Leica M Monochrom Typ 246 - Possible Sensor Corrosion

Pinolero

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Hi All,

I hope this thread finds you all well.

I was wondering if anyone experienced issues with the Leica M Monochrom Typ 246, where the sensor shows spots when stopping down pass f9?

Yesterday I took some pictures of the country side and I noticed the spots in Adobe Lightroom. I normally down stop down, typically don't go pass f5.6 so i didn't notice this problem. See below shots of the sky, showing the extend of the issue:

39c2771374104b88a50f344f26b96bf8.jpg

0277881aa4d547e2977ab18c670e069c.jpg

The camera was purchased from a Australian seller in eBay back in February 2020. He told me that he was the first owner, and that he bought the camera from Camera Lane store in Melbourne, Australia.

I went back to the earliest pictures I took, some at f9, and I can see some of the spots if I look closely so I got the camera with this defect.

I've emailed Leica Australia as well as the Leica support centre seeking advice. The sensor has been cleaned thoroughly, as well as the lens, but the spots are still there.

Maybe someone has seen this before? Please let me know.

Cheers.
 
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Hi All,

I hope this thread finds you all well.

I was wondering if anyone experienced issues with the Leica M Monochrom Typ 246, where the sensor shows spots when stopping down pass f9?

Yesterday I took some pictures of the country side and I noticed the spots in Adobe Lightroom. I normally down stop down, typically don't go pass f5.6 so i didn't notice this problem. See below shots of the sky, showing the extend of the issue:

39c2771374104b88a50f344f26b96bf8.jpg

0277881aa4d547e2977ab18c670e069c.jpg

The camera was purchased from a Australian seller in eBay back in February 2020. He told me that he was the first owner, and that he bought the camera from Camera Lane store in Melbourne, Australia.

I went back to the earliest pictures I took, some at f9, and I can see some of the spots if I look closely so I got the camera with this defect.

I've emailed Leica Australia as well as the Leica support centre seeking advice. The sensor has been cleaned thoroughly, as well as the lens, but the spots are still there.

Maybe someone has seen this before? Please let me know.

Cheers.
I am no expert, but the dark spots in the first image look like dust specs to me as I do not see any halos around them, which are typical of corroded sensors.

You'll find herebelow an image taken before sending my M9P to Wetzlar in order to get its sensor replaced back in 2016: in this case, you'll notice that the black spots are surrounded by white halos:

82c0c495d0c6417fa90daa6950e7cf31.jpg

And here is another image taken after I got the camera back: the sensor is still dirty :-x, but no more halos around the dust specs:

9022f33c6f994645ae5526df8134f279.jpg

Hope this helped.

Best, Joseph
 
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They all look like dust spots to me, and maybe a few "dead" pixels. Nothing like the corrosion spots that my M9 showed before I traded it in on the M-P 240.

... High resolution digital sensors often get a few dead pixels along the way. They're usually mapped out so as not to influence the photographs. It's possible your camera's sensor needs to be re-mapped for some of these spots. ...

G
 
A. It’s a cmos sensor. It doesn’t have corrosion problems.

B. It’s dust. Clean it.
 
The corrosion problem was caused by the S8612 cover glass used on the original KAF18500 sensors used in the M Monochrom, had nothing to do with the sensor being CCD or CMOS. The corrosion on my M Monochrom, sensor replaced for free by Leica, manifested itself as black spots and blobs with a corona. My M9 did not develop problems for over 7 years, I had the sensor on it replaced.

Leica solved the corrosion issue by using BG-55 cover glass in place of the S8612. On the M9- the color in the dye of the Bayer filter array was reformulated to match the original as closely as possible.

This looks like dried moisture spots, something very different from what I experienced.
 
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The corrosion problem was caused by the S8612 cover glass used on the original KAF18500 sensors used in the M Monochrom, had nothing to do with the sensor being CCD or CMOS. The corrosion on my M Monochrom, sensor replaced for free by Leica, manifested itself as black spots and blobs with a corona. My M9 did not develop problems for over 7 years, I had the sensor on it replaced.

Leica solved the corrosion issue by using BG-55 cover glass in place of the S8612. On the M9- the color in the dye of the Bayer filter array was reformulated to match the original as closely as possible.

This looks like dried moisture spots, something very different from what I experienced.
Thank you for your responses.

This is my first Leica and I'm worried that I got the camera with some kind of defect.

I'm planning to send it to get it checked to the official Leica Service Centre in Melbourne. I'm hoping you're all correct and that the spots are simply dried dirt on the sensor.

Thanks again all. I will report back once I get the camera from the service centre.

Cheers.
 
Hi Pinolero,
I came across your message by chance. I to own the M 246, which I bought second hand as well.


I first noticed sensor spots a few months ago, so I sent it off to be professionally cleaned. It came back perfect until I checked the pictures and the marks were still visible at F11 to F16. I sent it back for another try, and the outcome was the same.


I invested in some cleaning products (wet and dry) and did it myself half a dozen times, and the spots were still there. Finally, I conceded and sent the body and lens off to Leica Germany for a clean.


Yes, you guessed it, the outcome is the same! I've just had another look at to be fair; there isn't any dust on the sensor. It seems to be on the other side, the part you can't get to. I can see the dots with a magnifying glass, and the pattern is the same as what shows up on in my landscape pictures.


I've emailed Leica again to see what can be done. I have no issue with one or two marks, but like yours, I have significant clusters mainly at the edges.

I'll let you know the outcome.
 
Hi Pinolero,
I came across your message by chance. I to own the M 246, which I bought second hand as well.

I first noticed sensor spots a few months ago, so I sent it off to be professionally cleaned. It came back perfect until I checked the pictures and the marks were still visible at F11 to F16. I sent it back for another try, and the outcome was the same.

I invested in some cleaning products (wet and dry) and did it myself half a dozen times, and the spots were still there. Finally, I conceded and sent the body and lens off to Leica Germany for a clean.

Yes, you guessed it, the outcome is the same! I've just had another look at to be fair; there isn't any dust on the sensor. It seems to be on the other side, the part you can't get to. I can see the dots with a magnifying glass, and the pattern is the same as what shows up on in my landscape pictures.

I've emailed Leica again to see what can be done. I have no issue with one or two marks, but like yours, I have significant clusters mainly at the edges.

I'll let you know the outcome.
Hey workoffiction,

Thanks so much for your response and confirming that I’m not alone with this issue.

I had the sensor and professionally cleaned in Sydney and I can still see the spots on the corners of the images when stopping down pass f/8. I decided not to send it to Leica Melbourne yet as I’m afraid it’ll turn into a 6 months wait if not longer due to the distance from Australia to Germany and Covid-19. I contacted the first owner of the camera and he didn’t notice the issue, I guess that Lightroom spot removal tool wasn’t as good as it is now with identifying the marks on the images. I will officially log the issue with Leica Australia this week.

You are welcome to contact me and use my case as reference as well.
 
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Hi. By a strange coincidence, I just got a lengthy newsletter email on this topic. I have no connection with this company, but have been considering a monochrome conversion, so I'm on their list. Sounds like the OP might want to check them out. Good luck!





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Forward: This is a long missive, but the story is interesting and solves the mystery of the Leica 'corroded' image sensors.

The Leica M9 was manufactured from 2009 to 2014. Production estimates are around 180,000 camers. Leica made a variety of different versions including steel-gray paint, black paint, siver-chrome, Titanium, Vulcanite jacket and sapphire-crystal monitor, Hermes edition, purple shutter cameras (why?) and probably others. Leica likes to create lots of expensive variations of their cameras which leads to some wondering how much Leica is pandering to high networth individuals versus camera performance, but I suppose a company could hold both goals.

The M9 is a nice solid camera and for those who have not shot with a rangefinder, the experience is completely different than the 99% of point and shoot, mirrorless and DSLR cameras. With the typical camera, it is constantly trying to figure out optimum exposure, focus, ISO. The cameras have sophisticated Auto Focus (AF) systems including some that look at your eye to see where it is looking. The M9 rangefinder is completely different. You have to set focus. There is no AF. You look through the rangefinder, and focus the lens by aligning a split focus screen. The lenses are beefy, metal things with various grooved and turned rings to that you can feel what you are adjusting.

When you are ready to take a picture, you turn on the camera, set your focus (you can also set focus with the camera off) and aperture, and click. You hear a variety of sounds that seem like an film camera. And you watch a blinking light flash - for about 7 seconds - while the camera writes to the memory card. Depending, the camera has a 7-8 shot memory buffer. After that, wait 7 seconds before you can take another picture. You have to start thinking carefully before you press the shutter. Want to take a picture of you kid blowing out a birthday candle? Better get that timing right because your next shot will be them eating cake. Now this is a good and bad thing. On one hand, you have to think about your shot before you take it. On the other hand, sometimes catching the exact specific moment is hard. Maybe they could have compromised and give you a bigger memory buffer. Just my opinion, but the memory chips are inexpensive, and this is a camera that sold for $8,000.00 USD.

The real Leica cameras (not the rebadged Panansonic ones) are built like tanks, We are talking old time, heavy duty, German engineering where there is one right way. Solid camera, solid lens with great optics, and force user engagement.

The M9 used a 18MP Kodak full frame CCD sensor. Kodak sold their image sensor business to Truesense which was owned by Platinum Equity in 2011. Platinum Equity flipped the business to On Semi in 2014. Many of the old Kodak medium format cameras I have opened used the IR Cut Filter (ICF) as the sensor coverglass as well. Typically, the ICF is a separate peice of glass held in front of the clear sensor coverglass. I don't know if Kodak did that to lower costs or perhaps increase optical performance since every piece of glass light has to go through degrades the image somewhat.

Here is a typical ICF. This one has three layers. The IR absorbing glass (the teal color) which is has vapor deposition coatings to further shape the response and 2 layers of clear lithium niobate which make the AA/OLPF/Blur filter (horizontal and vertical blur).

ICF-Typical__600x355.jpg


It used to be that if you scratched the ICF, you could send the camera in, and they would replace just the ICF leaving the original sensor in the camera. Now, perhaps because of the higher resolutions and the difficulty of getting the glass really clean, the manufacturers force you to buy a new sensor with the ICF already attached.

There are a few shops such as ours that can replace a damaged ICF. There is no shop, except ours, that buys custom glass for each type of camera. Thickness is critical if you don't want to change focal plane. But buying lots of custom glass is expensive. Instead other use a few standard pieces of glass and then, if they even do that, adjust the sensor position to compensate for the focal plane change. I have seen hardware washers used as shims, belt sanded sanded sensor mounting points and such silly stuff that I won't work on a camera that has been modified and lost its factory sensor mounting position. It is too much work to correct.

When we put in our Class 100 clean bench in 2005, another prominent shop announced they had the same type of bench as well. Buyer beware. For our monochrome conversions, When our customer used our monochrome camera to make the youtube video, 'How the sun sees you' (18,639,712 hits so far), a well known shop put the video on their website implying that they could make monochrome conversion (they can't). While we don't have the flashiest website, there is no shop in the world offering the breath of our camera conversions, optical filters, lights, phosphors, inks and knowledge, with the equipment to back it up. Our goal is not to be the least expensive. Competeing on price leads to a race to the bottoms. We compete on quality, and no shop can match our quality. And we aren't that more expensive anyhow.

As an aside, back in 2005, we had a customer that upgraded their Nikon D70 for a D200 and noticed that the images were softer on the D200. The ICF is typically a combination of IR absorbing glass, various coatings and layers of lithium niobate which makes for the camera's Anti Aliasing/Optical Low Pass Filter/Blur Filter. Lithium niobate splits light into two polarizations. The thickness of the filter determines the amount of the the split. There are two layers - vertical and horizontal splits. The D70 had a thinner ICF/AA stack (1.30mm) than the D200 (2.15mm) by quite a bit. The customer asked me to install the D70 ICF in his D200 and images became noticeably sharper. For some odd reason, Nikon decided to add more blur to the D200 when, logically, with a smaller pixel size, you need less blur. At that point, I decided to get custom ICF's made to replace various camera ICF/AA stacks where the new ICF had the exact same thickness as the old stack so that the focal plane didn't change. We called that our High Resolution (HR) conversion. My guess is manufacturers worried that a reviewer would show how the camera would alias at the limit of their resolution on certain repeating patterns where the pattern was almost the same as the pixel spacing and declare the camera was defective. However, the flip side is that you give up on resolution when you have an AA filter, and those problems rarely occur anyhow. No medium format camera has an AA filter because the guys paying big money for those cameras wouldn't put up with it. As the years have gone on, manufacturers are increasingly making cameras with no AA filter, and I suspect we are a big factor.

I was curious about what this Leica 'sensor corrosion' actually was. I haven't seen the actual surface of the sensor corrode, and my guess was that something was happening to the ICF. Because Kodak liked to epoxy the ICF to the ceramic chip as the coverglass, maybe Leica couldn't just change the ICF. One theory I thought of was that perhaps there where pinholes in the vapor deposition metallic coatings that are applied to the ICF. Maybe those pinholes where oxidizing over time, but that is still a curious thing because coatings don't do that (at least I haven't seen it).

At first, Leica would replace the bad sensors at no charge - though sometimes it would take 6 months for customers to get their cameras back. Later, Leica started charging $1,600 to replace the sensor. Then On Semi, the company that made those sensors, decided to exit the CCD business. Now Leica, and their customers, are in a real jam because if their sensor goes bad, the camera becomes a brick. Leica is giving customers with a bad camera a credit towards a new camera, so, to their credit, they are trying to do the right thing.

I looked around a bit a found a M9 that was in really good shape except that the sensor was in horrible shape. Completely unusable.

LeicaM9SensorCorrosionInCamera.jpg


Taking the camera apart, here is what the sensor looks like out of the camera. That brown stuff around the sensor is from something that someone did while trying to clean the sensor.

LeicaM9SensorOut.jpg


Here is what the sensor looks like under a microscope.

LeicaM9CorrosionUnderMicroscope.jpg


You can see that the problem is something has gone wrong with the ICF, and that ICF is indeed epoxied to the ceramic package as the coverglass. My next thought was I wondered what would happen if I polished the ICF using synthetic sapphire 1 micron polish. I polished most of the corrosion off and took another look at the ICF and found that the surface of the glass itself pits from the oxidization! That's something I haven't seen before. Very odd. The sensor is no good with suface defects like that.

Next, time to take the sensor coverglass off which is a rather delicate operation. There are 5 micron gold bonding wire a millimeter or so under the glass that connect the active chip to the electrical connectors outside the sensor. If you touch the gold wire and break it, you need a special wire bonding machine. We have one, but I haven't become proficient enough at using (story for another day). You can't touch the surface of the sensor, or you leave permanent damage.

LeicaM9SensorPits1.jpg


After taking the ICF/Coverglass off, I measured the ICF with one of our spectrometers. What I found was a filter that extended down to 300nm. That filter doesn't have coatings! Notice in the graph below how the typical ICF has a sharp cutoff around 420nm. That is because of those metallic coatings I mentioned earlier. Leica / Kodak used an uncoated Schott BG type glass! The coatings seal the glass. Somebody *really* screwed up. All those BG and UG types of glasses are susceptible to oxidization. Variable include time, temperature, humidity, ozone and even the particular glass melt, but you would never put uncoated BG or UG glass in a camera and not think that one day you are going to have a problem. That Leica / Kodak would do that boggles the mind.

Another really odd thing is that they used a filter that passes light down to 300nm. For a consumer camera, I have never seen that. Camera sensitivity below 400nm is pretty low, but, still, it is just really strange to see a customer color camera with a filter like that - like I have never seen that ever in 25 years.

This also solves the mystery of the Leica 'sensor corrosion'. Not 'corrosion'; that's oxidization cause by a lack of protective coatings. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Now maybe they later started adding coatings that later became defective, but at least for my camera (with the serial number hand written inside of 66,643), the defect was caused by using unprotected glass.

This graph shows the filter transmission response curve of the M9 ICF versus almost every other ICF. Generally, manufacturer's ICF is designed to pass light form 420nm (blue light) to 650-700nm (red light). Our human eyes can see above and below that but sensitivity is low. My upper limit is around 910nm.

LeicaMpICF-ThickLineVsTypical.JPG


Here is what a 1/4 block of BG38 (our XNiteCC1 filter) looks like after coming out of the melt.

BG38-QuarterBlock.jpg


As long as we had the sensor coverglass off, we figured, why not remove the Color Filter Array (CFA) and turn it into a monochrome camera. We can make the cameras transition from a useless brick to a Monochrom M.

Sensor out, coverglass removed and cleaned up.

LeicaM9SensorCoverglassOff.jpg


Sensor out, CFA removed. Now the sensor is monochrome. Notice the edge to edge precise CFA removal.

LeicaM9SensorMonochrome.jpg


Here is a quick look at some images. These were shot with a fairly inexpensive ($450) TTArtisan 35mm F1.4 lens.

L9141409-Small.jpg


100% Crop

L9141409.png


L9141401-sm.jpg


100% Crop

L9141401.png


L9141385-sm.jpg


100% Crop

L9141385.png


Here is a comparison of a color and monochrome M9 both using the same Voigtlander Nokton 50mm F/1.5 lens at F8 aperture.

LeicaM9ColorComp1.jpg


LeicaM9MonoComp1(1).jpg


And here is a 200% comparison

Screen%20Shot%202020-09-11%20at%2012_58_06%20PM.png


What are the costs to do this?

We can offer the following conversion options:

1: Replace the defective ICF with a new ICF leaving the camera as a color camera: $1,500

2: Replace the defective ICF with a UV-VIS-IR window making the camera into a full spectrum color camera: $1,500.

Note that with this conversion, you will generally want to use a filter on your lens. For visible light pictures, you would use our UV and IR blocking XNiteCC1 filter. If you wanted to take an IR picture, you could use a variety of IR longpass and bandpass filters. If you wanted to take a UV picture, you would use a UV shortpass filter. We have hundreds of filter options in diameters from 25mm to 82mm.

3: Replace the defective ICF with a new ICF and change the sensor to monochrome: $2,500

4: Replace the defective ICF with a UV-VIS-IR windows making the camera into a full spectrum monochrome camera : $2,500.

UV sensitivity will be about 6x greater than leaving the camera as a color camera. Again, you would generally be using filters on your lens depending on what type of light you want the camera to see.

Poor Man's Hyper/Multi Spectral Imaging

Hyperspectral and Multispectral imaging systems are generally quite expensive. There is not exact definition of when a multispectral system become hyperspectral. The difference lies in the number of different bands. Certainly, a 5 band system that covers 400nm to 1100nm is considered multispectral. But a system that sees 500-700nm with 20 bands 10nm wide would be considered hyperspectral.

HyperspectralAcquisitionTechniques.jpg


A quick overview of the various types are:

1: Spatial Scanning. A strip of a scene is passed through a slight and then dispersed through a prism to separate the different frequencies. The prism spreads the light over an image sensor. As the scanner moves across the screen, the hyperspectral datacube is aquired. An advantage of this method is that the equipment is relatively inexpensive (hyperspectral imaging tends to be *very* expensive), but a big disadvantage is that you need precisely controlled motion to construct the datacube correctly. These sort of systems work well with items moving on a conveyor belt, but not so well when shooting from an airplane where there are a lot of moving things going on.

2: Spectral Scanning. A multispectral camera takes a series of pictures through various filters or light sources. This system requires the object to be stationary since you need time to change filters or lights. An advantage of this system is relatively low cost and very good resolution assuming the object being inspected does not move.

3: Spectral - Spacial Scanning. This system uses a 2 dimensional multispectral image sensor with a Linear Variable Filter (LVF) is placed over the sensor. The LVF looks like a rainbow filter where one side has one frequency of light and the filter varies continuously to the other side.

Hyp-480nmTo825nm.jpg


With the camera or object slowly moving the image from one side of the sensor to the other while taking a series of pictures, you can use software to construct a datacube. An advantage is relatively low cost and it can be used for a variety of applications, but it also requires computing resources to construct the datacube correctly. We build this sort of camera and use feature based object recognition to construct the datacube. Later, we can extract a freqency band of interest from each slice and reassemble into a new image. You can learn about our hyperspectral camera by clicking here.

4. Non-Scanning. This method is a bit hard to describe, but you basically take one picture and get a hyperspectral datacube. As you can imagine, the devices are very complex and tend to result in images that have lots of spectral frequency information but poor spatial detail resolution. From Wikipedia:

This is a method for capturing hyperspectral images during a single integration time of a detector array. No scanning is involved with this method and the lack of moving parts means that motion artifacts should be avoided. This instrument typically features detector arrays with a high number of pixels.

Although the first known reference to a snapshot hyperspectral imaging device—the Bowen "image slicer"—dates from 1938, the concept was not successful until a larger amount of spatial resolution was available. With the arrival of large-format detector arrays in the late 1980s and early 1990s, a series of new snapshot hyperspectral imaging techniques were developed to take advantage of the new technology: a method which uses a fiber bundle at the image plane and reformatting the fibers in the opposite end of the bundle to a long line, viewing a scene through a 2D grating and reconstructing the multiplexed data with computed tomography mathematics, the (lenslet-based) integral field spectrograph, a modernized version of Bowen's image slicer. More recently, a number of research groups have attempted to advance the technology in order to create devices capable of commercial use. These newer devices include the HyperPixel Array imager a derivative of the integral field spectragraph, a multiaperture spectral filter approach, a compressive-sensing–based approach using a coded aperture,a microfaceted-mirror-based approach, a generalization of the Lyot filter, and a generalization of the Bayer filter approach to multispectral filtering

5. Spatiospectral Scanning. This is similar to spatial scanner but instead of dispersing light by frequency through the slit, the dispersing element is before the slit and the datacube is acquired by frequency.

For many purposes, you don't need a hyperspectral imaging system. The hyperspectral systems are normally complex, expensive, require sophisticated software to create the datacube and often suffer from motion capture issues. When you look at reflection, absorption and fluorescence of many (most) materials, the curves tend to be broad. For instance a plant, paint pigment, dye, etc, don't normally have particular curve spikes. For most uses, you could use 50nm or 100nm wide bands and have more data than you need. An exception is some phosphors that often have very specific peaks.

A common method low cost method is to use a multispectral camera in a room with controlled lighting and use a series of camera filters to take pictures of a stationary object to be analyzed. That can work well assuming the light source is controlled, filters are available and you understand lighting limitations. For instance, most UV shortpass filters also pass infrared light. If you use a UV light source that also emits infrared (fluorescent tube, xenon light, HID, etc) then a tiny bit of IR will turn your picture into a mostly IR picture because the silicon camera sensors sees IR light very well and UV light poorly. This method can also have the limitation that finding filters that fit the camera lens in all the frequencies you want may be expensive or not even available.

Another expensive method is to use a liquid crystal tunable filter. These filters have no moving parts. They tune light. We have a variety of these filters from CRI (now Perkins Elmer) and Meadowlark Optics. Our Meadowlark filter covers 420-1100nm, 5nm wide bads, 0.1nm resolution and a switching speed of <100 ms. In 2016, we saw this filter appear in an Ebay auction. I called Meadowlark to ask about the filter. They said the filter was made in 2005 and sold at the time for $20,000. But the filter was costing them $40,000 to make so they discontinued production. I asked what if they could make the filter today and they said sure, but it would cost $120,000 (this is 4 years ago as well). The National Institute of Health was selling the filter - and it had never been used. I bought the filter for $2,500, and forturnately it works fine.

MeadowlarkFilter.jpg




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Hi Pinolero,

I wanted to give you a quick update.

I contacted Leica who were most helpful. In summary, I am sending my camera and lens back for a further clean as they have confirmed dust has either collected underneath the sensor or between the glass of the lens. Either way, I can't get to it.

I have had my postage paid for, a free comprehensive clean of both camera and lens and to top it off I've been offered a donor camera and lens of my choice.

Naturally, I went with the new M10 Monochrom and a 50mm F1.4 lens. Can't wait to try it out!

Fingers crossed they don't find any issue with the sensor as they may not be able to cover it and I imagine a new one would be really expensive!

I'll keep you posted.

Cheers
 
Hi Pinolero,

I wanted to give you a quick update.

I contacted Leica who were most helpful. In summary, I am sending my camera and lens back for a further clean as they have confirmed dust has either collected underneath the sensor or between the glass of the lens. Either way, I can't get to it.

I have had my postage paid for, a free comprehensive clean of both camera and lens and to top it off I've been offered a donor camera and lens of my choice.

Naturally, I went with the new M10 Monochrom and a 50mm F1.4 lens. Can't wait to try it out!

Fingers crossed they don't find any issue with the sensor as they may not be able to cover it and I imagine a new one would be really expensive!

I'll keep you posted.

Cheers
Hi Workoffiction, thanks for the update. I’m planning to send mine for service to Melbourne in the next couple of weeks. I’m sure that the won’t be giving me a loaner so it’ll be a few weeks until I get it back. But I’ll let them know about your case.

Please keep me posted.

Cheers.
 

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