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Ink just rubs off Canon + Ilford Classic Pearl

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Xaphod

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I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and saturaion on the classic pearl.....especially the feel...and lack of thumbprnits from glossy...

However!! I noticed after handling a photo that some of the ink had rubbed off aand this was several days after printing! It looked like my thumb had pulled the ink off the page.

To confirm my hypothesis I slightly wet my finger and rubbed and all the ink came right off! So if your skin is even slightly wet/sweaty you could esasily ruin a good print; this is nuts given that they recommend classic for dye based inks!

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers? I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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Are you sure the difference is due to pearl vs glossy? I would suspect that any nanoporous paper (e.g., Ilford Smooth Pearl or Gloss) will not have this problem.
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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A drop of water now or 20 years from now will ruin the print. That is one of the tradeoffs for using it in dye-based printers to get better longevity.

-Darryl
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and
saturaion on the classic pearl.....especially the feel...and lack
of thumbprnits from glossy...

However!! I noticed after handling a photo that some of the ink had
rubbed off aand this was several days after printing! It looked
like my thumb had pulled the ink off the page.

To confirm my hypothesis I slightly wet my finger and rubbed and
all the ink came right off! So if your skin is even slightly
wet/sweaty you could esasily ruin a good print; this is nuts given
that they recommend classic for dye based inks!

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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This is the CLASSIC pearl not the nanoporous smooth which ilford recommensd for EPSON printers; they recommend the CLASSIC for Canon which is where I'm having the problem
Jordan
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic paper
Jordan
darrylr said:
-Darryl
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and
saturaion on the classic pearl.....especially the feel...and lack
of thumbprnits from glossy...

However!! I noticed after handling a photo that some of the ink had
rubbed off aand this was several days after printing! It looked
like my thumb had pulled the ink off the page.

To confirm my hypothesis I slightly wet my finger and rubbed and
all the ink came right off! So if your skin is even slightly
wet/sweaty you could esasily ruin a good print; this is nuts given
that they recommend classic for dye based inks!

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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I understand you are using Classic Pearl; the question I was asking is whether the glossy you are using is also Classic.
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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jordan bortz said:
I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and
sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink
rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic
paper
Jordan
Click to expand...
I've found (on an Epson dye printer) that the print becomes gradually less sensitive to this problem over a period of weeks, although it never completely goes away. As others have said, it is a trade-off of long life vs a robust print...
 
Hi

The glossies I have used/use include Photo Paper Pro, Photo Paper Plus, and epson Premium Glossy, none of which have this problem; I haven' tried any of the ilfords glossies..
Jordan
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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Eek.. I just bought Ilford paper for the first time.
I have an Epson 1280 EX The paper is smooth gloss for up to 2880dpi.

I havent really checked into other Ilford paper, so I dont know the difference types.
Would this happen to my photos should I decide to give them as gifts?

I notice even the highest quality Kodak paper seems to take forever to dry with Epson Printers. I started using Epson highest premium paper until someone told me to check out Ilford.

So you think Ilford and Epson work well together for the long haul.. or will it not last long enough to sell photos professionally?

R
Graeme Cogger said:
jordan bortz said:
I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and
sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink
rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic
paper
Jordan
Click to expand...
I've found (on an Epson dye printer) that the print becomes
gradually less sensitive to this problem over a period of weeks,
although it never completely goes away. As others have said, it is
a trade-off of long life vs a robust print...
Click to expand...
--
--
http://gallery.bytephoto.com/rct4905
and
http://community.webshots.com/user/photofunatic
 
You want durability go for a porous paper like Ilford Smooth Gloss or Epson Premium Glossy or Canon Photo Paper Pro. All of these can be put under running water and scrubbed with your fingers without any ill effects.

You want longevity then you need to go resin coated/swellable papers that do not have the water resistance that porous papers do.

There's room for both types of papers.

For me I put the swellable behind glass with a matte in front to keep it from sticking to the glass and then display in open environments (daylight).

Everything else I use porous or matte papers with sleeves . .

--
Gerald
aka. Uzi Lovin Hawaiian - Defender of Common Sense!
Honolulu, Hawaii
 
Exactly my point. The ink rubbing off is not because of the finish (pearl vs. glossy), but basic paper type (Resin Coated vs nanoporous).

The glossy papers you tried are all nanoporous, whereas the Classic Pearl is RC.
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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Paper and ink are expensive.Get into the habit of wearing a cheap pair of cotton gloves when handling your paper before and after printing.Keep a clean pair next to your printer(s) when not in use.If you have sweaty hands or oily skin this habit will save you plenty.

The Ilford smooth series is almost instant dry when using with dye ink from canon or epson.The trade off is longevity.Your enviorment will dictate how long before color shifting occurs.I get fading within 2 months on unprotected smooth pearl with epson dye ink.None yet with classic pearl.

With the classic pearl or epson colorlife let it dry about 30 minutes after printing and then place a piece of plain copy paper over it and place it between the pages in a book for 2 or 3 days and you should be fine.
Ruth Taylor said:
I notice even the highest quality Kodak paper seems to take forever
to dry with Epson Printers. I started using Epson highest premium
paper until someone told me to check out Ilford.

So you think Ilford and Epson work well together for the long
haul.. or will it not last long enough to sell photos
professionally?

R
Graeme Cogger said:
jordan bortz said:
I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and
sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink
rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic
paper
Jordan
Click to expand...
I've found (on an Epson dye printer) that the print becomes
gradually less sensitive to this problem over a period of weeks,
although it never completely goes away. As others have said, it is
a trade-off of long life vs a robust print...
Click to expand...
--
--
http://gallery.bytephoto.com/rct4905
and
http://community.webshots.com/user/photofunatic
Click to expand...
 
The problem here is I'm printing shots for models (or maybe I can't print them on this printer) that they can take and carry with them and show to agencies/photographer's etc. Obviously neither they nor their potential clients can be wearing cotton gloves to handle the prints.... So what's the answer here?
Jordan
EJS said:
The Ilford smooth series is almost instant dry when using with dye
ink from canon or epson.The trade off is longevity.Your enviorment
will dictate how long before color shifting occurs.I get fading
within 2 months on unprotected smooth pearl with epson dye ink.None
yet with classic pearl.

With the classic pearl or epson colorlife let it dry about 30
minutes after printing and then place a piece of plain copy paper
over it and place it between the pages in a book for 2 or 3 days
and you should be fine.
Ruth Taylor said:
I notice even the highest quality Kodak paper seems to take forever
to dry with Epson Printers. I started using Epson highest premium
paper until someone told me to check out Ilford.

So you think Ilford and Epson work well together for the long
haul.. or will it not last long enough to sell photos
professionally?

R
Graeme Cogger said:
jordan bortz said:
I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and
sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink
rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic
paper
Jordan
Click to expand...
I've found (on an Epson dye printer) that the print becomes
gradually less sensitive to this problem over a period of weeks,
although it never completely goes away. As others have said, it is
a trade-off of long life vs a robust print...
Click to expand...
--
--
http://gallery.bytephoto.com/rct4905
and
http://community.webshots.com/user/photofunatic
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
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Digital Rebel Fan/Info/Chat and Forums Page
http://fotoluxe.com/cameras/drebel
 
Would it rub off too? Their site claims it is RC; they don't say whether it's nanoporous..ahve you tried it?

Also in terms of exactly my point, my canon glossy papers are all RC, not nanoporous, and yet none of them rub off, so how can you say that it's the RC paper that is the problem when I have no problems with the Canon RC paper?
Jordan
Dominic.Chan said:
The glossy papers you tried are all nanoporous, whereas the Classic
Pearl is RC.
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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http://fotoluxe.com/cameras/drebel
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Common sense will tell you the gloves are for you the printer not the client.

Models carry their photos in a portfolio.By the time they are displaying their wares the photos have been well cured and are well protected by the sleeves of a quality portfolio.If an agent or agency damages any,most models have a good back up supply,I'd think.
jordan bortz said:
EJS said:
The Ilford smooth series is almost instant dry when using with dye
ink from canon or epson.The trade off is longevity.Your enviorment
will dictate how long before color shifting occurs.I get fading
within 2 months on unprotected smooth pearl with epson dye ink.None
yet with classic pearl.

With the classic pearl or epson colorlife let it dry about 30
minutes after printing and then place a piece of plain copy paper
over it and place it between the pages in a book for 2 or 3 days
and you should be fine.
Ruth Taylor said:
I notice even the highest quality Kodak paper seems to take forever
to dry with Epson Printers. I started using Epson highest premium
paper until someone told me to check out Ilford.

So you think Ilford and Epson work well together for the long
haul.. or will it not last long enough to sell photos
professionally?

R
Graeme Cogger said:
jordan bortz said:
I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and
sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink
rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic
paper
Jordan
Click to expand...
I've found (on an Epson dye printer) that the print becomes
gradually less sensitive to this problem over a period of weeks,
although it never completely goes away. As others have said, it is
a trade-off of long life vs a robust print...
Click to expand...
--
--
http://gallery.bytephoto.com/rct4905
and
http://community.webshots.com/user/photofunatic
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Digital Rebel Fan/Info/Chat and Forums Page
http://fotoluxe.com/cameras/drebel
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jordan bortz said:
Would it rub off too? Their site claims it is RC; they don't say
whether it's nanoporous..ahve you tried it?

Also in terms of exactly my point, my canon glossy papers are all
RC, not nanoporous, and yet none of them rub off, so how can you
say that it's the RC paper that is the problem when I have no
problems with the Canon RC paper?
Click to expand...
The Epson Premium Glossy, Luster, and Semigloss (and I would guess the Canon also) are RC base with nanoporous coating. The Ilford Smooth Gloss and Smooth Pearl would also fall into this category. They're water resistant, and longevity probably won't be a problem if your customers keep them in sleeves in a portfolio.

The Ilford Classic Gloss and Classic Pearl, as well as Epson Colorlife, are the "swellable" type coating. They are more resistant to light fading, but might stick to portfolio sleeves if you're in a humid climate.

--
Tricia
 
Well what I continue to talk about and you contine to ignore is that I'm talking about prints that can be carried around and shown unprotected. Yes they may be in a portfolio but if someone is serious they will take it out and then look at it without the plastic portfolio, just like they would a normal photographic print.

What you keep talking about is protecting the print from the environmetn, constantly, and what I'm talking about is a print that can be taken out and shown WITHOUT constantly being behind a barrier.

So if you want to talk about laminating prints in some form or fashion please talk about it elsewhere; what I'm talking about here is prints durable enough to be taken out and shown without rubbing off if it's in a hot location where people may be sweaty.

Thanks,
Jordan
EJS said:
Models carry their photos in a portfolio.By the time they are
displaying their wares the photos have been well cured and are well
protected by the sleeves of a quality portfolio.If an agent or
agency damages any,most models have a good back up supply,I'd think.
jordan bortz said:
EJS said:
The Ilford smooth series is almost instant dry when using with dye
ink from canon or epson.The trade off is longevity.Your enviorment
will dictate how long before color shifting occurs.I get fading
within 2 months on unprotected smooth pearl with epson dye ink.None
yet with classic pearl.

With the classic pearl or epson colorlife let it dry about 30
minutes after printing and then place a piece of plain copy paper
over it and place it between the pages in a book for 2 or 3 days
and you should be fine.
Ruth Taylor said:
I notice even the highest quality Kodak paper seems to take forever
to dry with Epson Printers. I started using Epson highest premium
paper until someone told me to check out Ilford.

So you think Ilford and Epson work well together for the long
haul.. or will it not last long enough to sell photos
professionally?

R
Graeme Cogger said:
jordan bortz said:
I disagree like I said I've run water over the glossy prints and
sure there is a teeny bit of bleeding but nothing where the ink
rubs right off down to the paper like I'm seeing on this classic
paper
Jordan
Click to expand...
I've found (on an Epson dye printer) that the print becomes
gradually less sensitive to this problem over a period of weeks,
although it never completely goes away. As others have said, it is
a trade-off of long life vs a robust print...
Click to expand...
--
--
http://gallery.bytephoto.com/rct4905
and
http://community.webshots.com/user/photofunatic
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
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Digital Rebel Fan/Info/Chat and Forums Page
http://fotoluxe.com/cameras/drebel
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Jordan, I must be missing something because I'm not understanding why this thread is continuing . .

One issue I think you're confused about is the fact that ALL of the glossy papers you mentioned are POROUS PAPERS and not swellable resin coated ones . . Generally a resin coated paper is not an instant dry paper like the glossies you mentioned, the instant dry papers are porous papers . .

Why is it that you've tried glossy porous papers and have found that they are durable and yet you still insist on trying to print on resin coated papers expecting the same durability?
 
Jordan

He meany wear gloves BEFORE you print: that way no sweat or grease goes on the surface (where it will damage the surface) So when you've printed on smooth gloss or pearl, that's what you'll need for models photos. By the time that it fades, your models will have probably had their use from the pix. You can tell them up front to put the pix in plastic sleaves.

Or if you don't want the risk of fading, go with the classic gloss or pearl. You'll then HAVE to tell the models to keep the pix in plastic sleaves or folders as you've been told that the ink smears in damp conditions with this paper. I've not used the classic papers but the smooth papers are great!

I hope it exlains things better
spanky
 
jordan bortz said:
Would it rub off too? Their site claims it is RC; they don't say
whether it's nanoporous..ahve you tried it?

Also in terms of exactly my point, my canon glossy papers are all
RC, not nanoporous, and yet none of them rub off, so how can you
say that it's the RC paper that is the problem when I have no
problems with the Canon RC paper?
Click to expand...
Canon does not have a resin coated paper, they are all nanoporous. Ilford smooth gloss and smooth pearl are both nanoporous and will not rub off. Ilford classic gloss and classic pearl are both rc and will. Kodak and HP papers is also rc and will rub off. These are all true on any dye printers.
Xaphod said:
Jordan
Dominic.Chan said:
The glossy papers you tried are all nanoporous, whereas the Classic
Pearl is RC.
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
Dominic.Chan said:
jordan bortz said:
I had printed out several photos and really loved the color and

What is others experience with this paper...and otehr pearl papers?
I dont have this problem printing on glossy..this is on a canon i960
Jordan
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