suzyshutterbug
Member
I have the 35mm Rebel NOT the Digital Rebel ...oops....
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Which should I go for, clear 6mPixel (D70) or 8mPixel (8700)
- Thread starter CSeet
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Uncle Frank
Forum Pro
The 5700/8700 does just fine on cloudy days...
... and even on night shots, provided you use a tripod or hold it very steady.
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Warm regards, Uncle Frank,
FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Contributing Editor, digicamhelp.com
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank/coolpix
mrhooks
Leading Member
Can one use the SB-80DX on the 8700 and control ALL of its features?
If it still works "as before", then the answer would be "no", in which case, it is still crippled. Less crippled perhaps, but still crippled. :/
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Jesse
(see profile for equipment)
wayne58604
Senior Member
You should be fine on cloudy days. If needed, you can set to ISO100, but I remember using Kodachrome II (ASA25 which is close to ISO25 in todays standards) during cloudy days (outdoor portraits are much nicer on overcast days) with a 35mm. I think what Stuart was trying to say was that you will have to accept either a larger aperture or slower shutter speeds at ISO50 than you would with a dslr for the same 'noise' level. I think you will be happy with the 8700 for 99% of the normal conditions. I would pick a dslr for night shots. My 8700 seems fine during evening hours and will do some tests when time permits. Oh, to get real good results from the dslrs, you should save in RAW and do some post processing (many images seem lifeless - the dslrs by default use very little in-camera processing).
Wayne
PS I generally grab the 5700 (now 8700) when walking out the door - I do not like to have to carry the dslr and accessories in the field (unless doing indoor or fixed locations).
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Canon Digital Rebel, Nikon 5700, Nikon 8700, Panasonic LC5
mrhooks
Leading Member
Interesting. Is the smaller aperture absolutely necessary? What would be the result if you shot two f-stops lower and without flash (but still at 1/2000)?
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Jesse
(see profile for equipment)
Depends on what you want to shoot on those cloudy days.If you want to shoot only scenic overlooks the 8700 will do fine. Even better with a tripod. The 8700 won't be as good as a dslr on action shots indoors or on early evening or dark cloudy days. That is where the higher ISO with less camera noise kicks in.
http://www.pbase.com/ken_5
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http://www.pbase.com/ken_5
I meant "action shots" on the early evening and cloudy days also.
I wish this forum had an edit option. At least for a few minutes.
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http://www.pbase.com/ken_5
Are you saying that only very advanced photographers need the advantages of a DSLR?
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http://www.pbase.com/ken_5
wayne58604
Senior Member
I have the Sigma 500 DG Super and it does work with the 8700. However, I have not tried all the features of the flash with the 8700 (the book is about as thick as the 8700 manual - and since the 5700 did not use all the modes, had no reason to read those portions).
The biggest advantage (for me) of the 8700 over the 5700 is the ability to use studio strobes (I have a speed-o-tron set), non-Nikon strobes (single contact hot shoe - I have a very small Panasonic flash I like for travel), and other hot shoe accessories (I use a very old ring light set which was hit-or-miss with the 5700 for product shots) without having to 'fool' the internal flash. I have not discovered whether or not the af assist of the external flash works with the 8700, or if the 8700 only uses it's own af assist, and have not tried 2nd curtain sync (high speed sync seems to work). There just is not enough time to try all this (only had the 8700 since yesterday morning - first one that the local shop got - arrived monday at their main store and was delivered to the one I shop at tuesday).
Perhaps Nikon will do a revised firmware for the 5700 which will let you turn off the internal flash while keeping the hot shoe active. May not be a big deal to lots of you, but for me, this is the main reason for getting the 8700.
Wayne
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Canon Digital Rebel, Nikon 5700, Nikon 8700, Panasonic LC5
Uncle Frank
Forum Pro
I was just speaking for myself, Ken. I don't see an advantage in a dslr for the type of shots I take, and I'm primarily interested in making photos, not owning slick gear. If I specialized in indoor sports, or nature photography, or stuff where a dslr would offer advantages, I'd buy one.
Let me re-phrase that. I'd ask Aunt Nancy for permission to buy one
.And if I was as talented as Yves, I'd buy one without permission, cause I'd make it pay for itself.
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Warm regards, Uncle Frank,
FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Contributing Editor, digicamhelp.com
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank/coolpix
wayne58604
Senior Member
I second that!
And you are right about action shots - I much rather use my DR for those - unless conditions do not favor a dslr (dust, rain, snow, etc). Oh, snow is a big one here (in Colorado) - soccer games can start in the sun and end with an inch or two of snow on the field!
Wayne
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Canon Digital Rebel, Nikon 5700, Nikon 8700, Panasonic LC5
Uncle Frank
Forum Pro
I need the tight aperture for extended DOF, cause I pre-focus in a general area, but don't know exactly where the little buggers will be when I shoot them. And I'd need more than 2 f-stops; I'm typically 4 f-stops underexposed without flash.
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Warm regards, Uncle Frank,
FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Contributing Editor, digicamhelp.com
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank/coolpix
mrhooks
Leading Member
Aah, but then wouldn't that mean that you would not need 1/2000 flash sync with a DSLR, since its AF is fast enough that you would not need to prefocus?
But I understand the application now. Thanks!
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Jesse
(see profile for equipment)
I believe most flashes to control the amount of light they emit by shortening the flash duration. Full flash duration i believe to be in the 1/4.000s and shorter area. Partial flash could be as short as 1/25.000s.
When setting the camera to high shutterspeeds and small apertures you make sure the foto without flash would be almost totally dark. Now with flash the flash duration will decide how long the subject is exposed.
Imo the stopping of the hummingbird movement is due to the short flash duration rather than the shutterspeed.
Wat i'm trying to say is that the shutterspeed usually doesn't decide how long the subject will be exposed, because the flash duration will be much shorter than the shortest shutterspeed the camera can synchronise at. Only with max. flash duration (1/2.000 - 1/4.000) the shutterspeed on the latest Coolpixes could be shorter than this (5700 at 1/4.000).
So a D70 at 1/500s should stop the hummingbird wings as well with a short flash duration like 1/10.000s, as long as the normal light doesn't show up in the foto.
Any misconceptions in my reasoning?
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Success
Ben
N i k o n 5 7 0 0 - S u n p a k P Z 5 0 0 0 A F
http://wouters-ba.ath.cx
Uncle Frank
Forum Pro
Only one. The duration of my SB-22s Speedlight is 1/1100 at full power. That probably typical for most of the speedlights.
I'm guessing that my speedlight is firing at full power, and that the 1/2000 shutter is clipping its illumination.
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Warm regards, Uncle Frank,
FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Contributing Editor, digicamhelp.com
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank/coolpix
Hi UF
just found this site during some googling around:
http://www.rpphoto.com/howto/hummer/humguide1.htm
Perhaps you already knew it. He has some ideas about flash versus shutterspeed stopping the motion.
Interesting read!
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Success
Ben
N i k o n 5 7 0 0 - S u n p a k P Z 5 0 0 0 A F
http://wouters-ba.ath.cx
Ron T
Senior Member
Does it mean that, on a D70, after taking a shot, I will have to wait longer (for the image to be processed) before I could take the next shot.
wayne58604
Senior Member
No, the image is saved to your hd where you apply filters/actions/etc to enhance the image - most dslr images look 'flat' compared to pro-sumer images, so many find it necessary to tweak them a little (sometimes the unsharp mask or tweak the contrast/brightness). However, with a pro-sumer, you might be tweaking the image too (noise for example).
In any event, you do have this option (which works better if the image was saved in RAW format) and it is relatively easy to do (as opposed to painting/touching up negatives or prints).
Wayne
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Canon Digital Rebel, Nikon 5700, Nikon 8700, Panasonic LC5
Uncle Frank
Forum Pro
Very interesting stuff, Ben. I wish I had known about it last summer, as it answers some questions that I had to work out through lengthy trial & error. But his conclusion and elaborate setup is shaped by his use of a dslr, which can't sync flash at high speeds. Since a Coolpix can synch at up to 1/2000, and effectively clip the time that the flash illuminates the hummer, a hobbyist can get decent results simply using the INTERNAL flash, as I've done in this shot.
Unless you're going to specialize in hummingbird shots, the Coolpix offers a simple and low cost (actually, NO cost) solution that yields pretty good results.
--
Warm regards, Uncle Frank,
FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Contributing Editor, digicamhelp.com
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank/coolpix
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