Repairing an RX100 VII with a lens full of debris? Four questions for the experts

The RX100 VII is my favorite field camera - ever. Here on my desk in the motorhome with an adult beverage after a long rainy, snowy day afield in Montana:



It has bounced around, unprotected (because I don't have time to get it out of a case and capture the action images I want), in various pockets full of snow, feathers, blood, dog hair and debris of all sorts, plus as been used in very harsh environments, that include everything from fine blowing dust far out on the remote high prairie when upland bird hunting to salt spray when sailing off-shore.

As a result, the lens has sucked up all kinds of very visible debris. I'm really surprised the IQ hasn't degraded more than it apparently has. This is a recent shot of Bliss running the beach on remote Cedar Island on our annual two month spring sailing trip. IQ isn't all that bad.



There is nothing wrong with the camera other than the lens being full of debris and lots of the black paint being worn off. I could simply replace it if need be. Of course, I would much rather not spend the money to do that if not needed. If possible, I'd like to get it fixed before we leave to spend the fall hunting in Montana, starting in late August.

It really gets a workout there for action shots. Joy and Bliss pointing sharptail grouse:



I also use it for lifestyle and landscape type shots, if I don't have another, more appropriate camera with me, which is often. My buddy, Dave, and his beloved setter, Jack high on a butte late day:



Small Montana town under a Hunter's Moon:



I have an RX100 V that I could use as a compact, portable camera over the summer.

My questions:

1. Should I just leave well enough alone and keep using it until ti expires?

2. How/where would I go about getting the RX100 VII repaired?

3. Would repairing the camera make sense in terms of cost, or is it better to just bite the bullet and buy a new one?

4. How long would such a repair be likely to take? And... can I count on that time frame?

Thanks in advance for your time,

Greg

--
Check out my photos at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/137747053@N07/

I have heard that a few folks have had some success with the vacuum cleaner treatment, where they move the lens in and out while it is in a vacuum cleaner hose.

Have you checked to see if anybody has a YouTube video with a solution?

I found this one: Lens Cleaning Sony CyberShot DSC WX350 - YouTube

And this one: Cleaning the sensor in Sony RX100 mark 1 - YouTube

Jerry045 said:

I have heard that a few folks have had some success with the vacuum cleaner treatment, where they move the lens in and out while it is in a vacuum cleaner hose.

Have you checked to see if anybody has a YouTube video with a solution?

I found this one: Lens Cleaning Sony CyberShot DSC WX350 - YouTube

And this one: Cleaning the sensor in Sony RX100 mark 1 - YouTube

Click to expand...

Thank you, Jerry!!

Video #2 was way more than I'd want to try - also I don't have all my tools with me here in the motorhome. Video #1 involved a different model of camera, but it looked like the lens was set up the same as the RX100 VII, so I tried it. We are stuck inside due to very nasty weather here on Cedar Island, so this was a good indoors project for today.

It worked pretty well! And the price for the repair was right!! I was able to get the front of the lens off, clean up inside (it was packed with dirt and dust) and to suck maybe 80% of the debris out of the lens with a powerful vacuum. I was also able to get it back together with no problems and everything seems to work in a mechanical sense.

Frankly, I was amazed at how good the IQ remained even with all the dirt inside the tiny lens. If the weather relents at all, I'll try taking some pics with it and see if there is any improvement.

Thanks again,

Greg

Birddogman said:

The RX100 VII is my favorite field camera - ever. Here on my desk in the motorhome with an adult beverage after a long rainy, snowy day afield in Montana:



It has bounced around, unprotected (because I don't have time to get it out of a case and capture the action images I want), in various pockets full of snow, feathers, blood, dog hair and debris of all sorts, plus as been used in very harsh environments, that include everything from fine blowing dust far out on the remote high prairie when upland bird hunting to salt spray when sailing off-shore.

As a result, the lens has sucked up all kinds of very visible debris. I'm really surprised the IQ hasn't degraded more than it apparently has.

Click to expand...

Well, you know how it is with stuff on lenses: it's visible

a) as such at very narrow apertures and/or very short focusing distances

b) as part of bokeh circles

c) as loss of contrast/saturation

d) as flaring stuff in backlit situations (basically that's the same as c, just that washing out overbright light sources is a lot more obvious than other things)

For most photographs, the IQ loss is not of the "in your face" kind.

--
Dak

Birddogman said:

My questions:

1. Should I just leave well enough alone and keep using it until ti expires?

2. How/where would I go about getting the RX100 VII repaired?

3. Would repairing the camera make sense in terms of cost, or is it better to just bite the bullet and buy a new one?

4. How long would such a repair be likely to take? And... can I count on that time frame?

Click to expand...

I used to follow a fairly popular vlog of a guy moving from California to Anchorage. He used something like a RX100 II or III. Those models could suck in more dirt than a Hoover. It didn't help much that he walked around with the camera in a pocket of a wool shirt or jacket. Big blobs of lint or dust irritatingly persisted across multiple videos, often growing in in size and number.

He eventually took the camera to a small camera store. They cleaned the dust off the sensor in less than a day at a reasonable price. But over the following weeks the lint blobs returned and required another cleaning. Rinse and repeat. He eventually found a YouTube video on how to clean the sensor and started doing the job himself.

It seems newer models are less susceptible to sucking in large particles and depositing them on the sensor. But I've seen several RX100 cameras with visible dust in the lens assembly. Not sure if there's a practical method to clean that. Maybe the vacuum cleaner method could help.

If the debris isn't producing visible artifacts, I wouldn't do anything. If pictures of blue sky don't show any obvious sensor dust, you're probably OK. As has been mentioned, dust in the lens assembly could cause lens flare or loss of contrast. Not easy to quantity those issues.

BTW, nice series of pictures.

--
Phil

I followed the directions in video #1 and it seemed to work pretty well. Gave the camera a test today after the weather here abated enough to allow that. Here's a sample from today's post-cleaning test:





Greg

--
Check out my photos at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/137747053@N07/

Any camera with a lens that changes length has to vent air and possible dust and debris. Keeping the camera clean helps but it sounds like you are more interested in getting good images, which is what the camera was meant for.

‘The negative side of this is a pricy return to have it cleaned or just keep on shooting

Greg Gebhardt said:

Any camera with a lens that changes length has to vent air and possible dust and debris.

Click to expand...

Mechanical length. My main point of sympathy with the Panasonic DMC-FZ50 is its mechanically linked internal zoom mechanism. The camera zooms like a dream (if you don't use the full 10MB of resolution, it actually cheats by spreading what Sony calls "Smart Zoom" over the optical zoom range but does it so well that you really don't notice), very light fluid-damped zoom ring that nevertheless doesn't move by accident since nothing else on the outside of camera moves. So the camera changes optical length but stays the same size (which of course also means that it isn't a pocketable super-zoom).

Too bad there are other things that don't make it all that competitive these days. It's still nice for macro shots since you can hang off closeup lenses off the fixed front threads without affecting the zoom action.

Greg Gebhardt said:

Keeping the camera clean helps but it sounds like you are more interested in getting good images, which is what the camera was meant for.
‘The negative side of this is a pricy return to have it cleaned or just keep on shooting

Click to expand...

Is there anybody who would zoom slower in potentially dusty environments to reduce the likelihood of dust ingestion? Or is that just something for obsessive-compulsive engineers?

Greg Gebhardt said:

Any camera with a lens that changes length has to vent air and possible dust and debris. Keeping the camera clean helps but it sounds like you are more interested in getting good images, which is what the camera was meant for.
‘The negative side of this is a pricy return to have it cleaned or just keep on shooting

Click to expand...

Yes, it is unavoidable if you are going to really use such a camera in harsh environments. To me, a camera is just a replaceable tool to be used (and used up if necessary) and the image is all that matters. Long after I've forgotten what camera was used to create the image, I will be enjoying the image, like this one of my lady shelling on a sandbar off Cedar Island the other day:





If my hard use of a camera kills it, so be it. That's what it is for, IMO.





Having cleaned the lens of perhaps 80% of the debris, I am surprised to notice little change in the IQ. Oh well, it makes me feel better to see less dirt in the lens each time I use it.

Greg

--
Check out my photos at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/137747053@N07/

Dak on cam said:

Greg Gebhardt said:

Any camera with a lens that changes length has to vent air and possible dust and debris.

Click to expand...

Mechanical length. My main point of sympathy with the Panasonic DMC-FZ50 is its mechanically linked internal zoom mechanism. The camera zooms like a dream (if you don't use the full 10MB of resolution, it actually cheats by spreading what Sony calls "Smart Zoom" over the optical zoom range but does it so well that you really don't notice), very light fluid-damped zoom ring that nevertheless doesn't move by accident since nothing else on the outside of camera moves. So the camera changes optical length but stays the same size (which of course also means that it isn't a pocketable super-zoom).

Too bad there are other things that don't make it all that competitive these days. It's still nice for macro shots since you can hang off closeup lenses off the fixed front threads without affecting the zoom action.

Dak on cam said:

Keeping the camera clean helps but it sounds like you are more interested in getting good images, which is what the camera was meant for.
‘The negative side of this is a pricy return to have it cleaned or just keep on shooting

Click to expand...

Is there anybody who would zoom slower in potentially dusty environments to reduce the likelihood of dust ingestion? Or is that just something for obsessive-compulsive engineers?

Click to expand...

It isn't so much the zooming that sucks in the dirt on an RX100, Dak. When the camera is off, the lens is flush with the body. Each time the camera is turned on, the lens immediately extends some inches, regardless of the zoom (focal length) setting. That unavoidably draws air (and dirt) into the lens. Of course, zooming also makes the lens slightly shorter or longer and that exacerbates the problem.

I try to brush/blow dirt off the camera before I turn it on when possible, but at the end of the day, dirt in the lens cannot be avoided if you are going to actually use the camera in harsh environments.

Greg

Birddogman said:

Dak on cam said:

Is there anybody who would zoom slower in potentially dusty environments to reduce the likelihood of dust ingestion? Or is that just something for obsessive-compulsive engineers?

Click to expand...

It isn't so much the zooming that sucks in the dirt on an RX100, Dak. When the camera is off, the lens is flush with the body. Each time the camera is turned on, the lens immediately extends some inches, regardless of the zoom (focal length) setting. That unavoidably draws air (and dirt) into the lens.

Click to expand...

Right. So essentially it is a price to pay for compactness: the camera needs to get blown up before use and that requires air. Maybe a dedicated air inlet with good filtering is required, allowing good seals on the rest?

Birddogman said:

Of course, zooming also makes the lens slightly shorter or longer and that exacerbates the problem.

I try to brush/blow dirt off the camera before I turn it on when possible, but at the end of the day, dirt in the lens cannot be avoided if you are going to actually use the camera in harsh environments.

Click to expand...

Sounds like a case or halfcase might help keeping stuff from accumulating on the camera during transport, ready to get sucked in.

Dak on cam said:

Right. So essentially it is a price to pay for compactness: the camera needs to get blown up before use and that requires air.

Click to expand...

That's correct, Dak. For me, the compactness is important and I guess I'm willing to pay the price of dust in the lens to have a camera that I can actually take with me and use in the field.

Dak on cam said:

Maybe a dedicated air inlet with good filtering is required, allowing good seals on the rest?

Click to expand...

That would probably work. The joints between the telescoping rings of the RX100 VII lens are quite loose and open.



Query whether a filtered air inlet and putting seals on the rings would require a bigger, strong motor, making for a bigger, heavier camera, etc?

My Fuji WR ("weather resistant") lenses move in and out as the lens changes focal length. They have seals and have never sucked dust or dirt into the lens. To be fair, I don't take the Fuji equipment, unprotected, into harsh environments nearly as much as I do the RX100. I only use the Fuji equipment if all I am doing is photography - which is rare for me.

Dak on cam said:

Sounds like a case or halfcase might help keeping stuff from accumulating on the camera during transport, ready to get sucked in.

Click to expand...

No doubt that a full case would help (don't see what good a half-case would do), but taking the camera out of the case and getting it working would cause me to lose way too many opportunities to capture action in the field.



The poor little RX100 will need to continue to soldier on without any armor. If it dies completely, I'll buy another one (much as I hate to spend the money!), because I've yet to find a camera so well suited for my needs.

Greg

--
Check out my photos at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/137747053@N07/

Jerry045 said:

I have heard that a few folks have had some success with the vacuum cleaner treatment, where they move the lens in and out while it is in a vacuum cleaner hose.

Have you checked to see if anybody has a YouTube video with a solution?

I found this one: Lens Cleaning Sony CyberShot DSC WX350 - YouTube

And this one: Cleaning the sensor in Sony RX100 mark 1 - YouTube

Click to expand...

Thanks Jerry I bookmarked your post for future reference!

--
Bill
"Life's Too Short to Worry about the BS!"
So I Choose my Battles
Click for Wild Man's Photos
Using Rx10 IV at Present

I can't help with the camera, but I must compliment you on quite a healthy pour you've got there!

Thanks. It was a long, cold, windy day afield in northern Montana.



Greg

https://www.precisioncamera.com/Sony

--
Bill
"Life's Too Short to Worry about the BS!"
So I Choose my Battles
Click for Wild Man's Photos
Using Rx10 IV at Present

Bill Borne said:

https://www.precisioncamera.com/Sony

Click to expand...

Thanks, Bill. I'm going to leave well enough alone for now. Everything works and the IQ is fine for me.

Birddogman said:

Bill Borne said:

https://www.precisioncamera.com/Sony

Click to expand...

Thanks, Bill. I'm going to leave well enough alone for now. Everything works and the IQ is fine for me.

Click to expand...

Good choice, I believe!