settings

I am disappointed with my S2. Manual says to leave colour and tone to Org and sharpness Off. The images then have to be manipulated in PS but I still cant get a decent enough image even if the pictures were taken on a sunny day. Surely the colour and sharpness of the photograph then comes down to the ability of the Applemac user and not the photographer. I have been told by Fuji that a hand held light meter is useless as digital is very different to films. I was also told that the histogram is a just a general guideline and not to be taken too seriously. So how do I get a proper reading whether in the studio or outdoors? I'm afraid there was much too hype for the S2 and if it is the pick of the bunch in its field then mine can go back and I will stay 100% film. I am obviously doing something very wrong and the manual is useless - can anyone help me out there??

welshman2004 said:

I am disappointed with my S2. Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off. The images then have to be manipulated in
PS but I still cant get a decent enough image even if the pictures
were taken on a sunny day. Surely the colour and sharpness of the
photograph then comes down to the ability of the Applemac user and
not the photographer. I have been told by Fuji that a hand held
light meter is useless as digital is very different to films. I
was also told that the histogram is a just a general guideline and
not to be taken too seriously. So how do I get a proper reading
whether in the studio or outdoors? I'm afraid there was much too
hype for the S2 and if it is the pick of the bunch in its field
then mine can go back and I will stay 100% film. I am obviously
doing something very wrong and the manual is useless - can anyone
help me out there??

Click to expand...

--
hy

Hi--

First check the basics-- is your monitor accurate and profiled? If so, and you are unhappy with the color with your current settings, by all means experiment-- try different color & tone settings and see if that improves things.

If you're still unhappy, post a few images here and let us evaluate them. A lot can be learned this way.

As for exposure, most of us use the histogram this way: if the scene is contrasty, we make sure the highlights are not blown-- no line on the right side of the graph. It's okay to underexpose the rest a little.

If the scene is not contrasty, then exposure is easy. If the subject consists mostly of midtones-- an average scene-- make sure the bump in the curve is in the middle or maybe a little to the right.

Hope this helps.

-john

hy said:

welshman2004 said:

I am disappointed with my S2. Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off. The images then have to be manipulated in
PS but I still cant get a decent enough image even if the pictures
were taken on a sunny day. Surely the colour and sharpness of the
photograph then comes down to the ability of the Applemac user and
not the photographer. I have been told by Fuji that a hand held
light meter is useless as digital is very different to films. I
was also told that the histogram is a just a general guideline and
not to be taken too seriously. So how do I get a proper reading
whether in the studio or outdoors? I'm afraid there was much too
hype for the S2 and if it is the pick of the bunch in its field
then mine can go back and I will stay 100% film. I am obviously
doing something very wrong and the manual is useless - can anyone
help me out there??

Click to expand...

--
hy

Click to expand...

--do a lookup for gibbsy...GERWIN GIBBS... he is in wales and has posted a number a remarkable pictures on this site taken with his s2, wales does not look too big on my map maybe you could look him up and he might be able to help you. if that fails theres always ebay and film. oh, yea....what kind of glass is in front of your s2? digital slr's require 1st class glass. are u using uv filter? do you have closest subject disabled? post a picture with info and you will get help.
hy

welshman2004 said:

Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off.

Click to expand...

Are you using this in RAW mode or JPG? If RAW, which converter are you using (LE? EX?)

Have you tried setting the camera to fine/jpeg and all of the tone/colour/sharpness settings to standard?

welshman2004 said:

Surely the colour and sharpness of the
photograph then comes down to the ability of the Applemac user and
not the photographer.

Click to expand...

There are a number of ways of using the camera and processing the data... Some require more post processing than others..

welshman2004 said:

I have been told by Fuji that a hand held
light meter is useless as digital is very different to films.

Click to expand...

I doubt that a hand held meter is useless, but I can't see why you'd need one... providing that your S2 is working properly...

welshman2004 said:

was also told that the histogram is a just a general guideline and
not to be taken too seriously.

Click to expand...

Probably true, to a degree...

welshman2004 said:

So how do I get a proper reading
whether in the studio or outdoors?

Click to expand...

Expose as for slide film whilst keeping the histogram as far right as possible... i.e. without clipping the highlights...

welshman2004 said:

I'm afraid there was much too
hype for the S2 and if it is the pick of the bunch in its field
then mine can go back....

Click to expand...

The S2 is a superb camera in many ways... Your camera could be faulty, or maybe you just need to learn to use it properly... Without samples, it's hard to say where the problem is...

ATB,

Ian

welshman2004 said:

smithim said:

Manual says to leave colour and tone to Org and sharpness Off.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

welshman2004,

So, you've read the manual! A positive sign,indeed. This is your very first post. Rest assured that you can make the S2 work and work well. Org-Org-Off is one of the better ways to shoot 4256x Fine compression JPEG files in-camera, in order to preserve the greatest number of post-processing options for JPEG files.

Shooting RAW format and converting with EX Converter 2.0 or Photoshop CS will allow you to get the most out of RAW-captured files. The best aid to getting better color is shooting to a Custom White Balance space,especially if you shoot in JPEG mode. The preset WB's may also be of some use to you,and as you get farther along with the S2 you come to know the white balances and when they work best. But setting a custom WB is always useful I think.

Give the S2 a bit more time,and you'll come to be able to shoot better and better images with it. Within 3,000 frames you'll start to get a really good feel for how it meters,shoots,etc. Seriously....at least 3,000 frames.
--
Happy Shooting!
Derrel

smithim said:

welshman2004 said:

Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off.

Click to expand...

Are you using this in RAW mode or JPG? If RAW, which converter are
you using (LE? EX?)

Have you tried setting the camera to fine/jpeg and all of the
tone/colour/sharpness settings to standard?

smithim said:

Surely the colour and sharpness of the
photograph then comes down to the ability of the Applemac user and
not the photographer.

Click to expand...

There are a number of ways of using the camera and processing the
data... Some require more post processing than others..

smithim said:

I have been told by Fuji that a hand held
light meter is useless as digital is very different to films.

Click to expand...

I doubt that a hand held meter is useless, but I can't see why
you'd need one... providing that your S2 is working properly...

smithim said:

was also told that the histogram is a just a general guideline and
not to be taken too seriously.

Click to expand...

Probably true, to a degree...

smithim said:

So how do I get a proper reading
whether in the studio or outdoors?

Click to expand...

Expose as for slide film whilst keeping the histogram as far right
as possible... i.e. without clipping the highlights...

smithim said:

I'm afraid there was much too
hype for the S2 and if it is the pick of the bunch in its field
then mine can go back....

Click to expand...

The S2 is a superb camera in many ways... Your camera could be
faulty, or maybe you just need to learn to use it properly...
Without samples, it's hard to say where the problem is...

ATB,

Ian

Click to expand...

Hi; I am new to the S2...I will say that for studio work a meter is a must no matter what camera you have, and if you want some professional info go to http://www.smartshooter.com that is will crocket's site. Join it it is free and then you will be told when they have all day seminars in your area and they are FREE and it is one of the best seminars i have been too. They show you how to use the meter and they have everything set up from start to actually printing the finished product. Crockett uses the S2 (as well as other cameras) good luck, allen

Hy,

I am unfamiliar with many of the peculiarities of digital, and your mention of a UV filter piqued my interest. I use them on all my Nikon lenses more as a transparent lens cap that any fear of UV affecting my images. Do those filter affect the images on the S2?

hy said:

hy said:

welshman2004 said:

I am disappointed with my S2. Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off. The images then have to be manipulated in
PS but I still cant get a decent enough image even if the pictures
were taken on a sunny day. Surely the colour and sharpness of the
photograph then comes down to the ability of the Applemac user and
not the photographer. I have been told by Fuji that a hand held
light meter is useless as digital is very different to films. I
was also told that the histogram is a just a general guideline and
not to be taken too seriously. So how do I get a proper reading
whether in the studio or outdoors? I'm afraid there was much too
hype for the S2 and if it is the pick of the bunch in its field
then mine can go back and I will stay 100% film. I am obviously
doing something very wrong and the manual is useless - can anyone
help me out there??

Click to expand...

--
hy

Click to expand...

--do a lookup for gibbsy...GERWIN GIBBS... he is in wales and has
posted a number a remarkable pictures on this site taken with his
s2, wales does not look too big on my map maybe you could look him
up and he might be able to help you. if that fails theres always
ebay and film. oh, yea....what kind of glass is in front of your
s2? digital slr's require 1st class glass. are u using uv filter?
do you have closest subject disabled? post a picture with info and
you will get help.
hy

Click to expand...

Allen Mankin said:

smithim said:

welshman2004 said:

Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off.

Click to expand...

Are you using this in RAW mode or JPG? If RAW, which converter are
you using (LE? EX?)

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

All the pictures I've taken so far have been in jpg. What is the converter and how does it work? Maybe this is the solution? Will it simply convert a jpeg or raw file from the camera that had all its settings off to a professional image? I have seen many images from the S2 that appear first class. I would have thought a handheld meter reading is handy for most work and absolutely essential for the studio. I am obviously doing something very wrong. But the point I'm making is that if I have 100 pictures that I want to pass onto a client the last thing I want to do is spend time on the Applemac making sure every image is as good as I can get it. And what if my opinion of a decent image is not as good as a more experienced/talented pc operator? When my slides come back from the lab I know what to expect and I know beforehand that the quality will be enough to satisfy my client (and me). I shall send a few pictures next time. Thanks for your help - it is greatly appreciated.

Gabriel ET said:

Hy,

I am unfamiliar with many of the peculiarities of digital, and your
mention of a UV filter piqued my interest. I use them on all my
Nikon lenses more as a transparent lens cap that any fear of UV
affecting my images. Do those filter affect the images on the S2?

Click to expand...

Some people have experienced focusing or lack of sharpness problems on some lenses with some UV filters, even expensive ultra thin ones. It is worth removing the filter (something that I naturally do not want to do as I really like perfect front elements) for an experiment.

Sean

RAW files are basically the raw data from the CCD in the camera with no processing applied. If bought in the UK your camera will have come with the RAW Converter LE software which is the next best thing to useless. You will need to invest in either Photoshop CS which has a pretty good (and fast) S2 RAW convertor or in Fuji's EX convertor which retails for between £95 and £130. This is much slower but does produce slighly higher quality results than CS (but for many CS is just fine). Sound to me though you are after teh image quality that EX can provide.

Shooting RAW (witha convertor other than LE) is a very different business to shooting JPEGS or TIFFS. The Image setting such as colour, WB and shapness have no effect. You control these in the software. It will also allow you to recover over/under exposed images to a greater or lesser degree. If you are serious about taking first class pictures you really need to be working in RAW. Ok it means you cannot just take the images out of the camera but it does give you a level of control and image recovery that we do not have with slide film.

If you are shooting JPEGS then the S2 is one of the best "out of the camera" solutions there is, especially for colour. I would certainly check what your WB is set to.

Sean

welshman2004 said:

Allen Mankin said:

smithim said:

welshman2004 said:

Manual says to leave colour and tone
to Org and sharpness Off.

Click to expand...

Are you using this in RAW mode or JPG? If RAW, which converter are
you using (LE? EX?)

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

All the pictures I've taken so far have been in jpg. What is the
converter and how does it work? Maybe this is the solution? Will it
simply convert a jpeg or raw file from the camera that had all its
settings off to a professional image? I have seen many images from
the S2 that appear first class. I would have thought a handheld
meter reading is handy for most work and absolutely essential for
the studio. I am obviously doing something very wrong. But the
point I'm making is that if I have 100 pictures that I want to pass
onto a client the last thing I want to do is spend time on the
Applemac making sure every image is as good as I can get it. And
what if my opinion of a decent image is not as good as a more
experienced/talented pc operator? When my slides come back from the
lab I know what to expect and I know beforehand that the quality
will be enough to satisfy my client (and me). I shall send a few
pictures next time. Thanks for your help - it is greatly
appreciated.

Click to expand...

SeanDoherty said:

RAW files are basically the raw data from the CCD in the camera
with no processing applied. If bought in the UK your camera will
have come with the RAW Converter LE software which is the next best
thing to useless. You will need to invest in either Photoshop CS
which has a pretty good (and fast) S2 RAW convertor or in Fuji's EX
convertor which retails for between £95 and £130. This is much
slower but does produce slighly higher quality results than CS (but
for many CS is just fine). Sound to me though you are after teh
image quality that EX can provide.

Shooting RAW (witha convertor other than LE) is a very different
business to shooting JPEGS or TIFFS. The Image setting such as
colour, WB and shapness have no effect. You control these in the
software. It will also allow you to recover over/under exposed
images to a greater or lesser degree. If you are serious about
taking first class pictures you really need to be working in RAW.
Ok it means you cannot just take the images out of the camera but
it does give you a level of control and image recovery that we do
not have with slide film.

If you are shooting JPEGS then the S2 is one of the best "out of
the camera" solutions there is, especially for colour. I would
certainly check what your WB is set to.

Sean

Click to expand...

cheers Sean that is appreciated - my WB is always set to auto. Is it worth doing a manual setting for the studio?

welshman2004 said:

All the pictures I've taken so far have been in jpg. What is the
converter and how does it work?

Click to expand...

It sounds like you come from a strong film background... Film is fairly simple to use and inflexible... Digital is quite different, and because it is so flexible it can work in a number of different ways for different people...

Exposure is quite critical.... It's similar to exposing slide film, but digital doesn't have the shoulders on the curve that film has, so it is essential that you avoid blowing the highlights (i.e. don't overexpose)... At the same time, you need the bulk of the histgram either in the middle or to the right, to get the best dynamic range....

Guides to getting digital exposure correct and reading histograms can be found at :-

http://photography.about.com/cs/digital/a/a030104.htm

and

http://luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/understanding-histograms.shtml

There are many ways of using the camera and software settings, including many pieces of software, but I'd consider four main approaches first....

1) JPG - the S2 gives class-leading out of the camera JPGs... If you want the simplest possible approach, with the smallest amount of post-processing, then set the camera to the settings you require and just use the JPG output... Obviously, if you set the colour to ORG, then it will seem very muted and dull, so I would suggest setting everything to STD first, getting decent pictures and only then experimenting... For example, you might like a Velvia appearance, so might prefer setting the colour to high instead... Most people do not consider JPG as suitable for quality work, but (in Fine mode) it's really very good... Certainly 18" x 12" prints from JPGs can be perfectly acceptable... Some people even claim that much bigger enlargements are feasible... If you want the quickest workflow and minimal post processing, then this it it... Some pros only use JPG, as it gives perfectly acceptable quality and much smaller file sizes (4.5Mb)

2) Using RAW mode and the LE converter - With this approach, you use the very cut-down LE converter provided in the UK to process RAW images into 8-bit TIFFs... I've compared a number of images at 100%, and although I'm quite prepared to accept that the RAW versions may be better, I personally can't see any significant differences for smaller prints sizes... Quite often the images have to be blown up to 2-400% to show the differences....The Raw file is 12Mb and the resultant TIFF is about 35Mb, so we're talking near 50Mb storage per image... I can't really see that there are many benefits in this approach, personally...

3) Using RAW mode and buying the EX converter - I recently bought the EX converter from amazon (£96) and find it very flexible. It allows you to produce 16-bit files (which may be useful if you have a suitable imaging package) but are not a lot of use with lower end 8-bit packages... More importantly, if allows you to change most of the main camera settings (including tone/exposure etc) after the picture has actually been taken... To a slide film user, it's like magic Consequently, if you want the highest possible quality plus the greatest flexibility then this is the way to do it... However, it means that each batch of pictures (or even each picture) has to be modified, before you even have a TIFF file to work on...

4) Using RAW mode and other converters - Adobe CS has a plug-in that handles S2 RAW files (supposedly excellent) and there are a number of other programs that can process RAW files with varying degrees of success... Some, like Bibble give you a better workflow than EX, but (IMHO) at the cost of some quality...

welshman2004 said:

I would have thought a handheld meter reading is handy for most work > and absolutely essential for the studio.

Click to expand...

I must admit, I can't see why a handheld meter shouldn't work... It's only a meter, after all, so I'd expect it to work in the same way as with film... However, the S2's meter isn't that bad, so if it's way out you could have a faulty sample... It's not that likely, though...

welshman2004 said:

I shall send a few pictures next time.

Click to expand...

That would be useful, certainly...

I used to be a firm 35mm slide user... From my limited tests in the six months that I've had the S2, I now consider the S2 to be so far ahead that I can't see a reason for using slides again... If you persevere, I'm sure that you will also be pleased...

ATB,

Ian

welshman2004 said:

cheers Sean that is appreciated - my WB is always set to auto. Is
it worth doing a manual setting for the studio?

Click to expand...

Basically yes.

If you tend to use more than one lens in the studio you should even consider having a custom profile for the two you use most. The biggest reason is that it will give you consistent results. This is especially the case if you are shooting the same model in varying clothing or against different backgrounds in the same session. In auto the camera uses the colour info it can see to find the setting. A model in a red dress one minute and a green one the next will have very different WB. The model's skin tone however is teh same but the camera cannot see that all it sees it lots of one colour one moment and something else teh next.

Note that this is one of the benefits of using RAW and EX or PS CS. You can create these profiles and apply them afterwards. Having a grey or white (or both card) is also useful. If I am taking a series of shots I even outside I always try to shoot a test card first as it speeds the whole WB process up massively.

have a search around this forum, you will find lots of very sound advice on issues such as WB. The move from film, especially slide to Digital is actually a big one. may people who are absolute masters of thier craft suddenly are dropped back to the bottom of the learning curve. It is steep and there is much that you can transfer. You just have to keep reminding yourself that this is not film. You have a sensor that can be made to behave as if it was film with variable chemistry and I think the one thing that gets most of us after a while is that unlike film you do not use a new sensistive surface for every frame you shoot. It gets dirty, and you have to clean it. Changing lenses on a DSLR should be done with a level of care that most SLR users woudl be benused by.

Have fiun with it. This is a camera that will give you staunning results, and let you do things you could just no do with film (well not that easily).

Sean

SeanDoherty said:

The move from film, especially slide
to Digital is actually a big one. may people who are absolute
masters of thier craft suddenly are dropped back to the bottom of
the learning curve. It is steep and there is much that you can
transfer.

Click to expand...

Very true... and a much under-rated point... It came as quite a shock to me to realise how little I knew...

But it's great fun

ATB,

Ian

Hi

I feel that images from most digital cameras need some degree of computer post-processing to bring out their best - if only something as simple as a slight adjustment of the Levels or contrast.

Most of my images are shot in studios and the S2 handles itself well.

I would recommend always using a flash meter to make life easier.

I would also recommend using a Grey Card to set a Custom White Balance for each shoot to ensure that the colours are more accurate than if you were using Auto White Balance. Follow the CWB procedure as laid out in the manual - have the model hold the Grey Card and fill the viewfinder with it to set the CWB.

RAW is acknowledged as giving better file output, but until you get used to the camera you might like to shoot in Fine JPEG - the files will produce stunning prints.

I can understand that if you're new to digital you have a big learning curve ahead of you - but you'll get there!

Best regards

Paul

--
Paul Jones
http://www.pauljones.org

Are you using any filters?

Pete

So much new and yes so much fun. I think I have never shot more than 4 rolls of ISO 800 or faster film ever. Now however with the S2 I am an ISO 1600 junkie. I just cannot get enough of it, I just wish I could change the speed on one of the thumb wheels without having to stop look at the top of the camera, rotate the selector. At a pinch I can probably change a back as quickly.

I think it is time to go and capture some melting snow.

Sean

smithim said:

SeanDoherty said:

The move from film, especially slide
to Digital is actually a big one. may people who are absolute
masters of thier craft suddenly are dropped back to the bottom of
the learning curve. It is steep and there is much that you can
transfer.

Click to expand...

Very true... and a much under-rated point... It came as quite a
shock to me to realise how little I knew...

But it's great fun

ATB,

Ian

Click to expand...

SeanDoherty said:

So much new and yes so much fun...

Click to expand...

My photography had stagnated for a number of years, now I'm really interested again... Still useless, but interested

ATB,

Ian

It appears that the S2 has induced some shock and awe in you. You will find this forum excellent for advice to the uninitiated. As a previous poster mentioned, Gerwyn Gibbs is a Taffy and would not be too far away for a visit and a pint at the local. All the advice given so far is valid. You haven't just bought a camera, you have bought into a new system of visualizing. The computer is an integral part of the process and allows you to get the most out of your images. If you have Photoshop, there are some excellent books on digital image manipulation. One I recommend is by Martin Evening, "Adobe Photoshop 7 for Photographers." He has a web site which shows his expertise and is well worth a visit.

For the record, I shoot Org; Org: Off and Fine JPG 4256. For studio images I use a Custom white balance. I put my stuff through Photoshop 7.0 and print "fine art" images through an Epson 1280. Other prints are made through a local lab which has a Fuji Frontier machine, producing prints that are almost indistinguishable from film, except that they are better (no grain, boyo)

Persevere with the camera and shoot the hell out of it. Come back often with questions, this forum is probably the best when it comes to advice and help - no one puts you down for not getting it right first time.

Dave Roberts
http://www.pbase.com/deewun