that the IS would cause that much of a problem with a long exposure. I just turn mine off as a matter of habit when putting my camera on a tripod. Now I know why I should do that.
I like the little diffraction points around the lights. Really makes the picture cheery.
I guess you don't have the ghost of Christmas past living in your house afterall.
Happy shooting.
I like the little diffraction points around the lights. Really makes the picture cheery.
I guess you don't have the ghost of Christmas past living in your house afterall.
Happy shooting.
shybull
Well-known member
I used a Sigma 10-20 on my 350 on a tripod with mirror lock up and the RC1 remote. The best results were from an exposure of ISO 100, 10 seconds, f8. I'd post it but I don't have an online photo site
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