The bad and ugly about compact digital cameras

[borlavrin]

In the old days of a good CLR, the viewer was looking right through the optics and you saw what was… and you adjusted accordingly… the eye was close to the eye piece… there were no peripheral interference with the image.

Current digital cameras (except top pro) no longer have that direct line of sight… the image goes to a sensor and, from that, an image is reconstructed and presented on an LCD screen, my DMC-LX2 is large… and that leads to my complaint.

On a sunny day we looks, from a distance, at a small screen, it is flooded with reflections and glare… one can no longer put the eye to that rubber cup, adjust the diopter, and see the image correctly.

As I see it anyway,
Boris

 

[sherman_levine]

I assume you mean camera which only have an LCD screen at the back, and not an EVF.

For the LCD, you might want to take a look at the Delkin Pop-up Shade

http://www.delkin.com/products/popupshades/

Sherm

 

[pignoli]

And this is why I love my EVF. Exactly what the sensor sees, in any condiditions.
--
---
Laurence

I shoot with an EphZedFifty.
My flickr: http://flickr.com/photos/12102118@N06/

 

[borlavrin]

Excellent, thanks for the feedback.

Cheers,
Boris

 

[DickB12]

On a sunny day we looks, from a distance, at a small screen, it is
flooded with reflections and glare… one can no longer put the eye to
that rubber cup, adjust the diopter, and see the image correctly.

As I see it anyway,
Boris

The FZ18 has a diopter-adjustable EVF which allows close focus adjustments. As opposed to the SLR approach where you actually look throught the lens, the EVF shows what the sensor is receiving. Have found it extremely useful.
****

 

[MusicDoctorDJ]

Unfortunately, the average camera buyer doesn't want optical viewfinders . . . they want a big TV screen on the back of their cameras, so that is what the camera manufacturers are giving them!

They also want the tinyest cameras with a kazillion X optical zoom that will fit in a shirt pocket, with as much megapixel as possible, all for under $150 bucks!

There are cameras with optical viewfinders out there . . . you just need to search them out!

--
J. Daniels
Colorful Colorado
Panasonic FZ10, FZ50
Olympus E-510
Fuji S602Z, A825



Remember . . . always keep the box and everything that came in it!

 

[Eddy Vortex]

You can purchase cheap telescope eyecups here http://www.telescope.com/jump.jsp?itemID=36&itemType=CATEGORY&iMainCat=6&iSubCat=36&page=3&itemList=&oldList=
and many other places on the web. Do a search on 'eyecup". Eddy

--
My motto: Photographers should be seen and not heard.
FZ50, UZI, B-300

 

[Erik Ohlson]

Unfortunately, the average camera buyer doesn't want optical
viewfinders . . . they want a big TV screen on the back of their
cameras, so that is what the camera manufacturers are giving them!

They also want the tinyest cameras with a kazillion X optical zoom
that will fit in a shirt pocket, with as much megapixel as possible,
all for under $150 bucks!

There are cameras with optical viewfinders out there . . . you just
need to search them out!

--
J. Daniels
Colorful Colorado
Panasonic FZ10, FZ50
Olympus E-510
Fuji S602Z, A825



Remember . . . always keep the box and everything that came in it!

You know, reading your post, I got a quick flash of my "ideal camera".

I've said before, that it would be great if there were a "pocketable" version of my FZ-18.

I would happily give up the LCD for a smaller camera -- say, with ONLY an EVF, no LCD, if it would make the camera substantially smaller!

Who needs a LCD with such a good Electronic View Finder?

I'm sure Panasonic will put a whole engineering group on this as soon as they read it! ;-))

Cheers -Erik

--

 

[genece]

I was standing taking photos of an elk in Yellowstone we were in mostly shade and the elk was about 40 ft away......The fellow next to me had a camera and was using the LCD to take photos.....I could see the 10X and the L on the camera so I asked if it was a tizzy , that confused him but it turned ou thats what it was.....So I asked how it was doing getting the elk photos as I could not see th review on my D80 LCD.......he told me he had not gotten one photo for sure as he could not see the LCD well enogh to be sure where he was pointing......
So much for a pocketable camera.
It seems some of us have much more trouble with the LCD screen than others have.
I really can not see an EVF very well either, without an eyecup.
--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

 

[Erik Ohlson]

I was standing taking photos of an elk in Yellowstone we were in
mostly shade and the elk was about 40 ft away......The fellow next to
me had a camera and was using the LCD to take photos.....I could see
the 10X and the L on the camera so I asked if it was a tizzy , that
confused him but it turned out thats what it was.....So I asked how it
was doing getting the elk photos as I could not see th review on my
D80 LCD.......he told me he had not gotten one photo for sure as he
could not see the LCD well enough to be sure where he was
pointing......
So much for a pocketable camera.
It seems some of us have much more trouble with the LCD screen than
others have.
I really can not see an EVF very well either, without an eyecup.

I see the EVF very well without an eyecup, even at "almost 70" years. There IS a 'diopter adjustment' focus wheel.

So much for a pocketable camera.

Have you tried the FZ-18 EVF?

......as I could not see th review on my D80 LCD.

Yeah - that's a good part of my point: sometimes the LCD is hard to see, and the EVF is always 'shaded' - maybe with an eyecup ;-))

I often just review my FZ-18 photos in the EVF, something that isn't worthwhile to do with the old FZ-4's coarser EVF. The FZ-18 EVF is almost as good as an optical viewfinder for my old eyes IMHO.

Just another thing that sets the FZ-18 apart.

Yeah, the more I think of it the more I'd be first in line for an EVF-only "TZ-18"!

Cheers -Erik

--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

--

 

[genece]

I see the EVF very well without an eyecup, even at "almost 70" years.
There IS a 'diopter adjustment' focus wheel.

I also am almost 70 and I am aware of the diopter adjustment.......but there is a refleced light on the EVF with no eyecup......the eyecup was the first thing my wife lost off the FZ30 on our Alaska trip rendering the FZ30 just about useless to me. But she had no trouble seeing the EVF at all.

Do you think that was a plan? I had planned for her to use the FZ20.......but with the loss of the eyecup the FZ30 became and still is her camera, even with a new eyecup.

Have you tried the FZ-18 EVF?

No....I am not going back to that moveable lens, or at least I do not think I am.

--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

--

--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

 

[Erik Ohlson]

I see the EVF very well without an eyecup, even at "almost 70" years.
There IS a 'diopter adjustment' focus wheel.

I also am almost 70 and I am aware of the diopter
adjustment.......but there is a refleced light on the EVF with no
eyecup......the eyecup was the first thing my wife lost off the FZ30
on our Alaska trip rendering the FZ30 just about useless to me. But
she had no trouble seeing the EVF at all.
Do you think that was a plan? I had planned for her to use the
FZ20.......but with the loss of the eyecup the FZ30 became and still
is her camera, even with a new eyecup.

Have you tried the FZ-18 EVF?

No....I am not going back to that moveable lens, or at least I do not
think I am.

--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

Snip>

Not trying to start an argument, here, Of course you have your reasons.

For me - the face shades the EVF completely, even without a flexible eyecup. The only problem I've come up with in the FZ-18 EVF, is......when I'm concentrating, such as trying to track a BIF, my nose tends to press the "self timer" button! I'm going to have to stick a 'nose guard' next to it with some double-stick tape ;-))

Your comments are always thoughtful - I'd like to see what you think of the FZ-18 when you try it!

Cheers -Erik

--

 

[sherman_levine]

Right eye to the EVF, left eye open to help track the birds?

Nose guards tend to be a bit bulky.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nose_guard

Sherm

For me - the face shades the EVF completely, even without a flexible
eyecup. The only problem I've come up with in the FZ-18 EVF,
is......when I'm concentrating, such as trying to track a BIF, my
nose tends to press the "self timer" button! I'm going to have to
stick a 'nose guard' next to it with some double-stick tape ;-))

Your comments are always thoughtful - I'd like to see what you think
of the FZ-18 when you try it!

Cheers -Erik

--

 

[Erik Ohlson]

Right eye to the EVF, left eye open to help track the birds?

Nose guards tend to be a bit bulky.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nose_guard

Sherm

No, actually. I have tried that, because that would be ideal: it would help to track the bird + keep the old honker from hitting the self timer (left 'controller') button. Unfortunately I've been a left-eye person for too long to switch, it would appear.

It does appear that genece, also uses the left eye, from his signature picture.

For me - the face shades the EVF completely, even without a flexible
eyecup. The only problem I've come up with in the FZ-18 EVF,
is......when I'm concentrating, such as trying to track a BIF, my
nose tends to press the "self timer" button! I'm going to have to
stick a 'nose guard' next to it with some double-stick tape ;-))

Your comments are always thoughtful - I'd like to see what you think
of the FZ-18 when you try it!

Cheers -Erik

--

 

[sherman_levine]

unless he took it in a mirror
Sherm

 

[genece]

I never noticed that.......I use my right eye and the photo was taken in a mirror.

I do not know what it is but I can not see the EVF very well, under most conditions, without an eyecup.........I even use an Eyecup on my D50 and D80........I swear it helps me, and I need all the help I can get
.

unless he took it in a mirror
Sherm

--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

 

[MusicDoctorDJ]

I'm also left eyed . . . but right handed.

I've been looking through cameras with my left eye so much and long that I can see better with my right eye now, but I still can't use it to look through a camera.

I do need to get my eyes checked (I'm 47, by the way).

I've played around a little bit with the FZ18 (haven't had one in stock long enough to even sneeze on one), and it is a neat little camera, but I wouldn't trade my FZ50 for one.

The buttons have been rearranged a little bit from the FZ8, the joystick is shorter, and the diopter adjustment dials rotates very easily, which I don't like . . . very easy to knock it out of adjustment.

As for the eyepiece, the FZ50 does have a better eyecup than the FZ30, so I haven't had a problem with mine.

It wouldn't bother me in the least if the next FZ50 didn't have an LCD on the back and only an EVF . . . I'd rather see them put a larger EVF and dump the LCD!

Footnote for those who care:

I sold our last FZ50 today, and to my amazement, the price had dropped $100 since last week, and, as I tried to order another from the warehouse . . . I found out they were discontinued (by us, not Panasonic).
--
J. Daniels
Colorful Colorado
Panasonic FZ10, FZ50
Olympus E-510
Fuji S602Z, A825



Remember . . . always keep the box and everything that came in it!

 

[Ron_M]

I can use and see great in my EVF with my FZ30, but have a lot of trouble trying to see through the viewfinder on my Canon 30D. But then again I wear glasses and getting up there at 64.

I do not know what it is but I can not see the EVF very well, under
most conditions, without an eyecup.........I even use an Eyecup on my
D50 and D80........I swear it helps me, and I need all the help I can
get
.

unless he took it in a mirror
Sherm

--
Gene from Western Pa
see profile for equiptment
http://imageevent.com/grc6
http://grc225.zenfolio.com/



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!

--
Ron_M

 

[MusicDoctorDJ]

Here is my little viewfinderless pocket camera:



Couldn't see that LCD in direct sun . . . so got the popup shade!

It does help.

--
J. Daniels
Colorful Colorado
Panasonic FZ10, FZ50
Olympus E-510
Fuji S602Z, A825

Remember . . . always keep the box and everything that came in it!

 

[Marty4650]

Current digital cameras (except top pro) no longer have that direct
line of sight… the image goes to a sensor and, from that, an image is
reconstructed and presented on an LCD screen, my DMC-LX2 is large…
and that leads to my complaint.

Boris...

I think the problem is in finding space for a viewfinder on the back of a very small camera with a very large LCD panel on it.

There is a Ricoh compact camera that solves the problem by having a EVF that attaches to the hot shoe. But that is hardly an elegant solution...
--
Marty
Panasonic FZ7, FZ20, FZ30, LX2
Olympus C4000, C7000