Very disappointed with the Mk2

Not trying to be a Richard Cranium here , Andrew, but the 1D (and MK II) are very different cameras from the D60 and 10D. They do take a little time to learn. Shortly after I got my used 1D I sent it in for service (to have it checked out), I bought a 10D to use while it was out. The 10D was a breaze to work with out of the box, compared to the 1D. But after a couple months I sold the 10D, because I wasn't using it anymore.

I guess I'm saying not to dismiss the MK II because of a few minutes of P&S. Professional tools often times require knowledgeable amounts of voodoo to produce professional results. Professional tools, by design, are not made for weekend warriors. That's not to say weekend warriors can't or don't learn how to be extremely proficient and creative with professional tools. ... I have to stop dancing around and trying to be polite on this issue now, I'm getting tired!

I'm not criticizing your photography skills, just pointing out your ignorance of the MK II.

Again, not criticizing, your ignorance of the MK II is on par with everybody's.

Andrew Chiciak said:

Your right, Gerard. But I did not post the images I shot because
they were horribly soft. I shot an overall room shot with flash at
various exposures with the 24-70 at full wide at f5.6. The images
were very lackluster. Now since I do handle a digital camera every
weekend for profit and have pretty discerning judgement about the
output I am getting on every shot...I would expect that a
professional camera would give me at least a close approximation of
a saleable shot without large amounts of voodoo. Especially since
this is touted as a high speed, accurate piece of equipment.

This weekend, I shot a total of 980 exposures with my D60 and only
had to dump about 14 of them due to exposure or color issues.

Click to expand...

You have to provide your own 8x10 view camera though.

hank said:

hi yeah i

Click to expand...

Louis4444 said:

But the 1DII isn't about image quality

Click to expand...

Careful with statements like that. Someone might mistake this for the Sony forum.

... and someone how did take the time to learn to work with it.

I assume you can apply plenty of in camera sharpening or contrast adjustments via the software functions.

If you pop up a lens on the camera and make photos it provides "natural" photos. But Canon always prefered as little in camera sharpening as possible (means no at all) for the more professional cams.

Still the camera can do it and if you want razor sharp photos out of the box and don't want to manually tweak at your pc you can get that too, it's just a question of settings.

First of all, Mike, I am not a "weekend warrior" I have been doing professional portraiture and wedding photography for a long time. Also, I have had extensive experience with the 1D and like that camera a lot except for its limited resolution (cropping was marginal) I found that I could get used to it very quickly...there was no "voodoo" I expose digital files as far to the right as I can (just before a blowout) and found that the 1D gave excellent dynamic range in this regard with colorful, filmlike images that needed very little post processing to be good. My D60 needs a little more work sometimes to be very good, but about 75% of my shots now are right on and can be printed very well right off camera after a little usm or resizing. Frankly, I was hoping that the Mark II would be an extended resolution version fo the 1D...unfortunately it is not.

MR Mike said:

I guess I'm saying not to dismiss the MK II because of a few
minutes of P&S. Professional tools often times require
knowledgeable amounts of voodoo to produce professional results.
Professional tools, by design, are not made for weekend warriors.
That's not to say weekend warriors can't or don't learn how to be
extremely proficient and creative with professional tools. ... I
have to stop dancing around and trying to be polite on this issue
now, I'm getting tired!

I'm not criticizing your photography skills, just pointing out your
ignorance of the MK II.

Again, not criticizing, your ignorance of the MK II is on par with
everybody's.

Andrew Chiciak said:

Your right, Gerard. But I did not post the images I shot because
they were horribly soft. I shot an overall room shot with flash at
various exposures with the 24-70 at full wide at f5.6. The images
were very lackluster. Now since I do handle a digital camera every
weekend for profit and have pretty discerning judgement about the
output I am getting on every shot...I would expect that a
professional camera would give me at least a close approximation of
a saleable shot without large amounts of voodoo. Especially since
this is touted as a high speed, accurate piece of equipment.

This weekend, I shot a total of 980 exposures with my D60 and only
had to dump about 14 of them due to exposure or color issues.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

--
Andy C

I shoot weddings and portraiture. I shoot medium format mamiyas and hassleblad. I always shoot film on the essential shots, esp ones that I can't redo. I use the digital for the more creative and candid shots. I have shot some all digital jobs with great success, I was hoping for a camera that would replace my film ones in terms of ultimate repeatability.

MarkMiller said:

What type of photography do you do?

If you photograph weddings the 1d2 will improve your auto flash
exposure.

If you photograph sports ....

What do you photograph with your film camera (which one by the
way?) and your D60?

Click to expand...

--
Andy C

Andrew Chiciak said:

I shoot weddings and portraiture. I shoot medium format mamiyas and
hassleblad. I always shoot film on the essential shots, esp ones
that I can't redo. I use the digital for the more creative and
candid shots. I have shot some all digital jobs with great success,
I was hoping for a camera that would replace my film ones in terms
of ultimate repeatability.

Click to expand...

Do you not think that the 1Ds would be better for you?

Andrew Chiciak said:

MarkMiller said:

What type of photography do you do?

If you photograph weddings the 1d2 will improve your auto flash
exposure.

If you photograph sports ....

What do you photograph with your film camera (which one by the
way?) and your D60?

Click to expand...

--
Andy C

Click to expand...

I guess I need more dance lessons.

It's hard sometimes to read the tone of typed words, did not mean to offend. My weekend warrior comment was a play on words to your statement "Now since I do handle a digital camera every weekend for profit"

I missed the fact that you have extensive experience with the 1D.

A lot of the posts poo-pooing the 1D, 1Ds and 1D MK II are from people not understanding or expecting that there is a learning curve from the 300D, D60 or 10D to the 1D series.

We are getting such mixed reviews about the MK II and from what I've read, most (not all) of the bad reviews are from less experienced 1D-something people and the good reviews are coming from the most experienced 1D-something people.

Just my observation.

I am patiently waiting for production tests and reviews.

Andrew Chiciak said:

MR Mike said:

I guess I'm saying not to dismiss the MK II because of a few
minutes of P&S. Professional tools often times require
knowledgeable amounts of voodoo to produce professional results.
Professional tools, by design, are not made for weekend warriors.
That's not to say weekend warriors can't or don't learn how to be
extremely proficient and creative with professional tools. ... I
have to stop dancing around and trying to be polite on this issue
now, I'm getting tired!

I'm not criticizing your photography skills, just pointing out your
ignorance of the MK II.

Again, not criticizing, your ignorance of the MK II is on par with
everybody's.

Andrew Chiciak said:

Your right, Gerard. But I did not post the images I shot because
they were horribly soft. I shot an overall room shot with flash at
various exposures with the 24-70 at full wide at f5.6. The images
were very lackluster. Now since I do handle a digital camera every
weekend for profit and have pretty discerning judgement about the
output I am getting on every shot...I would expect that a
professional camera would give me at least a close approximation of
a saleable shot without large amounts of voodoo. Especially since
this is touted as a high speed, accurate piece of equipment.

This weekend, I shot a total of 980 exposures with my D60 and only
had to dump about 14 of them due to exposure or color issues.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

--
Andy C

Click to expand...

Andrew Chiciak said:

Frankly, I was hoping that
the Mark II would be an extended resolution version fo the
1D...unfortunately it is not.

Click to expand...

I think it depends on how you look at things. Maybe the images
it gives are very different than 1D images, and not liking to your
taste, and maybe the 1Ds Mark II will be more of what is best for
you, but I think for photo journalists that need 8.5fps and fast
focusing, et cetera, the 1D Mark II will be a perfect upgrade for
them. For what matters to them, the 1D Mark II will be "an
extended resolution version for the 1D".

And maybe once we get past the test shots, and past the photos
that people come up with quickly, and not the sort of photos I
will be shooting in the south of France this next summer, maybe
slowly you'll shift around in your thinking on this. It may just have
some different strengths than what the old 1D had.

But for myself, I am sure that I am going to like it better than my
10D. How much better ? I don't know, but better, for sure.

Andrew Chiciak said:

I shoot weddings and portraiture. I shoot medium format mamiyas and
hassleblad.

Click to expand...

May I suggest respectfully suggest Andrew that you have not given the 1d2 a chance here. You are not even using 1 series film cameras. It will take you a while to learn how to use this camera.

At the very least the resolution is competitive, ETTL2 will give far more reliable reults.

You are a far better photographer than me if you can pick up a new system fresh out of the box and get 100% results with it.

How long did it take to learn the mamiya and hassy sytems so they were native in your hands Andrew?

The 1ds may be better suited to your style, you might even wait for the next one.

I shoot weddings on 1ds but will be glad to move to the 1d2 when it arrives.

I always shoot film on the essential shots, esp ones

Andrew Chiciak said:

that I can't redo. I use the digital for the more creative and
candid shots. I have shot some all digital jobs with great success,
I was hoping for a camera that would replace my film ones in terms
of ultimate repeatability.

MarkMiller said:

What type of photography do you do?

If you photograph weddings the 1d2 will improve your auto flash
exposure.

If you photograph sports ....

What do you photograph with your film camera (which one by the
way?) and your D60?

Click to expand...

--
Andy C

Click to expand...

--
~ there are those that do ~ and those that talk about it ~

If this camera was taking great shot after great shot Canon would not have any problem with people posting them. I must admit I truely haven't seen any photos that could not have been produced by a 1D. This forum is starting to sound like the 10D front focus forum real quickly.

Andrew Chiciak said:

They were online last week in another thread...had to remove them
at canon's request.

Click to expand...

--
Mike Morbach
I'm still learning
http://www.pbase.com/kathy777
http://www.pbase.com/spike777

I shot the picture with the cheerleaders, and have posted it here, further so, i mailed Canon in Denmark and invited them to see the positive reaction the pictures got. I shot about 30 images with the camera and was very pleased with it and them.

I politely asked if I could use my own CF chip in their camera, and the answer was yes, so i didnt do this in stealth

Regards CR

Paul Juhn said:

Andrew Chiciak said:

MR Mike said:

Andrew Chiciak said:

If you read my text carefully...I did have the camera in hand and
did shoot quite a few images with it.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

--
Andy C

Click to expand...

--
http://www.pbase.com/pjuhn D30 24-85, 50, 75-300

Click to expand...

--
Kind Regards
Carsten Rasmussen

Tom O'Neil said:

Tom O'Neil said:

But the 1DII isn't about image quality

Click to expand...

Careful with statements like that. Someone might mistake this for
the Sony forum.

Click to expand...

LOL... ...to be more precise: the 1DII isn't about image quality in the sense that it is a performance-optimized camera that will shine in situations that are about getting any shot at all (AF, buffer size) versus "fine art" situations which allow for optimizing image quality on a pixel-by-pixel basis.

Hope that clarifies... ;-)