Lens suggestion after test and research

[king_arthur]

Hi everyone,

I am the proud owner of 350D with 18-55mm kit lens. Very Happy especially after the little one arrived almost 5 months ago I am an amateur photographer, picked up a DSLR because the lack of RAW and shutter delay on ALL of my compact digicams. I am a professional retoucher, by the way. I took my 350D to most trips and can't complain much with it.

Everything was perfect until I took A LOT of pics of the baby in the house with NO flash (my wife hates flash on our baby). I started to understand a lot of things about my camera. Shutter speed, aperture, ISO and lenses. With the baby moving most of the time I find my Kit lens could not keep up with her INDOOR. The best I can do is turning on multi snaps most of the time (is that going to kill my 350D quicker?). I can get a descent shot probably 4 out of 10 pics I took (not blurred). I find it challenging and fun trying to capture her expressions everyday. After lots of research on the net (here most of the time) I started to appreciate quality lens and it's price tag.

Anyway, we are going to go to Jakarta soon and since lens prices are cheaper there than here in Sydney I thought it would be a perfect time to put some in my collection.

I definitely going to purchase 50mm f/1.8 II and I am thinking about another one All purpose Zoom lens to replace my kit lens once and for all. Since this would my my first lens purchase I am not going to go crazy with the price (Forget L lens). I have a budget of $350 but willing to starve for a better one (not over the top)

So I'm aiming for a Zoom lens, fast indoor with no flash, Sharp, I dont think I need IS, never use USM but it sounds handy from reviews in forums (Seems to come with better lens).

So I come up with this baby to heavily consider:

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di LD Aspherical (IF) Macro (bit expensive but nice and fast overall)

And a few runner ups for "maybe" list:

Canon EF 28-105mm f/3.5-4.5 II USM (cheap cheap but is it fast indoor???)
Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM (nice but is it fast indoor?)

Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM (I'll rob a bank if I have to but is it fast indoor?)

Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 XR Di II LD Aspherical (IF) (Hmm, more zoom would be perfect)

And 2 questions:

1. For what I need, do I HAVE TO look for lens with around f/2.8 to make it work under low light fast??? That's the reason I picked the Tamron, although I would like it better wider.

2. For a lens with f/4-5.6 advertised does that mean I can't go f/2.8 or that just the recommended f stop? And stopping down means going below the advertised f stop, right? Sorry for this dumb question.

Again, I don't know much about lens and a bit nervous choosing Tamron over Canon lenses. What do you guys think? Thanks in advance.

NB: Sorry if the lens advice thread annoys some people but the search tool on this forum is so bad I can hardly get related thread (easily).

Cheers,

k.a

 

[jrscls]

In your situation, get the Tamron 17-50 f2.8 lens instead of the 28-75. You will definitely want a f2.8 lens. Anything with f5.6 for example will be way too slow (not any different than your kit lens). IS helps in low light, but not to stop action.

I think the Tamron 17-50 is about $500 so it may be a bit over your budget, but it will be worthwhile. The 50mm f1.8 is a good place to start as well as the 35mm f2 (around $230) and the 85mm f1.8 (around $350). In fact you might just want to consider adding a few primes to your kit lens. The 35mm f2 and 50mm f1.8 would be only about $310 and would blow your kit lens away and work well without flash indoors (although you will still need to raise the ISO).

 

[Clint Sanders]

The 50 1.8 is a good start. It will really show you how a fast lens will benefit you.

And 2 questions:
1. For what I need, do I HAVE TO look for lens with around f/2.8 to
make it work under low light fast??? That's the reason I picked the
Tamron, although I would like it better wider.

Pretty much. 2.8 is two stops faster than 5.6, which is what 2 of the lenses you listed have on their telephoto end. Two stops requires 4 times the shutter speed for the same exposure. So what would take 1/20 second at 5.6, will only take 1/80 second at 2.8.

2. For a lens with f/4-5.6 advertised does that mean I can't go f/2.8
or that just the recommended f stop? And stopping down means going
below the advertised f stop, right? Sorry for this dumb question.

They usually list two f-stops for zoom lenses - the minimum f-stop at the wide angle, and the minimum at the telephoto end (the telephoto being the larger of the two). The exception to this are the constant f-stop lenses, which have the same minimum on both ends (the tamron 2.8 lenses you listed have constant f-stop). You will not be able to go below this f-stop.

 

[king_arthur]

Thank you very much for your inputs...

I appreciate the explanation of f stops on lenses Anyone have links for it in depth (not what f stop is, but more related to lenses, if u know what i mean)

Yes those prime lenses really tickled me from all directions. I like 85 f/1.8 A LOT and that's next on my list. I still need a zoom lens so my wife can use it comfortably. I even dreamed about buying a second camera (My wife will kill me!!! I have enough trouble getting these lenses).

So Those Canon lenses will serve me no good at all with those aperture???

Damn, Tamron 17-50 looks good (looks like a straight better replacement for the kit)
but I quite like 28-75 range.

Thanks again, everyone

 

[Glendower]

Your best answer here might be purchasing an external flash like the Canon 430EX that you can bounce off the ceiling or wall producing relatively shadow-free images while not disturbing baby's delicate eyes. The kit lens works very well with such a flash.

Everything was perfect until I took A LOT of pics of the baby in the
house with NO flash (my wife hates flash on our baby). I started to
understand a lot of things about my camera. Shutter speed, aperture,
ISO and lenses. With the baby moving most of the time I find my Kit
lens could not keep up with her INDOOR.

--
http://www.pbase.com/glendower_ca/photoaweek

 

[Swim Fast]

A fantastic, tack sharp lens that is great for imaging children asleep or at play. I have the 85mm on my 30D almost welded on - the 17-85 IS just doesn't compare.

Good luck!

 

[felixreichardt]

Hi,

sorry for the OT reply but where in Jakarta do you buy?
I'm an expat in Jakarta and get my stuff here: http://www.jpckemang.com .
Guess you are buying there too?

--
http://felix-reichardt.smugmug.com/

 

[Champboy]

Thank you very much for your inputs...

I appreciate the explanation of f stops on lenses Anyone have
links for it in depth (not what f stop is, but more related to
lenses, if u know what i mean)

Yes those prime lenses really tickled me from all directions. I like
85 f/1.8 A LOT and that's next on my list. I still need a zoom lens
so my wife can use it comfortably. I even dreamed about buying a
second camera (My wife will kill me!!! I have enough trouble getting
these lenses).

So Those Canon lenses will serve me no good at all with those
aperture???

Damn, Tamron 17-50 looks good (looks like a straight better
replacement for the kit)

While these two lenses have a substantial overlap, I would like to point out
that the difference between the wide ends (17 vs 28) is just as large (actually
a tad larger) as the longer end (50 vs 75). This would open up some
wider angle possibilities. You would have to think about if that were
an advantage for the shooting you do. You might look at the EXIF data
on your pictures and see if you use the wide end or the long end of your
current kit lens more than the other.

For normal to dim indoor light F2.8 would probably be good. If you go to
a 1.4 prime it would be even better but your technique would have to be
good to get sharp photos due to the shallow DOF (Depth Of Field) with
that big of an aprature.

All that said a fast prime is your best bet for low light.

but I quite like 28-75 range.

Thanks again, everyone

--
champboy

 

[iMac therefore iAm]

Flash isn't going to hurt the baby. Get a dedicated flash and bounce it off the ceiling and you'll get more natural lighting and you won't be shooting the flash into the kids eyes.

 

[StuartBell]

Tamron 17-50 everytime. The Tamron 28-75 is a great lens for the full-frame bodies for which it was designed, but 28mm is far too narrow for the wide end of a crop-body general purpose zoom, IMHO.

Stuart
--
- -

 

[acfpt]

From one parent to another:

I have a 30D and shoot with a 28-105 mkII. This is my only lens which I purchased instead of a kit lens. I have a 5 year old and an almost 3 year old. I can tell you that this lens is not fast enough indoors without a flash, even at the wider end where the aperture gets bigger. I actually bought the 430EX flash with the money I saved on the lens (had to justify the budget to the CFO/Wife- more components made more sense to her). Anyway, you really need a f2.8 lens if your really going to avoid using a flash, but don't discredit bounce flash. If your ceilings are a) white, and b) less than 10 feet tall, you can get really soft lighting without startling the baby.

 

[thatkatmat]

My opinion....get the 430 flash and the 50 1.8, all in about $300-325. Then your wife can still use the kit and you'd have a 1.8 too. Not to mention the advantage of an external flash, which can be used to give that kit a boost up in speed.

The Tammy is a great lens, but you want @ $300
The Sigma 18-50 would be a good choice too but again > $300

--
Summer in Seattle!

 

[king_arthur]

Thank you all for all suggestion...

I forgot to mention that I have 430EX. It's fantastic but it doesn't work well with multi snaps which I use all the time. And it's not practical at all to use in the house all the time, since those moments come out of nowhere and I have to grab my camera and shoot in less than 10 second, I leave my camera on all the time (with auto turn off).

I have been looking into Tamron 17-50 but again it's similar range as my kit, which I'm happy with for outdoor purpose. Hence the reason I'm going to consider the 28-75.

@felixreichardt:

Yes I have been comparing prices from JPC, do you find them good and reasonable? I heard a lot of pro go to Bursa Kamera Professional in Bendungan Hilir or Mal Ambassador but it's really hard to find out everything via overseas call for me
Also check tokocamzone.com, just a link from friend, never bought anything yet.

@acfpt:

Thanks for the info. I would love to stay wiith canon lens, but I can't justify an f/2.8 canon lens price

I am shooting a lot on the long end of my Kit lens so 28-75 would be good, i think? Anyone else having good experience with Tammy 28-75 with indoor/moving kids with no flash??? Thanks.

 

[BAK]

I've only read part of te thred.

REgardless...

1/ keep the kit lens, and use it when you need wide angle shots

2/ Skip the Canon 50 f1.8 (see 3/)

3/ Buy the Tamron 28-75 f2.8

You are on track when you say you like the long end of the kit lens, and the 28-75 would be even better.

4/ Theory - Having a wider aperture allows a faster shutter speed, so the baby won't be blurry because of camera shake or subject movement. (or, at least, will be less blurry)

Howevr, using a wider aperture lowers depth of field, so parts of the baby will be fuzzy because of the reduced depth of field.

5/ Cheap east trick. For shots where you can set up, get a white reflector -- best are purpose made reflectors from companies like Photoflex, but you can just use a 2 x 3 foot piece of white art board -- and have your anti-flash wife hold this up beside you. Teist the 430EX flash in your hot shoe so that it points toward the reflector, and then can bounce light from the flash over towards the baby, much softer than directly from the flash gun. The short duration of the flash will freeze motion, and the extra brightness will allow an aperture with decent depth of field.

6/ Stop trying to use your camera like a movie camera. A couple of shots in a row will work fine, and the 430EX, even bounced, is good for two shots in a row even at low ISO settings.

BAK

 

[felixreichardt]

@felixreichardt:
Yes I have been comparing prices from JPC, do you find them good and
reasonable? I heard a lot of pro go to Bursa Kamera Professional in
Bendungan Hilir or Mal Ambassador but it's really hard to find out
everything via overseas call for me
Also check tokocamzone.com, just a link from friend, never bought
anything yet.

I find JPC the best shop in town. Never got any problems with them. I am always able to trade old stuff in. I actually bought almost all my lenses there. And they have almost the complete lens line-ups from Canon, Sigma and Tamron on stock (primes might be different byt they will always try to get them for you).

Bursa Kamera Prof: Bought the 135 L there. Small shop with smaller range. Prices are same or cheaper at JPC from my experience. Could not wait to get the 135 from JPC and bought here. 5 minutes after I bought it I got a cal from JPC - they
were able to get it at a cheaper price. Bad luck.

Thanks for the link did not know that website.

If you need any help drop me a mail [email protected]