Manual lenses on MFT - open discussion

ikolbyi · Dec 15, 2022

Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?
What brand/type of lens?
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....
For video, stills or both?
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.
--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

ahaslett · Dec 15, 2022

I use a Laowa 10/2 and have previously used a Samyang 7.5mm. The FF kit also has manual lenses and I usually use MF when shooting landscape on a tripod.

MF is done by Magnification, supported by Peaking.

MF isn’t an issue for me with UWA lenses, so I chose the Laowa as my preferred option in that FL range.

Manual primes can be smaller, lighter and cheaper than AF primes, although that’s not universal.

Andrew

Jack Tingle · Dec 15, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

Use existing lenses; cheaper lenses

ikolbyi said:
What brand/type of lens?

Minolta, Hanimex, Meike

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

The two Minoltas are dynamite lenses 50 years later. Fast, clear primes. The Hanimex was crap when I bought it. Better cameras make its crappiness more obvious. The Meike 25mm f/1.8 was a disappointment: poor C.A. correction & an unstopped aperture ring made it more trouble than it was worth.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

Stills

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Focus peaking & magnify

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

Skeeterbytes · Dec 15, 2022

Mostly to put old film lenses to new uses. They go from lovely paperweight to fun addition to my system. None will "best" it's closest digital cousin but some deliver a special look that I enjoy (e.g., for portraits). An 85/1.4 delivers a very thin DoF wide open, even if it's not terribly far from the 75/1.8 WRT specs.

My only MF m4/3 mount is a Laowa 7.5/2.0, selected because it's tiny, reasonably affordable and UWA does not present tricky focus problems (except at extreme minimum distance). Wish I would have known the auto-iris model was coming because I prefer to focus and meter with the lens wide open.

The f:0.95s remain unique so if you want one, you must go manual. The challenge of shooting portraits at 0.95 must be considerable.

Cheers,

Rick

Mike Micro 43 · Dec 15, 2022

I use lots of manual lenses:

Old cine-projector lenses which have super-soft bokeh (e.g. ISCO Ultra-Star HD-Plus), focussed using a helicoid

Newer Chinese lenses such as the superb 7Artisans 50mm F/0.95 - great for portraits

Classics such as the Contax Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm F/1.7

and some medium format gems such as the Pentax 645 120mm Macro.

I do mostly for nature / walkabout photography and get a great manual focus experience.

I use magnification 7x and find I can focus even the fastest lenses easily this way.

I use most of these lenses with a focal reducer / speed booster giving me one extra stop.

Mike.

ikolbyi · Dec 15, 2022

For myself, I have 2 native MFT mount manual lenses:

Voigtlander 17.5mm f0.95
Voigtlander 60mm f0.95

I also adapt the following Leica M (Full Frame) lenses:

Voigtlander 40mm f1.4
Voigtlander 90mm f2.8

Stills only. I like to use them because they give the images a touch of softness and shallow depth-of-field (the native MFT mount lenses). The Auto-focus lenses can't match the DOF from these lenses natively.

Focus peaking enabled. I will take 3-4 images at slight different focus throws then compare on larger computer screen.

Tom Caldwell · Dec 15, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

No particular reason. Manual Focus with mirrorless is quite easy and relatively quick with the focus aids provided. But why not exercise some skill in crafting an image rather than relying on the camera/lens to do everything. Selecting precise point of focus for effect or in difficult AF situations can be very useful.

ikolbyi said:
What brand/type of lens?

A huge collection of legacy MF lenses plus a select collection of modern Chinese sourced lenses that are made for M4/3 or at least made for aps-c and sold with M4/3 mount. There are several quality Chinese brand emerging and they are not all named Laowa, often they are cheaper as well. Think 7Artisans, TTArtisan, Mitakon, Viltrox, Meike - and there are others - difference some brands that just slap their marketing name on a lens made by another - something that has been going on in the lens industry since Adam was a boy.

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

Interest in crafting images (see above) and also there are situations where MF can more precisely define what the photographer intended to have in focus. AF usually works well for general photography purposes where MF skills are neither wanted nor needed.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

I don't do video - ever.

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Eye-ball, slow ball. Must be kidding, I need a combination of magnification and focus peaking, only then my eyeball says 'good enough'.

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

Later, maybe later, some of us are time deficient ....

ikolbyi said:
(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

Been using MF for years. Use it for my personal pleasure in achievement, but S-AF is very quick and gets the job done if time is a finite object.

Bobapingu · Dec 15, 2022

I dabbled once in order to use an old favourite lens with which I travelled the world as a young lad. Oh boy, what a disappointment. Not sharp, lacked contract, colour was bleh. I guess the lens fungus didn't help

That was an old film lens. Don't let that put you off a modern manual lens.

bs1946 · Dec 15, 2022

I've owned several copies of the fully manual Rokinon 7.5mm f3.5 Fisheye lens that I used on an Olympus EPL-5 and later a Panasonic GM5. The combo with either is small and easily pocketable, plus Fisheye lens need almost no focusing. I used to like to try and make my photos as as possible but never used any defishing post processing software.

I've also used several Laowa lenses with a GX9, including their 10mm which is a weird hybrid manual focus lens that requires the aperture to be set in the GX9 and provides exif data.

Olympus E-PL5 / Samyang 7.5mm f3.5 FE

Panasonic DC-GX9 & LAOWA C&D-Dreamer MFT 2.0/10mm

Panasonic DC-GX9 / Laowa 17mm f1.8

I recently bought a K&F Concepts LM/M43 adapter to try out with my Leica Summicron-M 2.0/50mm Type 5 lens, but have not had the chance to do it yet.

I've actually used far more manual lenses on the different Fuji bodies I've own. Fuji, Olympus, and Panasonic all have excellent focus peaking which makes using most manual lenses easy. But there are some very low contrast manual lens out there that do not work well peaking. Using manual lenses opens up a whole world of vintage and modern lenses that can be used on MFT. Plus once you learn to use zone focusing, manual is actually faster than AF.

--
Bill S.
www.flickr.com/photos/wrs1946
“Sharpness is a bourgeois concept”
- Henri Cartier-Bresson -

JasonTheBirder · Dec 15, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

Some lenses are only available in manual, or are cheaper if you get manual-only.

ikolbyi said:
What brand/type of lens?

The example is the Venus Laowa 2X macro. But I've used the Pentax-A 50mm f/1.8 also.

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

There is not autofocus 2X macro (though I know there will be). I know some other lenses from Laowa that are also unique as well.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

Both but I will say that the majority of video I do is manual focus only, so manual lenses work especially well.

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

I just use old-school focus and I find the G9's evf to be good enough for that, though occasionally I use magnification. I don't use focus peaking.

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

jalywol · Dec 15, 2022

Early in M43 days, I tried a lot of the suggested vintage MF lenses to cover a wide range of focal lengths. As the native glass filled in the gaps, though, I ended up keeping only a couple of lenses from those days, and those I still do use, albeit infrequently.

The two I have kept are the Yashical ML 50mm f1.7, and the micro Nikkor 55mm f 3.5 non-AI version. I've used them on all of my mirrorless bodies, from M43 to FF, and both are still great lenses.

The rest have pretty much gone by the wayside....

However, I do have a Laowa 100mm f2.8 macro, manual focus only, for my S5. It's a beauty of a macro lens, but it is a bit of a challenge to use at that length with only the IBIS in the body. Great output, though, if you keep the shutter speed up

.

-j

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

Depends on the lens....might be a particular "look" that a given lens has.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

I only shoot stills

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

I can't focus my way out of a paper bag. Peaking is very helpful.

ikolbyi said:
--- share some examples.

See below:

The first was taken with the Yashica on an M43 body.

These two were taken some years ago with the Yashica, but on an A7.

And these with the Laowa on the S5.

alcelc · Dec 15, 2022

I use mirrorless since the first ever model (Panasonic G1) was released in 2009. Due to the limited native lens support at that time (14-45 & 45-200), I had to adapt my long retired Nikon ais manual lenses in complement to the 2 native lenses.

I have a few US$ dummy adapter which is using until now.

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

Lack of native M43 AF lenses at the beginning, and later find the fun on shooting with MF that I never have back to the manual film slr's days some 30~40 years ago.

In the old days, my poor eyesight never works well with ovf (Nikon EM, FE and FE2) such that I had to screw on a 2x magnified eye piece, flip down to do focusing and up for framing... a lot of poor focusing result.

On G1, the focus box magnification in PIP making me able to do MF again. Then the Focus Peaking in later models just making it fun to use (if I have the time to enjoy it).

.

ikolbyi said:
What brand/type of lens?

As a Nikon guy, have a few Nikon ais manual focusing lenses gathered dust for decades (moved to AF lens as soon as it was available).

At the beginning, happily with the 50 f/1.8 and 28 f/2.8 as a fast speed prime lenses to complement the slower 14-45 and 45-200. Recently I also use the 35-135 f/3.5-4.5 macro more.

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

Nothing. But if I have time MF is fun to use.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

Until now, still not a video guy.

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Yes focus peaking helps a lot. Also the focus box magnification in PIP mode as well.

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

Not for contest of any kind:

G1 & Nikon ais 50 f/1.8

G85 & Nikon ais 35-135 f/3.5-4.5

G85 & Nikon ais 35-135 f/3.5-4.5

--
Albert
** Please forgive my typo error.
** Please feel free to download my image and edit it as you like

**

Bassam Guy · Dec 15, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

Already own

ikolbyi said:
What brand/type of lens?

OM, mostly purchased in the '80s & '90s

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

Nothing

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

Stills, I don't do video

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Both peaking and magnify. Both have their strengths and weaknesses. My eyes have no strengths and spectacular weaknesses

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

Doesn't count as what? You can take photos, can't you? I don't understand your comment.

ikolbyi said:
--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

I used adapted lenses a lot years ago but have reduced my use of them as I acquired more MFT lenses.

I don't know of a particular reason why manual focus is worth learning except fine tuning macro.

Digital Dick · Dec 15, 2022

I still use three of my old Olympus film lenses with my M43: 350mm f2.8, 90mm f2.8 macro and the nifty 50mm f1.8. Use both focus peaking and magnifier for MF. The first two have excellent optics, not so much for the nifty 50.

****

Satyaa · Dec 15, 2022

History... my two film cameras from mid 80s to mid 90s were manual focus. I have not used MF since moving to digital at the beginning of the century.

With GH5M2, I tried MF initially but it was a fail. The primary reason was the DSLR lenses that I tried to adapt. Their MF ring is not the easiest to use and the response was inconsistent. It feels like they were built with AF users in mind.

Recently bought a 40-150/2.8 (I know you said AF lenses don't count, but...) and its MF is so much easier to use. I am finding some use cases for it. Results are inconsistent but I am trying to learn to get better results.

unhappymeal · Dec 15, 2022

Tom Caldwell said:
ikolbyi said:

Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

Click to expand...

No particular reason. Manual Focus with mirrorless is quite easy and relatively quick with the focus aids provided. But why not exercise some skill in crafting an image rather than relying on the camera/lens to do everything. Selecting precise point of focus for effect or in difficult AF situations can be very useful.

Tom Caldwell said:

What brand/type of lens?

Click to expand...

A huge collection of legacy MF lenses plus a select collection of modern Chinese sourced lenses that are made for M4/3 or at least made for aps-c and sold with M4/3 mount. There are several quality Chinese brand emerging and they are not all named Laowa, often they are cheaper as well. Think 7Artisans, TTArtisan, Mitakon, Viltrox, Meike - and there are others - difference some brands that just slap their marketing name on a lens made by another - something that has been going on in the lens industry since Adam was a boy.

Tom Caldwell said:

What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

Click to expand...

Interest in crafting images (see above) and also there are situations where MF can more precisely define what the photographer intended to have in focus. AF usually works well for general photography purposes where MF skills are neither wanted nor needed.

Tom Caldwell said:

For video, stills or both?

Click to expand...

I don't do video - ever.

Tom Caldwell said:

Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Click to expand...

Eye-ball, slow ball. Must be kidding, I need a combination of magnification and focus peaking, only then my eyeball says 'good enough'.

Tom Caldwell said:

--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

Click to expand...

Later, maybe later, some of us are time deficient ....

Tom Caldwell said:

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

Click to expand...

Been using MF for years. Use it for my personal pleasure in achievement, but S-AF is very quick and gets the job done if time is a finite object.

I agree that the TTArtisan lenses are fun to play around with. I wish Cosina would release the their APS-C f/1.2 Voigtlaender lenses for m4/3. They are super compact with nice rendering. It would also help to give us a nice, bright lens for those who don't want the larger f/1.2 autofocus lenses.

Tim Reidy Productions · Dec 15, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

sometimes some lenses come at a low price, but also will get the job done.

What brand/type of lens?

main one would be 7artisans for me in this brand I have 25 35 55 and 60mm lenses

but I do own other ones from samyang and laowa.

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

usually low light work, but I did get a 60 macro just to have that macro.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

mostly stills, but some are better for cinema use. many have a clickless aperture.

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

focus peaking is better.

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

it is not as good with a AF lens in manual for many as the focus is fly by wire, so you may not know what distance you are good at.

ikolbyi said:
--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

here is one lens that does not easily exist in m43; the 85mm prime, used for something that was a bit too close yesterday. The cine lens used was good for moving focus distance.

getting away with 1/60

nzmacro · Dec 15, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

What brand/type of lens?

What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

For video, stills or both?

Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

I have no idea why people would do that when AF is sooooo easy. uh huh.

Take away the challenge and knitting becomes a viable option!

Why manual over auto-focus?

I'm in control and not some camera engineers algorithim that thinks they know what I want in focus. That's just plain daft.

As for AI stuff, well I already know what a plane, human, bird, boat and train looks like. As for this new fangled eye AI AF, well if the body of a bird is in focus, guess what, you won't belive this, but generally the eye is as well on m4/3

DOF on an m4/3 sensor and we are not shooting with F/1.2 tele lenses,

What brand/type of lens?

Canon FD tele lenses at around 40 years old.

What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

M4/3 don't offer a native prime 500 F/4.5 or 800 F/5.6. Be nice if they did.

The feel. It's like a slice of heaven at your finger tips. Smooth, fine and accurate. IT JUST FEELS RIGHT !!

For video, stills or both?

What the heck is this video thing you speak of.

Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Eye ball on m4/3 and focus peaking on Sony. Oly focus peaking is next to useless on a BIF or power boat racing. With Sony the focusing peaking stays on during a burst and when tracking, Oly does not.

--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

I own one AF lens I bought just over a year ago. Stunning Sony lens it is and yes, it does get put into MF now and again. Why, because it feels right and it's actually darn good at it.

--- share some examples.

We could be here all night if I started that. Thousands of them with m4/3 and Sony over the years. There's enough in my posting history if people can be bothered.

All the best.

Danny.

--------
http://www.birdsinaction.com
----
-----------------
I can always justify a need, but I can never justify a want.

glassoholic · Dec 16, 2022

If the MF lens is sharp enough, I just use magnification and with aperture wide open, zoom in and tweak focus visually until sharpest. I have never gotten on with focus edge peeking... too much false information... it gets me close but hit rate is 50/ 50... worst is with wide angles. If the lens is not that sharp wide open, I will manually close the aperture down a couple or more stops, where it will be sharp enough, and use magnification and eyeball it again.

My MF native m43 lenses are lenses that do not have AF alternatives, and usually because they also have a rendering that is appealing. I have adapted some old film lenses for fun, and if I wanted a soft focus effect that I felt a filter or processing could not achieve, most of them wide open would be interesting candidates.

tedolf · Dec 16, 2022

ikolbyi said:
Open discussion about manual lenses on MFT. If you use manual lenses on your MFT camera:

Why manual over auto-focus?

Because I use manual focus half the time anyway

ikolbyi said:
What brand/type of lens?

Leica M, some Pentax M39 telephoto, an old Nikon rangefinder 135mm.

ikolbyi said:
What do you achieve with the manual lens that you cannot achieve with the auto-focus lenses by Panasonic/Olympus/Sigma/etc....

Faster apertures at lower cost.

ikolbyi said:
For video, stills or both?

Stills

ikolbyi said:
Do you enable focus peaking or old school eye-ball focus?

Old school with zoom in focus.

ikolbyi said:
--- using an auto-focus lens in manual mode does not count.

--- share some examples.

E-pl1, 40mm f/2 Rokinon (minolta) M mount

E-pl1, 40mm f/2 M mount

E-pl1, 40mm f/2 M mount

ikolbyi said:
(Put this together for those who never considered using a manual lens, and why they would consider use a manual lens over auto-focus lens.) - educational understanding.

Manual lenses on MFT - open discussion

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