Daniel Cox (Ambassador) has been fired by Panasonic

richj20 · Dec 22, 2019

Tom Caldwell said:
Reviews need to be truthful - admitted as the reviewers opinion only - and the prospective buyers need to be confident that the reviewer has included the warts and decide whether or not that they can live with negatives that are mentioned.

I would add that we should make reviewer's photographs confirm their opinions.

Ambassadors often get pre-production models of equipment, and this was the case when D. Cox posted photographs three years ago with the Panasonic-Leica 100-400mm.

This was an exciting moment, a new telephoto lens with such a focal length range. Common opinion, based on previous experiences with other lenses, was that it would be less than stellar at the longer ranges.

D. Cox's photographs dispelled that notion, and I pre-ordered a copy. I was, and still am, not disappointed.

- Richard

--
http://www.rsjphoto.net

HRC2016 · Dec 22, 2019

Aberaeron said:
You can easily research the 'who?'. All the clues are there.

I do suspect that you know very well 'who' and are yet another respondent that thinks it clever to feign an aloof ignorance. Apologies if not.

Apology accepted.

I thought this was an interesting thread because it shows how others give credence to someone they a) don't personally know and b) has/had a business relationship with a company that wants our money (the details of which are being speculated about here).

DPR is a great way to learn about photography, but it provides a lot of insight into the minds of photographic-gear consumers, and how easily consumers can be tricked.

--
I believe in science, evolution and light. All opinions are my own. I'm not compensated for any of my posts. Can you honestly say that?

bobn2 · Dec 22, 2019

Gnine said:
bobn2 said:

Okapi001 said:

horsth said:

because he criticized their focus implementation DfD (Depth from Defocus) especially the continuous focus for BIF and other fast moving subjects.

Click to expand...

Well, that is what he says. But we don't really know why Panasonic canceled his contract. The reason may be simply that he is no longer using Panasonic exclusively (which I presume is a prerequsite for being an "ambassador").

Click to expand...

Why would that be a prerequisite for being an ambassador?

Click to expand...

Because in the real world, that would be like working for 2 competing companies.

That's only if you see that 'ambassador' role as 'working for'. If you do, then they are just salesmen, no need to take what they say seriously at all.

Gnine said:
If I went out moonlighting, working for the competition whilst still at my current job, I would expect to be sacked in very short order.

So, you think it's a 'job'. Yet there are some here who say they don't get paid...

spike29 · Dec 22, 2019

in my opinion a ambassador is a guy or girl who is enthousiast on a certain brand because of the vision and brought new gear. And every tool has it's weaknes and strongholds so no news there. being positive don't mean being blind.

Don't trashing a brand is officious as a ambassador but being realistic is a core behaviour to be keeping a appearance as expert.

if you can't be telling the truth your lost. And lying about things wil not be raising sells only lose loyal customers.

Me i choose for lumix/panasonic for a reason. knowing that others where better at somepoints. to be blunt i am certain that Olympus has some better body's but the one i chose was in my reach. and sony has quite a good line up wile canon and Nikon are entering mirrorless area.

His blog isn't smashing Lumix only speaking of being not the leader of the pack in predictive AF. i am not an expert so i believe his judgement.

is that bad? ok then i am bad too. And reviewer or Ambassador yes there is a difference but the thin line of lying and be positive about a brand is beyond that of an Ambassador in my eye's.

i still don't ditch my gear for Sony or Nikon. why? Lumix G80 is good enough for me.

JakeJY · Dec 22, 2019

glassoholic said:
Panasonic would have known they were working on big FW CAF Tracking update... why tear up his contract? They should have sent him pre-release FW for testing. I think his mistake was not in criticising Panasonic, but telling his followers that Sony and even Olympus were better.

My guess also. I'm pretty sure he criticized Panasonic before and Panasonic didn't have any apparent action. And I don't think the issue was using other systems, as he was not exclusively using Lumix anyways even previously.

But when you criticize Panasonic and at the same time say other brands are drastically better in comparison, that may cross a line in the contract, especially if that post had a big impact in promoting other brands. But this is all speculation as we don't know what specific terms that contract has.

Aberaeron · Dec 22, 2019

spike29 said:
in my opinion a ambassador is a guy or girl who is enthousiast on a certain brand because of the vision and brought new gear. And every tool has it's weaknes and strongholds so no news there. being positive don't mean being blind.

Don't trashing a brand is officious as a ambassador but being realistic is a core behaviour to be keeping a appearance as expert.

if you can't be telling the truth your lost. And lying about things wil not be raising sells only lose loyal customers.

Me i choose for lumix/panasonic for a reason. knowing that others where better at somepoints. to be blunt i am certain that Olympus has some better body's but the one i chose was in my reach. and sony has quite a good line up wile canon and Nikon are entering mirrorless area.

His blog isn't smashing Lumix only speaking of being not the leader of the pack in predictive AF. i am not an expert so i believe his judgement.

is that bad? ok then i am bad too. And reviewer or Ambassador yes there is a difference but the thin line of lying and be positive about a brand is beyond that of an Ambassador in my eye's.

i still don't ditch my gear for Sony or Nikon. why? Lumix G80 is good enough for me.

I agree with you mostly, I think. Where this chap went wrong from his continued prospects for employment was not in using a measured criticism of a single aspect of the camera's performance but in comparing it unfavourably with rival brands in this respect. His lack of diplomacy and respect for the hand that fed him.

It is a lesson for any employee of any company. If you are disloyal, disrespectful or publicly unduly critical of your employer or their product, expect the contract to be terminated.

That doesn't mean that a person has to lie in any way to retain patronage. They might even mention a relative disadvantage, but never in comparison with a rival product.

A 'reviewer' is, and should never be constrained in the same way, but the reviewer has a very different and less constained job to a brand ambassador.

A Brand Ambassador is a promoter and educator, not a critical reviewer.

Aberaeron · Dec 22, 2019

JakeJY said:
glassoholic said:

Panasonic would have known they were working on big FW CAF Tracking update... why tear up his contract? They should have sent him pre-release FW for testing. I think his mistake was not in criticising Panasonic, but telling his followers that Sony and even Olympus were better.

Click to expand...

My guess also. I'm pretty sure he criticized Panasonic before and Panasonic didn't have any apparent action. And I don't think the issue was using other systems, as he was not exclusively using Lumix anyways even previously.

But when you criticize Panasonic and at the same time say other brands are drastically better in comparison, that may cross a line in the contract, especially if that post had a big impact in promoting other brands. But this is all speculation as we don't know what specific terms that contract has.

That is what I think also.

danieljcox · Dec 22, 2019

spike29 said:
So we establisch that an Ambassador is "working" for a brand and thus a salesman of one brand. So all they say and post is colored and only advertisement. (also the reviews)

(how many reviewers are not biased or "sponsored"?)

I hope that they get payed good enough for that commitment other wise it is as in the real world : if the competition payes more im gone.

By the way i think Daniel Cox wasn't payed enough to speak "brand advertisements" and go mute about other options. I Think he really like(d) the Lumix products and Lumix was happy with him in there thinking of riding along on his blogging followers aiming for selling more. And he was finally done with speaking half the truth.

He was taking a risk well considered in order to be free to speak his mind about things.

His name was more worth to him then the "contract" i think.

SteveY80 · Dec 22, 2019

I saw him mention this a while ago, back when the G9's firmware upgrade was announced. From what he said it was specifically his statement that he preferred shooting birds in flight with his Sony A9 rather than his G9 that led to him being fired. Not a good look for Panasonic, but not exactly surprising.

His new article testing lens sharpness is interesting, especially as he provides full size test shots using the different lenses.

Based on his shots I'm quite impressed with the results from Sony's 200-600mm paired with the high resolution Sony A7R4.

Displayed at the same viewing size, the Sony kit easily outperforms the Olympus 300mm f/4 in the centre, while they're very similar in the corners. Even with the sensor resolution difference, I was expecting the Olympus prime to be better than a similarly priced full frame zoom.

Of course the Sony kit is bigger and heavier, but then it offers the convenience of a zoom and slightly better light gathering, along with the reach and quality...

James Stirling · Dec 22, 2019

SteveY80 said:
I saw him mention this a while ago, back when the G9's firmware upgrade was announced. From what he said it was specifically his statement that he preferred shooting birds in flight with his Sony A9 rather than his G9 that led to him being fired. Not a good look for Panasonic, but not exactly surprising.

His new article testing lens sharpness is interesting, especially as he provides full size test shots using the different lenses.

Based on his shots I'm quite impressed with the results from Sony's 200-600mm paired with the high resolution Sony A7R4.

Displayed at the same viewing size, the Sony kit easily outperforms the Olympus 300mm f/4 in the centre, while they're very similar in the corners. Even with the sensor resolution difference, I was expecting the Olympus prime to be better than a similarly priced full frame zoom.

Of course the Sony kit is bigger and heavier, but then it offers the convenience of a zoom and slightly better light gathering, along with the reach and quality...

It also offers the ability to use it in APS mode for a 26mp file at an effective FF FOV 300-900mm . Heck even if you use a quarter of the A7R4 frame you can still get 15mp images at an effective FF FOV 400-1200mm . The high mp cameras offer a lot of flexibility.

Every time I look at the higher end tele lenses in any system , I am so happy my interests are at the wide and macro end, where even the highest end gear in comparison to the high end tele is relatively speaking a bargain

MrALLCAPS · Dec 22, 2019

Sounds like he wanted to be fired, so he can go Sony.

Welp, he got his wish.

Model Mike · Dec 22, 2019

Aberaeron said:
While his job was maybe to promote the best and most effective use of the product or feature to the benefit of users, in this case the autofocus, it was not his job to criticise the product and certainly not criticise it in comparison with named competitors to that of his employer's. That is the job of independent reviewers and done very well here by DPReviewers actually, especially Jordan and Chris, who are obviously lent the cameras by the importers, as are almost all other popular reviewers.

Absolutely.

RedDog Steve · Dec 22, 2019

NCV said:
Member said:

. . .

Click to expand...

I try to find some impartial opinions of gear I want to buy.

I don't think there is such a thing as an "impartial opinion".

James Stirling · Dec 22, 2019

RedDog Steve said:
NCV said:

RedDog Steve said:

. . .

Click to expand...

I try to find some impartial opinions of gear I want to buy.

Click to expand...

I don't think there is such a thing as an "impartial opinion".

Opinions by their very nature are strongly influenced by ones personal predilections . However if you are reviewing a product as opposed to promoting it , you should be able to see both the advantages and disadvantages of the product . A major number of the disagreements in this and other forums is based on people arguing with someone else's opinion

lescrane · Dec 22, 2019

Some posters are calling him a whore for Panasonic, some a traitor.

I've been following Dan since I made my decision to go with Panny, I found him pretty measured in his praise and criticism. maybe a bit too positive at the beginning but it took honesty to re-evaluate the system after spending more time with it. Frankly I felt validation that the shortcomings of the focus tracking weren't my own technique. I'm sticking with it since action is not a majority of my work and I'm constrained by my inability to carry /hold the additional, weight of a FF long zoom.

Ergellegre · Dec 22, 2019

DtBB said:
acfo said:

bobn2 said:

horsth said:

because he criticized their focus implementation DfD (Depth from Defocus) especially the continuous focus for BIF and other fast moving subjects. He would like it to be changed to Phase Detection AF.

https://naturalexposures.com/comparing-sony-olympus-lumix-telephoto-sharpness/

Click to expand...

As a general point, it illustrates that we should be aware of the pressures on these 'ambassadors' when we analyse their opinions. Notice that he said they cancelled his contract. Too many here seem to think that 'ambassadors' are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts. This gentleman seems to have a backbone.

Click to expand...

Either the gentleman has a backbone or Sony made an offer he could not refuse.

On the serious side: Brand ambassadors do not make any serious money, they probably make their main income with a proper day job. Therefor the pressures on these 'ambassadors' isn't as high as you might think.

Click to expand...

Yes, Sony had the AUDACITY to offer a camera that CAN autofocus properly.

How DARE them!

...after 3 generations of development. DFD had absolutely nailed AF-S in its first gen. Has now reportedly caught up in video AF-C in its second gen updates. Following that trajectory, it's not unreasonable to suppose that BIF and action AF-C from DFD will match X-T3, E-M1ii and A7iii in its third iteration.

gary0319 · Dec 22, 2019

Tom Caldwell said:
NCV said:

Why is there so much interest in these brand prostitutes who sell their endorsements of this or that brand to the highest bidder?

The brand whore must say only good things about the brands gear. That is his assignment. He was just a tool in the hands of a pimp, to sell in this case Panasonic camera gear to unsuspecting camera buyers.

Not surprising he got the push when he stepped out of line.

It will be fun when we see him in bed with his latest punter, bad mouthing his old Panasonic gear.

I guess he is dashing off Emails to all and sundry asking if "they are looking for company"

Click to expand...

Over enthusiastic brand pushing can be as bad for a brand as no publicity. So we might trust reasons for “sacking” as being in a similar vein. Good journalism - and reviewers need to follow this practice to ensure their words remain believable - requires balance - so often we get criticism of relatively minor issues for the sake of that necessary balance.

Of course these negatives are seized upon by those that wish to detract and magnified out of proportion.

Reviews need to be truthful - admitted as the reviewers opinion only - and the prospective buyers need to be confident that the reviewer has included the warts and decide whether or not that they can live with negatives that are mentioned.

What is it that leads people to think that an “ambassador” is supposed to be an impartial reviewer? By definition an ambassador is one who represents and/or promotes an activity or product..... some might call them salespeople.

Ergellegre · Dec 22, 2019

Hmm? Daniel found the Olympus prime is sharper than either, which makes sense. It'd be surprising if that weren't the case.

'without a doubt, the sharpest lens of the bunch was the Olympus 300mm F/4. Shooting it with the 1.4X teleconverter showed almost no degradation in image quality and was still very, very sharp edge to edge.'

drj3 · Dec 22, 2019

SteveY80 said:
I saw him mention this a while ago, back when the G9's firmware upgrade was announced. From what he said it was specifically his statement that he preferred shooting birds in flight with his Sony A9 rather than his G9 that led to him being fired. Not a good look for Panasonic, but not exactly surprising.

His new article testing lens sharpness is interesting, especially as he provides full size test shots using the different lenses.

Based on his shots I'm quite impressed with the results from Sony's 200-600mm paired with the high resolution Sony A7R4.

Displayed at the same viewing size, the Sony kit easily outperforms the Olympus 300mm f/4 in the centre, while they're very similar in the corners. Even with the sensor resolution difference, I was expecting the Olympus prime to be better than a similarly priced full frame zoom.

Why should that surprise you. The DXO - P-Mix, sharpness clearly shows how apparent sharpness increases with increasing the number of pixels.

For example the Canon 600mm f4 has a P-Mix of 19 on the 20MP 6D and a P-Mix of 37 on the 50MP 5DSR. The Sony 60MP camera should easily have a score of twice the P-Mix on the 60MP Sony compared a 20 M-Pix sensor. This demonstrates one of the advantages of a large number of megapixels.

However, if you put the 200-600 on a sports camera - the 24MP Sony A9, the 300mm f4 would be sharper. The A9 has far fewer MP which demonstrates an advantage of a smaller number of megapixels if you want a camera with high frame rates and fast sensor readouts.

SteveY80 said:
Of course the Sony kit is bigger and heavier, but then it offers the convenience of a zoom and slightly better light gathering, along with the reach and quality...

MrALLCAPS · Dec 22, 2019

gary0319 said:
Tom Caldwell said:

NCV said:

Why is there so much interest in these brand prostitutes who sell their endorsements of this or that brand to the highest bidder?

The brand whore must say only good things about the brands gear. That is his assignment. He was just a tool in the hands of a pimp, to sell in this case Panasonic camera gear to unsuspecting camera buyers.

Not surprising he got the push when he stepped out of line.

It will be fun when we see him in bed with his latest punter, bad mouthing his old Panasonic gear.

I guess he is dashing off Emails to all and sundry asking if "they are looking for company"

Click to expand...

Over enthusiastic brand pushing can be as bad for a brand as no publicity. So we might trust reasons for “sacking” as being in a similar vein. Good journalism - and reviewers need to follow this practice to ensure their words remain believable - requires balance - so often we get criticism of relatively minor issues for the sake of that necessary balance.

Of course these negatives are seized upon by those that wish to detract and magnified out of proportion.

Reviews need to be truthful - admitted as the reviewers opinion only - and the prospective buyers need to be confident that the reviewer has included the warts and decide whether or not that they can live with negatives that are mentioned.

Click to expand...

What is it that leads people to think that an “ambassador” is supposed to be an impartial reviewer? By definition an ambassador is one who represents and/or promotes an activity or product..... some might call them salespeople.

That's exactly what they are from my view, Salesmen.

Everything is a positive to them, just as long as they get free trips and products.

Daniel Cox (Ambassador) has been fired by Panasonic

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