Prediction... I will own my 40D for a long time. Money well spent !

[me2000]

I hate spending a ton of money on technology that is rapidly changing because it goes out of date so fast. I hate buying technology that is finicky or doesn't work correctly.

I think the 40D will be a great long term camera and an excellent investment.

I spent more on my 40D setup ($1600) than I did on my first digital camera (Coolpix 950 - $750) and my first DSLR (D50, 2 lenses and flash - $1100).

I really the fact the 40D is that its the latest technology in a field that is slowing dramatically. Its going to be a camera that stands the test of time for a long time compared to the previous generations of cameras.

Sure the 50D might go to 12MP, but its unlikely that the high ISO noise will drop dramatically. We aren't seeing IQ change by leaps and bounds anymore. The 40D should remain competitive in this respect.

After the 50D release I bet the 60D goes full frame - 3 years from now. That is when the 40D will look dated. Thus I am not buying any more EFS lenses than I absolutely need. Until then my 40D should more than meet my needs. And in 3 years the 40D will make a great backup camera. Throw in the fact that the 40D is an outstanding bargain price wise (especially with the Dell coupons...) and that it is loaded with all the features I need and then some and I feel really great about purchasing it.

I love to come on this forum and read that the 20D and 30D guys are still going strong with their cameras. Gives me faith the 40D will work for me for a while. And the 40D is much less a compromise to use than the 20/30D, so it should meet my needs longer.

I felt really good about my D50 too, but not nearly as much. With the D50 I knew that it was missing things I wanted and needed. A second control wheel, 1/3 step ISO control, a larger viewfinder, ability to handle manual lenses, etc. I loved the D50 but the 40D bargain makes it look very pale in comparison.

One thing I didn't like about the D50 is that Nikon never published a shutter life number for it. I had 10K exposures on my D50. People posted reaching 20-25K exposures, but I always wondered how long it would last. I had the worry that I had used up 50% of my D50.

I like that Canon comes out and states the 40D is good for 100K exposures. It will take me a long, long time to reach anywhere near that number of exposures. (Maybe not though at 6 FPS !)

Sadly I was quite disappointed with my Coolpix 950. It was slow and it broke twice. Once the TV out quit. Not a huge problem, but at the time I was using it, so it had to go back. And the battery door broke and there is little way to fix it short of getting a new body. The 950 had TERRIBLE battery life. If you look back at the 950 reviews, it was the cat's meow when it came out, but I think we all knew it was a very new technology and very prone to become obsolete.

Anyway... I have no regrets about ordering my 40D, financially or otherwise. My initial reaction to those that post about "400D or 40D" is to spend for the 40D first and ask questions later ! Money very well spent.

--
On order: 40D, 28-135 IS, 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8, 430EX
Est deliver date is Dec 4.

I took over 10K images with my past outfit...
D50, 18-70, 50f/1.8D.
DK21M Eyepiece magnifier.
SB600 Flash

User of Gimp and Ufraw on Linux instead of Photoshop

 

[Curtis Gulick]

I am excited to get one and upgrade from my 20d. Lots of great new features. I also agree that this camera should last a LONG time. Course I said that about my 20d when i got it and that was only 3 years ago . They can't go bigger on the screen than the 40d, 10mpx is plenty (8.5 with my 20d is really enough anyway..), liveview is awesome, and lots more that I like about the 40d.

--
Curtis Gulick
http://www.curtisgulickphotography.com

-::- Canon 20D, 70-200F4L, 17-40F4L, 28-135IS, 100mm 2.8 Macro, 50mm 1.8, 16mm fisheye, 1.4x TC -::-

 

[Carskick]

As the other poster pointed out, he bought the 20D thinking it would be a camera to keep around for a while. And I say why not? I am not marketing the fact the 40D doesn't give useful upgrades, but the 20D is far from obsolete IMHO. It's fast, has excellent IQ, focuses well, and remains an excellent camera.

While I do occasionally lust for some 40D features, (bigger screen, better viewfinder, constant ISO display), I find my 20D offering everything I need at the moment, and the extra is better spent on lenses for now.

I think the 20D is standing the test of time, as will the 40D, for many years.

--
Main Albums: http://picasaweb.google.com/Carskick/
Older Albums: http://www.flickr.com/photos/carskick

 

[iMac therefore iAm]

After the 50D release I bet the 60D goes full frame - 3 years from
now.

Crop isn't going anywhere.

But overall, I agree with your sentiments. I used my D60 for 5 years and the best images I got out of it were the ones I took this past year - and they pretty much rival anything I've seen out of the 40D (which I now own).

 

[Curtis Gulick]

Yep, I agree! I definitely don't NEED to upgrade to the 20d, but I think the features that it offers will let me get better shots and that is worth it to me.

--
Curtis Gulick
http://www.curtisgulickphotography.com

-::- Canon 20D, 70-200F4L, 17-40F4L, 28-135IS, 100mm 2.8 Macro, 50mm 1.8, 16mm fisheye, 1.4x TC -::-

 

[YP226406]

and knock on wood three times...

 

[JSB_61]

I agree. You can make that "prediction" and miss out on some great EF-S lenses in the meantime. I'm not sure where the OP is getting his info, but it's nothing more than an uneducated guess.

After the 50D release I bet the 60D goes full frame - 3 years from
now.

Crop isn't going anywhere.

But overall, I agree with your sentiments. I used my D60 for 5 years
and the best images I got out of it were the ones I took this past
year - and they pretty much rival anything I've seen out of the 40D
(which I now own).

 

[Reybabes]

The OP has mirrored my sentiments exactly. I truly believe the 40D is a camera that someone can hold onto for a long time and not feel the pressure of wanting something better/faster/newer. That was a prime motivator for me when I bought it. In part, the durability and resilency of the 20D and 30D have brought me to this conclusion.

And I have a feeling crop camera are going to be with us for a while...
--
Photos and then some: http://www.deaconrey.com .

 

[Liscia]

This is just to point out and post a reminder that 1.6 crop factor cameras

can mount ANY current or past EF or EF-s mount lens while full frame bodies cannot. CF camera shooters may not be able to go as wide but they have a WIDER choice of lenses to choose from

 

[JimH]

Canon has other lines already established to be 1.3 and 1.0 X systems.

The XXD bodies are now, and will forever remain 1.6X. That's the point of having the naming conventions

Canon may well come out with more full-frame bodies but my point is that they WON'T be called XXD. And it also seems very logical to expect that we'll continue to see 1.6X bodies for a long time to come. Canon has invested heavily in EF-S technology and they're surely selling hundreds of 1.6X bodies for every full-frame body. It's where they make their serious money, I'm sure.

Even if FF sensors come down in price (which will happen slower than most people think), FF bodies will continue to be more expensive than 1.6X bodies because the 1.6X sensors will remain cheaper still. And, there's more to making a full-frame body than just the sensor. And don't forget that to get some things (like wide angle), you pay a lot more for the FF lenses too. That makes a FF system much more expensive than a 1.6X system.

If you get your nice $1500 full frame body, what will you do to take the place of the EF-S 10-22? Just look at the price of the 16-35 L. Ouch!

And now to get the 70-200 equivalent, you've got to buy a 100-400. Hmm. Do you like what the 70-300 IS does on your 1.6X body? Well, now we don't even have an equivalent, but look at the prices for a 500mm IS lens. Ow, again

So there will always be a market for 1.6X bodies. People like cheap and people like lightweight.

--
Jim H.

 

[dswcamera]

Last time I check, they weren't showing it.

Dan
--
'A bad idea in search of a good cause is..
just a bad idea' ... me

 

[chisquared]

with the 40D that they will never be able to sell a 50D.

Seriously, your post rings true with my sentiments. However, I did skip the 30D and waited for the 40D which I bought immediately on its release (based on my experience with the 20D).

So, I might skip the next one or two 1.6 factor cameras but will eventually upgrade again: if I can comfortably afford to and still remember how to use a camera.

I will not likely migrate to 1.3 or 1.0 bodies ... just don't often need a larger sensor camera.

 

[me2000]

I agree with your lens comments. Cost, size for 1.6x crop is much better.

But on the other hand sensors and such are going to get a lot cheaper. Moore's law, manufacturing experience, camera volumes, etc.

And I think that partial frame sensors have run into the physical limitations of more pixels = smaller pixel area. If we want better noise ratios and more pixels, something has to give.

The other aspect is price. Cameras are getting more and more features. Just look at the 40D. We basically have everything we want now. And we are bumping the limit on how many pixels we need. So if the manufacturers don't want a price war, they need to increase performance to keep competing. Canon is already dropping the X0D prices by $100 with every generation.

I think the x0D line will go FF sooner or later. Either that or the 5D MK III is going to be $1500 or less and it will effectively take out the current x0D line. If that is the case, a X0D will be selling for $750 and I don't think Canon wants that.

--
On order: 40D, 28-135 IS, 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8, 430EX
Est deliver date is Dec 4.

I took over 10K images with my past outfit...
D50, 18-70, 50f/1.8D.
DK21M Eyepiece magnifier.
SB600 Flash

User of Gimp and Ufraw on Linux instead of Photoshop

 

[me2000]

I checked yesterday as a matter of fact. Ufraw uses the DCRaw library to do the conversion. A new version was built last week. Prior to that you had to install a patch and build it. So Ufraw indirectly supported the 40D all along and now it does officially.

While we are on the topic of open source camera tools, I found an application called Hugin that stitches multiple shot panoramas together. I'll check it out the next time I shoot a panorama.

--
On order: 40D, 28-135 IS, 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8, 430EX
Est deliver date is Dec 4.

I took over 10K images with my past outfit...
D50, 18-70, 50f/1.8D.
DK21M Eyepiece magnifier.
SB600 Flash

User of Gimp and Ufraw on Linux instead of Photoshop

 

[me2000]

A 1.14x viewfinder ! Have you looked through a 5D ? (0.71 x 1.6 = 1.136)
Auto ISO, like the Nikons have.
Wireless flash commander, like the Nikons have.
12 MP, only if the noise goes down as well
swivelling LCD
phase focusing while in Live View, like the D300 does
on-off focusing grid, like the D70 does.
more focus points, faster AF.
AF that works with slower lenses... f/8
get rid of the useless print button

make the delete button work like it does on a Nikon. (Second press deletes the image.)
$1100 body price

I'd upgrade in 18 months if this list became reality.

--
On order: 40D, 28-135 IS, 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8, 430EX
Est deliver date is Dec 4.

I took over 10K images with my past outfit...
D50, 18-70, 50f/1.8D.
DK21M Eyepiece magnifier.
SB600 Flash

User of Gimp and Ufraw on Linux instead of Photoshop

 

[Carskick]

If you get your nice $1500 full frame body, what will you do to take
the place of the EF-S 10-22? Just look at the price of the 16-35 L.
Ouch!

I hate to say it, but that is a bad comparison IMHO. While the range is the same, the 16-35 is an F2.8, and has better IQ wide open. The 10-22 EF-S is more comparable 17-40 in speed, aperture, and even price.

--
Main Albums: http://picasaweb.google.com/Carskick/
Older Albums: http://www.flickr.com/photos/carskick

 

[Don Doyle]

I bought my 10D in 2003 after my Canon Elan film camera got swiped from my suitcase while traveling to Rio. I have enjoyed taking the digital turn and have gotten good use out of my 10D. I have some beautiful prints on the walls from my various travels. Now I'm ready to move up with a new camera and some new glass. I've pretty much decided on the 40D. I am thinking I'll also get the 70-200 L lens, probably the 4, maybe IS. One of the things I think I like about photography as a hobby is the notion that the technology is improving and that for the same money I spent four or five years ago I can get a lot more. It seems more or less parallel to my buying history with computers--about every 5 years I'm ready to upgrade, and I get excited about learning what is out there.

 

[JimH]

I don't know why I don't think of the 17-40. It'd be a very good wide zoom on a full-frame body. And its constant f/4 would be every bit as good on a full frame body as anything you'd get from the 10-22 on a 1.6X.

Plus, I rarely shoot wide angle at large apertures anyhow. So the 17-40 might just do what I want on a FF body.

But those longer teles would kill me ;-)

--
Jim H.

 

[JimH]

The basic idea of Moore's Law is that the number of transistors that you can fit on a given IC doubles every two years.

But we're actually talking about the exact opposite here. Instead of getting cheaper prices because we can shrink the size of the IC, we're talking about making an even larger IC. We're sort of going backwards.

The thing that has made the prices of electronics go down over the years has been miniaturization. Smaller ICs with more transistors on them allow for more functionality at a lower cost to manufacture. If we can get 1000 ICs on a wafer versus 500, then the cost for that same functionality is half as much.

But a full-frame sensor takes up a LOT of an 8" wafer. So the cost is high. You get a lot fewer good ICs from a wafer at full-frame size than you do at 1.6X size.

And another thing that has driven the prices of electronic devices down is the advent of surface mount technology which allows us to make the printed circuit boards smaller. Keeping everything tiny makes it all cheaper to manufacture and, of course, makes for more functionality in the same sized box or perhaps a smaller box. That's all great

But here, we're talking about actually making the sensor larger. That's sort of going backwards against the very thing that reduces prices. So I don't think we can expect the same rate of price drop that we're used to with electronics in general.

It's still very expensive to manufacture huge ICs. I hope there are breakthroughs in manufacturing that push the costs down, though. I'd like to have a medium format digital camera someday. But right now, they're wayyyy out of my league

--
Jim H.

 

[crankboom]

Just ordered mine tonight. Extremely excited. Ordered the 40D body, 17-55mm f/2.8 IS lens with lens hood and UV filter, and a 530EX II. Can't wait 'til it all gets here.

I was going to hold out until after Christmas, but really wanted to be able to use the camera when everyone comes to visit for the holidays. Always encouraging to see posts like this that help reinforce my buying decision.