D810 vs D5, wildlife and low light noise

Based on your need of less noise in your photographs, the D5 would be perfect for you, as it's a low light monster. If you crop a lot, you will be dealing with less pixels...20mp vs 36.

If it were me, I'd go with the D5 all day, and figure out how to get closer to the subject, or invest in longer glass.

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I upgraded to the D850 from the D810 shortly after it came out. I shoot birds most of the time and wanted to take advantage of the faster AF, faster frame rate, larger buffer, higher MPs for cropping and foldout LED. The 810 is an excellent camera and I would have kept it if not for my interest in bird and wildlife photography. I could have purchased a D5, but could never get over the lack of reach combined with the very high cost, despite the better low light capability. There are always tradeoffs, and I was able to buy two D850s for the price of a single new D5.

The D5 is an excellent camera, and I can see how you'd be tempted by a used one at 1/3 of the original price, but it sounds like you really don't need some of its key features.

A question for you, do you do much post-processing or do you prefer to share unedited images? For out of camera images in low light, the D5 would be the better camera. However, if you do post-processing, you can handle noise quite well with Topaz Denoise or Deeprime through DXO.

Check out these two shots with a Z9 at ISO 10,000 and 25,600, respectively, processed in Topaz Denoise. A D850 file should produce the same results. And I'm sure D810 files would benefit greatly as well.

Click to expand...

These are some excellent points, and pretty much convinced me that the D5, as good as it is, might be not quite the camera for me. The D850 would probably make more sense. Thank you!

Great light, D8XX and crop like crazy.

Lower light, D5, be careful with framing.

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I upgraded to the D850 from the D810 shortly after it came out. I shoot birds most of the time and wanted to take advantage of the faster AF, faster frame rate, larger buffer, higher MPs for cropping and foldout LED. The 810 is an excellent camera and I would have kept it if not for my interest in bird and wildlife photography. I could have purchased a D5, but could never get over the lack of reach combined with the very high cost, despite the better low light capability. There are always tradeoffs, and I was able to buy two D850s for the price of a single new D5.

The D5 is an excellent camera, and I can see how you'd be tempted by a used one at 1/3 of the original price, but it sounds like you really don't need some of its key features.

A question for you, do you do much post-processing or do you prefer to share unedited images? For out of camera images in low light, the D5 would be the better camera. However, if you do post-processing, you can handle noise quite well with Topaz Denoise or Deeprime through DXO.

Check out these two shots with a Z9 at ISO 10,000 and 25,600, respectively, processed in Topaz Denoise. A D850 file should produce the same results. And I'm sure D810 files would benefit greatly as well.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the Dxo tip! I downloaded the trial version and I'm amazed by how good it is after being a bit disappointed in previous denoisers, and I don't use "amazed" frivolously. Incredibly good for noise and even bringing out more detail.

I do actually enjoy post processing and Dxo Pure Raw feels like I'll save a thousand bucks on gear by just buying that. On some of my worst noisy pictures it worked pretty much flawlessly! I'm using the trial version for now but looks like this is an easy buy when that's expired. Right now it made my plans of a lower noise body pretty much useless!

Here's the two cameras compared at this link:

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/im...x=-0.007848266841072597&y=0.03169185763042418

D5 looks about 2 stops cleaner.

SimonV said:

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I upgraded to the D850 from the D810 shortly after it came out. I shoot birds most of the time and wanted to take advantage of the faster AF, faster frame rate, larger buffer, higher MPs for cropping and foldout LED. The 810 is an excellent camera and I would have kept it if not for my interest in bird and wildlife photography. I could have purchased a D5, but could never get over the lack of reach combined with the very high cost, despite the better low light capability. There are always tradeoffs, and I was able to buy two D850s for the price of a single new D5.

The D5 is an excellent camera, and I can see how you'd be tempted by a used one at 1/3 of the original price, but it sounds like you really don't need some of its key features.

A question for you, do you do much post-processing or do you prefer to share unedited images? For out of camera images in low light, the D5 would be the better camera. However, if you do post-processing, you can handle noise quite well with Topaz Denoise or Deeprime through DXO.

Check out these two shots with a Z9 at ISO 10,000 and 25,600, respectively, processed in Topaz Denoise. A D850 file should produce the same results. And I'm sure D810 files would benefit greatly as well.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the Dxo tip! I downloaded the trial version and I'm amazed by how good it is after being a bit disappointed in previous denoisers, and I don't use "amazed" frivolously. Incredibly good for noise and even bringing out more detail.

I do actually enjoy post processing and Dxo Pure Raw feels like I'll save a thousand bucks on gear by just buying that. On some of my worst noisy pictures it worked pretty much flawlessly! I'm using the trial version for now but looks like this is an easy buy when that's expired. Right now it made my plans of a lower noise body pretty much useless!

Click to expand...

That’s awesome! I’ve never used it, but it’s got a great reputation. You’re a perfect candidate to take advantage of it. Glad it may save you some gear $$s!

--
Alan Clark
https://arclark.smugmug.com/

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I upgraded to the D850 from the D810 shortly after it came out. I shoot birds most of the time and wanted to take advantage of the faster AF, faster frame rate, larger buffer, higher MPs for cropping and foldout LED. The 810 is an excellent camera and I would have kept it if not for my interest in bird and wildlife photography. I could have purchased a D5, but could never get over the lack of reach combined with the very high cost, despite the better low light capability. There are always tradeoffs, and I was able to buy two D850s for the price of a single new D5.

The D5 is an excellent camera, and I can see how you'd be tempted by a used one at 1/3 of the original price, but it sounds like you really don't need some of its key features.

A question for you, do you do much post-processing or do you prefer to share unedited images? For out of camera images in low light, the D5 would be the better camera. However, if you do post-processing, you can handle noise quite well with Topaz Denoise or Deeprime through DXO.

Check out these two shots with a Z9 at ISO 10,000 and 25,600, respectively, processed in Topaz Denoise. A D850 file should produce the same results. And I'm sure D810 files would benefit greatly as well.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the Dxo tip! I downloaded the trial version and I'm amazed by how good it is after being a bit disappointed in previous denoisers, and I don't use "amazed" frivolously. Incredibly good for noise and even bringing out more detail.

I do actually enjoy post processing and Dxo Pure Raw feels like I'll save a thousand bucks on gear by just buying that. On some of my worst noisy pictures it worked pretty much flawlessly! I'm using the trial version for now but looks like this is an easy buy when that's expired. Right now it made my plans of a lower noise body pretty much useless!

Click to expand...

That’s awesome! I’ve never used it, but it’s got a great reputation. You’re a perfect candidate to take advantage of it. Glad it may save you some gear $$s!

Click to expand...

Here's a quick example of how well it works even on really ugly noise. Granted, this is cropped quite a bit already, and the whiskers make it apparent there's noise reduction (they don't have any detail in the noise anyway), but otherwise it did a great job. Seems to work well on people too, it preserved detail in things like skin pores that weren't even really visible with high noise, it really is impressive.


Before


After

SimonV said:

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I upgraded to the D850 from the D810 shortly after it came out. I shoot birds most of the time and wanted to take advantage of the faster AF, faster frame rate, larger buffer, higher MPs for cropping and foldout LED. The 810 is an excellent camera and I would have kept it if not for my interest in bird and wildlife photography. I could have purchased a D5, but could never get over the lack of reach combined with the very high cost, despite the better low light capability. There are always tradeoffs, and I was able to buy two D850s for the price of a single new D5.

The D5 is an excellent camera, and I can see how you'd be tempted by a used one at 1/3 of the original price, but it sounds like you really don't need some of its key features.

A question for you, do you do much post-processing or do you prefer to share unedited images? For out of camera images in low light, the D5 would be the better camera. However, if you do post-processing, you can handle noise quite well with Topaz Denoise or Deeprime through DXO.

Check out these two shots with a Z9 at ISO 10,000 and 25,600, respectively, processed in Topaz Denoise. A D850 file should produce the same results. And I'm sure D810 files would benefit greatly as well.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the Dxo tip! I downloaded the trial version and I'm amazed by how good it is after being a bit disappointed in previous denoisers, and I don't use "amazed" frivolously. Incredibly good for noise and even bringing out more detail.

I do actually enjoy post processing and Dxo Pure Raw feels like I'll save a thousand bucks on gear by just buying that. On some of my worst noisy pictures it worked pretty much flawlessly! I'm using the trial version for now but looks like this is an easy buy when that's expired. Right now it made my plans of a lower noise body pretty much useless!

Click to expand...

That’s awesome! I’ve never used it, but it’s got a great reputation. You’re a perfect candidate to take advantage of it. Glad it may save you some gear $$s!

Click to expand...

Here's a quick example of how well it works even on really ugly noise. Granted, this is cropped quite a bit already, and the whiskers make it apparent there's noise reduction (they don't have any detail in the noise anyway), but otherwise it did a great job. Seems to work well on people too, it preserved detail in things like skin pores that weren't even really visible with high noise, it really is impressive.


Before


After

Click to expand...

Excellent example! I treat all my high iso work with DXO PureRaw2. Perfect results, but you need patience, PureRaw2 is quite slow editing big raw photo data. Even on powerful machines!

Henri Leuzinger said:

SimonV said:

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

ARClark said:

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I upgraded to the D850 from the D810 shortly after it came out. I shoot birds most of the time and wanted to take advantage of the faster AF, faster frame rate, larger buffer, higher MPs for cropping and foldout LED. The 810 is an excellent camera and I would have kept it if not for my interest in bird and wildlife photography. I could have purchased a D5, but could never get over the lack of reach combined with the very high cost, despite the better low light capability. There are always tradeoffs, and I was able to buy two D850s for the price of a single new D5.

The D5 is an excellent camera, and I can see how you'd be tempted by a used one at 1/3 of the original price, but it sounds like you really don't need some of its key features.

A question for you, do you do much post-processing or do you prefer to share unedited images? For out of camera images in low light, the D5 would be the better camera. However, if you do post-processing, you can handle noise quite well with Topaz Denoise or Deeprime through DXO.

Check out these two shots with a Z9 at ISO 10,000 and 25,600, respectively, processed in Topaz Denoise. A D850 file should produce the same results. And I'm sure D810 files would benefit greatly as well.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the Dxo tip! I downloaded the trial version and I'm amazed by how good it is after being a bit disappointed in previous denoisers, and I don't use "amazed" frivolously. Incredibly good for noise and even bringing out more detail.

I do actually enjoy post processing and Dxo Pure Raw feels like I'll save a thousand bucks on gear by just buying that. On some of my worst noisy pictures it worked pretty much flawlessly! I'm using the trial version for now but looks like this is an easy buy when that's expired. Right now it made my plans of a lower noise body pretty much useless!

Click to expand...

That’s awesome! I’ve never used it, but it’s got a great reputation. You’re a perfect candidate to take advantage of it. Glad it may save you some gear $$s!

Click to expand...

Here's a quick example of how well it works even on really ugly noise. Granted, this is cropped quite a bit already, and the whiskers make it apparent there's noise reduction (they don't have any detail in the noise anyway), but otherwise it did a great job. Seems to work well on people too, it preserved detail in things like skin pores that weren't even really visible with high noise, it really is impressive.


Before


After

Click to expand...

Excellent example! I treat all my high iso work with DXO PureRaw2. Perfect results, but you need patience, PureRaw2 is quite slow editing big raw photo data. Even on powerful machines!

Click to expand...

Yeah, it's about a minute per photo. Luckily I don't have hundreds of keepers so it's manageable

Alan, great images! Well done.

David Lal said:

Alan, great images! Well done.

Click to expand...

Thanks, David!

The D5 has very significantly better AF in poor light than the D810, and better AF than the D850, and the D5 will shoot better at MUCH higher ISO than the D810, and better than the D850.

How much better? I wouldn't even consider using either of my D850's in poor light - and I bought 3 D5's to use on multiple lenses during a shoot - and I recently took out all 3 of my D6's and one of my D5's when I was shooting with 4 lenses, including the 500mm pf f/5.6 and a 1.4 x TC on my 500mm f4 - which produced very nice results at 700mm and f5.6.

If you never try a D5 - you're missing out. You'll miss 'driving a racecar' - and you never even realize how much of a joy that racecar is.

Do yourself a favor, and try renting a D5 for a few days, or see if you can somehow find one to borrow. You can thank me later.

PerfectPoms said:

The D5 has very significantly better AF in poor light than the D810, and better AF than the D850, and the D5 will shoot better at MUCH higher ISO than the D810, and better than the D850.

How much better? I wouldn't even consider using either of my D850's in poor light - and I bought 3 D5's to use on multiple lenses during a shoot - and I recently took out all 3 of my D6's and one of my D5's when I was shooting with 4 lenses, including the 500mm pf f/5.6 and a 1.4 x TC on my 500mm f4 - which produced very nice results at 700mm and f5.6.

If you never try a D5 - you're missing out. You'll miss 'driving a racecar' - and you never even realize how much of a joy that racecar is.

Do yourself a favor, and try renting a D5 for a few days, or see if you can somehow find one to borrow. You can thank me later.

Click to expand...

I've been going back and forth, and while the D5 is very tempting in many ways, the biggest issue is the low-ish resolution when you need to crop a lot. The AA filter is a minus too. Since I'm quite particular about sharpness and often need to crop animal shots, the 21 megapixels is just a tad on the low side. Otherwise it would be almost ideal, since used ones are almost on par with the D850 in price now.

If I could afford more reach, like a 600 F4 or more, I could get closer, but with my current 200-500 I have to resort to cropping. Even the 500 F4 is almost 4k used. I'll probably never afford the really good long primes, so I'll have to invest in higher resolution cameras instead.

SimonV said:

PerfectPoms said:

The D5 has very significantly better AF in poor light than the D810, and better AF than the D850, and the D5 will shoot better at MUCH higher ISO than the D810, and better than the D850.

How much better? I wouldn't even consider using either of my D850's in poor light - and I bought 3 D5's to use on multiple lenses during a shoot - and I recently took out all 3 of my D6's and one of my D5's when I was shooting with 4 lenses, including the 500mm pf f/5.6 and a 1.4 x TC on my 500mm f4 - which produced very nice results at 700mm and f5.6.

If you never try a D5 - you're missing out. You'll miss 'driving a racecar' - and you never even realize how much of a joy that racecar is.

Do yourself a favor, and try renting a D5 for a few days, or see if you can somehow find one to borrow. You can thank me later.

Click to expand...

I've been going back and forth, and while the D5 is very tempting in many ways, the biggest issue is the low-ish resolution when you need to crop a lot. The AA filter is a minus too. Since I'm quite particular about sharpness and often need to crop animal shots, the 21 megapixels is just a tad on the low side. Otherwise it would be almost ideal, since used ones are almost on par with the D850 in price now.

If I could afford more reach, like a 600 F4 or more, I could get closer, but with my current 200-500 I have to resort to cropping. Even the 500 F4 is almost 4k used. I'll probably never afford the really good long primes, so I'll have to invest in higher resolution cameras instead.

Click to expand...

You may want to give Topaz a shot. You can try their programs free. I was impressed and bought the photo suite but Photo AI or DeNoise will eliminate noise.

Mal Paso said:

SimonV said:

PerfectPoms said:

The D5 has very significantly better AF in poor light than the D810, and better AF than the D850, and the D5 will shoot better at MUCH higher ISO than the D810, and better than the D850.

How much better? I wouldn't even consider using either of my D850's in poor light - and I bought 3 D5's to use on multiple lenses during a shoot - and I recently took out all 3 of my D6's and one of my D5's when I was shooting with 4 lenses, including the 500mm pf f/5.6 and a 1.4 x TC on my 500mm f4 - which produced very nice results at 700mm and f5.6.

If you never try a D5 - you're missing out. You'll miss 'driving a racecar' - and you never even realize how much of a joy that racecar is.

Do yourself a favor, and try renting a D5 for a few days, or see if you can somehow find one to borrow. You can thank me later.

Click to expand...

I've been going back and forth, and while the D5 is very tempting in many ways, the biggest issue is the low-ish resolution when you need to crop a lot. The AA filter is a minus too. Since I'm quite particular about sharpness and often need to crop animal shots, the 21 megapixels is just a tad on the low side. Otherwise it would be almost ideal, since used ones are almost on par with the D850 in price now.

If I could afford more reach, like a 600 F4 or more, I could get closer, but with my current 200-500 I have to resort to cropping. Even the 500 F4 is almost 4k used. I'll probably never afford the really good long primes, so I'll have to invest in higher resolution cameras instead.

Click to expand...

You may want to give Topaz a shot. You can try their programs free. I was impressed and bought the photo suite but Photo AI or DeNoise will eliminate noise.

Click to expand...

Thanks, actually yeah based on this thread I tried Dxo Pureraw 2, it's crazy good and removes a lot of the need of a lower light camera. The D5 is tempting mostly because the ergonomics (for me) and the AF system. But in the end is a bit hard to justify because of the price.

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

A lot of good answers and ARClark is right, given you may want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography the D850 can't be beat—it's not reputed to be the top DSLR for nothing. There are a lot of advantages to it over almost every other Nikon DSLR. It's hard to take a bad photo with a D850.

That said, PerfectPoms makes some good points as well and from my own experience with the D810, D850, D500 and most other Nikon DSLRs and mirrorless as well, the D5 is supreme, second only to the D6, but it's a close second, and as far as IQ there isn't much difference. I too thought 20MP was on the low side, but you can crop all you want and still get the sharpest, noise-free image ever. PerfectPoms is right, try a D5 and you'll thank him later. I almost hesitate to tell you this as I've been contemplating buying it myself, but there is a D5 on Amazon with less the 3K clicks for $2800, a fantastic deal.

Here are some examples of the D5, having been cropped more than you would ever believe; I process all of my D5/D6 images (and Z9 images too) with either DxO PureRAW or Topaz Photo AI—both work extremely well. This hawk was nearly 50 ft away, so cropping was an imperative. If I wanted to print these, I could print them 48" wide if I wanted to. Look at the "original" size and enlarge that and you will see how sharp a D5 photo can be. Forget about megapixels. There's magic in there.







I often shoot at ISOs over 16000 up to 25600. I've never had a camera that could focus in extremely low light, in light so low I can barely make out the subject.



The D5/D6 is not a landscape camera, per se, but you can shoot landscapes with the D5. This one is from the D6 but the D5 would have worked just as well.



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If you don’t aim for perfection, you cannot make a great photo. And yet, true perfection is impossible. So, at the end you must reconcile yourself to failure. No photo is perfect, you have to make your peace with that. How? You pick up your camera and you start again. —Carasco

Guy is right that the 'cropability' of 20mp D5 images is underestimated, because photos taken with my D6 (almost the same as the D5) are SHARP - but photos from my Z9 are not - so images cropped to the same amount (of magnification) from my Z9 will look worse than from my D6. I'm probably not explaining well, but if I crop out half the photo on either camera, the D6 images will still look better, because they are sharp to begin with. The seemingly small mp's left are deceptively 'good.'

I spent last night sorting through photos taken by my Z9 in BRIGHT sunlight on Sunday - and I've ruled out shutter speed as one cause of my images not being well focused on the eyes (by the Z9). My Z9 misses focusing on the eyes by enough that the images are throways. My D6 would be much more likely to grab the eyes in focus.

And I thought a shutter speed of 1,600 of a second that I almost always use on my moving dogs with my D6 might not be fast enough with the smaller pixels of the Z9 - but I see much faster shutter speed photos taken a few days ago with the Z9 that are not sharply focused on the eyes. So shutter speed isn't the problem.

SimonV said:

I currently have a D810, it's the second I've owned since selling my previous one some years ago so I'm relatively familiar with it. I've been considering the D5 too now that they've come down in price a bit.

I'm having trouble finding out some stuff about the D5 image quality and how much of a tradeoff it is when you consider things like better focus etc.

I always liked my D810 in general, I used it mostly for wildlife, birds, deer etc, but I really hate noise and the files get pretty noisy at 3200 ISO already when in lower light, like evening/twilight. The AF is fine but I've heard it's not the most ideal for wildlife. I've never used a better AF camera though so I can't really tell. I would want to shoot occasional landscapes and general photography too.

Would there be any point in getting a D5 instead, for the AF and low light performance? What would be the biggest downsides of the D5? The thing I like most about the D810 is the resolution and cropability, but I hate the noise. I loved the D810 with a grip so the ergonomics of the D5 would be great.

People tend to praise the D850 instead of these two and it does seem good at almost everything, but wouldn't its resolution result in more noise too? Did I mention I hate noise?

Would there be any sense in getting a D5, or even a D4s? I don't really need the higher fps, but I'm mostly interested in the smoother files due to lower noise as well as a more reliable AF system, for animals mostly. And the grip is a plus.

Click to expand...

I see you have found your answer, and that is all well and good; the D850 is a superb camera and a bit more akin to your D810, which is itself a great camera—it was my main camera for a few years. You will love the D850. Below are some examples from both the D6 (same as the D5) and the D850. Both cameras produce incredible results at high ISOs if processed properly in post.

The first photo is a D6 image, one that I just edited, first with Topaz Photo AI at its default setting, then with Lightroom where I cropped and adjusted everything else and then applied LR's enhance super resolution to upscale the image to 4419x4419 pixels. I then opened it in Photoshop and reduced, sharpened for the web and added logo and signature as well as the specs text caption at bottom and exported as a JPRG. All of that took about 15 minutes at most.

The second image is the original without any editing in Lightroom or Photoshop, just opened and saved as a jpeg at original 20.7 MP D6 size. This was taken at pretty much my maximum parameters as far as aperture and ISO goes; normally I prefer to shoot at a faster shutter speed and lower ISO, but in this case the cardinal wasn't moving much and the light was low so I could shoot at 1/640.

The last photo is one taken with the D850, at 25600, similar post processing except using DxO PureRAW instead of Topaz. It is as good as the D6, and that perhaps says a lot about the D6. You can't go wrong with either (D5 or D850), but the D850 will give you more flexibility overall, it's a better all-around camera.

View each at "original size" and see the difference.


CROPPED AND EDITED


ORIGINAL WITHOUT ANY EDITING, NO SHARPENING NOR NOISE REDUCTION


D850 AT ISO 25600

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If you don’t aim for perfection, you cannot make a great photo. And yet, true perfection is impossible. So, at the end you must reconcile yourself to failure. No photo is perfect, you have to make your peace with that. How? You pick up your camera and you start again. —Carasco