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VOTE HERE to WAKE UP Canon - Part II

Go to last post
And vote "yes" instead of wasting valuable message number to counter-argue... :)

110%
james-montana said:
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!
48 says "Yes" so far...
Click to expand...
Out of 150 posts, that's not a universal endorsement of your view.

Continuing from part 1:
110percent said:
Enough is enough. If you want to pick a fight, go somewhere
else...
Click to expand...
I wanted you to address the counter-view that I and several others put. It weakens your argument when you only respond to people agreeng with you. I made some very valid and carefully thought out points, but you failed to address a single one.
110percent said:
I don't want to argue with you any more... You should work
for Canon's marketing department because you sounded just
like one...As a user of 300D, instead of fighting for more
features for your follow photographer, you are willing to
justify these crippings by saying it's a market strategy...
Click to expand...
I'm just a satsified user that has issue with you adopting the tone of representing the views of all Rebel users. You don't and I'd like that known. I never once suggested it was marketing strategy, but marketing reality. Products are developed and evolve over time with just about every product on the shelves, from chocloate biscuits and soap powder to cars and computers. It's a fact, new developments will be anounced and released at regular intervals and competitors will release new products that gives the ones on the shelves already a beating. Every piece of technology has built in obsolescence. That's all good for us, the consumer, as long as manufacturers are competing and each needs the edge - they will release increasingly improved products.

It's if they had no healthy competition that we'd never see improvements. Far from feeling that I'm missing out on new features, I rejoice that they're still being developed and when I'm ready to upgrade in 12 or 18 months, the products available then will be stunningly well featured. The product you have doesn't regress because new products come out, only your perception of it and satisfaction with it does. The point where you're disatisfied is the time to move on - sounds ike that's where you're at now. But I'm not. I don't use half the features it has now, I have no particular desire to increase the ones I have access to. If I did, I would have bought the 10D, I chose not to.

I started taking pictures with a film SLR about 30 years ago and what I carry in my head, my eye and my ability to judge a scene and decide how I want to take it, doesn't change with firmware upgrades or feature lists. I use my eye and brain far more than I use the meter.
110percent said:
And let me ask you if there is a firmware upgrade, will you
choose not to install that firmware upgrade?
Click to expand...
Probably. For me, it isn't broken, so I see no reason to fix it - in fact it could even make things worse and have an impact on the way some features work that I like - an improvement for one peson might be a backward step for another. I would be interested in a switchable AI servo and an improvement to the LCD brightness, but none of the ones you listed interest me.
110percent said:
If you prefer to be left behind by Canon and looking at a
brand new 300D with all features next to a D70 on the
shelves, then so be it...
Click to expand...
I've not been left behind by Canon. I bought a camera on the 4th October 2003 to fulfil certain functions. It did that the day I bought it and it still does, probably even better than it did then, as I now understand it better. I am well aware that in the near future Canon and other manufacturers will bring out shiny new models with increased feature sets. It always was that way, it will continue to be so. At such time in the future as the 300D doesn't fulfil me, I'll repeat the process and choose the best of those on the market at the time, in my price range. And thus it will continue in perpetuae.
110percent said:
For others, we are willing to fight on!!!
Click to expand...
This is where I have the problem - change the word 'we' to 'I' and I might leave you alone. You do not speak for me.

--
So many photos, so little time . . .
http://www.peekaboo.me.uk - general portfolio
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk - live music photos
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk/lowlight.html - available light live music tutorial
http://imageevent.com/boophotos/ - holding page for recent images
 
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Well, I will buy a D70 now...

Look, I didn't post this petition before D70 comes out because of
people like you will say go and get a 10D. But now D70 is out, your
point of getting is no longer valid...
Click to expand...
The D70 is not out yet - and it's been half a year or so since the 300D was released - a long time in DSLR evolution. With time cameras do get cheaper and more full-featured. Do you demand a free upgrade from your computer manufacturer because your model is no longer latest and greatest the year after your bought it? Sure, I would love to get the additional features on the Rebel, would be glad if Canon provides an upgrade, but don't feel we are in a position to demand it. By and large, we all knew what we were buying.
--
Misha
 
Why is it invalid? The 10D had the features you wanted, yet you bought the 300D. Period. There is no story after that. Canon didn't force you to buy it, and it's still the only sub 1k dSLR until the D70 actually ships.

Now months later Nikon has a body with the features you want at a reduced price, but you had to KNOW that would happen. But how does that make Canon responsible for updating your 300D to match it? To help you validate your choice to friends?

Your feature chase will never end. My advice is to save a few bucks, get that 300D on Ebay and wait to see what Canon has planned for the 10D. They never let Nikon go unchecked, especially in the digital world.

-James
110percent said:
Look, I didn't post this petition before D70 comes out because of
people like you will say go and get a 10D. But now D70 is out, your
point of getting is no longer valid...

110%
Chris Dodkin said:
I assume you actually read the spec on your camera before you
bought it?

The 300D is an awesome camera for the money.

You can choose to buy a 300D or spend more for more features and
get a 10D

Buying the cheapest DSLR and then moaning to Canon is pointless and
stupid.

That's why Canon have a range of cameras, so that you can choose
how much you want to spend, and which features you want/need.

Perhaps if I buy a Honda Civic, and then complain enough, Honda
would put their F1 engine in my car for free...

Yeah right!

Just learn how to use your camera, and work WITH it's features.

Chris.
--
http://www.1D-images.com
[email protected]
Mac G4/iMac/iBook/iPod
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Okay, switcahable AI-Servo is listed on my list and it's certainly firmware upgradable...

Case closed...

And "we" means the 48... no correction it's now 52! There are certainly more people says "yes" than "no"...

Disclaimer

From now on, when I say we, the we excludes Boo who don't want a firmware upgrade but if there's one, he will PROBABLY take it...

110%
Boo said:
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!
48 says "Yes" so far...
Click to expand...
Out of 150 posts, that's not a universal endorsement of your view.

Continuing from part 1:
110percent said:
Enough is enough. If you want to pick a fight, go somewhere
else...
Click to expand...
I wanted you to address the counter-view that I and several others
put. It weakens your argument when you only respond to people
agreeng with you. I made some very valid and carefully thought out
points, but you failed to address a single one.
Boo said:
I don't want to argue with you any more... You should work
for Canon's marketing department because you sounded just
like one...As a user of 300D, instead of fighting for more
features for your follow photographer, you are willing to
justify these crippings by saying it's a market strategy...
Click to expand...
I'm just a satsified user that has issue with you adopting the tone
of representing the views of all Rebel users. You don't and I'd
like that known. I never once suggested it was marketing strategy,
but marketing reality. Products are developed and evolve over time
with just about every product on the shelves, from chocloate
biscuits and soap powder to cars and computers. It's a fact, new
developments will be anounced and released at regular intervals and
competitors will release new products that gives the ones on the
shelves already a beating. Every piece of technology has built in
obsolescence. That's all good for us, the consumer, as long as
manufacturers are competing and each needs the edge - they will
release increasingly improved products.

It's if they had no healthy competition that we'd never see
improvements. Far from feeling that I'm missing out on new
features, I rejoice that they're still being developed and when I'm
ready to upgrade in 12 or 18 months, the products available then
will be stunningly well featured. The product you have doesn't
regress because new products come out, only your perception of it
and satisfaction with it does. The point where you're disatisfied
is the time to move on - sounds ike that's where you're at now.
But I'm not. I don't use half the features it has now, I have no
particular desire to increase the ones I have access to. If I did,
I would have bought the 10D, I chose not to.

I started taking pictures with a film SLR about 30 years ago and
what I carry in my head, my eye and my ability to judge a scene and
decide how I want to take it, doesn't change with firmware upgrades
or feature lists. I use my eye and brain far more than I use the
meter.
Boo said:
And let me ask you if there is a firmware upgrade, will you
choose not to install that firmware upgrade?
Click to expand...
Probably. For me, it isn't broken, so I see no reason to fix it -
in fact it could even make things worse and have an impact on the
way some features work that I like - an improvement for one peson
might be a backward step for another. I would be interested in a
switchable AI servo and an improvement to the LCD brightness, but
none of the ones you listed interest me.
Boo said:
If you prefer to be left behind by Canon and looking at a
brand new 300D with all features next to a D70 on the
shelves, then so be it...
Click to expand...
I've not been left behind by Canon. I bought a camera on the 4th
October 2003 to fulfil certain functions. It did that the day I
bought it and it still does, probably even better than it did then,
as I now understand it better. I am well aware that in the near
future Canon and other manufacturers will bring out shiny new
models with increased feature sets. It always was that way, it
will continue to be so. At such time in the future as the 300D
doesn't fulfil me, I'll repeat the process and choose the best of
those on the market at the time, in my price range. And thus it
will continue in perpetuae.
Boo said:
For others, we are willing to fight on!!!
Click to expand...
This is where I have the problem - change the word 'we' to 'I' and
I might leave you alone. You do not speak for me.

--
So many photos, so little time . . .
http://www.peekaboo.me.uk - general portfolio
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk - live music photos
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk/lowlight.html - available light live
music tutorial
http://imageevent.com/boophotos/ - holding page for recent images
Click to expand...
 
You shou
110percent said:
110%
james-montana said:
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
..with newbies! Caveat emptor we have your money goodbye? I think that Canon should do a firmware update for free, fixing some basic stuff at the very least. This will also help resale/ trade in value. Cuz everyone knows the present Rebel is so crippled. Which is even more obvious now that it's Nikon competitor has nicer / more features that can really help you out and make picture taking less of a gamble.

Stan
 
Can you guys start a new thread under the heading "why people asking for more features from 300D should buy a 10D instead"??

This thread is for people who want to vote "Yes" for a firmware upgrade...

Show osme curtesy...

110%
Chris Dodkin said:
I assume you actually read the spec on your camera before you
bought it?

The 300D is an awesome camera for the money.

You can choose to buy a 300D or spend more for more features and
get a 10D

Buying the cheapest DSLR and then moaning to Canon is pointless and
stupid.

That's why Canon have a range of cameras, so that you can choose
how much you want to spend, and which features you want/need.

Perhaps if I buy a Honda Civic, and then complain enough, Honda
would put their F1 engine in my car for free...

Yeah right!

Just learn how to use your camera, and work WITH it's features.

Chris.
--
http://www.1D-images.com
[email protected]
Mac G4/iMac/iBook/iPod
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Well, there is two guys said no (one is the owner of a 10D not 300D).

Around 6-10 argue that we shouldn't ask Canon for one but I am
pretty sure they will say "Yes" if Canon asks them if they want a
firmware upgrade or not. :)
Click to expand...
My impression was that their argument wasn't if they would or wouldn't install the proposed (or any other) firmware upgrade made available by Canon but the validity or reason behind demanding an upgrade. But of course, that's only me.
110percent said:
And I am pretty sure I will be called a 12-year-old rich kid again
for making that kind of comment...

But, I just couldn't stop myself from commenting on the hypocrisy...

110%
Dan FR said:
110percent said:
48 says "Yes" so far...
Click to expand...
Out of curiosity, and to be completely fair, of course... 48 say
"Yes" and, how many said "No"?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Case closed...
Click to expand...
You still haven't addressed any of my points and when you make veiled references to them in other posts, you don't even do so accurately. I sincerely hope that you can argue your case and analyse data with more skill in your medical career than you have here, or people will die.
110percent said:
And "we" means the 48... no correction it's now 52! There are
certainly more people says "yes" than "no"...
Click to expand...
Out of the tens of thousands of Rebels out in the field in use, it's but a drop in the ocean.
110percent said:
Disclaimer
From now on, when I say we, the we excludes Boo who don't want a
firmware upgrade but if there's one, he will PROBABLY take it...
Click to expand...
Where do you get off on second guessing what I'm thinking, feel or am likely to do - you really do have issues with what might happen in the future. And I'm a she, not a he and I already said that I probably wouldn't upgrade (so you're now calling me a liar as well) - unless there was an option to select specific features, it may well make the camera function worse than it is now. I'll happily continue to use the camera, which I'm perfectly happy with, as it is.

--
So many photos, so little time . . .
http://www.peekaboo.me.uk - general portfolio
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk - live music photos
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk/lowlight.html - available light live music tutorial
http://imageevent.com/boophotos/ - holding page for recent images
 
I have owned only Canon products since I purchased my first SLR 25 years ago. Canon was the first to introduce a sub $1000.00 DSLR but it looks like Nikon has followed with a more "feature rich" model in the same price range. Canon can regain the upper hand and retain it's loyal customers by releasing a firmware upgrade to the 300d that would make it comparable to the new Nikon.
 
... that way we can turn our ugly silver camera into a beautiful black body!!
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
 
110percent said:
Wow! Thanks guys!

Within 7 hours of time, the thread reaches the max number of
messages...

48 says "Yes" so far...

Keep them coming...

This is the old message:

Okay now the D70 is out, I think it IS time for Canon to finally
wake up
from its 3-months of business dream-run and start to put consumer
first rather than trying to short-change us.

I urge all the 300D / DR users to vote 'Yes' on the proposal to
un-cripple the 300D / DR with a free firmware upgrade. Namely, give
us

1. FEC control
2. Selectable metering mode - including spot metering if possible
3. Selectable focus mode
4. E-TTL II (with distance exposure)

Also, we demand an explanation of the future of EF-S lens (since
1Ds Mk II is not EF-S compatible), is there going to be a lens
similar to Nikon 17-70mm in the near future?

Just hit reply and say "Yes" on the subject heading.

Come on, guys! Let's send a wake-up call to Canon because it seems
like Nikon is brewing coffee already!

110% getting afraid to recommend 300D to friends and getting tired
to defend my purchase decision
Click to expand...
--
Canon Powershot S45, Canon EOS 300D
 
Boo said:
110percent said:
Case closed...
Click to expand...
You still haven't addressed any of my points and when you make
veiled references to them in other posts, you don't even do so
accurately. I sincerely hope that you can argue your case and
analyse data with more skill in your medical career than you have
here, or people will die.
Click to expand...
Great, yet another personal attack... When will you stop?

I have made myself crystal clear on the issue with my own thoughts along with many others (read the good points section).
Boo said:
Boo said:
And "we" means the 48... no correction it's now 52! There are
certainly more people says "yes" than "no"...
Click to expand...
Out of the tens of thousands of Rebels out in the field in use,
it's but a drop in the ocean.
Click to expand...
Yes, and I consider it as a good start. One by one, this petition hopefully, will involve those tens of thousands...

There's more work to be done!

And you got me even more excited now. A firmware upgrade (read disclaimer II) can potentially bring value to tens of thousands of people's photographic life not just to yours and mine...
Boo said:
Boo said:
Disclaimer
From now on, when I say we, the we excludes Boo who don't want a
firmware upgrade but if there's one, he will PROBABLY take it...
Click to expand...
Where do you get off on second guessing what I'm thinking, feel or
am likely to do - you really do have issues with what might
happen in the future. And I'm a she, not a he and I already said
that I probably wouldn't upgrade (so you're now calling me a liar
as well) - unless there was an option to select specific features,
it may well make the camera function worse than it is now. I'll
happily continue to use the camera, which I'm perfectly happy with,
as it is.
Click to expand...
Gee, you are hard to please, aren't you? You said I misrepresented you with my usage of the word "we" so I've made a disclaimer. No I won't call you a liar but you did say 'probably.' Why the change?

Disclaimer II

From now, a firmware upgrade refers to FEC control, selectable focus / metering mode, E-TTL II (if hardware permits), 2nd curtain sync, mirror lock up...

110%

ps. curious, are you going to sue all the politicians who use the word "we" to voice their policies on TV from now on?
Boo said:
--
So many photos, so little time . . .
http://www.peekaboo.me.uk - general portfolio
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk - live music photos
http://www.boo-photos.co.uk/lowlight.html - available light live
music tutorial
http://imageevent.com/boophotos/ - holding page for recent images
Click to expand...
 
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