Do photos printed at home fade faster than those in the lab?

[redryder]

I'm using a cheap 3-in-1 multi-function inkjet printer, and the photos printed out fade very quickly, within 3 months all the color leaches out and it becomes sepia-toned. And this is using photo paper, not normal paper. Since I have not owned a dedicated photo printer before, I would like to ask the members here if the same thing happens with dedicated photo printers? What about dye-sub?

Obviously no photo lasts forever, but are there photo printers that produce long-lasting prints? What is the typical longevity of a home-printed photo that is kept in an album (with regards to retention of color)?

 

[MikeSp]

Some of the dedicated printers that use pigment-based inks produce prints that have been tested showing about 200 years of archival life when stored under glass or in a scrapbook. This would be up to three times the archival life of prints produced in most photolabs. Some dye-based inks in photo printers can produce prints that come close to those done in most photo labs. For more info, here is a link to tests about archival life of various printers and inks:

http://www.wilhelm-research.com/

MikeSp

 

[N8535Y]

As pointed out in another post here, Pigment Ink printers have a very very long archival no fade life, much longer than you can get on chemically developed Lab papers.

However, even with dye based printers you can equal or exceed what you get from the Lab by using special slow drying papers that have a surface that encapsulates the ink. Ilford has a series of papers called Ilford Classic Galerie Pearl and Gloss which are very good and should give you an easy 30 years behind glass. I have been using this paper for at least five years with no fading showing, even when not behind glass. Only problem is that the paper is very subject to water spotting, but this has not been a problem for me.

So, what kind of a printer do you have?

Also, Epson has a line of new dye based printers out that claim 100 year life--not proven yet-- with inks called Claria Dye Inks. They evidently produce very well saturated colors and everybody has been happy with the inks. Only problem is that the ink is expensive, especially with the lower priced machines. The printers using this ink are available under $100 and as low as $70 Epson R260, but they supply very small cartridges and the cost of an entire refil exceeds the costs of the printer.

Epson also uses this ink in their R380 and RX580 (all in one) and in their new Epson 1400 13 inch carriage printer.

The problem with pigment inks is that they are great for matte papers and OK with Gloss papers, but you do not get as good saturation with pigment inks as you can with dye based inks.

Hope this helps.

Bob

I'm using a cheap 3-in-1 multi-function inkjet printer, and the
photos printed out fade very quickly, within 3 months all the color
leaches out and it becomes sepia-toned. And this is using photo
paper, not normal paper. Since I have not owned a dedicated photo
printer before, I would like to ask the members here if the same
thing happens with dedicated photo printers? What about dye-sub?

Obviously no photo lasts forever, but are there photo printers that
produce long-lasting prints? What is the typical longevity of a
home-printed photo that is kept in an album (with regards to
retention of color)?

--
Bob

 

[Hail Hurtz]

The problem with pigment inks is that they are great for matte papers
and OK with Gloss papers, but you do not get as good saturation with
pigment inks as you can with dye based inks.

My Epson Pro 4800 prints on canvas or matte papers are def as saturated as
any dye ink out there. I often have to de-saturate prints because they
print too rich and saturated. These inks are as good and better than any
dye ink I've used prior, and they last in severe personal testing.

HH.

 

[Chris R-UK]

What you are experiencing is probably "gas fading" caused by exposure to the air, e.g. on a refrigerator. It is thought to be caused by atmospheric pollutents, particularly ozone (e.g. from the motor of a refrigerator), and is also accelerated by humidity.

Your printer will almost certainly use dye inks and these are particularly affected by gas fading. You can greatly reduce the problem by switching to the swellable papers mentioned by Mike. If you have an HP printer, try HP Premium Plus papers.

You can also avoid gas fading, of course, by always having your prints in an album or framed behind glass.

As Bob and Mike have mentioned, the most certain way to avoid fading is to switch to pigment inks. Epson do a range of consumer pigment ink printers using an ink called Durabrite, although these are not really photo printers. I believe that the only consumer pigment ink letter size photo printers available are the Kodak 5100/5300/5500 multifunctions and the Epson R800.

Dye subs don't suffer from gas fading, but the smaller dye subs come out very badly in light fading tests - see the Wilhelm article here http://www.wilhelm-research.com/ist/ist_2007_03.html (you will probably need to download the PDF to read it). I think that the larger dye subs from Kodak and Olympus have much better ratings.
--
Chris R

 

[Hail Hurtz]

What you are experiencing is probably "gas fading" caused by exposure
to the air, e.g. on a refrigerator. It is thought to be caused by
atmospheric pollutents, particularly ozone (e.g. from the motor of a
refrigerator), and is also accelerated by humidity.

I've never experienced this after 20 or 30,000 Epson dye or pigment prints
for hobby or resale use.

As Bob and Mike have mentioned, the most certain way to avoid fading
is to switch to pigment inks. Epson do a range of consumer pigment
ink printers using an ink called Durabrite, although these are not
really photo printers. I believe that the only consumer pigment ink
letter size photo printers available are the Kodak 5100/5300/5500
multifunctions and the Epson R800.

If you are printing only for hobby use and want your prints to last a long
time while saving in a binder or closed drawer, virtually any good quality
OEM ink will do the job well. I've got plain old dye based 1280 prints on
a wall after 5 years or so that show no signs of fading. The paper has suffered
tho. If you want hi-end ink, get a K3 Ink Epson printer. It's the best pigment
ink. The 3800 is a not in the league of the 4800, 7800 or 9800 for versatility,
but it does use smaller K3 inks at least and is a good consumer/hobbiest choice.

==============

 

[Scott Eaton]

These inks are as good and better than any dye ink I've used prior, and they last in severe personal testing.

I haven't recently tested the gamut range of the Ultrachrome 3 inks, but I do know the Dmax of the pigmented black ink isn't nowhere near Epson's dye based inks. None of the K3 producd prints I've had made have near the black density as the dye based Epson 220 I'm using.

 

[Hail Hurtz]

These inks are as good and better than any dye ink I've used prior, and they last in severe personal testing.

I haven't recently tested the gamut range of the Ultrachrome 3 inks,
but I do know the Dmax of the pigmented black ink isn't nowhere near
Epson's dye based inks. None of the K3 producd prints I've had made
have near the black density as the dye based Epson 220 I'm using.

I suspect you'll never be happy with an Epson Professional printer.
They require more effort to use than a consumer printer.

 

[STPitt]

I keep photos framed behind glass, displayed out of direct sunlight. No fade noticed. The rest go in albums with archival sleeves. All have been printed at home with a Canon i950 til it died, then a Canon ip6600D. In my opinion, keeping prints protected is the key. When I had prints done from b/w or color negs by a lab, they would fade if not protected. Fade is nothing new.

Steve-Seattle

 

[Chris R-UK]

What you are experiencing is probably "gas fading" caused by exposure
to the air, e.g. on a refrigerator. It is thought to be caused by
atmospheric pollutents, particularly ozone (e.g. from the motor of a
refrigerator), and is also accelerated by humidity.

I've never experienced this after 20 or 30,000 Epson dye or pigment
prints
for hobby or resale use.

It is only a problem with dye inks on nanoporous papers, and has become less serious in recent years because of changes to inks and papers. It was a big issue with Epson printers, I think particularly the 870, some years back when it was called "Orange Shift". Epson had to change their photo paers to reduce the problem.

Gas fading was always very erratic - some people never experienced any problems and others had colour changes in under 10 days. Humidity and ozone were thought to be the two main variables.

I had problems on my older printers - an Epson Photo Stylus 700 and then a Canon S820. With my Canon S820 prints pinned up in my bathroom started to change colour in 3 weeks.

If anybody reports really fast fading and the print is not in bright sunlight, then it is almost certainly "gas" fading. My guess is that the original poster on this thread experienced it because he was using a non-photo printer.

Wilhelm now test for "gas fading" and calls it "ozone resistance testing". Here is an example: http://www.wilhelm-research.com/ist/WIR_IST_2007_03_HW.pdf
--
Chris R

 

[Leonard525]

I use a canon pro 9000 photo dedicated printer with either genuine Canon inks vs Inkfarm re manufactured inks (dye not pigment inks) resistance to fading in room lighting with the following results.The room testing was done in the visible light range using a 13 watt CFL bulb, 2700 Kelvin, producing 800 lumens at the source. The test prints were 3 inches (0.0762 meters) away from the light source and under 1/8 in thick clear glass (which does NOT block UV light). The temperature was a maximal of 31.9 degrees.

The purpose of this test was to see the independent effect of humidity and temperature on the photos. All control photos did not receive any light exposure. All control photos seem to have no significant differences, at least at the 14 day marker. The photos in the UV testing were at 52 degrees centigrade and 20 % relative humidity. The photos in the room testing were at 31.9 degrees centigrade and 35% relative humidity. The ozone content of the air in the relative testing procedures is not known but presumed to be between 0.003 and 0.0125 ppm.

A different test was run using exact same photos printed with Canon ink and Ink farm ink either as controls or exposed to 500 + lumens of CFL light for 4 months. The temperature in the room averaged 80 degrees Fahrenheit and humidity about 52%. There was no fade observed on the controls. Surprisingly there was minor fading on BOTH canon and Ink farm test Photos. Note the average lumens in an average lit room is about 50 lumens. The lumens in this test are comparable to an extremely well lit office spaces. So there is a need to keep light exposure to fine digital photos low and use protective glass over the artwork. The amount of fade is approximately equal between the canon and ink farm test photos.

500 Lumens of CFL light x 4 months exposure. It is apparent that bright CFL light causes fade of fine digital prints but the difference between genuine canon ink and inkfarm ink is negligible.

UV light is very destructive to fine digital photos, bright light especially direct sunlight should be avoided at all costs

Leonard525

 

[farmersteve]

Do you realize you dredge up a 10 year old thread?

 

[digidog]

Do you realize you dredge up a 10 year old thread?