IR-auto non focusing works

Having read on and off about IR autofocus problems with flash, I have now found out myself that only about half the shots are in focus. and I am not aiming the target at the wrong point.

This hotshot almost pro has now ruined the shots of the grandkids christmas. I am not very popular now.

Is it that I always have to get a new camera when it first arrives or have any of you the same problem?

I used the E-10 with the FL- 40 Flash. It focuses ok with IR turned off.

Needless to say, I am very disappointed with an otherwise great camera.

Ludwig

Hello Ludwig,

Sorry to hear your troubles.
I'm using IR ON all the time and have no problems.
But, to assure that focussing is OK, do this:

• zoom in at 140mm
• press the shutterbutton half way down and keep it down. The camera will focus and in the vieuwfinder you can see if it's correct.

If autofocussing isn't correct from the first time, redo it or point to an as far subject with different contrast.

• whe focus is OK, zoom out to the desired angle
• take the photo

Using that technique, your focussing rate should raise a lot.
It works fine for me (and a lot of others here).

Hope this can help ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ludwig said:

Having read on and off about IR autofocus problems with flash, I
have now found out myself that only about half the shots are in
focus. and I am not aiming the target at the wrong point.

This hotshot almost pro has now ruined the shots of the grandkids
christmas. I am not very popular now.

Is it that I always have to get a new camera when it first arrives
or have any of you the same problem?

I used the E-10 with the FL- 40 Flash. It focuses ok with IR turned
off.

Needless to say, I am very disappointed with an otherwise great
camera.

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

Hello Ludwig,

Sorry to hear your troubles.
I'm using IR ON all the time and have no problems.
But, to assure that focussing is OK, do this:

• zoom in at 140mm
• press the shutterbutton half way down and keep it down. The

camera will focus and in the vieuwfinder you can see if it's
correct.
If autofocussing isn't correct from the first time, redo it or
point to an as far subject with different contrast.

• whe focus is OK, zoom out to the desired angle
• take the photo

Using that technique, your focussing rate should raise a lot.
It works fine for me (and a lot of others here).

Hope this can help ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Jaja - I´ll try the full tele trick.

Unfortunately I took most pictures in pretty dim light, were I could not verify sharpness in the viewfinder. After holding the shutter release part way I waited for the focus confirmation beep and dot before firing. Still way out of focus.

I have taken a lot of shots with a studio strobe and modelling lights on - always in good focus. Maybe I am trying to make the camera autofocus with too little light. I was thinking the IR could do that.

Ludwig

The more I use it, the less I like the autofocus. It just doesn't work. My wife took 5 shots, brought the camera back to me and said she must have pushed a button. All the shots were out of focus. A friend of ours tried to take a shot of my wife and I, 5 shots later, all out of focus. I focused for him, turned the focus to manual, and he finally got a focused shot. It was low light, but not wide angle(there goes that theory). E10 lowlight focus truly sucks. Mine is going back...

Ludwig said:

Having read on and off about IR autofocus problems with flash, I
have now found out myself that only about half the shots are in
focus. and I am not aiming the target at the wrong point.

This hotshot almost pro has now ruined the shots of the grandkids
christmas. I am not very popular now.

Is it that I always have to get a new camera when it first arrives
or have any of you the same problem?

I used the E-10 with the FL- 40 Flash. It focuses ok with IR turned
off.

Needless to say, I am very disappointed with an otherwise great
camera.

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Hello Ludwig,

In this time of year, there's always a christmastree as a subject.
I did a lot of tests using mine at home and no focussing problems at all ...
All lights were out, except the christmastree-lights ...

To compare, I took my Yashica SLR. The autofocus went nuts most of the time and couldn't get in focus. The E-10 managed much better.
Using IR ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ludwig said:

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

Hello Ludwig,

Sorry to hear your troubles.
I'm using IR ON all the time and have no problems.
But, to assure that focussing is OK, do this:

• zoom in at 140mm
• press the shutterbutton half way down and keep it down. The

camera will focus and in the vieuwfinder you can see if it's
correct.
If autofocussing isn't correct from the first time, redo it or
point to an as far subject with different contrast.

• whe focus is OK, zoom out to the desired angle
• take the photo

Using that technique, your focussing rate should raise a lot.
It works fine for me (and a lot of others here).

Hope this can help ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Jaja - I´ll try the full tele trick.

Unfortunately I took most pictures in pretty dim light, were I
could not verify sharpness in the viewfinder. After holding the
shutter release part way I waited for the focus confirmation beep
and dot before firing. Still way out of focus.

I have taken a lot of shots with a studio strobe and modelling
lights on - always in good focus. Maybe I am trying to make the
camera autofocus with too little light. I was thinking the IR
could do that.

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Ludwig said:

Having read on and off about IR autofocus problems with flash, I
have now found out myself that only about half the shots are in
focus. and I am not aiming the target at the wrong point.

This hotshot almost pro has now ruined the shots of the grandkids
christmas. I am not very popular now.

Is it that I always have to get a new camera when it first arrives
or have any of you the same problem?

I used the E-10 with the FL- 40 Flash. It focuses ok with IR turned
off.

Needless to say, I am very disappointed with an otherwise great
camera.

Click to expand...

I also was experiencing the "out of focus blues" with my E-10. I then turned off the IR and took about 40 photos with and without flash. These were all tac sharp, but the autofocus times in low light were unacceptable. I then turned IR back on and was very careful not to obscure the IR port with my extra large hands. I have now shot 50+ photos with IR on which are all nice and sharp. That IR window is in a poor location and is very easy to inadvertently cover either partially or completely. I hope that this solves my problem.

Happy Holidays
Ed Stokes

Member said:

Ludwig

Click to expand...

I had a few reason for buying the E10, IR in-the-dark focusing was one of them. It can in fact do this, but it is so hit and miss (on my sample) as to be totally unreliable for me.

Member said:

I have taken a lot of shots with a studio strobe and modelling
lights on - always in good focus. Maybe I am trying to make the
camera autofocus with too little light. I was thinking the IR
could do that.

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Hello Jaja,

tried your suggestion of full tele and contrasty object and had good results - except in candle illumination.

It seems that the camera cannot focus in low light. If it focuses with the IR off, then it will also focus with it on. If the light gets too low for the CCD focusing, then the IR seems to be hit and miss.

What I find unacceptable is that I get a focus confirmation beep and dot when actually it is not in focus when the shot ist taken. Like beeing lied to.

Maybe I just expected too much from the AF

Ludwig

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

In this time of year, there's always a christmastree as a subject.
I did a lot of tests using mine at home and no focussing problems
at all ...
All lights were out, except the christmastree-lights ...
To compare, I took my Yashica SLR. The autofocus went nuts most of
the time and couldn't get in focus. The E-10 managed much better.
Using IR ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ludwig said:

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

Hello Ludwig,

Sorry to hear your troubles.
I'm using IR ON all the time and have no problems.
But, to assure that focussing is OK, do this:

• zoom in at 140mm
• press the shutterbutton half way down and keep it down. The

camera will focus and in the vieuwfinder you can see if it's
correct.
If autofocussing isn't correct from the first time, redo it or
point to an as far subject with different contrast.

• whe focus is OK, zoom out to the desired angle
• take the photo

Using that technique, your focussing rate should raise a lot.
It works fine for me (and a lot of others here).

Hope this can help ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Jaja - I´ll try the full tele trick.

Unfortunately I took most pictures in pretty dim light, were I
could not verify sharpness in the viewfinder. After holding the
shutter release part way I waited for the focus confirmation beep
and dot before firing. Still way out of focus.

I have taken a lot of shots with a studio strobe and modelling
lights on - always in good focus. Maybe I am trying to make the
camera autofocus with too little light. I was thinking the IR
could do that.

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Ludwig said:

Hello Jaja,

tried your suggestion of full tele and contrasty object and had
good results - except in candle illumination.

Click to expand...

In addition to the Jaja technique, I find that I sometimes need to do the focus twice or more. I hold the button down until focus confirmation, then do it again. In low light the first confirmation looks out of focus in the view finder. The second time, the focus seems to work. This is with or without IR. In low light, IR works, as long as the subject is a meter or more away from the camera, as I think parallax error creeps in if the subject is too close.

Mike

No I don't think you are expecting too much from this AF. I don't think I am expecting too much from it either.

I don't think my camera is faulty either, I've tried two others with similar results, and nonetheless I'll go through the loops and send it back ASAP.

I haven’t even looked at my E10 in five days now though my kids took a few pics of the gang in the street with their new bikes and the quality of focus just is not there. I have about a week off and should be excited about my purchase as I bought it during a particularly busy time and it went to work immediately, but I've lost interest in it already and it does not inspire me to play with it. I must snap out of this I’m getting depressed.

Of course I was expecting another sample by Christmas Eve – but the shop sold it before I could collect it! Another bottle of wine I think, my memory is starting to come back! ;-)

Member said:

Maybe I just expected too much from the AF

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Hello Ludwig,

Glad my suggestion helped. But I also mentioned the autofocus having problems in some circumstances and need to refocus several times.
This method als works with manual focussing.

As you mention, the focus confirmation is a pain. When not in focus, it shouldn't confirm. This is also a real problem Oly should work on.
One can't trust the focus confirmation and that's realy bad.

What I tried to do was finding a "workaround" untill Olympus has solved the focussing problem in low light situations.

In daylight, autofocus works perfect, but at low light, it's not what it should and could be.

But, we have a workaround and if autofocussing fails, I just use manual focussing.
Olympus, there's work on the (engeneering) table!!!!
But I keep loving my E-10, it's just a great camera ))

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ludwig said:

tried your suggestion of full tele and contrasty object and had
good results - except in candle illumination.

It seems that the camera cannot focus in low light. If it focuses
with the IR off, then it will also focus with it on. If the light
gets too low for the CCD focusing, then the IR seems to be hit and
miss.

What I find unacceptable is that I get a focus confirmation beep
and dot when actually it is not in focus when the shot ist taken.
Like beeing lied to.

Maybe I just expected too much from the AF

Ludwig

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

In this time of year, there's always a christmastree as a subject.
I did a lot of tests using mine at home and no focussing problems
at all ...
All lights were out, except the christmastree-lights ...
To compare, I took my Yashica SLR. The autofocus went nuts most of
the time and couldn't get in focus. The E-10 managed much better.
Using IR ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ludwig said:

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

Hello Ludwig,

Sorry to hear your troubles.
I'm using IR ON all the time and have no problems.
But, to assure that focussing is OK, do this:

• zoom in at 140mm
• press the shutterbutton half way down and keep it down. The

camera will focus and in the vieuwfinder you can see if it's
correct.
If autofocussing isn't correct from the first time, redo it or
point to an as far subject with different contrast.

• whe focus is OK, zoom out to the desired angle
• take the photo

Using that technique, your focussing rate should raise a lot.
It works fine for me (and a lot of others here).

Hope this can help ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Jaja - I´ll try the full tele trick.

Unfortunately I took most pictures in pretty dim light, were I
could not verify sharpness in the viewfinder. After holding the
shutter release part way I waited for the focus confirmation beep
and dot before firing. Still way out of focus.

I have taken a lot of shots with a studio strobe and modelling
lights on - always in good focus. Maybe I am trying to make the
camera autofocus with too little light. I was thinking the IR
could do that.

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Hello Mike,

"my technique" is verry flexible

Yes, in certainc ircumstances, I have to refocus also and even sometimes, autofocus would do any job. But, there's always the manual focussing.
That's also possible using the same technique.

The only big problem is the focus confirmation. It shouldn't appear when focus is wrong.
Yesterday, I shot some candlelights and christmaslights.
On Belgium Digital, the item "The camera saw it" is one of them.
I had to use manual focussing to get a well focussed photo.

Now we're getting closer to what's wrong, Olympus will have to put some engineers at work to solve our focussing problems.

I'm glad I found a "workaround" that can help and does a good job untill the E-10 will do what it should en could do using autofocus.

As I worte in my message to Ludwig, I keep loving my E-10. It's a fantastic camera. Now Olympus has to sort out the things that aren't perfect.

Let's hope they do it quickly and show some respect for all those that are helping to point them to some weak points of the E-10.

We're doing 'field'-work in this forum and that should be rewarded by Olympus by taking our complaints serious.
Never the less, tomorrow, there's another shooting day!!!! ))

This forum is growing into a constructive area in which Olympus should frequent very often ...

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Mike Tichon said:

Ludwig said:

Hello Jaja,

tried your suggestion of full tele and contrasty object and had
good results - except in candle illumination.

Click to expand...

In addition to the Jaja technique, I find that I sometimes need to
do the focus twice or more. I hold the button down until focus
confirmation, then do it again. In low light the first confirmation
looks out of focus in the view finder. The second time, the focus
seems to work. This is with or without IR. In low light, IR works,
as long as the subject is a meter or more away from the camera, as
I think parallax error creeps in if the subject is too close.

Mike

Click to expand...

Hello Ger,

I perfectly understand how you must feel ...
Having a great tool that doesn't function as it should and could be.
If other brands can make a perfectly working autofocus, Olympus also can.
But, I remenber my CP990 with firmware 1.0 ...

After the upgrade to firmware 1.1, it was capable of autofocussing in low light situations.

Using the CP990, no workaround was possible. The E-10 offers at least that possibility.

Olympus should take us serious and do something about it. It can't be that difficult ... ))
BTW, a glass of wine a day is good for your health, a bottle ...???

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ger Beee said:

I don't think my camera is faulty either, I've tried two others
with similar results, and nonetheless I'll go through the loops and
send it back ASAP.

I haven’t even looked at my E10 in five days now though my
kids took a few pics of the gang in the street with their new bikes
and the quality of focus just is not there. I have about a week off
and should be excited about my purchase as I bought it during a
particularly busy time and it went to work immediately, but I've
lost interest in it already and it does not inspire me to play with
it. I must snap out of this I’m getting depressed.

Of course I was expecting another sample by Christmas Eve –
but the shop sold it before I could collect it! Another bottle of
wine I think, my memory is starting to come back! ;-)

Ger Bee said:

Maybe I just expected too much from the AF

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

another issue:

while doing low light/flash testing, I noticed that in program mode all flash exposures were between f 2 and 2.4 i.e. wide open. This to me should be the other way around, with the camera selecting the smallest f stop and use all the light the flash can deliver. This was the case also with a distance of a meter or less. I switched to aperture priority and f 11 with good results and much more depth of field.

any comments?

Ludwig

Ludwig,

Read this thread - it might have saved you some ruined pictures. Sorry.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1022&message=668137

Joe Hawblitzel

Ludwig said:

another issue:

while doing low light/flash testing, I noticed that in program mode
all flash exposures were between f 2 and 2.4 i.e. wide open. This
to me should be the other way around, with the camera selecting the
smallest f stop and use all the light the flash can deliver. This
was the case also with a distance of a meter or less. I switched to
aperture priority and f 11 with good results and much more depth of
field.

any comments?

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Jaja - Belgium Digital said:

Yesterday, I shot some candlelights and christmaslights.
On Belgium Digital, the item "The camera saw it" is one of them.
I had to use manual focussing to get a well focussed photo.

Click to expand...

Great picture of a Christmas light!
Mike

Hello Ludwig,

In P-mode , the E-10 chooses the highest shutterspeed as possible, so it's logic you will end up with an aperture between 2.0 and 2.4.

When more DOF is desired (verry often , use A-mode, but don't exagerate. F11 is good for close objects, 4.0 or 5.6 will do fine.
And it's logic that f11 delivers a much larger DOF than 2.0.
The smaller the "hole", the larger the DOF (f11 = smallest "hole" ))

Jaja
http://www.belgiumdigital.com

Ludwig said:

another issue:

while doing low light/flash testing, I noticed that in program mode
all flash exposures were between f 2 and 2.4 i.e. wide open. This
to me should be the other way around, with the camera selecting the
smallest f stop and use all the light the flash can deliver. This
was the case also with a distance of a meter or less. I switched to
aperture priority and f 11 with good results and much more depth of
field.

any comments?

Ludwig

Click to expand...

verry interrestink!

I guess I vill hev to revive the old system of dividing the distance by the dollar exchange rate - or was it the price of the camera to determine the max aperture for the flash.

Used f 11 just to see if the flash had the power - it did.

Seriously though, it is not really an issue, but I would find it convenient if the camera would recognize the expensive FL-40 flash and use it's power fully. Especially since shutter speed is not the determining factor of flash exposure.

Full open does excacerbate (big word - I am only guessing at the spelling) the focus accuracy.

Ain't this forum great or what?

Ludwig

Joe Hawblitzel said:

Read this thread - it might have saved you some ruined pictures.
Sorry.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1022&message=668137

Joe Hawblitzel

Ludwig said:

another issue:

while doing low light/flash testing, I noticed that in program mode
all flash exposures were between f 2 and 2.4 i.e. wide open. This
to me should be the other way around, with the camera selecting the
smallest f stop and use all the light the flash can deliver. This
was the case also with a distance of a meter or less. I switched to
aperture priority and f 11 with good results and much more depth of
field.

any comments?

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I personally prefer the wide aperatures with flash indoors because it helps to balance with the existing light. You can see room lights on, christmas lights or candles, etc. At f11 you would most likely need direct flash, bounce may not work. The wide aperature flash shots is one of the reasons I loved the 2020... my.02

Ludwig said:

I guess I vill hev to revive the old system of dividing the
distance by the dollar exchange rate - or was it the price of the
camera to determine the max aperture for the flash.

Used f 11 just to see if the flash had the power - it did.

Seriously though, it is not really an issue, but I would find it
convenient if the camera would recognize the expensive FL-40 flash
and use it's power fully. Especially since shutter speed is not the
determining factor of flash exposure.

Full open does excacerbate (big word - I am only guessing at the
spelling) the focus accuracy.

Ain't this forum great or what?

Ludwig

Joe Hawblitzel said:

Read this thread - it might have saved you some ruined pictures.
Sorry.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1022&message=668137

Joe Hawblitzel

Ludwig said:

another issue:

while doing low light/flash testing, I noticed that in program mode
all flash exposures were between f 2 and 2.4 i.e. wide open. This
to me should be the other way around, with the camera selecting the
smallest f stop and use all the light the flash can deliver. This
was the case also with a distance of a meter or less. I switched to
aperture priority and f 11 with good results and much more depth of
field.

any comments?

Ludwig

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...