Flash exposure compensation (FEC) +2/3

Blue Breeze · Mar 1, 2004

I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

wilfredmrand · Mar 1, 2004

If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Blue Breeze said:
I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking
about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some
opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

Pseudonym · Mar 1, 2004

wilfred m rand said:
If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Well, ahem, not officially anyway:

http://revolution.cx/rcx/fecset.htm

wilfredmrand · Mar 2, 2004

I suppose I could use a friend's pc (I'm on a mac) and try this out - but I'm leery of hacking my firmware. (I keep emailing Canon and telling them the features I'd gladly pay for a la carte.) Since my flash needs are so limited, Sunpak got my $150 instead of Canon. Canon? Are you listening?
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Pseudonym said:
wilfred m rand said:

If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Click to expand...

Well, ahem, not officially anyway:

http://revolution.cx/rcx/fecset.htm

Loggedonnow · Mar 2, 2004

I used it and it does help. But to really solve the problem, you need to use and external flash and preferably one that has an Auto mode that bypasses E-TTL (Metz 54-3 hint hint). The problem lies with E-TTL. The Metz does E-TTL, Auto and Manual. It also has FEC. When I use the E-TTL mode, the pics are usually underexposed unless I also use FEC. When the flash is in Auto mode, pictures are usually much better exposed.

Blue Breeze said:
I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking
about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some
opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

Jarl Sandberg · Mar 2, 2004

FECSET changes the FEC setting via a published interface but does not hack the firmware.

It is a slight difference

--jalle

wilfred m rand said:
but I'm leery of hacking my firmware. (I keep emailing Canon and

telling them the features I'd gladly pay for a la carte.) Since my
flash needs are so limited, Sunpak got my $150 instead of Canon.
Canon? Are you listening?
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Pseudonym said:

wilfred m rand said:

If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Click to expand...

Well, ahem, not officially anyway:

http://revolution.cx/rcx/fecset.htm

Click to expand...

JThomasLambert · Mar 2, 2004

I was using +2/3 at all times with both the internal and 420EX. After buying the Ominbounce, however, I've reduced it to +1/3 and generally find the results pretty consistent.

Blue Breeze said:
I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking
about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some
opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

--

http://www.pbase.com/jthomaslambert

wilfredmrand · Mar 2, 2004

Looks like the code was lifted from another Canon camera and gets ported over. That said, anything short of an official Canon installer would be - technically - a hack. Technically? Anyway, I contacted a friend with a PC and since it IS Canon code, I think I'll give it a try.
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Jarl Sandberg said:
It is a slight difference

--jalle

wilfred m rand said:

but I'm leery of hacking my firmware. (I keep emailing Canon and

telling them the features I'd gladly pay for a la carte.) Since my
flash needs are so limited, Sunpak got my $150 instead of Canon.
Canon? Are you listening?
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Pseudonym said:

wilfred m rand said:

If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Click to expand...

Well, ahem, not officially anyway:

http://revolution.cx/rcx/fecset.htm

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Doug Kerr · Mar 2, 2004

Blue Breeze said:
I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I don't apply any FEC just as a general rule. I will certainly use it when conditions suggest (with my 550EX external flash, through which it can be set tactically).

Blue Breeze said:
I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

That can happen. You need to be thoughtful, however, about what you consider to be "underexposed". Canon's approach to metering (ambient and flash) places a high permium on avoiding the clipping of highlight detail. As a result, often the exposures made by Canon cameras don't seem to be as "bright" when viewed as those from other cameras.

There are really two criteria for "underexposure", the first being rather absolute, the seciond more subjective:

1. Have we lost any shadow detail?

2. Could we have used a greater exposure and still not have clipped any (significant) highlight detail.

Blue Breeze said:
Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up?

Well, all the exposures were greater, and the exposure results (what you can see in the image) were brighter. The incidence of overexposure was greater.

Best regards,

Doug

Doug Kerr · Mar 2, 2004

Wilfred,

wilfred m rand said:
If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Not quite so. The internal FEC setting of the 300D can be set over the USB link from various camera support software packages.

This is of course not very handy for tactical use.

Best regards,

Doug

RATPhoto · Mar 2, 2004

My advice is to learn how to use Flash Exposure Lock correctly and then use it with a gray, white and black card. After that you should know whether your camera is calibrated correctly or not. My internal flash and my Sigma EF-500 DG Super require +1 (unless using the Stofen Omnibounce with the Sigma).

--
If you are a new user chances are good your question is answered in the FAQ at:
http://www.marius.org/eos300dfaq.php

For a gallery of my photographs, see:
http://www.pbase.com/ratphoto

See my profile for my equipment

Blue60407 · Mar 2, 2004

Unless you are very good, the automatic mode will provide more consistent good lighting. (Assuming most are as inept at ettl as I am).

Loggedonnow said:
Blue Breeze said:

I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking
about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some
opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

Click to expand...

--
Blue
http://www.pbase.com/image/7450272

wilfredmrand · Mar 2, 2004

Now that I've tried it, one can see it's not real FEC.....not if one has to hook their DR up to a PC to everytime one wants to change the setting. A Canon FEC would be adjustable on the camera. FECset +2/3 does help with the onboard flash, certainly, but I hope it doesn't interfere with my Sunpak, which works much better.
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Jarl Sandberg said:
It is a slight difference

--jalle

wilfred m rand said:

but I'm leery of hacking my firmware. (I keep emailing Canon and

telling them the features I'd gladly pay for a la carte.) Since my
flash needs are so limited, Sunpak got my $150 instead of Canon.
Canon? Are you listening?
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Pseudonym said:

wilfred m rand said:

If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Click to expand...

Well, ahem, not officially anyway:

http://revolution.cx/rcx/fecset.htm

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Doug Kerr · Mar 2, 2004

wilfred,

Not sure what the definition of a hack is! I've always taken it to mean an ad hoc modification of some software. (Or a portable clock to carry chronograph time around a vessel. Or an inept locksmith.) But whatever!

wilfred m rand said:
Now that I've tried it, one can see it's not real FEC.....not if
one has to hook their DR up to a PC to everytime one wants to
change the setting. A Canon FEC would be adjustable on the camera.

The one in the 300D isn't. It's real though, and present (if not accessible) without any "hacking", and created by Canon. Every 300D has it.

wilfredmrand said:
FECset +2/3 does help with the onboard flash, certainly, but I
hope it doesn't interfere with my Sunpak, which works much better.

It won't interfere with your Sunpak if you keep it (the camera FEC) set to 0.

If the Sunpak works in this regard like the Canon 550EX, if you have a non-zero value (such as +2/3) set in the camera, you will not be able to get "0" by setting the flash FEC to "0". (only a non-zero value in the flash overrides a non-zero value set in the camera). You can get any other value (in the range to wehich the flash can be set.)

Best regards,

Doug

timnelsonic · Mar 2, 2004

I find that +1/3 is a pretty good all-around setting for the internal flash. Still a little dark at times, but at +2/3 I'd get an occassional picture that was too blown out. It's always easy to do a little post-production lightening, but once you blow out the highlights, you're done. I've never had anything overexposed at +1/3.
-Tim

Blue Breeze said:
I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking
about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some
opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

wilfredmrand · Mar 3, 2004

That's the implication from his own words on his own website.

Definition of a hack? From webopedia.com:

(v) 1. To write program code. 2. To modify a program, often in an unauthorized manner, by changing the code itself.

1. Code that is written to provide extra functionality to an existing program. 2. An inelegant and usually temporary solution to a problem.

If Canon ever gets around to officially unlocking this feature, we won't have to run to a PC every time we want to change the FEC setting. (This is a real inconvenience for Mac users.) You'll be able to dial in the setting from a menu on the back of the camera body.

As to the Sunpak 5000 issue, the +2/3 FEC setting doesn't seem to interfere with the way I personally use the flash, which is to manually dial in the flash power setting just like I would in a studio setting. I just dial in a new value.

(On-camera flash is such a brutal way to illuminate a scene. The solution is a chip that will give us a noise-free ISO 6400 or 12800. Will we see this in out photographic lifetime?)
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Norbu · Mar 3, 2004

Pseudonym said:
wilfred m rand said:

If you want to use flash AND a DR, you need to buy a flash like
Canon 550EX, Sunpak 5000AF or Sigma 500DG Super. Otherwise there is
now way to adjust flash exposure on the DR.

Click to expand...

Well, ahem, not officially anyway:

http://revolution.cx/rcx/fecset.htm

I own a 420EX. For what I would have to spend to sell it and replace it with the 550EX, which by the way is a monster, I could buy the 10D instead and have FEC. Or, since I still can, I could return my DR, sell my Canon lens and the 420EX and wait for the Nixon D70. I just know that in "05 Canon will release a new DR with FEC. I remember that they did this undumbing dance with the analog Rebel as well.

Doug Kerr · Mar 3, 2004

wilfred,

What author are you speaking about?

What "it" is a hack? The process of setting the FEC in the camera with one of several camera control software packages?

I presume that you are referring to noun definition 2 from the webopedia definition. That's probably valid here.

Of course, some would say that buying a 300D to shoot a hockey game when they really want to use a 1D to do it is a hack under that definition!

Best regards,

Doug

Norbu · Mar 3, 2004

OK, here's a question, and perhaps I should make it a new thread, but I think it applies. I was taking a shot of two friends playing their instruments and each one was on either side of a lamp. I used a 420EX flash and of course it read the lamp and the subjects were underexposed. In photoshop when I lightened the shot to a proper exposure for the subjects the lamp in the picture got too bright. I'm new to the DR and just learning flash photography, could I have read the subjects and did a flash lock of some sort?

timnelsonic said:
Blue Breeze said:

I'm just wondering if any Rebel/300D owners always use FEC +2/3 (or
lesser) everytime you use the onboard flash when taking low light
photos.

I have had my Rebel for 2 months now and found some flash pics to
be a little dark or underexposed.

Did you see a difference when FEC was bumped up? I'm thinking
about trying the software and checking it out myself, but need some
opinions first.

Thanks.

--
Former Kodak 280 user.
Current Olympus d-40 owner
Panasonic FZ10 owner/user/keeper
Canon Rebel newbie

Click to expand...

wilfredmrand · Mar 3, 2004

Doug Kerr said:
What author are you speaking about?

The guy who wrote FECset.

Doug Kerr said:
Of course, some would say that buying a 300D to shoot a hockey game
when they really want to use a 1D to do it is a hack under that
definition!

Too true. And sometimes sportswriters are considered hacks, too. Heck, I've been called a hack! =0)) -will.
--
Wilfred M Rand
http://www.pbase.com/wilfredmrand/

Flash exposure compensation (FEC) +2/3

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