The PC Super-Angulon 28mm f/2.8 by Schneider-Kreuznach (and Leica): a Deep Dive

I've used this lens extensively on a Nikon d800, and gotten great results. But based on this experience, it's hard to imagine it working well on a GFX camera.

I found a very narrow sweet spot for this lens: f11 to f16, and no more than 6mm vertical shift, if there's any fine detail in the upper corners.

This translates to a sharp image circle of just over 53mm ... not quite enough to cover the GFX sensor unshifted.

So I'll be waiting for the native Fuji lens, and looking for a new home for the dear Schneider. And if the price of the Fuji makes my eyeballs explode, maybe I'll try a 35mm Pentax 645 lens with a t/s adapter.

I will say that within the sweet spot on 35mm, results are excellent. I've made 40" and 60" prints that were frequently mistaken for large format (possibly by people who'd had some wine at the opening), and that looked as good to me as the best prints from my Nikon 14-24.

I found all the (older generation) Nikon PC lenses to be lousy on Nikon as well. Haven't tried the newer ones.

Printing 40" x60" with the sweet spot is a testament to how good a lens this is. I suspect your demands will be hard to match with any lens. I use shifted medium format film lenses on 50MP FF and I doubt the Pentax 35mm will live up to your corner criteria. I am not sure Fuji will be able to approach what Rodenstock is doing with medium format lenses.

I suspect that I, and many others, would be very pleased with fully shifted/stitched images from the Schneider at 40" x 60".

Again your results reinforce just how good a lens this must be.

It's definitely not a super star. I don't use it a lot, but every once in a while I need the angle of view it provides because my SMC Pentax-A 645 35/3.5 is not wide enough.

Here I needed to show where Willow West Creek flows into the Speed River. I needed the power poles and lines to hold down the upper part, and I needed just a bit of the Speed on the right for context. If I could have gone further into the river I might have been able to use the 35mm, but one more step and my boots would have filled.


Leica PC Super-Angulon 28mm f/2.8 at f/13 on Fuji GFX 100S. This is on my F-Universalis. There's some tilt, a bit of swing, and some rise. Purple fringing is present in the wires and poles, but it's not visible except at high magnification.

If I had an excellent 30mm lens, I might replace both the Leica 28 and the Pentax 35 for a lighter load. It would need to work on an F-Universalis, so the forthcoming (maybe?) Fuji GF 30mm tilt-shift lens is not an option.

Until last week I thought this was a fantasy, because someone would have to make one. Last week I discovered that Silvestri in Italy has just put a nice little 35mm on the market. Apparently it's not a re-housed lens (like Cambo), but an actual new from scratch design. Maybe they have plans for a 30mm, or a 28mm. Hint hint.

paulraphael said:

I found all the (older generation) Nikon PC lenses to be lousy on Nikon as well. Haven't tried the newer ones.

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The Nikon PC-e 19mm works super perfect with the gfx 100s, but it is a little bit too wide. Vignetting is not really a problem, but while shifting it to wide, it starts to have blured edges.

A fun lens, for near distance field photography (27mb) https://malus.exotica.org.uk/~zeg/fuji/7382fuji100snikon19pce.jpg

The 35mm Pentax 645 brings very nice looking colors into the images, but for shifting, shiftadapter, it starts to colorshift, colorfringe !?, for me, propably the used lens i have had gave the problem, i have given it away already.

Pentax 35mm (20mb) https://malus.exotica.org.uk/~zeg/fuji/6252fujigfx100spentax352023.jpg

For the Schneider/Kreuznach Super Angulon, only the very expensive version with the blue ring willl do, and here the best with the canon mount, since the diameter is larger than the nikon F version. Schneider-Kreuznach 28mm F4.5 PC-TS Super-Angulon HM Aspheric, Nikon F / Canon EOS, the mount plate can be changed. There was also a Pentax K and Sony Alpha version around. Have given it away as well, too bulky for a walk aroiund lens. The implemented shift and tilt mechanism was invented by some other company.

Christopher Leggett have used it very extensive,
There is also a 50mm Schneider/Kreuznach 50mm f2,8 Super-Angulon, that one is very sharp, but it starts vignetting at 4-5mm shift already. Have given it away as well.

Too heavy as walk around lens. (50mb) https://malus.exotica.org.uk/~zeg/fuji/DSF5235fujigfx100sr50mmschneiderkreuz.JPG

Finaly the Canon 24mm tse lens v2, https://malus.exotica.org.uk/~zeg/fuji/Mueresitheaodeon052023..jpg

Have used Kipon, HCam, Noveflex adapters.

byebye, richard

John Crowe said:

Printing 40" x60" with the sweet spot is a testament to how good a lens this is. I suspect your demands will be hard to match with any lens. I use shifted medium format film lenses on 50MP FF and I doubt the Pentax 35mm will live up to your corner criteria. I am not sure Fuji will be able to approach what Rodenstock is doing with medium format lenses.

I suspect that I, and many others, would be very pleased with fully shifted/stitched images from the Schneider at 40" x 60".

Again your results reinforce just how good a lens this must be.

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I'll bet the Fuji will be significantly better than the old Schneider. But I agree that it probably won't be up to the standards of Rodenstock tech camera lenses (what is?)

How good anyone thinks the Schneider is when shifted is likely situation-specific. The astigmatism in the corners gets very smeary when you shift past a few millimeters. In some images it's hardly noticeable; in others, looking at it makes me feel a bit seasick.

There's also plenty of lateral CA (easily correctible), and distortion (possible to correct, but I've only been able to do it well using Schneider's software utility, which asks you to manually input the amount of shift).

Here's an example of the Schneider 28mm (f2.8 PC Super Angulon) that shows some of its shortcomings: https://paulraphaelson.com/sweet-ruin/#ms-926

It looks pretty good at 60", but not as sharp and tactile as some others. Despite doing lots of work to correct distortion, some remains. An architectural photographer noticed this immediately (these guys sniff for distortion as if it's truffles) but happily no one else has cared.

This might be right at the limits of acceptable shift for this lens, which is about half of what's mechanically available.

Awesome subject matter! Reminds me of "Terminator" and "Brazil."

Not sure these show any short comings. The complexity of each image may be disguising how the lens may be performing. A lot of these elements may never have been straight and square either.

Really well done.

paulraphael said:

Here's an example of the Schneider 28mm (f2.8 PC Super Angulon) that shows some of its shortcomings: https://paulraphaelson.com/sweet-ruin/#ms-926

It looks pretty good at 60", but not as sharp and tactile as some others. Despite doing lots of work to correct distortion, some remains. An architectural photographer noticed this immediately (these guys sniff for distortion as if it's truffles) but happily no one else has cared.

This might be right at the limits of acceptable shift for this lens, which is about half of what's mechanically available.

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What you're doing here is showing that a skilled photographer can make excellent images with lenses that have shortcomings. Nicely done.

paulraphael said:

Here's an example of the Schneider 28mm (f2.8 PC Super Angulon) that shows some of its shortcomings: https://paulraphaelson.com/sweet-ruin/#ms-926

It looks pretty good at 60", but not as sharp and tactile as some others. Despite doing lots of work to correct distortion, some remains. An architectural photographer noticed this immediately (these guys sniff for distortion as if it's truffles) but happily no one else has cared.

This might be right at the limits of acceptable shift for this lens, which is about half of what's mechanically available.

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Just when I thought I had enough (or too much) on my reading list to explore, now I find your blog. Thanks for exploring the boundaries, where interesting things are often discovered.

https://paulraphaelson.com/the-signal-the-noise

fentriss said:

The 35mm Pentax 645 brings very nice looking colors into the images, but for shifting, shiftadapter, it starts to colorshift, colorfringe !?, for me, propably the used lens i have had gave the problem, i have given it away already.

Pentax 35mm (20mb) https://malus.exotica.org.uk/~zeg/fuji/6252fujigfx100spentax352023.jpg

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Interesting ... I was thinking of getting this lens with a photodiox shift adapter to use until the native Fuji shift lens shows up. I didn't realize it would have problems shifted. I've never seen this lens; just read reviews from Pentax people who love it. I'm now wondering if it's a poor choice.

There's surprisingly slim pickings in affordable wide angle lenses with enough coverage.

John Crowe said:

Awesome subject matter! Reminds me of "Terminator" and "Brazil."

Not sure these show any short comings. The complexity of each image may be disguising how the lens may be performing. A lot of these elements may never have been straight and square either.

Really well done.

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Thank you. You're right that it takes some pressure off when the thing you're photographing is less than perfect. Or on the verge of buckling and falling over.

paulraphael said:

paulraphael said:

The 35mm Pentax 645 brings very nice looking colors into the images, but for shifting, shiftadapter, it starts to colorshift, colorfringe !?, for me, propably the used lens i have had gave the problem, i have given it away already.

Pentax 35mm (20mb) https://malus.exotica.org.uk/~zeg/fuji/6252fujigfx100spentax352023.jpg

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Interesting ... I was thinking of getting this lens with a photodiox shift adapter to use until the native Fuji shift lens shows up. I didn't realize it would have problems shifted. I've never seen this lens; just read reviews from Pentax people who love it. I'm now wondering if it's a poor choice.

There's surprisingly slim pickings in affordable wide angle lenses with enough coverage.

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The Pentax-A 645 35/3.5 is a mainstay in my outfit. I shift it a lot. There's illumination falloff, as expected with any lens, but in years of using it on different cameras, I have never seen any colour shift (as in the magenta/green kind caused by sensor crosstalk). Colours do change with illumination falloff, but that's a different (and normal) thing.

The one flaw this lens has for people who shoot things that have straight lines in them is moustache distortion. It's only noticeable on shifting. Moustache distortion is par for the course with wide angle retrofocus lenses of this vintage. I have never corrected for it because I don't see it in the work I do. It will be bothersome for the person who uses a lot of shift while photographing interiors or buildings.

Side note: the A version I use has FA and HD-FA sibling. The FA brought a revised lens design and autofocus. The HD-FA added a few more small changes (slightly different optical formula, new aperture blade design, slightly better coatings). I didn't like the FA for my purposes (worse on the edges). I own an HD-FA, which I'm going to get rid of because I didn't find it better in any way meaningful to me. It really belongs on a Pentax 645Z camera, where someone can take advantage of what it offers.

Lots of good info on Pentax 645 lenses here FYI: https://www.pentaxforums.com/lensreviews/SMC-Pentax-645-Medium-Format-Lenses-i4.html

That's helpful, Rob, thanks so much. Sounds like it's worth a try. The distortion may be similar to what I'm used to on the Schneider.

paulraphael said:

That's helpful, Rob, thanks so much. Sounds like it's worth a try. The distortion may be similar to what I'm used to on the Schneider.

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It's very similar. If you don't shift on a 33mm x 44mm sensor, you may not even notice that barrel distortion is just starting to head towards pincushion at the very edges of the frame.

It can be corrected in post, but the process is more involved than I was willing to do. There's a forum member who has posted the procedure (but I can't remember where). It's all manual, and I believe he used PtGUI and Photoshop.

By the way, there is a brand new 35mm lens for shift applications from Silvestri (APO-Silvetar). Not much has been published about how it performs. Samples I've seen so far are helping to keep my credit card in my wallet.

Thank you, Rob, very interesting review. I personally opted to use the Canon 24mm TS-e and crop a bit if I need a tighter perspective.

Antonio Chagin said:

Thank you, Rob, very interesting review. I personally opted to use the Canon 24mm TS-e and crop a bit if I need a tighter perspective.

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I've never used that lens Antonio, but lots of people are happy with it (and making money with it!) so it does seem to be a good option.

I continue to hope that one of these days Laowa will put out a good 28mm shift lens (or even a good 30mm). That would be wide enough for me. It's not a focal length I use a lot, but when I need it, there's no easy substitute. I know that I could get there by flat stitching the 35mm, but I strongly prefer a one frame approach.

I'm going to sell mine. Nikon mount. Getting ready to put on ebay, but will sell here if there's interest.

paulraphael said:

I'm going to sell mine. Nikon mount. Getting ready to put on ebay, but will sell here if there's interest.

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What are you going to do for that focal length Paul? Will you wait for the Fuji TS 30mm or do you have another option in mind? If you have another 28mm option that is better, I'm all ears!

Rob de Loe said:

paulraphael said:

I'm going to sell mine. Nikon mount. Getting ready to put on ebay, but will sell here if there's interest.

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What are you going to do for that focal length Paul? Will you wait for the Fuji TS 30mm or do you have another option in mind? If you have another 28mm option that is better, I'm all ears!

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I'm waiting for the Fuji, and in the mean time have picked up a nice Pentax 645 35mm (as recommended in this thread) and Fotodiox t/s adapter.

I'll be taking it on its maiden voyage in a half hour. Hoping the temperature drops below 90!

This has come about because I'm offloading all my Nikon gear. The Fuji system makes it redundant for my purposes.