Laowa 100mm Macro (Canon-Version) and the Sigma MC-21

Hello,

I found a review, where the Canon-Version of the Laowa 2x-Macro with automatic aperture was tested with the MC-21 on the S1R. The results looked great and I ordered the lens for my combination.

Unfortunately, it does not work...

I asked the reviewer, if he had some special settings, but since he had to give both, the camera and the lens, back after the review, he can't remember any special settings nor can he check it.

So, my question is, does anyone here have this setup working? And if so, are there some special settings to apply to the camera? I have the latest firmware on the camera (could be a "problem" since the review was from May 2019).

The behavior, I'm getting is:

• switch camera on, lens is recognized and aperture can be set via camera. Sometimes, though, I see a short blackout on the display.
• quick press on the shutter does nothing, second longer press opens the shutter but takes very long to close it (a few seconds)
• no image recorded
• display shows a message, saying "Lens attachment failed. Make sure the lens is attached correctly."

Too bad, since this lens has much better usability as Canon-Version with automatic aperture that the also adaptable Nikon-Version, which also has less aperture-blades (7 vs.9).

Thanks in advance!

it's possible you and the reviewer might have been on different camera firmware versions. that's all i can come up with.

/guy

That is currently also my guess. But still hoping for a better answer, since I really would love to have that lens on the S1R.

I wanted to use this combination too, but I was afraid that the adapter might not recognize the lens due to its electronic components. I don't have a problem with any other EF-mount lenses + the MC-21 except the Canon 65/2.8 MPE macro, which it doesn't recognize. (I expected this, since my previous Sigma EF-Sony adapter, MC-11, doesn't recognize it either.)

Sorry to hear about your difficulty. I decided to get a Nikon mount Laowa, which arrived yesterday, and it works fine. I don't presently have a Nikon-L mount adapter, so at the moment I've got a Nikon-EF adapter on the lens, with that combination attached to the MC-21 and it works fine. If I decide to use it quite a bit, I'll get a dedicated Nikon-L mount adapter so I don't have to piggyback two adapters.

Sounds like your best choice, at present, may be to take the route that I did. Seems like someone else (Metabones?) would make an EF to L-mount adapter before too long.

AutoEverything said:

Hello,

I found a review, where the Canon-Version of the Laowa 2x-Macro with automatic aperture was tested with the MC-21 on the S1R. The results looked great and I ordered the lens for my combination.

Unfortunately, it does not work...

I asked the reviewer, if he had some special settings, but since he had to give both, the camera and the lens, back after the review, he can't remember any special settings nor can he check it.

So, my question is, does anyone here have this setup working? And if so, are there some special settings to apply to the camera? I have the latest firmware on the camera (could be a "problem" since the review was from May 2019).

The behavior, I'm getting is:

• switch camera on, lens is recognized and aperture can be set via camera. Sometimes, though, I see a short blackout on the display.
• quick press on the shutter does nothing, second longer press opens the shutter but takes very long to close it (a few seconds)
• no image recorded
• display shows a message, saying "Lens attachment failed. Make sure the lens is attached correctly."

Click to expand...

This is the same message that shows with the EF 100-400/4.5-5.6 MkI (and more or less what the other symptoms indicate).

If one can be solved then the other might be as well.

One thing that happens with some Metabones oddities - usually to do with which stabilisation is invoked when both camera and lens offer it. Was that the camera could be switched on before the lens was then mounted. It is a completely different set of circumstances of course and will almost certainly not give a cure but might be worth trying.

AutoEverything said:

Too bad, since this lens has much better usability as Canon-Version with automatic aperture that the also adaptable Nikon-Version, which also has less aperture-blades (7 vs.9).

Thanks in advance!

Click to expand...

Danny Burk Photo said:

Seems like someone else (Metabones?) would make an EF to L-mount adapter before too long.

Click to expand...

+1 two issues:

1) Sigma have no brief to make any other EF mount lens compatible to L-Mount other than their own. If any other EF mount lens works then it is just an accidental freebie - not a right. This could be seen as a limiting nuisance even if it is quite fair comment.

2) Sigma really wants us to use native L-Mount lenses and this means that they are not going to make even their own EF mount lenses work as well as their native L-Mount lenses which I think is rather poor considering that many have bought their EF mount lenses in good faith and now might reasonably wish to use them on the L-Mount which Sigma co-sponsors.

The third party vendors really need to get into this act.

I think the whole issue of limited success of adapting EF mount lenses to L-Mount is going to limit the adoption of the L-Mount as a system and could backfire on both Panasonic and Sigma - although Leica might not care.

The fact is that you cannot really sell lots of new lenses for an emerging new mount system without lots of camera bodies sold first to create the market for the lenses.

It seems that Sigma is producing a whole flotilla of L-Mount lenses and piously believing that Panasonic camera bodies will rush off the shelves to people who will then buy half a dozen Sigma L-Mount lenses and willingly dispose of their previous lens holdings.

The world does not always work in such a commercial fashion.

--
Tom Caldwell

Tom Caldwell said:

1) Sigma have no brief to make any other EF mount lens compatible to L-Mount other than their own. If any other EF mount lens works then it is just an accidental freebie - not a right. This could be seen as a limiting nuisance even if it is quite fair comment.

Click to expand...

I did not expect them to make any promises. I have the MC-21 and I'm glad, it works with my two Sigma-Lenses. I have specifically bought the Sigma 100-400 Tele and the oldie but goldie 15mm Fisheye for the MC-21/S1R, as I never had a Canon camera. So no complaints to Sigma from my side.

However, if there is a complaint, then its towards the L-Alliance as a whole, that the buildup of different lenses for all purposes (and different price ranges...) takes way too long. I think, it would have been better, to have more lenses available at the start of the alliance. Bodies change all the time, lenses is, what people keep and bind to a system.

Tom Caldwell said:

2) Sigma really wants us to use native L-Mount lenses and this means that they are not going to make even their own EF mount lenses work as well as their native L-Mount lenses which I think is rather poor considering that many have bought their EF mount lenses in good faith and now might reasonably wish to use them on the L-Mount which Sigma co-sponsors.

Click to expand...

I guess, there may also be some technical reasons for that considering the different focusing methods. The high frame-rate of the S1 DFD focusing may just not work very well with many older lenses.

Tom Caldwell said:

I think the whole issue of limited success of adapting EF mount lenses to L-Mount is going to limit the adoption of the L-Mount as a system and could backfire on both Panasonic and Sigma - although Leica might not care.

Click to expand...

I wouldn't go so far that adapting lenses determines the success of the L-Mount. But lens-lineup will have a big impact. Currently, this looks not very good and new lenses take too long.

We have the boring standards between 24 to 200mm and a few extremely expensive Leicas. But no long tele (with quick AF), no impressive macro, a selection of fast primes or zooms... Me, I also always want a good fisheye. - Tastes and needs differ... But most needs are currently not met.

Tom Caldwell said:

The fact is that you cannot really sell lots of new lenses for an emerging new mount system without lots of camera bodies sold first to create the market for the lenses.

Click to expand...

Chicke-egg-problem... Why buy a camera, if you can not use the lenses, you want?

Tom Caldwell said:

It seems that Sigma is producing a whole flotilla of L-Mount lenses and piously believing that Panasonic camera bodies will rush off the shelves to people who will then buy half a dozen Sigma L-Mount lenses and willingly dispose of their previous lens holdings.

Click to expand...

That would be okay for me. I would buy good Sigmas, if they were available.

But such special lenses like the Laowa-Macro (and many of their other stuff) are nothing to expect from Sigma. Thats okay for me, if there is a working adapter solution. The S1R is a very interesting camera for macros and the Laowa-Macros are very capable and interesting lenses. But using the 100mm stopped down manually for focusing when using it handheld outside, is just not very promising.

So I returned the lens, waiting for better times...

There is a lot of difference between someone with a full suite of EF mount lenses and someone starting to buy lenses.

I have the full suite and there is no way that I am particularly interested in re-buying them. But I am interested in using them on my S1 body. There are plenty of very effective electronic adapters EF-Sony FE and of course Canon has made useful adapters EF-RF. So what has the L-Mount done so far - the apparently part-crippled MC-21 which so far does not even give best effort conversion for Sigma EF mount lenses let alone Canon and other third party EF mount lenses. Some EF mount lenses simply will not work and are unlikely ever to do so. It has locked out C-AF capability forever.

To my way of thinking if Sigma can put C-AF into their L-Mount lenses because they know how (and they should) then they should also be able to convert their EF mount lenses to C-AF as well. This especially so for the bunch of lenses already on the market that they are simply re-mounting to become L-Mount lenses. I can understand why they wish to sell L-Mount lenses but I have good reason to wish to adapt EF mount lenses to be fully comfortable to transition to L-Mount. Therefore there has to be a compromise and the MC-21 is that compromise as it stands for the moment. I am not so sure that the MC-21 is going to attract hordes of rusted in EF mount users who already have a full suite of lenses that they can use. Nor is it going to win EF mount lens owners who are already in part transition to Sony FE where they get better adapter performance from their EF lenses today.

Those that have few lenses might wish to pick and choose from a wide smorgasbord of lenses on offer. They are not going to suddenly buy a full suite of lenses overnight.

This will only produce reasonable sales quantities of some of the more popular affordable lenses which is going to leave the more exotic and expensive types pretty well high and dry with quite low sales volume until there are enough L-Mount camera bodies around to create a big enough market for them to sell into. This will tend to make lenses more expensive because of low sales volume - unless the consortium subsidises the lens prices in order to attract sales. It will cost them quite a lot to do so on low volumes.

I thought that this would be quite obvious.

Furthermore there is always a sting in the tail when anyone buys a full suite of lenses - heavy investment in L-Mount lenses completely relies on the on-going success of the L-Mount itself and the ability of mount system to keep making camera bodies that suit L-Mount lens owners. Those owning EF mount lenses can choose to either go back to Canon or swap to Sony E/FE if they so choose. Those with a bunch of L-Mount lenses just have a bunch of L-Mount lenses.

I continue to insist that I am happy with my S1 and MC-21 adapter - but I could be happier.

It's quite timely that you should mention the problems with the Laowa. I just received an update from Don Komarechka on the progress he is making on his new book on macro photography. Don is a highly-respected macro and wildlife photographer based here in western Canada. He mentioned some of the frustrations he is having using the Laowa on his S1R. I'm sure he won't mind me copying and pasting an excerpt from his book update where he describes the problem:

There have been some minor setbacks. These include some lenses not being compatible with adapters for comparison shots – most notably the Laowa 100mm 2X macro lens will not communicate with the Lumix S1R via the Sigma MC-21 adapter, even though similar lenses (manual focus, automatic aperture control) such as the Irix 150mm lens work just fine. This just means one less lens in the comparison section of the book, but these comparisons are not intended to be product-specific. There are other 2X macro lenses in the tests to illustrate what sort of magnification you can achieve for specific subjects.

I was really torn with buying the Laowa or the Irix 150mm. I finally decided that I'd go with the Irix primarily because I thought it might be more versatile for my needs. Now I can confirm that that the EF version of the Irix works perfectly on the S1R. And it balances better on the larger S1R body compared to my Z7. As well, I was able to get it to work on my Z7 using stacked MC-11 and Techart EF-Z adapters with full aperture control and focus confirmation (for the benefit of any Nikon Z6/Z7 owners who are also reading this thread).

BTW, it looks like Don is using the S1R for a number of the shots he is putting together for his book. Here is a link to his book's pre-order form:

https://skycrystals.ca/product/pre-order-macro-photography-the-universe-at-our-feet/

Also, you may have caught DPReviewTV's excellent video on macro techniques last fall that featured Chris Nichols working with Don on a number of small macro projects. Here's the link to the video if you haven't seen it: .

I specifically bought the S1R for macro, still life and garden photography. Once I receive my copy of Don's book, I'll post a mini-review here from a S1R owner's perspective in this forum if any S1/S1R macro shooters are interested.

Sorry, I made one mistake in my post. I think Don is still based in Ontario, not out west here.

Hi, sorry to dig up an old post.

I wanted to know if you ever discovered what the problem was and resolved it? I have the same combination of gear and having some dramas with it. I can take 1 shot, but the successive shot fails to the Lens attachment failed error and i have to power the camera down and restart, just to take 1 shot again.

There is no problem to change aperture on the camera.

I will try it again this evening.

Thomas Mottl said:

There is no problem to change aperture on the camera.

I will try it again this evening.

Click to expand...

Thanks Thomas, do you own the Laowa 100mm macro f2.8 as well? I was more specifically asking about this lens combined with the MC21.