Canon i960 printer - any color problems?

shanstu70 · Dec 29, 2003

I'm still researching the subject, but the search engine is down. I just got the i960 for Christmas, and was shocked when what came out of the printer didn't look even close to the colors on my monitor - very yellow cast, and the reds are a little too dark.

Anybody here have any solutions to this? It's been suggested on the Printing forum that I've got the wrong profile driver, but I don't know where to find the right one. I'm using Ilford Gallerie smooth gloss paper, the i960, and I've got a Viewsonic Viewpanel VG150 flat LCD monitor.

I tried shooting in RGB from the camera and setting Adobe RGB 1998 on the printer, and it matches, but I don't know how it will "tweak" in photoshop. I don't like it straight out of the camera at all. Maybe RAW would help, then converting to RGB if I need/want to post process. I was under the impression that anything except all parameters set to zero would be limit what you can do post process. Still trying...

Thanks in advance for your suggestions...

--
Shannon

joereich3 · Dec 29, 2003

The only thing I found was that the pics werer a little darker than on the monitor...but not as bad as printing at Ritz. I also bumped up the blue 5 ticks. Otherwise, I'm very pleased.

mike bustad · Dec 29, 2003

I have had the i950, i960 now along with the i900D and they are very accurate. Have you tried Canon paper? I use Canon or Epson photo paper. I have tried Kodak but it was awful. Are you sure you have the ink cartidges in their right spot? The other option is take it back and try another.

Tanglefoot47

DogsPlayingPoker · Dec 29, 2003

I have the i850 - I am VERY impressed with how it prints. Basically the same as the i860 which is very close to the i960 (which should do a better job on pics than the 850 or 860).

shanstu70 said:
I'm still researching the subject, but the search engine is down.
I just got the i960 for Christmas, and was shocked when what came
out of the printer didn't look even close to the colors on my
monitor - very yellow cast, and the reds are a little too dark.

Anybody here have any solutions to this? It's been suggested on
the Printing forum that I've got the wrong profile driver, but I
don't know where to find the right one. I'm using Ilford Gallerie
smooth gloss paper, the i960, and I've got a Viewsonic Viewpanel
VG150 flat LCD monitor.

I tried shooting in RGB from the camera and setting Adobe RGB 1998
on the printer, and it matches, but I don't know how it will
"tweak" in photoshop. I don't like it straight out of the camera
at all. Maybe RAW would help, then converting to RGB if I
need/want to post process. I was under the impression that
anything except all parameters set to zero would be limit what you
can do post process. Still trying...

Thanks in advance for your suggestions...

--
Shannon

dLESKO · Dec 29, 2003

That post was from me...

I don't use Ilford paper but I hear it needs yellow turned down a lot. You can also increase C and M to balance out the yellow.

What you want to do is the following.

Go to Start/Settings/Printers and Faxes and select the Canon. In Print manager, choose printer/properties. Under the Color Management Tab, elect the CNBJPRN2 profile and remove it as an associated profile and APPLY the setting (You can leave it automatic now)

Under General/Printer Preferences bring up the printer properties page. Under the Main/Color Adjustments section, click on Manual and press the SET button.

UNCHECK the "Enable ICM" button! If you don't, the windows driver will pick one based on the paper type you choose and that means you'll be profiling the output from Photoshop which may already be using the profile you want! This is the confusing step I believe...

Now, in the settings - Choose Print type "Normal" Brightness Normal. Slide the yellow slider to -25, Black to -3 and Inensity to +3. You'll pay with these later and remember that each application can remember these settings so they change from the defaults you defined in the Windows Printer Properties page.

Now, in photoshop, choose Print with Preview and then select the "Show More Options" radio button.

In the drop down, pick "Color Management". Source document should be sRGB or Adobe 1998 depending on what you selected on the camera. Print Space you select the Canon profile that best matches the Iford, or, you choose a profile for your paper (if you have one). I am using the Canon SP1 for Photo Glossy Plus paper. (Epson Premium Photo Luster is better!)

Intent is "Perceptual" and check off the "Use Black Pont Compensation".

Click "Done"

Now go to "Print" and fire off a test print. It should be much less yellow.

Now, it is up to you to click on the print properties and adjust the CYM BI sliders to get a print that is satisfying to you.

You can also do this all in the Windows Print Driver Properties and choose to NOT have Photoshop handle the profiles.

I have found that letting different applications use the same profile to print results in different results!

I suggest to pick one printing method and stick to it

Good luck!

dlesko

shanstu70 said:
I'm still researching the subject, but the search engine is down.
I just got the i960 for Christmas, and was shocked when what came
out of the printer didn't look even close to the colors on my
monitor - very yellow cast, and the reds are a little too dark.

Anybody here have any solutions to this? It's been suggested on
the Printing forum that I've got the wrong profile driver, but I
don't know where to find the right one. I'm using Ilford Gallerie
smooth gloss paper, the i960, and I've got a Viewsonic Viewpanel
VG150 flat LCD monitor.

I tried shooting in RGB from the camera and setting Adobe RGB 1998
on the printer, and it matches, but I don't know how it will
"tweak" in photoshop. I don't like it straight out of the camera
at all. Maybe RAW would help, then converting to RGB if I
need/want to post process. I was under the impression that
anything except all parameters set to zero would be limit what you
can do post process. Still trying...

Thanks in advance for your suggestions...

--
Shannon

Photo Newbe · Dec 29, 2003

dLESKO said:
I don't use Ilford paper but I hear it needs yellow turned down a
lot. You can also increase C and M to balance out the yellow.

What you want to do is the following.

Go to Start/Settings/Printers and Faxes and select the Canon. In
Print manager, choose printer/properties. Under the Color
Management Tab, elect the CNBJPRN2 profile and remove it as an
associated profile and APPLY the setting (You can leave it
automatic now)

Under General/Printer Preferences bring up the printer properties
page. Under the Main/Color Adjustments section, click on Manual and
press the SET button.

UNCHECK the "Enable ICM" button! If you don't, the windows driver
will pick one based on the paper type you choose and that means
you'll be profiling the output from Photoshop which may already be
using the profile you want! This is the confusing step I believe...

Now, in the settings - Choose Print type "Normal" Brightness
Normal. Slide the yellow slider to -25, Black to -3 and Inensity
to +3. You'll pay with these later and remember that each
application can remember these settings so they change from the
defaults you defined in the Windows Printer Properties page.

Now, in photoshop, choose Print with Preview and then select the
"Show More Options" radio button.

In the drop down, pick "Color Management". Source document should
be sRGB or Adobe 1998 depending on what you selected on the camera.
Print Space you select the Canon profile that best matches the
Iford, or, you choose a profile for your paper (if you have one). I
am using the Canon SP1 for Photo Glossy Plus paper. (Epson Premium
Photo Luster is better!)

Intent is "Perceptual" and check off the "Use Black Pont
Compensation".

Click "Done"

Now go to "Print" and fire off a test print. It should be much less
yellow.

Now, it is up to you to click on the print properties and adjust
the CYM BI sliders to get a print that is satisfying to you.

You can also do this all in the Windows Print Driver Properties and
choose to NOT have Photoshop handle the profiles.

I have found that letting different applications use the same
profile to print results in different results!

I suggest to pick one printing method and stick to it

Good luck!

dlesko

shanstu70 said:

I'm still researching the subject, but the search engine is down.
I just got the i960 for Christmas, and was shocked when what came
out of the printer didn't look even close to the colors on my
monitor - very yellow cast, and the reds are a little too dark.

Anybody here have any solutions to this? It's been suggested on
the Printing forum that I've got the wrong profile driver, but I
don't know where to find the right one. I'm using Ilford Gallerie
smooth gloss paper, the i960, and I've got a Viewsonic Viewpanel
VG150 flat LCD monitor.

I tried shooting in RGB from the camera and setting Adobe RGB 1998
on the printer, and it matches, but I don't know how it will
"tweak" in photoshop. I don't like it straight out of the camera
at all. Maybe RAW would help, then converting to RGB if I
need/want to post process. I was under the impression that
anything except all parameters set to zero would be limit what you
can do post process. Still trying...

Thanks in advance for your suggestions...

--
Shannon

Click to expand...

canonfodder191222 · Dec 29, 2003

joereich3 said:
The only thing I found was that the pics werer a little darker than
on the monitor...but not as bad as printing at Ritz. I also bumped
up the blue 5 ticks. Otherwise, I'm very pleased.

Hi there,

I've got the older s800 and s820,and I always seem to get slightly darker pictures printed than displayed on the monitor, I presume it's because one is reflective light and one is transmitted light. Sometimes I add a little brightness before printing to try to overcome this.

About adding blue, I take a lot of pictures of our two miniature dachsunds that have black and tan coats, the black always shines slightly blue and it shows on the monitor like that. However when I print, the bluish sheen always seems to come out like reflected silver/white. So at the moment I have upped the cyan to plus 20 and the yellow to minus 20 and things are slightly better on the prints.

I think I shall have to fiddle about a bit more yet.

The Ilford paper does give excellent results and the price is right too.

Regards.
.

Neil Walker · Dec 29, 2003

Don't know who made them or how but they are for the Ilford Classic Gloss and Classic Pearl papers:

http://www.alexphotos.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownload&cid=3

I have the i960 and have achieved very nice results with the pearl paper. Haven't tried the gloss yet. And my monitor isn't properly calibrated, just the half-a* ed gamma correction with the Adobe tool.

Settings I used:

print from PS, choose the correct Ilford profile, black point compensation and relative colormetric intent.
In Canon driver settings, make sure all colour adjustments are off (set to 0), Colour management is OFF (I know it's counter-intuitive, but turn it off in the printer properties..PS is handling the colour management for you), print type=none (NOT photo!) paper type=Photo paper pro, quality=fine, halftoning=diffusion.

Cheers,

Neil

shanstu70 said:
I'm still researching the subject, but the search engine is down.
I just got the i960 for Christmas, and was shocked when what came
out of the printer didn't look even close to the colors on my
monitor - very yellow cast, and the reds are a little too dark.

Anybody here have any solutions to this? It's been suggested on
the Printing forum that I've got the wrong profile driver, but I
don't know where to find the right one. I'm using Ilford Gallerie
smooth gloss paper, the i960, and I've got a Viewsonic Viewpanel
VG150 flat LCD monitor.

I tried shooting in RGB from the camera and setting Adobe RGB 1998
on the printer, and it matches, but I don't know how it will
"tweak" in photoshop. I don't like it straight out of the camera
at all. Maybe RAW would help, then converting to RGB if I
need/want to post process. I was under the impression that
anything except all parameters set to zero would be limit what you
can do post process. Still trying...

Thanks in advance for your suggestions...

--
Shannon

Don Jagoe · Dec 29, 2003

With my S900 I've found you have to watch the ink tanks scupulously. If one runs dry (or even low), the whole photo tone balance goes nuts. And as someone previously mentioned, be very careful the right tank is in the right slot. I once had Cyan in the Photo Cyan slot and couldn't figure out what was wrong...duh. Fixed it immediately. Also, you will be amazed how much the black cartridge is used/matters.

Anyway, just a thought, but I always look at the obvious first.

drcannon · Dec 29, 2003

Paper brand/finish and printer settings all have a profound effect on the final print. I use a Canon s900 and stick to Epson photo paper. However, I've recently been using Office Depot's Premium High Gloss Photo Paper with excellent results at the Glossy Photo Paper setting. May even like it better than Epson. Nice tonal/color reproduction and sharpness with a high gloss finish. Dry right out of the printer but much more affected by water than Epson paper. So don't spit polish the surface!

DC

DRG · Dec 29, 2003

shanstu70 said:
I'm still researching the subject, but the search engine is down.
I just got the i960 for Christmas, and was shocked when what came
out of the printer didn't look even close to the colors on my
monitor - very yellow cast, and the reds are a little too dark.

Anybody here have any solutions to this? It's been suggested on
the Printing forum that I've got the wrong profile driver, but I
don't know where to find the right one. I'm using Ilford Gallerie
smooth gloss paper, the i960, and I've got a Viewsonic Viewpanel
VG150 flat LCD monitor.

I tried shooting in RGB from the camera and setting Adobe RGB 1998
on the printer, and it matches, but I don't know how it will
"tweak" in photoshop. I don't like it straight out of the camera
at all. Maybe RAW would help, then converting to RGB if I
need/want to post process. I was under the impression that
anything except all parameters set to zero would be limit what you
can do post process. Still trying...

Thanks in advance for your suggestions...

I don't own an i960, but have been using an i950 since it first came out. Most of the issues and driver settings should be similar.

The first thing I'd try is to start with an image in the sRGB space. If you shot in any of the Parameter * modes, you're in sRGB. If you shot in Adobe RGB, then load the image into Photoshop. Depending on your color management settings, it may notify you that the image's color space doesn't match the working space and provide options. If it provides the option to convert to the working RGB space and if this space is sRGB, then select this option. Otherwise, go to the Image menu, select Mode and then Convert Profile ... Set source space to Adobe RGB and destination to sRGB, with Perceptual as the intent.

I'll now assume that you'll be printing from within Photoshop. Go to Print with Preview and check off Show more Options. Just below, there's a drop-down menu. Select Color Management and then, in the Print Space field, set profile as Printer Color Management. Then click the Print button.

Once the Print dialog button comes up, click the Properties button. On the Main tab, set your media type appropriately for the type of paper you're using. Then, set Print Quality to Custom and click the Set button. Move the slider to the highest quality (as close to 1 as it will go) and press the Diffusion button under Halftoning. "OK" out of this dialog and select Manual for Color Adjustment. Press Set and check off the Enable ICM button. Make sure the various color sliders are set to 0. Then, "OK" out of all the printer driver dialogs and press "OK" on the Print dialog box to print.

You'd think that Enable ICM would allow the printer driver to print any properly-tagged file correctly. However, it seems to really mean "Enable ICM but assume the input file is sRGB."

If you want to be able to print straight from an Adobe RGB file, you'll need to use Photoshop's color management, which, in turn, means having a proper print ICM profile. Then, in the same place you previously selected Printer Color Management, you could select the printer profile and allow Photoshop to translate on the fly. Since most color profiles assume that no color management is enabled in the printer driver, you'd also want to make sure that, after setting Color Adjustment to Manual and pressing Set, you deselect the Enable ICM checkbox, set the Print Type to None and set the Brightness to Normal. These are the settings normally used to print a target for profile generation and thus are the settings to use when printing using such a profile.

Hope this helps. If you aren't printing from PS but rather from a package such as Qimage, let me know and we can customize the instructions for that software.

David

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Canon i960 printer - any color problems?

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