Expired film?

photoholiko

Veteran Member
Messages
4,468
Solutions
3
Reaction score
2,572
Location
Indiana, USA
I know this subject has been discussed before, but I would like to know if some of you would be kind enough to give their thoughts and experience on using expired films. What adjustments would you make to the exposures and ISO ratings. I have both 35 and 120 film from Kodak, Fuji and others.

Thanking you truly.
 
Assuming you have enough film to spare, simply give it a try. Bracket. You could call it "wasting a roll" or you could call it "an investment in calibration" :)

Go outside on a sunny day (so the "Sunny 16" rule will be easy to work with). Point your camera in the opposite direction from the sun so you don't get any flare on the lens. Try to get a variety of objects in the frame, light and dark, so you can judge how well exposed the highlights and shadows are.

Set your shutter speed to the inverse of the film's rated ISO speed, and your aperture to f/16. Then take identical shots, opening up the aperture by a stop (or less if you prefer) until the aperture is wide open, keeping the shutter speed constant. You don't need to use up the whole roll. The shots don't need to be interesting or even very sharp.

Have the film developed by a reputable lab so the chemistry & temps are known to be controlled, unless you have a lot of experience at home developing.

Examine the film. If the shot at f/16 is underexposed but the shot at f/11 looks good, and the film was rated at ISO 100, then you know you need to expose the other rolls in that batch by a stop, or set your meter to ISO 50. If f/8 looks optimal then two stops, etc. Or choose a number in between if you prefer.

That will work well for negatives. For slide film you might wish to calibrate to half or third stops.

Once you've got the compensation dialed in, write it down on a slip of paper and put it in a freezer bag along with the rest of the rolls from that batch, and freeze it. That compensation value will be valid for that batch for several decades if the film is kept frozen.

Give a roll of frozen film about 2 hours at room temperature before opening it up, so you don't get condensation.

If the shots are important and the lighting is uncertain, always bracket.

Best of luck,
Sterling
--
Lens Grit
 
Thank you very much for your advice, I will look into doing that. I will post results when that happens.
 
The rule of thumb if you know the films age (and it’s negative film) is to add one stop of exposure for each 10 years past the date. So if it expired in 2005 and it’s a ISO400 speed film then shoot it at ISO100. And then like SterlingBjorndahl says above, bracket the exposures. You will probably find you don’t need so severe an overexposure, but negative film can take overexposure well, and bracketing will give you the correct exposure. This assumes of course that you have more than one roll.
 
Last edited:
Yes, color neg film is tolerant of over-exposure.

With black and white film, I would develop with a restrainer (benzotriazole) to suppress base fog. Did that also when there was some time between exposing the film and processing it.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
 
Last edited:
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
 
That's good to know, I have some experimenting to do.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
Are you sure there wasn't something wrong with the camera? Before digital and when I was mostly taking snap shots, I would regularly leave a roll in a camera for a year or more and the images would be fine. This was consumer grade colour film. B/W film should be more stable.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
Are you sure there wasn't something wrong with the camera? Before digital and when I was mostly taking snap shots, I would regularly leave a roll in a camera for a year or more and the images would be fine. This was consumer grade colour film. B/W film should be more stable.
It’s a specific thing with Pan F. Ilford say “Once exposed, process PAN F Plus as soon as practical – we recommend within 3 months.” - https://www.ilfordphoto.com/amfile/file/download/file/1905/product/700/
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
Are you sure there wasn't something wrong with the camera? Before digital and when I was mostly taking snap shots, I would regularly leave a roll in a camera for a year or more and the images would be fine. This was consumer grade colour film. B/W film should be more stable.
Nope, the camera was fine as demonstrated by all the most recently exposed images being fine. (Fine, but not Pulitzer Prize winners :-) )

Perhaps you missed my point that the edge markings were also gone, latent images faded away. Those are exposed in the factory, not the camera.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
Are you sure there wasn't something wrong with the camera? Before digital and when I was mostly taking snap shots, I would regularly leave a roll in a camera for a year or more and the images would be fine. This was consumer grade colour film. B/W film should be more stable.
It’s a specific thing with Pan F. Ilford say “Once exposed, process PAN F Plus as soon as practical – we recommend within 3 months.” - https://www.ilfordphoto.com/amfile/file/download/file/1905/product/700/
Thanks for the clarification. I wonder what it is about this film's chemistry that makes it unstable beyond 3mths post exposure?

NB I also looked at Kodak Gold tech sheet and it also said developed as soon as possible but it doesn't state a time frame.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
Are you sure there wasn't something wrong with the camera? Before digital and when I was mostly taking snap shots, I would regularly leave a roll in a camera for a year or more and the images would be fine. This was consumer grade colour film. B/W film should be more stable.
Nope, the camera was fine as demonstrated by all the most recently exposed images being fine. (Fine, but not Pulitzer Prize winners :-) )

Perhaps you missed my point that the edge markings were also gone, latent images faded away. Those are exposed in the factory, not the camera
Oops! Yes I did miss that.
 
Depends entirely on the specific film. I have 55 year old bulk Kodak Panatomic X that has been stored everywhere in my homes, mainly in a bin in the garage. Except for a little increase in base fog, it's as good as new. Still rated ASA.
I had 20 yr over exp bulk TMax 100 and it worked fine at ISO 100. I think b&w films don't degrade as fast as color. Some Ektacrome in the same box had a compromised D-Max ( base color) but the colors weren't bad just no blacks.
Except for Ilford Pan F. I have no idea how long the film will be usable if not exposed. Several years probably. But if not processed within a few months of exposure, the latent image will fade away. I found a roll of partially used roll of Pan F in my Nikon F 100, finished the roll and had it processed. the first area on the roll was blank, as was all the edge markings. The new exposures were fine. The film had been in the camera for about a year.
Are you sure there wasn't something wrong with the camera? Before digital and when I was mostly taking snap shots, I would regularly leave a roll in a camera for a year or more and the images would be fine. This was consumer grade colour film. B/W film should be more stable.
It’s a specific thing with Pan F. Ilford say “Once exposed, process PAN F Plus as soon as practical – we recommend within 3 months.” - https://www.ilfordphoto.com/amfile/file/download/file/1905/product/700/
Thanks for the clarification. I wonder what it is about this film's chemistry that makes it unstable beyond 3mths post exposure?

NB I also looked at Kodak Gold tech sheet and it also said developed as soon as possible but it doesn't state a time frame.
With Pan-F it also only seems to affect photos that you’ve taken. As far as I know it’s not affected by being out of date more than any other film.
 
I have dozens of rolls of 2007-2009 Fuji Superia X-tra 400 35mm in my stash. Always kept in the freezer for the first 1.5 decade or so, then the refrigerator for the last 5 years.

For the last year I have been shooting a roll a month, with my daughter. The results are totally hit or miss, and these days more miss than hit: the images are radically underexposed, even with +2 compensation (following the "1 stop per decade" internet wisdom). Occasionally a roll will come out nicely, but even then it is obvious the film is old.

The old film used to work like a charm, but I believe we have passed the threshold of usability. My advise is don't do it, if you care about the results, at least not with this film stock at this age.
 
Thanks for telling me your experience, when the weather changes, I'll try a couple, just for my own experience.
 
If you are working to get fine images and prints - why waste the time on on film that may be sub standard?

Sensitivity and color response changes as film ages. Fog levels increase.

If you don't care - OR - if you like surprises then use it. Otherwise stick with what you know works and is reliable.
 
I've used up film that was in the camera, I believe it was Portra 400 120, sitting for probably 10 years. The images I took were washed out, but the old pics on the roll looked absolutely fine like they were taken yesterday on fresh film. Just today I put my shots into Lightroom and I saw the histogram showed color shifts, the red, blue and green all started at different points. I lined them all up and voila! Colors look fine now. That is one experience.

A few weeks ago I finished off a roll of expired Fuji Superia 400 in a camera I was testing out, this time 35mm. The colors look OK but the grain is really bad. Along with that roll I developed a roll of Superia 800 at the same time from another camera I was testing. Also too grainy, except this camera had some existing pics on it. These were much less grainy.

Those 2 35mm rolls could have suffered from bad development too since I did them myself. The chemicals had maybe 4 or 5 rolls on them and were about a month old. It should be OK but who knows. Of course now that these 2 came out this way I don't trust the chemicals and will want yet another batch, but if I keep buying fresh chemicals it negates the savings of doing it myself.

Anyway, my advice is to only use expired film if you are willing to have imperfect results. There is only so much you can do in LR or whatever you use to make up for lost detail in the grain.
 
Thanks for sharing your experience.
 

Keyboard shortcuts

Back
Top