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NO 828 for me :-(

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Ulysses said:
luben solev said:
  • And while we are on the same vain why can’t we use Burst mode on
shutter speeds 1/25th or lower? Many people blend multiple
exposures in Photoshop in order to reduce CCD noise and increase
image detail. This is as important (if not more so) in night as it
is in day photography. But to make this process easier, the Burst
and Exposure Bracketing features need to be available at all
shutter speeds. Maybe they could even be combined into one super
“Stacking” function!!!! (sorry, just dreaming :-)
Click to expand...
In my opinion, this is no reason to avoid the camera. They allowed
a lowe shutter speed than I expected. For anything longer, I can
use either my own finger to depress the shutter, or else utilize a
remote. :-)
Click to expand...
Remotes do cost money, while leaving burst and bracketing modes available on all shutterspeeds is free. They don't need to do any extra coding for this, so why limit it?
Member said:
Member said:
  • I admire Sony for being the only camera manufacturer to offer
truly IR capable cameras. So why go to all the effort to develop
this technology, only to limit its use?!?!? Why not make Nightshot
usable during daylight?
Click to expand...
There are several reasons for this, but they're stated in other
threads. For what it's worth, there may be a good workaround
available. Read the thread about Nightshot and Program Shift. There
are unproven possibilities on the horizon.
Click to expand...
I'm eagerly awaiting to see whether it proves a good solution!! :-)
Member said:
Member said:
Sony is one of the few companies that does NOT offer timelapse
functionality on such a highly priced digital still camera. The
irony is in the fact that Sony is the market leader in video
capture with their Broadcast & Film camera offerings and as such
should be far more used to timelapse than purely photographic
companies such as say Nikon.
Click to expand...
There are remotes on the market which will enable this capability.
Again, the F828 is not excluded, but you do need to purchase an
optional accessory.
Click to expand...
I haven't seen any that are on sale. I know that there is a german guy who is about to release a similar unit, but it will cost. Surely programming it into the camera is not that hard?
Member said:
Member said:
But three out of how many?! I don’t care much for the 8MP, my 5MP
shots print well at 8” x 10”. What I really needed from the 828 is
MORE CONTROL and LESS FEATURE CRIPPLING.
Click to expand...
For what I need, Sony has actually provided more features above and
beyond the F717. They have not "killed off" anything that the F717
was able to do already, but have rather expanded beyond it in most
cases. The glass is mostly full for me. :-)
Click to expand...
Sorry that I did not make myself clear. I did not mean that the 828 is crippled compared to the 717. I meant that the 717 is crippled and that the 828 has continued being crippled.
Member said:
Member said:
I will of course continue to use my 717 which has served me
brilliantly. After I get my 10D replacement, I will replace the IR
blocking filter in front of the CCD and then use the 717
exclusively for IR work.
Click to expand...
I can understand your great emphasis on IR photography. And you do
beautiful work. It's understandable that you'd want an even better
tool, not an equal tool. Very good points you've made, Luben.
Click to expand...
Thanks again for your feedback
Member said:
--

Ulysses
Click to expand...
--
Luben
--------------------

The world is not black and white, but different shades of grey.

 
Nice pics Luben.

I do understand your and others point.

The camera won't be a "BOMB" and is not one to bash it. Actually was no bashing, just "unhappy" comments. Always somebody is asking for something extra left out from the package, but most of them forgot about the tens of things available (and unthinkable a few years ago...)

The thing is IMHO, the 828 will be a very good camera. However none of the cameras will please everybody. I would appreciate the possibility to do whatever I want with a camera like this, because the hardware is there. And maybe the firmware could be fixed...

I will buy yhe 828 anyway, I skipped the 5xx, 7xx cameras because my Coolpix is still makes decent pics.

Regards
Joe
 
luben solev said:
Remotes do cost money, while leaving burst and bracketing modes
available on all shutterspeeds is free. They don't need to do any
extra coding for this, so why limit it?
Click to expand...
Yes, and from what I have read, the remotes are not cheap since they are so specialized.

It would require a little extra coding for this feature. But I'm as surprised as anyone else that they didn't put some sort of interval timer in there.
luben solev said:
Sorry that I did not make myself clear. I did not mean that the
828 is crippled compared to the 717. I meant that the 717 is
crippled and that the 828 has continued being crippled.
Click to expand...
Ahhh, I understand better. Thanks.

--

Ulysses
 
Don't know if anyone has mentioned this so far, but isn't the F818 supposed to be way much faster than the F717? there's no telling how fast it will take the F818 to process a photo when taken at long exposures.

long exposures are the same lenght, so what? it's the same as the F717, so why no complaints there? you could always get the remote if it bugs you that much.

bracketing and burst modes seem the same, what's the biggie? can't say that I know for sure, I never bother with these.. so that's just me.

Infrared is exactly the same as the F717, not recommended in daylight, and only limited to program, auto and video mode. there's no telling what shutter speeds it's limited to, whether it's the same as the F717 or the V1, I have yet to figure this one out.. but if it's the same as the F717, then what's all the jive about? you're looking at 8MP photos, which may deliver crisper photos when downsized. I see this as a plus, maybe I was hoping for.. but we're not all doomed to hell.

timelapse sounds like fun, but is it honestly something you can't live without? tell it isn't so...

--
http://www.sublogic.net
 
ed-d said:
Don't know if anyone has mentioned this so far, but isn't the F818
supposed to be way much faster than the F717? there's no telling
how fast it will take the F818 to process a photo when taken at
long exposures.

long exposures are the same lenght, so what? it's the same as the
F717, so why no complaints there? you could always get the remote
if it bugs you that much.

bracketing and burst modes seem the same, what's the biggie? can't
say that I know for sure, I never bother with these.. so that's
just me.

Infrared is exactly the same as the F717, not recommended in
daylight, and only limited to program, auto and video mode. there's
no telling what shutter speeds it's limited to, whether it's the
same as the F717 or the V1, I have yet to figure this one out.. but
if it's the same as the F717, then what's all the jive about?
you're looking at 8MP photos, which may deliver crisper photos when
downsized. I see this as a plus, maybe I was hoping for.. but we're
not all doomed to hell.

timelapse sounds like fun, but is it honestly something you can't
live without? tell it isn't so...

--
http://www.sublogic.net
Click to expand...
--
http://www.sublogic.net
 
luben solev said:
  • Another improvement would be the introduction of a CCD IR
blocking mirror that does not produce a hot spot in the middle of
the image when you try to shoot IR without going into Nightshot
mode. To see what I mean see the following image:
Click to expand...
While I agree with your wish to have Nightshot available in Manual modes, having shot most of my IR with Nightshot, I tend to believe that you will still get a "hotspot" in the middle of the photo. It might not be as pronounced as your example, but I think it's still there. I haven't done any research, but I tend to think that is due to the way IR lightwaves travel through the lens. Here's one of my Nightshot samples that shows a brighter center.


luben solev said:
The reason to shoot IR this way is to achieve the false-colour IR
look as shown on this image:
Click to expand...
Perhaps this isn't what you want, but, FWIW, I use a color tone on almost all of my IR shots. It's very easy to do in an editor. Here's a couple of examples.





--
my gallery of so-so photos
http://www.pbase.com/kerrypierce/root
 
I can live without some of the benefits of the 10D. I'm hoping the 828 will have better dynamic range (compared to the 707/717) because of the new lens and 4 color sensor. I also don't mind the IR issues. However, it is very hard to live without the time lapse option.

Does anyone know of a 3rd party option to add time lapse shooting to the 828? It'd be nice to be able to connect the camera to the computer for long time lapse shooting but that doesn't seem possible with the 828.

I still can't justify a 10D because of price. The 828 is a near complete package at $950 and the 10D is at least double that when you add lenses.

Joe
 
I was anxiously awaiting to buy the camera but if it has no provision for some kind of a cable release, I will no way buy it. I have no interest in the lousy remote control tripod that I unfortuantely bought (and sold as soon as possible) when I had a Mavica 300.
 
I appreciate your thoughts on the hotspot and I loved your IR images. If what you say is true then there is lettle that Sony can do about the hotspot.

thanks again

--
Luben
--------------------

The world is not black and white, but different shades of grey.

 
Michael Fusco said:
I was anxiously awaiting to buy the camera but if it has no
provision for some kind of a cable release, I will no way buy it. I
have no interest in the lousy remote control tripod that I
unfortuantely bought (and sold as soon as possible) when I had a
Mavica 300.
Click to expand...
AFAIK, you can still buy the remote cable release without the tripod. I use the rmdr1 with my 717, but I think it has been replaced with a newer model. There's a new thread here about it that you should be able to find easily.

--
my gallery of so-so photos
http://www.pbase.com/kerrypierce/root
 
new remote http://www.jg-ic.com/jgrc1.html

Hopefully he will make US version soon :)

-------------
Features:

Receiver : wired,
two buttons on it: "Focus" and "Release"

Transmitter : wireless remote control, up to 100m open field range (100 meters = more than 300 feet), 3 buttons, 11 functions

Intervalometer : This tool will let you set up the JG-RC1 for time lapse photography. You set the time between shots (from 10 seconds to 20 minutes) and the JG-RC1 take shoots till your memory card is full. Once programmed, the interval time is stored in nonvolatile memory and can be recalled at any time. The use of the AC adapter is recommended. When the JG-RC1 starts interval mode, it will either take a picture and then begin the count to the next photograph. It is also possible to make movies from time lapse sequences with some programs (not included) - for example: flowing clouds, opening flowers.

You can download a free programm here: [ JPGVideo ]

Focus, exposure and white balance should be set to manual mode avoiding image changes by the automatic.

Functions

Focus : "Press Shutter Half", Focus is automatically extended, so you have time to let this button go and press the Release button after it
Release : (Shutter)

Camera On : Every button (except "Off") will switch camera on, when it is off (in battery mode)
Camera Off : Switch your Camera off with the remote to extend battery life.
Zoom Wide : (this will not work with F828 because of its mechanical zoom)
Zoom Tele : (this will not work with F828 because of its mechanical zoom)
Set Zoom Position 1 : Saved in nonvolatile memory, can be recalled at any time
Zoom to Position 1 : Recall saved Zoom Position
Zoom to Position 0 : Zoom to "Full Wide" (Power-On-Position)
Set Intervall-Timer : Set up Intervalometer
Start Intervall : Do Time-Lapse-Photography
RC-Setup : Teach-in new remote (transmitter) or change button assignment

Power-Slide-Switch : Receiver is powered from camera or from internal battery (button cell). "Camera On" is only possible in Battery-Mode!

--
Slava
 
luben solev said:
I appreciate your thoughts on the hotspot and I loved your IR
images. If what you say is true then there is lettle that Sony can
do about the hotspot.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the kind words on my images. :-) I really don't know what more to think about the hotspot. I can only say that I've noticed it on a number of my Nightshot images. Some are more pronounced than others and I have no idea why. I would expect to see the same thing with the 828, but of course, that's just speculation...

--
my gallery of so-so photos
http://www.pbase.com/kerrypierce/root
 
for me it's a matter of this simple fact...I was goint to buy this camera for doing infrared...now I will NOT buy it...very simple.

I will use my Dimage 7 for infrared since it is not crippled and will use the 300d for the natural light.

There was enough justification for me to buy the 828 if the infrared mode would be fonctional...not if it is not fonctional.
 
120 Euro plus shipping. I'm not saying it is overpriced, on the contrary I think it is quite good value considering the development effort required and how many they will sell, but other cameras have this feature as part of the package.

After all lets face it, a timelapse feature is nothing more than a macro if implemented within the camera.

Why have to pay 120 Euro for all this extra hardware, when a few extra lines of code could have done the trick for FREE?

--
Luben
--------------------

The world is not black and white, but different shades of grey.

 
and with all points that you made. But as with any camera out there users try to compensate luck of some features by all means possible :) They add tele and wide converters, eat rolls to get caps to set WB, remove hot mirrors, use small lasers to focus in the dark, come up with many home-made tools and solutions :)

Lets just hope F828 will perform at its best, and we can come with new after-market solutions to make our pictures better :)

Since firmware is upgradeable now, may be Sony will add some of the most requested features later via patches. F828 is the top of the line, there is no sense to limit its functionality on purpose.

--
Slava
 
Agreed. The F828 is FAR from being a perfect camera ... and it's definitely not the right camera to a lot of people ... but I still think it's a great camera, overall. I can't find a better camera that can can do so much for only $1,000 ... well, maybe the A1, but even the A1 is not on my shortlist.

The d-Rebel is not on my shortlist too, as it's more of a crippled camera in my opinion. The 10D I cannot afford, as I would have to spend about $4,000 and I cannot justify that. I will need a couple of L lenses to go with it - as I will not feel good with anything less.
Mark J said:
Luben, I respect your position on this F828 prospective purchase.

Whatever camera works for your needs, that's what you should be
using.... you don't need the latest and the greatest if it
doesn't suit your particular photography.

I will have to admit, few if ANY of your concerns, are any of mine.
So you see... it just depends on your shooting style and type of
photography you enjoy doing.

Have a great day today,
Mark J
Click to expand...
 
For me, what tipped me over to waiting for the 828 WAS the reality of a non-crippled IR capability. It was a very close call between the 828 and the Canon 300D. Well, I guess they did cripple it which really makes the 828 a lot less attractive.

MT
 
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