Has a consensus now developed on the new GFX100RF?

The consensus is that it's expensive.
Of all the knocks on the GFX 100 RF, this is the one that resonates the least with me. It's a 100 MP MF camera with a lens for less than $5K.
But even against the high prices of this high rez gear, it seems obvious that £5000 for a hobby camera, especially a fixed lens compact, is a bit insane.
I'm not wealthy. I choose what I spend money on very carefully. Since this camera won't be used for my pro work, it goes into my personal work category, supporting my art practice and as a fantastic travel camera. Please don't call me insane.

I can think of a lot of other hobbies that cost a whole lot more: anything to do with cars or motorbikes, golf, boating, sailing, and much much more.
I've said this many a time before, despite being someone who has been ridiculously profligate in buying camera gear, I feel out of my depth in this forum because of the sheer ease with which some members simply dismiss incredibly expensive purchases as nothing.
Please show me who here---or anywhere else for that matter---has dismissed this camera's cost or other NEW gear purchases as "nothing". I think this is a strange accusation, along with the "insane" comment.
This is the medium format forum and medium format is therefore what is discussed, but honestly I do wonder exactly what percentage of forum users actually benefit from using a £5000 camera rather than a £300 camera.
Why do you wonder? What does it matter to you?
Throwing absurd amounts of money at cameras for moderate improvements is kind of daft.
Now we're daft. This is pretty insulting.
Almost a disease I would have thought.
Your accusations just get worse.
I see from the statistics that even among older people (the ones more likely to buy expensive cameras), between 1/4 and 1/3rd of pensioners in the UK live solely off their state pension of £10k pa. £5000 is not cheap!
This is an even stranger context, like saying that to a homeless person Indian take-away is expensive.
By all means buy expensive stuff if you need it for a specific purpose, but don't pretend it is cheap,
Considering that this is, as Jim Kasson said, a 100mp medium format camera, one that comes with the lens, and kind of by definition in this category something manufactured in limited quantities and with evident special care---in comparison with other camera and lens combinations on the market at this high level---in that context it's something of a bargain. That it does not suit your needs or interests or opinions about value does not translate into your assertions being factual data about the camera and its value.
When I look back over my camera buying life, all this expenditure seems faintly nuts. A £500 second hand Lumix G9 and a 14-140mm superzoom would have most likely have satisfied 99% of my lifetime photographic requirements. GAS and curiosity makes for a crazy attitude to spending, spending, spending...
And so, one wonders why you are visiting and posting in this forum.
 
Hi,

Well, first off solar panels need to be square onto the sun on a clear day at high noon to acheive rated current output. In other words, the 200w is the most you can expect to ever see. And probably never will. Sun angle, amount of atmosphere due to the angle, clouds (even ones you can't see) and other crap in the air. All conspiring against you.

Then there is the question of just how the charger unit being used operates. And, that I don't know. Some are quite a bit less efficient in their output to the battery for their input then others.

What I'd do next is use two digital multimeters in the output of the panel. One to measure voltage and the other to measure current. Then I could see just what the panel is outputting vs what the charger is supplying the battery.

I know my Nitecore chargers on the 100w multiple output power supply don't deliver anywhere near what the supply is capable of delivering. On purpose. The chargers don't want to over feed whatever battery is being charged.

On the other hand, I can attach four things to the power supply and it has enough current to let each thing charge at whatever the chargers want to use.

After all this is said, many solar panels I have seen just don't ever manage to supply their rated output on any sunny day I happen to find. And maybe this is actually what is happening.

One of my hobbies is Amateur Radio. And in that, I like to field operate. That means a 100 watt output single sideband radio on a battery and a portable antenna. And there is a 200 watt solar panel to put charge back into the battery which the transmitter takes out.

There is no way to ensure the peak current demand of the transmitter from solar unless I want the kind of array seen at commercial power solar plants. Hence Mr Battery. And Mr Regulator (which has loss but we don't want to run up past 14.2 volts).

However, I quickly found that one 200w panel was not really putting out but half of that. So I didn't sweat it. I just added a second panel. I figured it out prerty quickly using the two meter (not to be confused with the ham band by the same name) system.

And that is enough for the fairly short transmitter on times I run. I have two additional panels and a second battery if necessary. Can operate on one set of panels and swap out the battery should I overdo it. And then the second set of panels can recharge the depleted battery.

So he might very well need to add another panel or two. But it will take some time with a couple of meters to sort it out.

Stan
Thanks! I'll get measuring.
 
Indeed so.

I notice a strange effect caused by reading this thread. It caused me to check an inflation calculator to compare today's camera prices with the early adopter prices I paid 25 years ago. And based on the those calculations, today's prices suddenly didn't seem so high and I felt the sudden onset of the desire (GAS) to buy a new camera...

I don't have a need for a new camera and can't actually think of one to buy. I did get tempted by the new XE5 but honestly, only because it is pretty. Frivolous. However, I suddenly found myself trying to convince myself that I could save weight and bulk on my two-camera two-lens infrared + normal outfit by buying another Fuji X which could share the same lens as my IR camera and therefore I could leave my A7R4 + 18-135 aps-c lens at home.

Voila! a credible reason to buy another camera I don't need!

The funny thing is that the ability to use the A7R4 with aps-c lenses was something my GAS saw as a good reason to get the Sony in the first place, as in APS-C mode it could replace the small sensor cameras I had. A multi format camera. I even got rid of my X-T100 for this reason. And now I find my treacherous GAS brain attempting to reverse the logic to get me to buy another APS-C.

The conclusion I draw from this?

DPReview forums possess the magical ability to draw out GAS feelings and make them live once again. Almost certainly a key reason as to why DPR spend so much resources on maintaining them.

So yes, not coming to this forum (or any other) might actually be healthy. Spending too much time discussing camera clearly makes one want to buy cameras. Better to spend the time discussing photographs.

I do think I'm quite willing to review my purchasing decisions, assess whether they were good choices and reflect brutally honestly on why I made them. If only that self reflection worked as well before purchasing :-)

--
2024: Awarded Royal Photographic Society LRPS Distinction
Photo of the day: https://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/wp/photo-of-the-day-2025/
Website: https://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/wp/
DPReview gallery: https://www.dpreview.com/galleries/0286305481
Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidmillier/ (very old!)
 
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So, almost as rare as billionaires 😂 (10x difference).
I think I mentioned couple months earlier were I a tech billionaire I would gladly gift every regular member of this MF forum a 100Rf : if I could get hold of 100Rfs. 😹

Would take currently approx a decade for me to have spare change for 100Rf if it drops used £1K with warranty. I'm happy to wait as I'm happy to wait years for 100mk1 to drop to around £1K used with warranty, currently around £2K used with warranty.

Wouldn't be my only camera though that I'd carry. I like carrying pany ois 14-140 (28-240) on my m4/3 body stabilised pany Gx7, as well as my oly 45/1.8 on my m4/3 body stabilised oly E-Pl7.

I find m4/3 with its 4:3 ratio smaller lenses, body stabilised ideal for my photogrpahy. Alongside a 100Rf that would be moi sorted. (I have a 5dmk2, A7rmk2 hardly gets utilised).
 
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The consensus is that it's expensive.
Of all the knocks on the GFX 100 RF, this is the one that resonates the least with me. It's a 100 MP MF camera with a lens for less than $5K.
But even against the high prices of this high rez gear, it seems obvious that £5000 for a hobby camera, especially a fixed lens compact, is a bit insane.
I'm not wealthy. I choose what I spend money on very carefully. Since this camera won't be used for my pro work, it goes into my personal work category, supporting my art practice and as a fantastic travel camera. Please don't call me insane.
I didn't call you insane, I said the price was insane.
I can think of a lot of other hobbies that cost a whole lot more: anything to do with cars or motorbikes, golf, boating, sailing, and much much more.
Whataboutery. If I had a private jet it would cost me more than any camera. I don't have a private jet, so that justifies the purchase of any camera, no matter how silly the price. Good one.
I've said this many a time before, despite being someone who has been ridiculously profligate in buying camera gear, I feel out of my depth in this forum because of the sheer ease with which some members simply dismiss incredibly expensive purchases as nothing.
Please show me who here---or anywhere else for that matter---has dismissed this camera's cost or other NEW gear purchases as "nothing". I think this is a strange accusation, along with the "insane" comment.
You don't have to explicitly say £5000 is not a large sum. It is clearly implied when someone lists £30,000 worth of camera gear they bought for their hobby that they are not short of a bob or concerned about spending it. It's not difficult to search the forum for clear statements about very large sums of money being spent in quite a casual manner. I'm not talking about instances where a very passionate photographer has spent 5 years scrimping and saving to get a needed camera. I'm talking about a forum where people make it very evident that multiple thousand pound purchases are not once-in-a-lifetime events.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with someone spending their money either, just that when you are apparently surrounded by people with means far outside the range of people you know in real life, it can be alienating. It makes me feel I've walked into first class by mistake.
This is the medium format forum and medium format is therefore what is discussed, but honestly I do wonder exactly what percentage of forum users actually benefit from using a £5000 camera rather than a £300 camera.
Why do you wonder? What does it matter to you?
Obvious surely? Why throw money away on something that brings you no benefit (if it doesn't). I'm quite realistic about my own GFX purchase. It brought me none of the benefits I imagined or was told it would bring. Instead it brought me the unexpected and accidental benefit of proving to be an excellent camera for long exposures. Apart from that its superior image quality provides no benefits in the small print sizes I use. if it weren't for the LE quality, it would have been an unwise purchase for me. The knowledge that a device possesses superior image quality isn't much cop if you can never realise it in a print. It's just potential quality you'll never be able to take advantage of. Horses for courses and all that. So I wonder whether people really need the capabilities or are over-buying. Not that it matters what the motivation is, but it is interesting to speculate.
Throwing absurd amounts of money at cameras for moderate improvements is kind of daft.
Now we're daft. This is pretty insulting.
I doubt that you'll find many professional financial managers recommending the throwing away of large sums of money needlessly as a sound strategy.
Almost a disease I would have thought.
Your accusations just get worse.
Gambling is considered a disease of sorts. Some gamblers might argue it's a bit of fun. GAS maybe qualifies.
I see from the statistics that even among older people (the ones more likely to buy expensive cameras), between 1/4 and 1/3rd of pensioners in the UK live solely off their state pension of £10k pa. £5000 is not cheap!
This is an even stranger context, like saying that to a homeless person Indian take-away is expensive.
No, it's a statement intended to assess what the general population might class as 'cheap'. Given expensive cameras tend to be bought by older people (more money, their big expenses days behind them, more time to save and so on), and given that up to 1/3rd of UK pensioners have an annual income only twice that of the price of the RF, do you think the consensus is likely to be that a camera that costs 50% of an annual income is cheap?

If you do, you have a different concept of cheap than I do.
By all means buy expensive stuff if you need it for a specific purpose, but don't pretend it is cheap,
Considering that this is, as Jim Kasson said, a 100mp medium format camera, one that comes with the lens, and kind of by definition in this category something manufactured in limited quantities and with evident special care---in comparison with other camera and lens combinations on the market at this high level---in that context it's something of a bargain.
Something being somewhat of a bargain within the context of its market segment is very different from it being cheap. Realistically, it is an extremely expensive camera that is way beyond the means of the majority of the world's population. That doesn't classify it as cheap but as a luxury good for the wealthy. It maybe a bit of a bargain as a luxury good for the wealthy but that is something else.
That it does not suit your needs or interests or opinions about value does not translate into your assertions being factual data about the camera and its value.
Hypothetical: Let's find a way of putting it to the vote of the whole population of the UK: Do you think a £5000 camera is a bargain? What do you think the response would be?
When I look back over my camera buying life, all this expenditure seems faintly nuts. A £500 second hand Lumix G9 and a 14-140mm superzoom would have most likely have satisfied 99% of my lifetime photographic requirements. GAS and curiosity makes for a crazy attitude to spending, spending, spending...
And so, one wonders why you are visiting and posting in this forum.
See other reply for more on this one, but the short answer is that it has the most interesting posters of the forums. The m43 forum is obsessed with FF, the FF forums are obsessed with other brands or full of questions about how to fit the neckstrap. MF forum is interesting.

--
2024: Awarded Royal Photographic Society LRPS Distinction
Photo of the day: https://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/wp/photo-of-the-day-2025/
Website: https://www.whisperingcat.co.uk/wp/
DPReview gallery: https://www.dpreview.com/galleries/0286305481
Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidmillier/ (very old!)
 
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So, almost as rare as billionaires 😂 (10x difference).
I think I mentioned couple months earlier were I a tech billionaire I would gladly gift every regular member of this MF forum a 100Rf : if I could get hold of 100Rfs. 😹

It wouldn't be my only camera though that I'd carry. I like carrying pany ois 14-140 (28-240) on my m4/3 body stabilised pany Gx7,
I'm a fan of that 14-140mm. It's tiny and light for the range and good.

I'm also a fan of the GX7. It's small enough with a pancake lens almost to be considered a compact but it's big enough you can grip it properly and it has an EVF and a full set of controls.

And guess what: 12" x 12" prints from it are exactly as good as from GFX. Mine cost £139.

as well as my oly 45/1.8 on my m4/3 body stabilised oly E-Pl7.

I find m4/3 with its 4:3 ratio smaller lenses, body stabilised ideal for my photogrpahy. Alongside a 100Rf that would be moi sorted. (I have a 5dmk2, A7rmk2 hardly gets utilised).

Would take currently approx a decade for me to have spare change for 100Rf if it drops used £1K with warranty. I'm happy to wait as I'm happy to wait years for 100mk1 to drop to around £1K used with warranty, currently around £2K used with warranty.
 
Two recent purchases saw a hike in price again as I moved up to high resolution cameras, possible because I temporarily came into a bit of money:
  • 2022 GFX50s (£1800) Funded by windfall
  • 2024 A7Riv (£1749) Funded by windfall
But even against the high prices of this high rez gear, it seems obvious that £5000 for a hobby camera, especially a fixed lens compact, is a bit insane.
My family members considered me bit insane even for spending money on camera for hobby. So I prefer to speak about gear in forums like this, because the insane level bar is lot higher. Even if it's not GFX100RF level high, if I'd have spare money for Hasselblad X2D with one lens more than double price, as a hobby photographer how hard would hit the insane bar?

I can't understand those non professionals spending lot of money on FF systems with large and heavy glasses. They carry around more than 1,5-2kg gear on hikings, vacations. They collect lenses, accessories, cannot live with one focal length, even can't decide what to bring or maybe buy for a trip, bunch of primes or a huge zoom. They arrived with professional grade lenses to a crowded tourist destination, and can't shot even one satisfying, good picture because of the crowd. And even better you can google thousands of professional, high level pictures about every place.

That's indicates to me we are no more after taking pictures, but gear as a toy for playing. And I don't see why is a high-end fixed lens camera worse than a several kg system for same price in this case.
 
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Measurements

Latitude London

Noon midsummer

Clear day, with blazing sun, maybe a bit of haze higher up

Panel orientated as head on as possible. It's a slightly flexible panel so without support it curves a bit so not exactly face on.

I don't have two multimeters that are working at the moment so I had to measure voltage and current separately

Short circuit Voltage: 26v (in spec with label on the rear of panel)

Open circuit current: 5A (the label say 8A)

so output 130W (label says 200W).

The output is well below the spec but a lot better than than the 0.3A my brother in law got in Scotland. Not just the weather, there may be something wrong with his charger/solar converter. He's checking it at home.

I think we are making progress understanding what is going on.

Thanks, Stan.
 
Two recent purchases saw a hike in price again as I moved up to high resolution cameras, possible because I temporarily came into a bit of money:
  • 2022 GFX50s (£1800) Funded by windfall
  • 2024 A7Riv (£1749) Funded by windfall
But even against the high prices of this high rez gear, it seems obvious that £5000 for a hobby camera, especially a fixed lens compact, is a bit insane.
My family members considered me bit insane even for spending money on camera for hobby. So I prefer to speak about gear in forums like this, because the insane level bar is lot higher. Even if it's not GFX100RF level high, if I'd have spare money for Hasselblad X2D with one lens more than double price, as a hobby photographer how hard would hit the insane bar?
I'd judge it this way:

Can I see any difference in my prints between the output of say a £400 X-T2, a £700 A7Rii (sourced from MPB) and a 10-15x more expensive £7000 hassie body.

If I can't see any difference in the prints, I might need to either:

Print bigger!

or

Think very carefully about why I want the Hassie.

Is it the practical image quality for my use case? Or is something else (say the traditional romance and the glamour of a famous Chinese drone manufacturer brand).

If it were the latter, I might want to have my sanity independently checked, or be sufficiently wealthy that the price is irrelevant.

I personally have no issue with someone who is rich wanting to use their money inefficiently just because they can. I'd feel a bit sad for someone who can't really afford it, but who lets the fantasy/glamour get to their head. The new-car sheen wears off fairly quickly, then you are left with the real world.

That's my take on it.

One practical problem in all this is it is not very easy for most people to get hold of and test expensive products in advance of purchase (at least not where I live). That means your initial GAS is driven by hearsay and your own tendency to hype up the worth of a prospective purchase in your own head untempered by real world practical experience. It's usually my experience that GAS creates rose tinted glasses that only hands-on experience can illuminate properly. It's especially the case with high end products that are way beyond your usual experience. The reality can often be less than hoped.

It's an eye opener to me that no one appears to be able to see any image quality difference between m43 and GFX with my 12" prints. The printer/inkset/paper is the primary determiner of print quality here, not the camera.
 
Ignoring the hype, do photographers and credible reviewers have a consensus yet on this new, fixed lens model? Anyone care to attempt objectivity and boil it down for a FF user? Thank you for your concise thoughts. I see lots for sale on Fred Miranda.
I would probably not buy a camera, which reaches a consensus across numerous users ;-)

I was looking forward to a rangefinder-style fixed lens medium camera from Fuji. I used to have a Fuji 645 film camera in the old days. I started with an X-Pro 1 into the Fuji X world. Now I have an GFX 100s II and several lenses, but for business travels, I also wanted a more compact camera. I opted for a used Leica Q2 this year. Last week, I visited a Fuji store and had a closer look at the GFX 100RF.

Likes:
  • I prefer the 4:3 sensor and viewfinder format by far
  • the 100 MP sensor to me is sensational
  • I am used to Fuji color profiles
Dislikes, or why I prefer the Q2
  • lens operation is more classic on the Q2, giving me the feeling of old manual lenses
  • no IS on the 100RF - as I mainly use the Q2 for business travels, I shoot in low-light evening settings quite often, where IS is very helpful (see picture a 1/8s)
  • f4 vs. f1.7 - it is still fun to play with DoF and bokeh (see picture of a cat)
  • I don`t like the extra dials on the 100RF as I am a RAW shooter anyway
  • I am German - a Q2 being produced in Germany gives me some sentimental value and reminds me of the days when Leica, Rollei and Voigtländer ruled the photography world
So no consensus - just personal thoughts.

Leica Q2 at f2

Leica Q2 at f2

Leica Q2, 1/8s handheld
Leica Q2, 1/8s handheld
Nice images! Love that cat!
 
Ignoring the hype, do photographers and credible reviewers have a consensus yet on this new, fixed lens model? Anyone care to attempt objectivity and boil it down for a FF user? Thank you for your concise thoughts. I see lots for sale on Fred Miranda.
Honestly, I haven’t even reached consensus with myself, let alone other people. It is an extreme anomaly of a camera.

The long story short is this: I was intrigued, then excited, pre-ordered one, handled it, rejected it, hired one, came to terms with it, pre-ordered another one, bought it, and only a very short time later sold it.

There are some key events in there, easily the most significant of which is what happened between the last two items in the list: Fujifilm announced the X-E5.

For me as an amateur, the 100RF was on a new level of expenditure. Previously I had peaked at paying just over £2000 for a 50R body. (Plus another £1500 or something on the 23 and 50mm lenses, though I later sold those for pretty much exactly what I paid. For what it’s worth, I have zero regrets about buying the 50R: it is the most wonderful camera I have ever used and if it failed today I would immediately buy another.)

But I saw the 100RF as a replacement for X System. At my most-used view of 35-40mm equivalent, it would churn out 60MP which was more than enough, and it would also give me the option to capture 100MP at a wide angle for landscapes etc.

The handling suited me. It performed well—I was very pleasantly surprised by the AF—and of course produced great sharp images. I had no issue with it being f/4 without IBIS, in terms of its usable envelope, and I knew beforehand that it would be fine in that respect. Perhaps most importantly of all it has the best top-left viewfinder that Fujifilm offer. Only the 100RF and the 50R have big EVFs in the rangefinder-style location, and that is a big deal for me. It’s one of the key reasons I bought the 50R: nothing in the X System provides that EVF experience.

However, a few things didn’t gel with me. I always said from the time the rumours started that for me it would live or die based on how Fuji implemented the crop-zoom and the aspect ratios. I never expected them to deliver what I wanted; I set my expectations accordingly, which was fine.

But one thing I was not expecting: the fact that when you turn the camera on, the crop does not return to where it was when you turned it off. If I was in the 45mm crop, a power cycle would return it to the full sensor view. It seems a small thing, but for me it makes a fundamental difference in how the camera wants to be used: it is a 28mm-equivalent camera that offers a lot of cropping potential, but it is not a camera that can act as a drop-in substitute for another camera fitted with a 28, 35 or 50mm equivalent prime.

I had a problem with that; a problem which was exacerbated by the fact that an f/4 wide angle lens does not give much assistance in reducing the level of detail that the 100MP chucks out. (I was actually ok with setting the image size to “medium”, but of course the raw file is still an absolute tsunami of fine detail.)

As an aside: I realise that criticising the detail available in a 100MP medium format camera is on the face of it a ridiculous stance to take. But it’s more about how that detail is relentless and ubiquitous with no real devices to be able to suppress it. Often I want that detail. Other times I wish it would leave me alone. I would have developed some sort of strategy in time, I’m sure.

I am someone who finds that tools inform the process and the results: cameras and lenses both guide me in certain ways and what I come up with is a product of those influences almost as much as it is my own expression. So it’s important for me to feel comfortable with where a camera leads me. I found that it was an outstanding camera for X-Pan format at full resolution, but I also felt that at more conventional aspect ratios it took me to places I didn’t want to go, for much the same reason as I sold my GF lenses: the cleanliness and the level of detail worked in some situations but too much of the time led me to uninteresting or clichéd results.

None of which was to say that the 100RF was a bad camera, nor even that it wouldn’t have worked for me. I could have happily lived with it: I have the 50R and old lenses as my beloved antithesis of the ultra-high fidelity GF rendering.

But then the X-E5 was announced, along with a second pancake that was right in my window. Not 100MP, but plenty enough—and at 35mm equivalent actually pretty comparable with the 100RF. Smaller, lighter, some enticing usability improvements (not just the brilliant front lever inherited from the RF, but signs that Fuji is starting to understand recipes) and most of all a lot less expensive. Selling the RF so soon after buying it lost me nearly £1000; but I am not one to be drawn into the sunken cost fallacy, and replacing it with the X-E5 and the pancake put over £2000 back in my pocket.

So, in a very longwinded way, I think this alludes to one of the reasons consensus is so hard to achieve on this camera.

If you come at it from the medium format ground, it looks restrictive. It is restrictive. Of course it is. But it’s also small, incredibly nice to handle, discreet, and incredibly powerful. If you like 28mm equivalent, small and wieldy cameras, and highly detailed images, it is an absolute triumph.

If you come at it from the APS-C ground, it looks extremely expensive. And, from that perspective, it is. But it can—for many, but far from all, use cases—replace a lot of kit with one package, whilst delivering immense image quality at the wide angle. If you like 28mm equivalent, small and wieldy cameras, and highly detailed images, it is an absolute triumph.

The tricky thing with the 100RF is finding the right bit of a Venn diagram. That’s an inevitable thing for any fixed lens camera, but for a camera like this that sits in a chasm between two very different systems with very different users who have very different expectations, it’s even more true.

It is brilliant. But, at its price point, does it do enough to lift it above smaller formats? For some people, for the immediate future, sure. But it’s a real misfit. All the best things are.
 
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A nice story and an effective way to get at the conundrum that is the RF.

You mentioned the XE5. Looking at the review photos, it looks beautiful to me similar to the way the X100 looks beautiful, Leica rangefinders look beautiful and the Epson RD1 looks beautiful. It has the classic all round balanced look the smartest of rangefinder style cameras have that seems to be beyond most SLR styles cameras. My GAS is engaged immediately simply because of the looks.

But... I used to own the first XE1 (a bit pig-ugly in comparison) and an XA1. I found that the problem with them is that even with the help of half cases or accessory grips, they were hard to hold. Soon as you stick on the 18-135 superzoom or anything bigger that is front heavy and torques the camera downwards, you have to hold it the old fashioned way with the left hand underneath taking the weight. I really don't want to hold cameras like that any more, I much prefer a proper right hand grip. All these essentially flat grip-less cameras (even the X-T1 style body) are nice to look at, but a pain to hold and use unless you mount tiny pancake style lenses.

I am tempted to get myself an XE5 but I know it would end up being a toy to play with, not a day to day camera.
 
Ignoring the hype, do photographers and credible reviewers have a consensus yet on this new, fixed lens model? Anyone care to attempt objectivity and boil it down for a FF user? Thank you for your concise thoughts. I see lots for sale on Fred Miranda.
Sorry if you've seen this already. I found it to be credible from someone who owns a good bit of high-end gear and seems to have a lot of photographic experience.

 
But... I used to own the first XE1 (a bit pig-ugly in comparison) and an XA1. I found that the problem with them is that even with the help of half cases or accessory grips, they were hard to hold. Soon as you stick on the 18-135 superzoom or anything bigger that is front heavy and torques the camera downwards, you have to hold it the old fashioned way with the left hand underneath taking the weight. I really don't want to hold cameras like that any more, I much prefer a proper right hand grip. All these essentially flat grip-less cameras (even the X-T1 style body) are nice to look at, but a pain to hold and use unless you mount tiny pancake style lenses.
Oh, I love flat gripless cameras, can’t get on with bulky grips 🙂

They’re so much more wieldy and fluid, much more comfortable in a variety of subtly different positions. I rarely use large lenses, but it’s never a problem when I do. I get why some people like a big grip but for me it just creates problems and I feel detached from the camera.

Any camera with a viewfinder is primarily a two-handed camera for me at the point of shooting, hence any sized lens being fine once it’s to my eye. I waver between making occasional use of a rear screen and never going there at all; never used them on the X-Pros.

If I’m flying one-handed, it’s Ricoh GR time.
 
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I don't know. I went to play with one at Adorama and didn't have high expectations. I ended up liking it so much that I traded in my Q43. I find the camera very engaging, very well built, probably the best from Fuji that I've handled. I knew what to expect from an F4 lens and no IBIS and I adapt the way I shoot with it accordingly. The best surprise (to me, sorry all the tech nerds), is that the camera's distortion is akin to a 35mm lens and not the 28mm field of view it has in FF terms. My Q3 (owned before the Q43) had a lot more distortion that made it more difficult to photograph people. As far as DOF is concerned, I do not really care. I found that whenever I had the chance to use an extremely brite lens, I became lazy with my composition and relied mostly on the artistic nature of shallow DOF. I sometimes use AI for DOF, it's not ideal, but works better and better.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Elie

--
"There is only you and your camera. The limitations in your photography are in yourself, for what we see is what we are." - Ernst Haas
 
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But... I used to own the first XE1 (a bit pig-ugly in comparison) and an XA1. I found that the problem with them is that even with the help of half cases or accessory grips, they were hard to hold. Soon as you stick on the 18-135 superzoom or anything bigger that is front heavy and torques the camera downwards, you have to hold it the old fashioned way with the left hand underneath taking the weight. I really don't want to hold cameras like that any more, I much prefer a proper right hand grip. All these essentially flat grip-less cameras (even the X-T1 style body) are nice to look at, but a pain to hold and use unless you mount tiny pancake style lenses.
Oh, I love flat gripless cameras, can’t get on with bulky grips 🙂

They’re so much more wieldy and fluid, much more comfortable in a variety of subtly different positions. I rarely use large lenses, but it’s never a problem when I do. I get why some people like a big grip but for me it just creates problems and I feel detached from the camera.

Any camera with a viewfinder is primarily a two-handed camera for me at the point of shooting, hence any sized lens being fine once it’s to my eye. I waver between making occasional use of a rear screen and never going there at all; never used them on the X-Pros.

If I’m flying one-handed, it’s Ricoh GR time.
I agree on the two handed hold, but its the hand that bears the weight that is the issue.

With a right hand grip the right hand naturally prevents the camera with a front heavy lens from tilting downward. I find this tilt is hard to suppress without a beefy grip.

My favourite in this respect is my old Pentax K5. I fitted it with a ridiculous long tamron superzoom 28-375mm equivalent and repurposed it to replace the bridge camera I sold. It's a preposterous lens at max zoom, but the grip on the K5 is so perfect for my hand that I can literally let go of the grip and it just balances using the front and rear overhangs without any applied hand gripping at all.

With the XE1, even bulked out with a fat and rigid half case, it required an exhausting grip of death to keep it steady. Same problem with the X-T100 with its stupid tiny screw on grip. And to a lesser extent with the X-T1 with its half grip.

The only exception I've come across so far with grip-less cameras is the GX7. It doesn't have a grip, more a fat rubber bump. But it's shape is just enough to get the job done.

I guess it all depends on the lenses you use, the shape of your hand and your hand strength.

This website https://cameraergonomics.blogspot.com/p/measuring-ergonomics.html is an interesting site. It focuses mainly on aspects of ergonomics and user interface design for cameras. The site owner has gone to the trouble of building dummy cameras to test handgrip and button positions and developing a measurement system for different aspects of usability.

I don't always agree with him but he is very thorough.

--
2024: Awarded Royal Photographic Society LRPS Distinction
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Measurements

Latitude London

Noon midsummer

Clear day, with blazing sun, maybe a bit of haze higher up

Panel orientated as head on as possible. It's a slightly flexible panel so without support it curves a bit so not exactly face on.

I don't have two multimeters that are working at the moment so I had to measure voltage and current separately

Short circuit Voltage: 26v (in spec with label on the rear of panel)

Open circuit current: 5A (the label say 8A)
How can there be any current at all into an open circuit? I'm confused here.
 
This is a bit like a debate over whether a Ferrari is cheap because a Mcclaren is more expensive...
I have a friend who was into mountain biking. Someone asked him how he could justify the admittedly large expenses for gear. He said: "It could be worse. I could be into airplanes, sailboats, or women other than my wife."
 
Ignoring the hype, do photographers and credible reviewers have a consensus yet on this new, fixed lens model? Anyone care to attempt objectivity and boil it down for a FF user? Thank you for your concise thoughts. I see lots for sale on Fred Miranda.
Honestly, I haven’t even reached consensus with myself, let alone other people. It is an extreme anomaly of a camera.

The long story short is this: I was intrigued, then excited, pre-ordered one, handled it, rejected it, hired one, came to terms with it, pre-ordered another one, bought it, and only a very short time later sold it.

There are some key events in there, easily the most significant of which is what happened between the last two items in the list: Fujifilm announced the X-E5.

For me as an amateur, the 100RF was on a new level of expenditure. Previously I had peaked at paying just over £2000 for a 50R body. (Plus another £1500 or something on the 23 and 50mm lenses, though I later sold those for pretty much exactly what I paid. For what it’s worth, I have zero regrets about buying the 50R: it is the most wonderful camera I have ever used and if it failed today I would immediately buy another.)

But I saw the 100RF as a replacement for X System. At my most-used view of 35-40mm equivalent, it would churn out 60MP which was more than enough, and it would also give me the option to capture 100MP at a wide angle for landscapes etc.

The handling suited me. It performed well—I was very pleasantly surprised by the AF—and of course produced great sharp images. I had no issue with it being f/4 without IBIS, in terms of its usable envelope, and I knew beforehand that it would be fine in that respect. Perhaps most importantly of all it has the best top-left viewfinder that Fujifilm offer. Only the 100RF and the 50R have big EVFs in the rangefinder-style location, and that is a big deal for me. It’s one of the key reasons I bought the 50R: nothing in the X System provides that EVF experience.

However, a few things didn’t gel with me. I always said from the time the rumours started that for me it would live or die based on how Fuji implemented the crop-zoom and the aspect ratios. I never expected them to deliver what I wanted; I set my expectations accordingly, which was fine.

But one thing I was not expecting: the fact that when you turn the camera on, the crop does not return to where it was when you turned it off. If I was in the 45mm crop, a power cycle would return it to the full sensor view. It seems a small thing, but for me it makes a fundamental difference in how the camera wants to be used: it is a 28mm-equivalent camera that offers a lot of cropping potential, but it is not a camera that can act as a drop-in substitute for another camera fitted with a 28, 35 or 50mm equivalent prime.

I had a problem with that; a problem which was exacerbated by the fact that an f/4 wide angle lens does not give much assistance in reducing the level of detail that the 100MP chucks out. (I was actually ok with setting the image size to “medium”, but of course the raw file is still an absolute tsunami of fine detail.)

As an aside: I realise that criticising the detail available in a 100MP medium format camera is on the face of it a ridiculous stance to take. But it’s more about how that detail is relentless and ubiquitous with no real devices to be able to suppress it. Often I want that detail. Other times I wish it would leave me alone. I would have developed some sort of strategy in time, I’m sure.

I am someone who finds that tools inform the process and the results: cameras and lenses both guide me in certain ways and what I come up with is a product of those influences almost as much as it is my own expression. So it’s important for me to feel comfortable with where a camera leads me. I found that it was an outstanding camera for X-Pan format at full resolution, but I also felt that at more conventional aspect ratios it took me to places I didn’t want to go, for much the same reason as I sold my GF lenses: the cleanliness and the level of detail worked in some situations but too much of the time led me to uninteresting or clichéd results.

None of which was to say that the 100RF was a bad camera, nor even that it wouldn’t have worked for me. I could have happily lived with it: I have the 50R and old lenses as my beloved antithesis of the ultra-high fidelity GF rendering.

But then the X-E5 was announced, along with a second pancake that was right in my window. Not 100MP, but plenty enough—and at 35mm equivalent actually pretty comparable with the 100RF. Smaller, lighter, some enticing usability improvements (not just the brilliant front lever inherited from the RF, but signs that Fuji is starting to understand recipes) and most of all a lot less expensive. Selling the RF so soon after buying it lost me nearly £1000; but I am not one to be drawn into the sunken cost fallacy, and replacing it with the X-E5 and the pancake put over £2000 back in my pocket.

So, in a very longwinded way, I think this alludes to one of the reasons consensus is so hard to achieve on this camera.

If you come at it from the medium format ground, it looks restrictive. It is restrictive. Of course it is. But it’s also small, incredibly nice to handle, discreet, and incredibly powerful. If you like 28mm equivalent, small and wieldy cameras, and highly detailed images, it is an absolute triumph.

If you come at it from the APS-C ground, it looks extremely expensive. And, from that perspective, it is. But it can—for many, but far from all, use cases—replace a lot of kit with one package, whilst delivering immense image quality at the wide angle. If you like 28mm equivalent, small and wieldy cameras, and highly detailed images, it is an absolute triumph.

The tricky thing with the 100RF is finding the right bit of a Venn diagram. That’s an inevitable thing for any fixed lens camera, but for a camera like this that sits in a chasm between two very different systems with very different users who have very different expectations, it’s even more true.

It is brilliant. But, at its price point, does it do enough to lift it above smaller formats? For some people, for the immediate future, sure. But it’s a real misfit. All the best things are.
This mimics my experience, except I kept mine. I am hoping a firmware fix will allow us to LOCK in the zoom, as I agree with you, sometimes I want to stay at on of the other zooms, and not need to reset it.
 
But... I used to own the first XE1 (a bit pig-ugly in comparison) and an XA1. I found that the problem with them is that even with the help of half cases or accessory grips, they were hard to hold. Soon as you stick on the 18-135 superzoom or anything bigger that is front heavy and torques the camera downwards, you have to hold it the old fashioned way with the left hand underneath taking the weight. I really don't want to hold cameras like that any more, I much prefer a proper right hand grip. All these essentially flat grip-less cameras (even the X-T1 style body) are nice to look at, but a pain to hold and use unless you mount tiny pancake style lenses.
Oh, I love flat gripless cameras, can’t get on with bulky grips 🙂

They’re so much more wieldy and fluid, much more comfortable in a variety of subtly different positions. I rarely use large lenses, but it’s never a problem when I do. I get why some people like a big grip but for me it just creates problems and I feel detached from the camera.

Any camera with a viewfinder is primarily a two-handed camera for me at the point of shooting, hence any sized lens being fine once it’s to my eye. I waver between making occasional use of a rear screen and never going there at all; never used them on the X-Pros.

If I’m flying one-handed, it’s Ricoh GR time.
I agree on the two handed hold, but its the hand that bears the weight that is the issue.

With a right hand grip the right hand naturally prevents the camera with a front heavy lens from tilting downward. I find this tilt is hard to suppress without a beefy grip.

My favourite in this respect is my old Pentax K5. I fitted it with a ridiculous long tamron superzoom 28-375mm equivalent and repurposed it to replace the bridge camera I sold. It's a preposterous lens at max zoom, but the grip on the K5 is so perfect for my hand that I can literally let go of the grip and it just balances using the front and rear overhangs without any applied hand gripping at all.

With the XE1, even bulked out with a fat and rigid half case, it required an exhausting grip of death to keep it steady. Same problem with the X-T100 with its stupid tiny screw on grip. And to a lesser extent with the X-T1 with its half grip.

The only exception I've come across so far with grip-less cameras is the GX7. It doesn't have a grip, more a fat rubber bump. But it's shape is just enough to get the job done.

I guess it all depends on the lenses you use, the shape of your hand and your hand strength.

This website https://cameraergonomics.blogspot.com/p/measuring-ergonomics.html is an interesting site. It focuses mainly on aspects of ergonomics and user interface design for cameras. The site owner has gone to the trouble of building dummy cameras to test handgrip and button positions and developing a measurement system for different aspects of usability.

I don't always agree with him but he is very thorough.
I'm a big fan of less is more - and that is true with it comes to the extra grips that have become a fad in photographic equipment. If such grips were custom fit to the hands, then they could provide some benefit in some situations but they are not. The only think my Z8 grip is good for is it allows me to easily carry the camera with a clutch attached with one hand securely. It aids nothing in shooting - even with a long lens. If the lens is too long to hold the camera stable - it needs a tripod or monopod not a grip. You don't see many snipers hand hold a 50 cal sniper rifle hitting a target 2 clicks away without a barrel tripod or bipod.

I mentored a Command Master Sargent Sniper in photography and he mentored and coached me in my competitive shooting days. I made him a better photographer and he made me a better photographer along with a few first place prizes in my shooting hobby.

How did he make me a better photographer - his firearms coaching resulted in a much more stable platform and better photographic skill craft.

The key in both is proper technique - and amazedly enough hitting a bulls eye shot after shot in succession and hitting every image sharp and in focus are common skills. You get better at both by embracing the suck of missed shots or bad images and keep on training until the suck is not as bad and keep training more.

The worst habit one sees in both new shooters and new photographers is using only one eye, not synchronizing breathing with the trigger or shutter, to much pressure on trigger or shutter and the "chicken wing" off arm position. This will be the left arm for a photographer. It could be either for a rifle or hand gun. By that I mean when the left arm is open in the air like a chicken holding his wing out. That elbow should be planted firmly against the body for stability. Along with that, gun shooters practice and prefect what is know as "push-pull." That is the hand on the handle (in case of the camera the right hand on the camera) gives a slight push to to the other hand which provides resistance with a slight "pull." That provides stability in both cases.



For my hands the GFX100RF is almost a perfect size with a nice bump that allows my hand to relax around the camera. The dimensions for the buttons is almost perfect to use the AEL/AFL button for BBF and remove the shutter for focusing nonsense. Any larger "grip" I would find uncomfortable and if you are uncomfortable your images will suffer. My relationship with the Z8 is pretty much a love hate relationship. The grip - while nice for stable one handed carrying - pretty much sucks for shooting. I have been around long enough to work around it and the Z8 IBIS probably helps some. But the grip pretty much sucks for all lenses.
 

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