Breathing Compensation for More Lenses

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

Toss said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

Toss said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

SafariBob said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

SafariBob said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded? I’d love to find out more. And also I assume firmware would be coming for the α7s III and α1 after α7 IV is out for awhile.

Toss said:

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

Toss said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

Toss said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded?

Click to expand...

If future additions to the list require firmware updates on cameras or lenses. And if new lenses automatically get it (then it would be lens coded)

Toss said:

I’d love to find out more. And also I assume firmware would be coming for the α7s III and α1 after α7 IV is out for awhile.

Click to expand...

Thanks again for your input. I hope Sony makes more announcement about this. There are other lenses we all would love to utilize this feature. And of course about firmware too.

The 28-135G PZ is cine oriented with very low breathing to begin with. As well, tests on the new 70200G2 show minimal breathing. Don't know why they bothered.

The list is actually longer than I suspected. Of course the GM primes need it badly. Good to see the worst offenders covered. But I doubt the 35G will ever on there. Just doesn't need it.

--
Here to help. Here to learn.
http://photoclydethomas.com/

Clyde Thomas said:

The 28-135G PZ is cine oriented with very low breathing to begin with. As well, tests on the new 70200G2 show minimal breathing. Don't know why they bothered.

The list is actually longer than I suspected. Of course the GM primes need it badly. Good to see the worst offenders covered. But I doubt the 35G will ever on there. Just doesn't need it.

Click to expand...

I see your points. Some lenses out there don’t need breathing competition because they have low breathing already, and especially we don’t want an additional crop. And yes, I agree the GM prime lenses need it because they are expensive.

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Dunno, I mean Sony gave A7Siii S-cinetone after the A1 got it so there's hope but breathing compensation, animal eye AF in vid is more useful in A1, A7SIII, FX3 and FX6 than it will in A7IV in terms of usage because if you'd want video capabilities, any of these are better, it would be weird that a lower specced model that's not even video focused to have it.

Toss said:

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

Toss said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

Toss said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded?

Click to expand...

It's a pretty good bet that it's camera coded.

That's because a number of the lenses that are listed as supported were released more than five years ago - so it's hard to imagine that Sony pre-configured them to anticipate a feature that (presumably) wasn't even on their roadmap yet (if they'd even thought of it back then)!

Toss said:

I’d love to find out more. And also I assume firmware would be coming for the α7s III and α1 after α7 IV is out for awhile.

Click to expand...

It seems distinctly possible (I'm not aware of any technical impediment - and it would be nice if they do that, in relation to several of the new features introduced in the 7iv).

But we'll have to wait and see if they do. ; )

--
Former Canon, Nikon and Pentax user.
https://500px.com/raycologon
https://www.instagram.com/raycologon

Djehuty said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Dunno, I mean Sony gave A7Siii S-cinetone after the A1 got it so there's hope but breathing compensation, animal eye AF in vid is more useful in A1, A7SIII, FX3 and FX6 than it will in A7IV in terms of usage because if you'd want video capabilities, any of these are better, it would be weird that a lower specced model that's not even video focused to have it.

Click to expand...

I dunno.

I'd say any camera that has a flip-to-the-side LCD screen is primarily video oriented.

Even more specifically, vlogger oriented. For most other applications (possibly excepting a subset of portrait stills shooters - those who frequently shoot from the waist or lower), a majority users seem to prefer a tilt LCD mechanism.

Perhaps I'm the only one. But the front screen is invaluable for me as a one man crew for setting up talking head client interviews mics and lights out of shot the first time.

The quick shots, that don't justify external monitor. Saves the extra setup time (and connection foibles) for that.

Yes also preferred for high/low angle verticals... mostly high because models are really tall in their high heels. I'm constantly shooting with camera over my head. And yes I look pretty funny doing it.

And front screen is super useful for the quick tabletop product photo. So easy to sit between camera and product, and adjust product while looking at screen.

Image Edge is not a solution. Connections drop and latency is unacceptable. And it's broken on a9 and a7s3. Forces every photo to upload into phone. No option for viewing/control only. My a6600 allows no upload. But not a9 our a7s3. Sony Pro Support confirmed my findings and claims to be working on fix. Haven't heard anything back from them.

What might surprise you though is that I agree with you that the side swing LCD is bad design. It blocks I/O ports and prevents L-Bracket use... and that's where my mic radio receivers mount.

So believe it or not, for my day to day professional career client jobs, I use a7s3 for stills photos because of the vertical flip screen. But I use a6600 for all product photo and video because top side flip screen allows viewing from both sides front of camera and doesn't prevent L Bracket receiver mounting.

The only time I uses a7s3 video is hand held for the Active Steady Shot on events what I'm always behind camera. And I'm thinking of getting A1 for that because it doesn't have side swing screen.

I'm literally using Sony's still cams for video and their video cam for stills. You can guess how I feel about that since Sony could solve everyone's concerns just by using the old AMount a99 style screen.

Rant over... Thank you for your patience.

--
Here to help. Here to learn.
http://photoclydethomas.com/

I don't expect the focus breathing comp for a7s3 because it requires cropping into the sensor. 12mp may not be enough to crop from the 4k native. Some of the Sony primes are really heavy breathers.

But, I'm definitely hoping it can be done. Even if limited to certain modes.

Clyde Thomas said:

I don't expect the focus breathing comp for a7s3 because it requires cropping into the sensor. 12mp may not be enough to crop from the 4k native. Some of the Sony primes are really heavy breathers.

But, I'm definitely hoping it can be done. Even if limited to certain modes.

Click to expand...

doesn’t it have active is? (Which would necessitate cropping?)

Clyde Thomas said:

--
Here to help. Here to learn.
http://photoclydethomas.com/

Click to expand...

SafariBob said:

Clyde Thomas said:

I don't expect the focus breathing comp for a7s3 because it requires cropping into the sensor. 12mp may not be enough to crop from the 4k native. Some of the Sony primes are really heavy breathers.

But, I'm definitely hoping it can be done. Even if limited to certain modes.

Click to expand...

doesn’t it have active is? (Which would necessitate cropping?)

Click to expand...

To what degree Active Steady Shot crops compared to various crops required for various lenses for breathing comp I don't know.

But if breathing comp is indeed possible, it probably mandates losing my ASS...

SilvanBromide said:

Toss said:

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

SilvanBromide said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

SilvanBromide said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded?

Click to expand...

It's a pretty good bet that it's camera coded.

Click to expand...

maybe, but my understanding is that, generally, adjustments are lens coded with Sony. I could be wrong.

SilvanBromide said:

That's because a number of the lenses that are listed as supported were released more than five years ago - so it's hard to imagine that Sony pre-configured them to anticipate a feature that (presumably) wasn't even on their roadmap yet (if they'd even thought of it back then)!

Click to expand...

the only “old” lens I could see is the 28-135 f4 pz.

there are other options, firmware updates could be included in the camera, or it could be coded on both ends. It seems implausible to me that it isn’t lens coded, because it would mean that new lenses would not have the feature, without body firmware updates.

SilvanBromide said:

SilvanBromide said:

I’d love to find out more. And also I assume firmware would be coming for the α7s III and α1 after α7 IV is out for awhile.

Click to expand...

It seems distinctly possible (I'm not aware of any technical impediment - and it would be nice if they do that, in relation to several of the new features introduced in the 7iv).

But we'll have to wait and see if they do. ; )

Click to expand...

indeed

SilvanBromide said:

--
Former Canon, Nikon and Pentax user.
https://500px.com/raycologon
https://www.instagram.com/raycologon

Click to expand...

SafariBob said:

SilvanBromide said:

Toss said:

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

SafariBob said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

SafariBob said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded?

Click to expand...

It's a pretty good bet that it's camera coded.

Click to expand...

maybe, but my understanding is that, generally, adjustments are lens coded with Sony. I could be wrong.

SafariBob said:

That's because a number of the lenses that are listed as supported were released more than five years ago - so it's hard to imagine that Sony pre-configured them to anticipate a feature that (presumably) wasn't even on their roadmap yet (if they'd even thought of it back then)!

Click to expand...

the only “old” lens I could see is the 28-135 f4 pz.

Click to expand...

• SEL85F14GM
• SEL2470GM
• SEL70200GM2

These three were all announced in March 2016 and introduced shortly after, so they're also now more than five years old.

SafariBob said:

there are other options, firmware updates could be included in the camera, or it could be coded on both ends. It seems implausible to me that it isn’t lens coded, because it would mean that new lenses would not have the feature, without body firmware updates.

Click to expand...

I agree there are several ways they may have gone with this, so we're in the realm of speculation here. Probably best to wait for something more tangible before reaching any conclusions. So I take back my "pretty good bet" comment! : o

--
Former Canon, Nikon and Pentax user.
https://500px.com/raycologon
https://www.instagram.com/raycologon

SilvanBromide said:

SafariBob said:

SilvanBromide said:

Toss said:

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

SilvanBromide said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

SilvanBromide said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded?

Click to expand...

It's a pretty good bet that it's camera coded.

Click to expand...

maybe, but my understanding is that, generally, adjustments are lens coded with Sony. I could be wrong.

SilvanBromide said:

That's because a number of the lenses that are listed as supported were released more than five years ago - so it's hard to imagine that Sony pre-configured them to anticipate a feature that (presumably) wasn't even on their roadmap yet (if they'd even thought of it back then)!

Click to expand...

the only “old” lens I could see is the 28-135 f4 pz.

Click to expand...

• SEL85F14GM
• SEL2470GM
• SEL70200GM2

These three were all announced in March 2016 and introduced shortly after, so they're also now more than five years old.

SilvanBromide said:

there are other options, firmware updates could be included in the camera, or it could be coded on both ends. It seems implausible to me that it isn’t lens coded, because it would mean that new lenses would not have the feature, without body firmware updates.

Click to expand...

I agree there are several ways they may have gone with this, so we're in the realm of speculation here. Probably best to wait for something more tangible before reaching any conclusions. So I take back my "pretty good bet" comment! : o

Click to expand...

great! Then I will take back suggesting only the pz was more than five years old!

SilvanBromide said:

--
Former Canon, Nikon and Pentax user.
https://500px.com/raycologon
https://www.instagram.com/raycologon

Click to expand...

SafariBob said:

SilvanBromide said:

SafariBob said:

SilvanBromide said:

Toss said:

SafariBob said:

Toss said:

Hi all. since the announcement of the new Sony α7 IV, I have look into the list of Breathing Compensation lenses on Sony support page, and the list is short. I have read or heard somewhere that they could/might add more lenses on this list. I’m no optical engineer and wondering how could they make it work on more {existing} lenses. Some inputs or thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

it depends if it is lens coded or camera coded. if lens coded could be limitations, if camera coded, should work with any lens communicating distance, aperture focal length. could even self learn

SafariBob said:

I also know that some (I think all) of you α7s III and α1 owners would also like to see a firmware update for this feature as well. That would be nice, but would they do it? I’d like to hear your thoughts on this as well.

Click to expand...

I think so given that they are more expensive and video centric

SafariBob said:

Here is the support page with the list of lenses that support breathing compensation:

https://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/support/ilc/breathing/en/index.html

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for your insight. How would we know whether Sony uses lens or camera coded?

Click to expand...

It's a pretty good bet that it's camera coded.

Click to expand...

maybe, but my understanding is that, generally, adjustments are lens coded with Sony. I could be wrong.

SafariBob said:

That's because a number of the lenses that are listed as supported were released more than five years ago - so it's hard to imagine that Sony pre-configured them to anticipate a feature that (presumably) wasn't even on their roadmap yet (if they'd even thought of it back then)!

Click to expand...

the only “old” lens I could see is the 28-135 f4 pz.

Click to expand...

• SEL85F14GM
• SEL2470GM
• SEL70200GM2

These three were all announced in March 2016 and introduced shortly after, so they're also now more than five years old.

SafariBob said:

there are other options, firmware updates could be included in the camera, or it could be coded on both ends. It seems implausible to me that it isn’t lens coded, because it would mean that new lenses would not have the feature, without body firmware updates.

Click to expand...

I agree there are several ways they may have gone with this, so we're in the realm of speculation here. Probably best to wait for something more tangible before reaching any conclusions. So I take back my "pretty good bet" comment! : o

Click to expand...

great! Then I will take back suggesting only the pz was more than five years old!

Click to expand...

Sounds more than fair! : )

Meanwhile, I see that I listed the SEL70200GM2 above, but actually (of course), I meant to refer the the original (SEL70200GM) version of that lens. : o