Non-camera backpacks: Mammut Trion, Arva Tour, Gregory Targhee 26, Peak Design Outdoor 25L

This general topic has been discussed before, but I thought I'd share my recent personal experiences. For reference, see:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/65951072

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/66146074

Like many others, I find photography-specific backpacks to be uncomfortable for hiking. God knows I've tried so many, from LowePro, ThinkTank, Fstop, Manfrotto, Tamrac, Tenba, etc. In general they feel like bricks. So in recent years I've been using several Mammut Trion with various inserts. This has a back panel opening that makes it so well suited for photography.

For an upcoming trip, I am looking for something smaller than the Trion 50L, and larger than the Peak Design Everyday Zip 20L. The Zip 20L has enough volume, but the dividers don't accommodate the extra lenses so well, and it's uncomfortable carrying the weight of my gear. I have a Peak Design Everyday 30L (flap top), but I find the internal dividers to be very space-inefficient, and less able to carry other non-camera gear, such as clothing layers, snacks, etc.

My gear list for this trip will be:

• Z8 with 100-400 (possibly with 1.4x)
• Z7 with 24-120
• 14-30
• 50 f/1.8
• MacBook Pro 14"

The trip will have two distinct halves: winter landscape photography in Hokkaido, then urban/family photography in Kansai. Hence the desire for a pack that's rugged enough for a rural setting, but slim and trim enough for the city.

Mammut Trion 50

First, let's start with my tried-and-true. This or earlier versions have accompanied me to Antarctica, Iceland, South America, Alaska, Yosemite, Death Valley, etc. The insert you see in the photos is an SKB 5DV-2011-TT, but I've also used the Pelican 015100-4050-000. Both are designed for hard cases, but fit well, and offer great customization. I have the Trion 35 as well. Its length and width are exactly the same as the 50. Its depth is less, and just fits the inserts, but leaves little room for extra gear, such as a laptop.

There's a simple steel wire hoop frame inside the main bag, and another set of spring steel stiffeners in the back panel. I carry loads >20 lbs routinely, for a few miles, at least, and I find the weight well distributed on the hip belt. Trions from the past several years added stretch water bottle pockets on both sides, and a zip pocket on the belt. The stretch pockets and cinch straps work well for tripods, at least up to "2-series" (in Gitzo speak).

Looks like the 35L Trion is now discontinued, but the 50L carries on. Just in case, I stocked up during last season's sales























Arva Tour 32

My quest for a smaller bag with back panel opening led me logically to ski touring packs, but the Arva Tour line is unique in having numerous side pockets for water bottles & tripods. These are very light bags, with little structure, and no metal frame. The perforated foam sheet in the back panel is the only support. But because the hip belt wraps around your lower back, I found that the gear above was comfortable, at least while walking the dog.

The insert you see is the Dakine Photo Insert Pro. It's a fairly well-structured insert, and its stiffness contributes to the support and comfort of the pack. A softer insert was not as comfortable. The sample insert was too snug in the Arva Tour 25, which once again has the same length and width, but is less deep. As you can see the MacBook Pro 14 fits perfectly in the hydration bladder pocket.

Personally, I liked it quite a bit, but my wife vetoed it based on looks. I might reconsider if it goes on sale after ski season.























Gregory Targhee 26

Gregory makes my favorite day packs, the Zulu series. The Targhee is a well-structured ski pack, and comes in several sizes. It doesn't have water bottle pockets, but I found it straightforward to add some. It has many specific ski-carrying features that I will never use, so they add unnecessary weight and complexity.

Nevertheless, the pack is a very comfortable camera-carrier. There are spring steel wires in the back panel only. Here, I'm using an old ThinkTank insert (the Stash Master™ Pro is its closest current match). Funny enough, it fits best upside down, and aligns well with a fabric panel inside the bottom of the pack. I can flip the padded opening down to shield the laptop, or flip it up out of the way when I'm in shooting mode. There's plenty of room on top of the insert for lunch. The front avalanche gear pocket is roomy enough for additional clothing. The Dakine insert was a bit snug, due to that fabric panel and the shape of the bottom of the pack. As with the Arva, the MacBook Pro fits well in the hydration pocket.

This pack was only $85 in the recent REI clearance, and my wife approves the look, so despite its lack of side pockets, this will be my choice for the upcoming trip.



























Peak Design Outdoor 25L

We did go to the San Francisco store to check out the newly-announced Peak Design Outdoor 25L pack. The pack looks nice, with great materials, in true Peak Design fashion However, the ThinkTank insert barely fit... the back panel zipper needed some help to close. The "smedium" size insert made by Peak Design is not nearly big enough for my gear; larger Peak Design inserts are not recommended.

But the overall impression of this pack is that it is overly fussy. The back zip works well, but the top openings are unnecessary complicated, different for the sake of being different, not necessarily better. They did adopt a plastic squeeze buckle for the waist belt (not included), but the sternum straps (2 of them) are difficult to use hooks. So despite the additional incentives for backing the Kickstarter in-store, we decided to pass.



Anyway, I hope these comments have been helpful! Let me know if you have any questions.

The information on the Mammut 50 and the insert with pics is super helpful! I am going to keep this pack on my list to buy when I see a sale.

Curious on the insert: it looks like it is only 5" deep - have you had any issues with this depth? The Z8 is a chunk and stands tall...

jmccas said:

Curious on the insert: it looks like it is only 5" deep - have you had any issues with this depth? The Z8 is a chunk and stands tall...

Click to expand...

I've had the Z8 both on its bottom and on its side in the insert... I haven't experienced any issues. Perhaps there's more pressure on the body when on its side, but I don't feel it on my back, as the rear panel padding is quite adequate.

The Trion 50 is quite deep, allowing the insert plenty of room. The Trion 35 is just deep enough for the insert, so perhaps the Z8 sideways would be tight.

Yes these are better than basically most camera specific pacs and cheaper too (I suspect the two TMP coming out might be better for actually hiking stuff), if one insist on having backpanel entrance to the gear.

But personally I never liked climbing or skiing packs for other than short duration and for what those are designed for in terms of action packed activities.

If you have flatback syndrome it might be different.

These also lack the pouches for water bottles and can be a bit or a pain to carry much in, as their load carrying capacity is on the lower end, those aren’t really made to haul lots of stuff around but more carrying the equipment for the climb and skiing, which has some physical limitations.

For me these are like camera packs a daytrip pack or a walk from a car pack, because these aren’t built to take or haul all the stuff needed for longer duration. Also like any moulded pp not fantastic in hot and humid weather, again not really designed purpose of them.

I do agree camera packs are generally uncomfortable, this is especially true if you have a longer back. Their main gain is fundamentally you can take most onboard a European flight, which isn’t always possible with actual hiking packs and also a problem with skiing packs with internal frame (typically too tall)

SFShooter said:

Like many others, I find photography-specific backpacks to be uncomfortable for hiking. God knows I've tried so many, from LowePro, ThinkTank, Fstop, Manfrotto, Tamrac, Tenba, etc. In general they feel like bricks.

For an upcoming trip, I am looking for something smaller than the Trion 50L, and larger than the Peak Design Everyday Zip 20L. The Zip 20L has enough volume, but the dividers don't accommodate the extra lenses so well, and it's uncomfortable carrying the weight of my gear. I have a Peak Design Everyday 30L (flap top), but I find the internal dividers to be very space-inefficient, and less able to carry other non-camera gear, such as clothing layers, snacks, etc.

Click to expand...

Wish PD put their new outdoor harness system on their everyday line. I've tried a bunch of "camera specific" backpacks too over the years. Out of the bunch Shimoda is the one I find most comfortable without venturing into real hiking packs.

Shimoda women line is the only version that uses perforated mesh padding on the backpanel & straps. Not sure why they don't offer for mens line too, but women fits fine on men.



This is my Explore v2 25 which fits a Sony 200-600 with body, 70-200 & room to spare for another lens. Their website says the 25L can only fit the medium mirrorless core unit inserts but I was able to squeeze in the large mirrorless core unit. It was snug, had to insert from the top instead of rear but worked.







There is also the new PGYTECH OnePro Flex 25L which looks promising. Early shipment out next month. Has the layout of Shimoda, PD outdoor kangroo pouch minus fussy cords and Osprey harness/TMP system.