Learning to use RAW files

I printed these suggestions off to follow as I go through it. Thank you!!

Texas hobbyist said:

I’m using my Sony RX10 iv and I have taken the advice of many here and downloaded dxo trial version and capture one free version. I just came home from a trip to the mountains and have about 1200 photos to go through so I’ll try these and see which one works best for me I’m sure I’ll have more questions as I go

Thank you so much!!

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Yes, feel free to ask. I think there are a number of users of both products here who will be happy to provide advice and tips.

Ab S said:

If Capture One Express for Sony is still free of charge than that is a perfect way to start with RAW processing. However, I read at DPR that C1 stopped with this free version. But I would say just give it a try.

At this time I would not recommend a full C1 to start with; DxO PL-5 with DeepPrime NR would be a better choice for non-professional use.

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Why wouldn't a professional use it? Yes, Photoshop is preferable for publishing but most professionals are not in the publishing industry.

JeremyB2 said:

Good to hear that you've managed to download Capture One Express. It may seem a bit mind-boggling at first, as probably will PhotoLab 5 Elite, but a few hours spent getting familiar with the basics will pay off. Initially, it's only too easy to feel that you need to be playing with a lot of the available options, but start off simply and progress from there.

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I tried C1 and now use PL5 elite. In my experience, PL5 is a lot easier to use and I got better results as well.

Texas hobbyist said:

I have Topaz and wondered if it is suitable for developing RAW files or if DXO is significantly better? Can anyone point me to a place to learn how to do this as I've only started shooting Raw.

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I know nothing about Topaz but I've been using DXO PL5 for 9 months now. I rarely shot RAW before because the effort to get good results just wasn't worth it. Now I shoot only RAW and Batch process everything with DXO because it's so easy to use and I get better results than I get shooting JPEG.

Texas hobbyist said:

I’m using my Sony RX10 iv and I have taken the advice of many here and downloaded dxo trial version and capture one free version. I just came home from a trip to the mountains and have about 1200 photos to go through so I’ll try these and see which one works best for me I’m sure I’ll have more questions as I go

Thank you so much!!

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Very sound approach. FWIW I am a very happy C1 Express for Sony user for a couple of years now. I must say I did not find it particularly daunting to start using but that is obviously a personal thing. Note that C1 has changed the tools layout in the recent 22.15.3 version, eliminating the "Quick" sub menu and moving things around. I really dislike what they have done as I consider it illogical. At the same time they also removed the "Clarity" adjustment from the free version. Because of that I am sticking with version 15.2.1.

JeremyB2 said:

Good to hear that you've managed to download Capture One Express. It may seem a bit mind-boggling at first, as probably will PhotoLab 5 Elite, but a few hours spent getting familiar with the basics will pay off. Initially, it's only too easy to feel that you need to be playing with a lot of the available options, but start off simply and progress from there.

Some suggestions:-

First of all have Levels and High Dynamic Range set to 'Auto Adjust' (top left – Adjustments > Configure Auto Adjustments) which are triggered by Ctrl L on the keyboard. This gives you a good starting point and from there you can tweak HDR to suit the image. I usually find that the Auto Adjust setting for Levels is pretty good.

Then try applying a little Clarity (it may not be available in the Express version).

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It used to be but for some inexplicable reason they have removed it from the most recent 22.15.3 versions. Because of that, plus the changes to the tool menus, I am sticking with 15.2.1

JeremyB2 said:

I often boost Saturation from 0 to 4 (that's a personal preference). The standard Sharpening is set to 160 and I don't often mess with that. Finally, play with the Exposure setting, bearing in mind that this will have some affect on other settings. By this stage I am often happy with the image but will sometimes tweak White Balance very slightly if I feel it's necessary. Other settings such as Contrast & Brightness are used occasionally.

Doing the above is pretty fast; probably no slower than doing similar things with a JPEG in Elements or something similar. If I have a series of images which are similar I will click on the Copy/Apply upward facing arrow at top right, and then when I move to the next image I click on the downwards facing Copy/Apply arrow.

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Agreed with this. I used to edit JPG's in Faststone and once in a blue moon in Photoshop Elements and I find C1 no slower to use.

JeremyB2 said:

That's about it to start off with. The C1 Noise Reduction is not as good as DeepPrime in PhotoLab, but it can yield improvements. From then on, if you are so inclined and the image warrants it, playing with Colour Balance and / or the Colour Editor can be fun. The Keystone tool is often useful with buildings and the Magic Brush (another one that may not be in Express), Healing mask & Cloning mask can be handy once you have got used to them.

Other users of C1, probably much more competent than I am, will use it differently. Over time you will develop a sequence that suits you.

There is so much more in C1, much of which I will rarely if ever use. It's important to set up your Export recipes correctly (these appear when you click on Export).

In the Express version some of the things mentioned above may not apply. The tools I talk about will probably appear in different Tool Tabs but it's very easy to configure a personalised tool tab containing just those you will use routinely.

I can highly recommend the 'Photographers Guide to Capture One' by Nils Wille Christoffersen which is available as a download. I know it's more expenditure but I have found it invaluable in helping me to get to grips with the basics of C1.

PS. As you probably already know, working on images in C1 or PhotoLab is a nondestructive process. This means that at any point you can go back to your original RAW file and try different settings.

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tbcass said:

Ab S said:

If Capture One Express for Sony is still free of charge than that is a perfect way to start with RAW processing. However, I read at DPR that C1 stopped with this free version. But I would say just give it a try.

At this time I would not recommend a full C1 to start with; DxO PL-5 with DeepPrime NR would be a better choice for non-professional use.

Click to expand...

Why wouldn't a professional use it? Yes, Photoshop is preferable for publishing but most professionals are not in the publishing industry.

Click to expand...

C1 has the tethering option; in C1 you see real time the effect of NR (okay, that would also be possible with DxO non-AI options)..

Wow! That's quite a recommendation. Thanks!!

Ab S said:

tbcass said:

Ab S said:

If Capture One Express for Sony is still free of charge than that is a perfect way to start with RAW processing. However, I read at DPR that C1 stopped with this free version. But I would say just give it a try.

At this time I would not recommend a full C1 to start with; DxO PL-5 with DeepPrime NR would be a better choice for non-professional use.

Click to expand...

Why wouldn't a professional use it? Yes, Photoshop is preferable for publishing but most professionals are not in the publishing industry.

Click to expand...

C1 has the tethering option; in C1 you see real time the effect of NR (okay, that would also be possible with DxO non-AI options)..

Click to expand...

C1's NR is really inadequate; I'm often shocked at the poor quality images it produces. I couldn't tolerate using C1 for that reason, quite apart from the clunky UI. It's the tethering that attracts professional studio photographers, and given that they have full control of their lighting and are using at least full-frame cameras, NR probably isn't a big issue for them.

DxO PRIME NR isn't AI-based, but like DeepPRIME and Topaz DeNoise AI, it's computationally intense, and therefore too slow for real-time display. But it really doesn't matter that you can't see the effect of DeepPRIME in real-time: you can just trust it to do a good job, and get on with editing the next image while the previous one processes in the background.

tbcass said:

Texas hobbyist said:

I have Topaz and wondered if it is suitable for developing RAW files or if DXO is significantly better? Can anyone point me to a place to learn how to do this as I've only started shooting Raw.

Click to expand...

I know nothing about Topaz but I've been using DXO PL5 for 9 months now. I rarely shot RAW before because the effort to get good results just wasn't worth it. Now I shoot only RAW and Batch process everything with DXO because it's so easy to use and I get better results than I get shooting JPEG.

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..I shot jpg with my RX10 mk1 just for about two weeks, discovered the Capture One Express for Sony and found my preference starting settings within a few hours of fiddling around with af few pictures, saved that as "my default user style". A few months later I went to Capture One Pro for Sony.

If Capture One Express is still available for free, you can always start with that.

It took a few searches, but I did find the free version for Sony and I'm trying it out now.

Thanks!!

Digital Nigel said:

Ab S said:

tbcass said:

Ab S said:

If Capture One Express for Sony is still free of charge than that is a perfect way to start with RAW processing. However, I read at DPR that C1 stopped with this free version. But I would say just give it a try.

At this time I would not recommend a full C1 to start with; DxO PL-5 with DeepPrime NR would be a better choice for non-professional use.

Click to expand...

Why wouldn't a professional use it? Yes, Photoshop is preferable for publishing but most professionals are not in the publishing industry.

Click to expand...

C1 has the tethering option; in C1 you see real time the effect of NR (okay, that would also be possible with DxO non-AI options)..

Click to expand...

C1's NR is really inadequate; I'm often shocked at the poor quality images it produces. I couldn't tolerate using C1 for that reason, quite apart from the clunky UI.

Click to expand...

Tom, I am sorry to say so but I am really afraid that you did not master to use C1..

C1's NR is really inadequate; I'm often shocked at the poor quality images it produces. I couldn't tolerate using C1 for that reason, quite apart from the clunky UI.

Agree that C1’s noise reduction isn't a patch on DeepPrime. Interesting comment about "clunky UI". That is exactly the expression I have used about the PhotoLab UI compared with C1, so it all goes to show that we all have different experiences and opinions. I reckon much of it evolves around just how much time and effort one has put into learning the software. Once one has spent quite a lot of time getting to grips with one or the other, there isn't a lot of incentive to invest more time in another software. Of course, I often use PhotoLab for lens correction and noise reduction, but then prefer to move on to C1 for the rest of my editing.

Topaz can turn a raw file into a JPEG within the specialized functions of Sharpen, Denoise and Upscaling but you'll need a raw converter to modify the exposure and colors of the image, or to simply crop.

If you already have the C1 Express for free then you're all set with the two software. You don't need to have DXO since DXO's prime attraction is the de-noise feature which Topaz Denoise already does. Dxo also has lens profiles but so does C1 Express. I have all the softwares I mentioned so I'm talking from personal experience.

Thank you. That’s helpful!

..my remark was meant for Nigel, applogies Tom

Texas hobbyist said:

The initial capture one page I went to was indeed a trial version for the pro version. However I did a search for capture one free version for Sony Rx10 and was taken to a different page on Capture One for the download. I’m just now checking it out but I guess in 30 days I’ll know for sure.

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Did you have to create an account and then get a licence number emailed to you?

If not then you have a 30 day trial maybe.

If I remember rightly back some years, when I went to the Sony Express page and tried the download button it asked me to create an account and it all worked from there. https://www.captureone.com/en/capture-one-express/sony and got this just now....



I guess I could create a second account using another one of my email addresses and get a second free licence so I could run two copies of Express on separate computers.

As it is now I can simply "deactivate" on one computer and "activate" on the next and so on.

Logging into your account allows you to see what you have installed and activated.

Hmmm, just now I tried to open C1 Express on this third computer and it forced me into an activation process to give my account login then the licence number and then it activated on this 3rd computer and also told me I was running an older version so here's the latest update to download. That must have auto deactivated the other computer in this triangle of three.

Anyway use Help - About to get the window that tells of the version you have installed...



Looking in my Capture One account the activation history confuses me as it seems to promote the latest activation to be Computer 1 and pushes the other two to 2 and 3....



It seems that once I have the free Express licence number I can have C1 installed on any number of computers, but when I try to open the program on one it will either work immediately if it was the last one activated, otherwise it will do what happened to me now, and force me to log in to authenticate me and then ask me to provide the licence number again, thus activating this computer and auto deactivating the last one that was activated.

JeremyB2 said:

C1's NR is really inadequate; I'm often shocked at the poor quality images it produces. I couldn't tolerate using C1 for that reason, quite apart from the clunky UI.

Agree that C1’s noise reduction isn't a patch on DeepPrime. Interesting comment about "clunky UI". That is exactly the expression I have used about the PhotoLab UI compared with C1, so it all goes to show that we all have different experiences and opinions. I reckon much of it evolves around just how much time and effort one has put into learning the software. Once one has spent quite a lot of time getting to grips with one or the other, there isn't a lot of incentive to invest more time in another software. Of course, I often use PhotoLab for lens correction and noise reduction, but then prefer to move on to C1 for the rest of my editing.

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Heck, I even used Silkypix for years and everything else was strange and different. Now after using Photolab for some years then Silkypix trips me up when I go back to it.

Ab S said:

Digital Nigel said:

Ab S said:

tbcass said:

Ab S said:

If Capture One Express for Sony is still free of charge than that is a perfect way to start with RAW processing. However, I read at DPR that C1 stopped with this free version. But I would say just give it a try.

At this time I would not recommend a full C1 to start with; DxO PL-5 with DeepPrime NR would be a better choice for non-professional use.

Click to expand...

Why wouldn't a professional use it? Yes, Photoshop is preferable for publishing but most professionals are not in the publishing industry.

Click to expand...

C1 has the tethering option; in C1 you see real time the effect of NR (okay, that would also be possible with DxO non-AI options)..

Click to expand...

C1's NR is really inadequate; I'm often shocked at the poor quality images it produces. I couldn't tolerate using C1 for that reason, quite apart from the clunky UI.

Click to expand...

Tom, I am sorry to say so but I am really afraid that you did not master to use C1..

Click to expand...

I'm sure you're right.

C1 seemed to take much more effort to use, and produced worse quality results, so I saw no point in wasting time mastering it. PhotoLab just seemed a much better solution: much easier to use, highly productive workflow, better quality results. So why would I want to master C1?