Lighting Diagrams

[nickrego]

I spend a lot of time reading posts, magazines, books, web tutorials, etc., about lighting set-ups and techniques.

So far, they all have one major flaw...Lighting is not 2 dimensional !

All the lighting diagrams are basically top views of where the lights are in relation to the subject in the Horizontal plane.

What I would also like to know is, what it the positioning in the vertical plane ? Is the light above the subject, even with the subject, below the subject ? They never seem to say ? Does anyone know of a lighting reference book, website, or other that gives you all the information ?

Thanks,

--
Nick Rego
Manteca, CA USA
http://www.reegphoto.com

 

[photolando]

I can understand but there are other things you can look for when lighting a subject. Let's take a portrait for example. The height or even angle to the camera isn't really one set place. It really depends on how your subject is positioned/posed in relation to the camera. Your main light would be in three different positions depending upon whether they were full face, 2/3s or profile to the camera. One of the biggest problems I do see with beginners is that they DON"T move the main light as they turn the subect but leave it at the same 45 degrees to the camera resulting in very poor lit subjects. As your subject moves, so does your light.

Height will aslo depend on a few things. The height of the subject, the size of the light modifier, etc. One 'rule of thumb' is to place the main 45 degrees away from AND 45 degress above the subject. But this could be a little more or a little less. But again, as you turn them, move the light accordingly. This is just a starting point and you can fine tune from there.

You want to pay attention to the nose shadow and perhaps the catchlights in the eyes. Of course we are talking classical portraiture here. Once you know what kind of shadows to get; closed loop, open loop, rembrant, split, butterfly, etc., the position of the main should be a piece of cake.

To learn lighting you have to 'see' the lighting. You'll never get it all from a diagram.

Mike
--
'Change the way you look at things, and the things you look at change.'

 

[signmaster]

As a biginner I would love to have diagrams that show the exact positioning of the lights, subject and camera. I have purchased a number of books on lighting and all had extremely poor diagrams, almost impossible to follow and some don't even relate to what is in the text. Most photographers are very visual people and diagrams showing the exact position of lights would be a great help. If I had a precise starting point I am sure I would learn a lot faster and once the basics are sorted then I could vary the positions of the lights as required.

I would certainly be interested in any books or websites with good diagrams showing both top view and front views of the lighting positions.
--
Signmaster

 

[Kent Johnson]

I spend a lot of time reading posts, magazines, books, web
tutorials, etc., about lighting set-ups and techniques.

So far, they all have one major flaw...Lighting is not 2 dimensional !

All the lighting diagrams are basically top views of where the
lights are in relation to the subject in the Horizontal plane.

What I would also like to know is, what it the positioning in the
vertical plane ? Is the light above the subject, even with the
subject, below the subject ? They never seem to say ? Does anyone
know of a lighting reference book, website, or other that gives you
all the information ?

Most diagrams accompany a photograph that utilized the lighting diagram. If you can't tell where the lights were positioned vertically by the type/location of the shadows on the subject then you might want to consider changing your approach slightly.

The quickest way that I personally (not saying it works for everyone) have found to learn is to find a photograph that uses the same basic lighting you have access to and try to copy the lighting. This is the one I used initially:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1025&message=12094982

After I spent a few days failing I think I was feeling the same way you might be until I changed my midset a bit and stopped expecting the description/diagram/whatever to do the hard work for me. And it is hard work performing the trial and error testing necessary to get it right.

I found it hard to resist this midset (I'm an engineer, LOL) even as I started to make progress I couldn't resist the urge to take notes and write things down subconsciously hoping to create a "formula". Once I fully realized that even a great formula can get destroyed instantly by the position of the subject and any one of a thousand other variables I began to let go of the formula mindset and start the "seeing" mindset you hear and read so much about.

I am not saying you should disregard all of the great techniques that Chuck G and others have referred to at length, quite the opposite, I am saying that the artist should learn to "See" and then use techniques to realize his/her vision.
I hope this makes sense.
Regards,
Kent

 

[ziggy53]

I came up with a few interesting links with the following Google:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=%2B%22closed+loop%22+%2B%22open+loop%22+%2Brembrandt+%2Bbutterfly
--

'Real photographers are never depressed. Every negative is a potential positive.' ziggy53

 

[americasteam]

Here is one showing the top view.

http://www.theflashcentre.com/

Click "guides" on the left hand side. From there you will have two options. Choose "The art of lighting for digital and film"

--
http://ivanmassey.smugmug.com/

 

[Bill McLeod]

I gotta say, that guide has some of the nastiest portraiture I've ever seen anyone try and pass off as professional.

 

[JR_Sprawls]

I found it hard to resist this midset (I'm an engineer, LOL) even
as I started to make progress I couldn't resist the urge to take
notes and write things down subconsciously hoping to create a
"formula". Once I fully realized that even a great formula can get
destroyed instantly by the position of the subject and any one of a
thousand other variables I began to let go of the formula mindset
and start the "seeing" mindset you hear and read so much about.
I am not saying you should disregard all of the great techniques
that Chuck G and others have referred to at length, quite the
opposite, I am saying that the artist should learn to "See" and
then use techniques to realize his/her vision.
I hope this makes sense.
Regards,
Kent

Makes excellent sense to me, and expresses what I was thinking as I read the thread.

My advice to beginners: Treat the diagrams and "rules" as general guides. Every light is different, every subject is different and every photographer's vision is different. Set up the lights, study the shadows and highlights on your subject, tinker with the setup until it looks right, then push the button. Upload the results to the computer, look it over and figure out how to make it better.

It used to take hundreds of dollars in film to learn lighting, now all it takes is a few cents worth of electricity -- plus a ton of time and commitment.

--
J.R.

Somewhere south
of Amarillo