OM-D and the future????

Photo Pete said:

Antal I Kozma said:

Hi to all,

I had a year with the OM-D E1 MK II which didn't turn out well. I ended up selling the system. AF was very much hit and miss when photographing small songbirds. The lens, the Zuiko 300mm f4 Pro with the 1.4x converter was excellent though. I loved it, it delivered excellent images when I had the focus spot on.

As it turned out after my selling the gear the new owner had to have the motherboard replaced in the camera. He has a fine camera and lens now which he is very happy with.

Now, when the OM-D E-MX1 came out with improved AF I was thinking about buying into the system again. Why I decided to hold on is that I wanted to wait till the new 150-400mm f4.5 Pro zoom becomes available. Apparently it will be coming out in the winter of this year. I am very interested in getting that lens with the E-MX1 for birding and wildlife in the back country. I spend a lot of time off the beaten path and weight considerations are at premium.

All this said, now there is a kink in the picture again. As we know Olympus is selling its photographic division. Or its camera division? I am not sure, some will educate me on this matter I am sure. So, the Olympus OM-D will not be Olympus any more, another era closes in the history of Olympus as we have known it.

What will this bring? New innovations true to Olympus heritage or something less promising? Should I still buy into the system again? I very much hope that I'll get some positive input from you folks, not some negativity. Just honest opinions about how you see the future for the OM-D system, including optical developments and the µ4/3 in general.

All the best to all in the µ4/3 system, AIK

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Personally I wouldn’t be investing in Olympus equipment until full details of the sale are known and the quality of ongoing service and parts has been confirmed. Things should be clearer by the end of this year.

If you need something for great reach right now and can’t wait I’d be tempted to go for a Sony A7Riv and Sony 200-600 f5.6 - 6.3 lens. Using APSC mode from that 61mp camera with the 200-600 at 600mm will give you an equivalent of 900mm f9 and 26mp image size. The Olympus 150-400 f4.5 gives an equivalent of 800mm f9 and 20mp.

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I doubt very much that these two optics are of equal quality in terms of resolution. Olympus reputation is strongly grounded in it's ability to make high quality optics for it's system. If the Sony 200-600 F5.6 to F6.3 lens were Sony's finest it would be priced accordingly and it would be a faster lens.

In any case an F4.5 lens can give exposure at F4.5, an F6.3 lens at F6.3. That is not equivalent with respect to SS at each system's optimal IQ regarding ISO.

Photo Pete said:

You can pick up an A7Riv for around £2400 (I have just done that) and the 200-600 is about £1600. Probably not far off the price of an EM1x and 150-400 I would guess.

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Gary from Seattle said:

Felice62 said:

Gary from Seattle said:

Felice62 said:

No firmware updates? Whatif yiur 1x needs assitance in 2 years?they haven't sold bulk loads of it..

Newest lens out whi's going to honir the warranty in 2 years..

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What if all of your speculation turns out to be hogwash? You don't know anything here and just react with emotion.

Gary from Seattle said:

All valid questions to ask yourself, imho.

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True Gary, but these are reasonable questions I an currently asking myself. Since this place is for sharing thoughts, in addition to facts and for this peculiar matter facts are unknown any statement must be considered as a poster's personal opinion.

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And should be stated as such, i.e. "my personal guess is"

None of us have "inside information" and we are all going on speculation. My personal speculation is that there would be nothing to buy if warranty and repair were not part of the transition equation.

Gary from Seattle said:

I respect your opinion about okympus continuing supporting it's products.

Can I kindly ask you to do the same in my respect?

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I believe my closing statement (quote:’ all valid questions to ask yourself, imho) was sufficiently clear about.

Chris R-UK said:

This is just to let you know that Olympus BIF photographers aren't the only ones to be in an uncertain situation.

Canon appears to have stopped manufacturing the 7Dii without announcing its discontinuation or any successor. Just about everywhere is out of stock. That gives Canon APS-C BIF shooters no upgrade path. They either have to go FF or change systems.

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They want you to go FF mirrorless.

Someone who knows more may be able clarify: they are quoted as dropping development of all future DSLRs? Or was it just EF lenses?

Antal I Kozma said:

Hi again,

Thanks to all who responded. As far as I understand the consensus is that it is unpredictable how the future will work out for the OM-D system.

On the other hand, if one buys a good camera with excellent optic(s) then it will be there for years to use, regardless whether the brand is carrying on or not.

Thanks again, AIK

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Amen, I still love & use my Nikon 1 gear (long ago discontinued) all the time.

I have three V3 bodies that were originally released in April 2014 & are still working fine. This gear hit a sweet spot for stills/video when I hike and camp. My average display size is a tablet, so a 1" sensor is overkill.

Remember, you will be able to buy Oly gear at KEH, MPB or Fleabay for many many years.

There are also many 3rd party repair shops that you can use if something breaks and the new company stops repairs.

AIK - I wouldn't buy anything from anyone based upon what one believes is going to happen in the future. Especially now with Olympus...call it what you want a lot of word smithing has happened in the past.

If the lens isn't on the shelf or available to be ordered today there is no guarantee it will be there in the future. if the future date is a few months out I think the odds are even worse.

I am keeping my Olympus gear because of size, quality of build, IBIS and basically does what I need it to do. When something breaks I'll see what the alternatives are at the time both new and used.

Good luck in your decision.

Dan

"But for Olympus it makes no sense to produce equipment in the last few months if the intention isn't to continue business under the new ownership."

The way I have seen these kinds of things work is there are agreements made prior to the sale that have to be lived up to. The seller doesn't want to be seen as ruthless and cold... just abandoning the employees, tossing them to a a ruthless and predatory company. it would harm the reputation of the company and hurt future sales in other divisons. (and that is the only reason, it is all about money.) So there is an agreement in writing when the sale is made that business will continue on for one or two years.

I know about fifty people personally who have been through this in the last two years. The agreed upon "no changes" date was told to them (and me) the day the sale was announced. That gives people time to transer to other work in the company, or go somewhere else. (Some positions are work from home now so it can be easier to transfer than one might think...gone are the days of having to move to a new city to transfer.) A few days after the time period is over, the lay off notifications come out. In our most recent case the layoffs actually occured after another six months. During the two year grace period we wrapped up things that were nearly completed. That only made sense because they were paying us anyway and we had nothing else to do otherwise. And the cost of it was worked into the sale.

During the grace period, nothing new was approved. Press communications sounded a lot like what I am hearing from Olympus now. (we are fully committed, we are excited, look at how we prove our committment with this new widget,etc) In reality the decision to wield the axe has already been made, which management will deny until afterwards. (partly because of the language of the original sale agreement)

Colleagues I know in other companies all have similar stories. I can easily recount six without even trying very hard. It is just the way business people do things in certain industries, particularly ones where consumer brand recognition is considered an important part of the companies value. Companies in other industries without that consideration can behave differently and I have seen that as well.

OpticsEngineer said:

"But for Olympus it makes no sense to produce equipment in the last few months if the intention isn't to continue business under the new ownership."

The way I have seen these kinds of things work is there are agreements made prior to the sale that have to be lived up to. The seller doesn't want to be seen as ruthless and cold... just abandoning the employees, tossing them to a a ruthless and predatory company. it would harm the reputation of the company and hurt future sales in other divisons. (and that is the only reason, it is all about money.) So there is an agreement in writing when the sale is made that business will continue on for one or two years.

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With what company's have you witnessed this for yourself?

All large companies have clauses in the employment agreement that one is subject to immediate termination if one publicly comments on any aspect of business operations and identifies the company. It includes if the company is not named but one could figure out who it was. That could even potentially affect my colleagues in other companies who have said things about their employers. It is just the world we live in.

Just to throw out a made up example, someone could say they work for the company that makes Windex and say they use Windex to clear up cold sores and could get fired for that. (because representing themselves as a company member implies a medical claim.) Even though it was a humorous subplot in the movie "My Big Fat Greek Wedding."

OpticsEngineer said:

All large companies have clauses in the employment agreement that one is subject to immediate termination if one publicly comments on any aspect of business operations and identifies the company. It includes if the company is not named but one could figure out who it was. That could even potentially affect my colleagues in other companies who have said things about their employers. It is just the world we live in.

Just to throw out a made up example, someone could say they work for the company that makes Windex and say they use Windex to clear up cold sores and could get fired for that. (because representing themselves as a company member implies a medical claim.) Even though it was a humorous subplot in the movie "My Big Fat Greek Wedding."

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Since it's in the past it doesn't matter much if the already terminated contract is terminated. So please share your own experiences and what where the companies?

It is just a tool said:

OpticsEngineer said:

All large companies have clauses in the employment agreement that one is subject to immediate termination if one publicly comments on any aspect of business operations and identifies the company. It includes if the company is not named but one could figure out who it was. That could even potentially affect my colleagues in other companies who have said things about their employers. It is just the world we live in.

Just to throw out a made up example, someone could say they work for the company that makes Windex and say they use Windex to clear up cold sores and could get fired for that. (because representing themselves as a company member implies a medical claim.) Even though it was a humorous subplot in the movie "My Big Fat Greek Wedding."

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Since it's in the past it doesn't matter much if the already terminated contract is terminated. So please share your own experiences and what where the companies?

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Do not force it, if he doesn't want to share it for his own reasons then there is no point in beating the drum.

I worked for a large corporation for a few years. I wasn't terminated. However I remember what elaborate clauses were in my contract regarding to giving out information or implying anything that wasn't approved by the company prior to anything being published. Also, confidentiality agreements do not cease to exist at time of one's leaving the company or being terminated. One can be sued out of his pants if he/she discloses anything, especially negative stuff, after leaving the company.

Best, AIK

So basicly anyone can tell negative stories without any way for others to fact check...

LandscapeWhisperer said:

Chris R-UK said:

This is just to let you know that Olympus BIF photographers aren't the only ones to be in an uncertain situation.

Canon appears to have stopped manufacturing the 7Dii without announcing its discontinuation or any successor. Just about everywhere is out of stock. That gives Canon APS-C BIF shooters no upgrade path. They either have to go FF or change systems.

Click to expand...

They want you to go FF mirrorless.

Someone who knows more may be able clarify: they are quoted as dropping development of all future DSLRs? Or was it just EF lenses?

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I think they said that they would be stopping the development of nw EF lenses unless there was a demand. They have clearly switched all their resources to R mount lenses and they have a very adequate range of DSLR lenses.. I don't think that Canon has said anything official about stopping DSLR development.

Antal I Kozma said:

It is just a tool said:

OpticsEngineer said:

All large companies have clauses in the employment agreement that one is subject to immediate termination if one publicly comments on any aspect of business operations and identifies the company. It includes if the company is not named but one could figure out who it was. That could even potentially affect my colleagues in other companies who have said things about their employers. It is just the world we live in.

Just to throw out a made up example, someone could say they work for the company that makes Windex and say they use Windex to clear up cold sores and could get fired for that. (because representing themselves as a company member implies a medical claim.) Even though it was a humorous subplot in the movie "My Big Fat Greek Wedding."

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Since it's in the past it doesn't matter much if the already terminated contract is terminated. So please share your own experiences and what where the companies?

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Tool,

Absolutely let it go.

Antal I Kozma said:

Do not force it, if he doesn't want to share it for his own reasons then there is no point in beating the drum.

I worked for a large corporation for a few years. I wasn't terminated. However I remember what elaborate clauses were in my contract regarding to giving out information or implying anything that wasn't approved by the company prior to anything being published. Also, confidentiality agreements do not cease to exist at time of one's leaving the company or being terminated. One can be sued out of his pants if he/she discloses anything, especially negative stuff, after leaving the company.

Best, AIK

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Your absolutely right. It could be a violation that could severance agreement.

Bernard

It is just a tool said:

So basicly anyone can tell negative stories without any way for others to fact check...

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Distorted view. That is not what I said. The case is strictly related to leaving a large corporation, one way or the other. Confidentiality clauses have quite long expiry dates......... ;-) ;-)

Think about this, someone leaves a large corporation, let's say the CIA..... , then starts telling how things work behind the scenes that the public never can hear about......... Well you get the picture I guess........ ;-)

It doesn't have to be the CIA though, Home Depot, Apple, NASA, etc,etc,etc do business the same way.

Best, AIK

It is just a tool said:

So basicly anyone can tell negative stories without any way for others to fact check...

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Let's say someone is being let go, let's say they feel they were treated badly b4, and especially now. By taking the severance your putting all that behind you. Your signing documents.

If you were to go online and constantly attack them, you are reneging on what you agreed to.

If it were in a forum with anonymity , and if they could connect the dots... They can get their severance back.

Bernard

It is just a tool said:

So basicly anyone can tell negative stories without any way for others to fact check...

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It's a fair point however that NDAs don't always end simply because your contract ended with the employer. They easily extend 1-10 years after, and for some things (like trade secrets) they may last forever. There are likely provisions in the NDA where if you violate it later, they can sue to you to get damages or at least get back the severance pay you likely got as a result of signing that NDA.

https://www.everynda.com/blog/typical-duration-non-disclosure/

https://www.workplacefairness.org/nondisclosure-agreements

That said, you are right that in this case there would be no way for someone to fact check his claims about agreements to continue on after sale with a set date for the end, while PR continues claiming development is ongoing. Others however can bring up examples of companies that make such PR claims and ended up folding (some of these examples may happen to coincide with companies he claims).

..

It is just a tool wrote:

So basicly anyone can tell negative stories without any way for others to fact check.

_--------------------------------------

As you were initially pressing for info, but have let it go.... I just thought

Pressing for details is like asking some one in witness protection "you don't have to tell me your name, just tell me who you worked for" Lol

Best Regards, Bernard

[No message]

Antal I Kozma said:

Hi to all,

I had a year with the OM-D E1 MK II which didn't turn out well. I ended up selling the system. AF was very much hit and miss when photographing small songbirds. The lens, the Zuiko 300mm f4 Pro with the 1.4x converter was excellent though. I loved it, it delivered excellent images when I had the focus spot on.

As it turned out after my selling the gear the new owner had to have the motherboard replaced in the camera. He has a fine camera and lens now which he is very happy with.

Now, when the OM-D E-MX1 came out with improved AF I was thinking about buying into the system again. Why I decided to hold on is that I wanted to wait till the new 150-400mm f4.5 Pro zoom becomes available. Apparently it will be coming out in the winter of this year. I am very interested in getting that lens with the E-MX1 for birding and wildlife in the back country. I spend a lot of time off the beaten path and weight considerations are at premium.

All this said, now there is a kink in the picture again. As we know Olympus is selling its photographic division. Or its camera division? I am not sure, some will educate me on this matter I am sure. So, the Olympus OM-D will not be Olympus any more, another era closes in the history of Olympus as we have known it.

What will this bring? New innovations true to Olympus heritage or something less promising? Should I still buy into the system again? I very much hope that I'll get some positive input from you folks, not some negativity. Just honest opinions about how you see the future for the OM-D system, including optical developments and the µ4/3 in general.

All the best to all in the µ4/3 system, AIK

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Nothing personal but you seam to change cameras as often as you change socks. Many have told me that people invested in a system are reluctant to change system. I have personally never seen this as almost ever photographer I know changes camera brands every two years.

Grimstod said:

Antal I Kozma said:

Hi to all,

I had a year with the OM-D E1 MK II which didn't turn out well. I ended up selling the system. AF was very much hit and miss when photographing small songbirds. The lens, the Zuiko 300mm f4 Pro with the 1.4x converter was excellent though. I loved it, it delivered excellent images when I had the focus spot on.

As it turned out after my selling the gear the new owner had to have the motherboard replaced in the camera. He has a fine camera and lens now which he is very happy with.

Now, when the OM-D E-MX1 came out with improved AF I was thinking about buying into the system again. Why I decided to hold on is that I wanted to wait till the new 150-400mm f4.5 Pro zoom becomes available. Apparently it will be coming out in the winter of this year. I am very interested in getting that lens with the E-MX1 for birding and wildlife in the back country. I spend a lot of time off the beaten path and weight considerations are at premium.

All this said, now there is a kink in the picture again. As we know Olympus is selling its photographic division. Or its camera division? I am not sure, some will educate me on this matter I am sure. So, the Olympus OM-D will not be Olympus any more, another era closes in the history of Olympus as we have known it.

What will this bring? New innovations true to Olympus heritage or something less promising? Should I still buy into the system again? I very much hope that I'll get some positive input from you folks, not some negativity. Just honest opinions about how you see the future for the OM-D system, including optical developments and the µ4/3 in general.

All the best to all in the µ4/3 system, AIK

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Nothing personal but you seam to change cameras as often as you change socks. Many have told me that people invested in a system are reluctant to change system. I have personally never seen this as almost ever photographer I know changes camera brands every two years.

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Grim,

That may be what we see from a small sampling here. If it is true in bigger picture maybe it's nothing more than those that buy a 1 or 2 lens kit, sell it and move on, again and again. In a search for who knows what. And sometimes they come back to square one.

Ben Herman takes superb interior shots/pictures in general and he uses one of the many not so new cameras at his disposal.

Knowing what your doing and why and when is more important than constantly system hopping.

Best Regards,

Bernard