B&H arbitrarily charges 2% for some lenses shipped to Canada?

Michael Fryd said:

Keep in mind that when it comes to the law, common sense does not always apply.

For instance, many digital still cameras also take video. Frequently, the recording time is limited to a maximum of 29 minutes and 59 seconds. The reason for the limitation is legal, not technical. If the camera can take a video of 30 minutes or longer, then it falls into a different legal classification and different import duties apply.

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That is a telling example. The EU has or used to have a duty on videocams, in which the definition was based on that time limit. The reason this rule got in was because at that time there was a lobby from European companies that made these cams in a EU country and felt they could not compete with the Japanese (it is so long ago that the Koreans, let alone the Chinese were not really involved. In the end, this duty did not save the local production. That did of course not mean the duty stopped: apart from bringing in money, it was could still be used as a bargaining chip

Michael Fryd said:

From a common sense perspective there isn't much difference between a camera whose firmware limits video recording to 29:59 and a camera without this firmware limitation. From a legal perspective the difference is quite significant.

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henryp said:

Pov2 said:

Thanks for responding promptly. Your profile says "no private messages",

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It also says For e-mail, PLEASE use: [email protected].

henryp said:

so I suppose it's OK to post the order number here. It's 1057759841. The lens was Lumix G Vario 14-140mm f/3.5-5.6 II ASPH. POWER O.I.S. B&H #PA1414035562. This was the first time I was charged duty on a lens.

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When I put the lens into a shopping cart on our site and indicated Ontario as the destination it did tell me there's
Details of Duties & Taxes
Duties:$11.96
HST:$79.29
Brokerage:$1.00
Total:$92.25

We do not make these calculations internally, nor are they arbitrary (a poor and pejorative word choice IMO). We have engaged a company whose international reputation is pristine to handle these calculations for us.

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You mean a Customs Broker? There is no such thing as pristine reputation in brokerage, given the complexity and ambiguity of customs tariffs.

Lastly, and more importantly, by law in Canada it is the Importer and not the broker who is responsible for proper classification of imported goods. Customs broker is ONLY a facilitator. In case of mis-classification, it is the Importer who is on the hook.

You may not agree, I am in this business.

henryp said:

Of course, they are not perfect so I will ask our liaison here to have them review this.

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Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

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If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

Pov2 said:

Lenses for "photographic cameras" and "colour video cameras" fall in the same category and are duty free. The cameras can be film or digital, or something else uninvented yet but as long as they take photographs and/or videos the lenses for them should be duty free.

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Where are you seeing this definition?

Pov2 said:

If what you wrote is indeed how customs interprets the government tariff schedule it's time to see my MP because it's just wrong.

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I don't work in customs, I've asked my wife to clarify. It's a good thing you completely understand it though, eh?

Pov2 said:

Interesting that 5 people upvoted your post without even looking at the tariff schedule or reading my quote from it. Fortunately, public opinion doesn't change the law.

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Indeed. Specifically, yours doesn't. Nor does man on the street's interpretation of it. I wouldn't attempt to understand the customs tariff, I know that. I've heard lots of stories in the 20 years my wife has been working as a broker.

Pov2 said:

EDIT: Here is another example of this inconsistency. Canon RF lenses incur 2% duty. Let's say they can't be used on a film camera, that's why. But Rokinon 85mm f/1.4 Lens for Canon RF, Rokinon 14mm f/2.8 Lens for Canon RF, and Meike MK-50mm f/1.7 Lens for Canon RF are for the same mount and can't be used on a film camera either. But they are duty free.

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You know, it could simply be a misinterpretation of the tariff, by whoever programmed B&H's system. Presumably its an automated system that they simply bought off the shelf. Lots of such things exist, and like computer programs, they're rarely 100% correct. My wife has told me many stories over the years how, especially inexperienced raters don't follow through a classification to the end, and thus classify things incorrectly. I can't even imagine how difficult it would be to rate all products for B&H to use in an automated system.

richiebee said:

Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

Click to expand...

If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

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I should probably follow my own advice and not try to interpret the tariff... I could be wrong on this, but right at the top of Chapter 90, it says (and I've simplified by removing lots of text, but still make it possible for you to find...

"This chapter does not cover:

...

(h) ... television cameras, digital cameras and video camera recorders (heading 85.25)..."

richiebee said:

richiebee said:

Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

Click to expand...

If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

Click to expand...

I should probably follow my own advice and not try to interpret the tariff... I could be wrong on this, but right at the top of Chapter 90, it says (and I've simplified by removing lots of text, but still make it possible for you to find...

"This chapter does not cover:

...

(h) ... television cameras, digital cameras and video camera recorders (heading 85.25)..."

Click to expand...

...my wife adds -

Digital cameras are classified in Chapter 85 of the Customs tariff, photographic cameras are classified in chapter 90.

The explanatory notes for heading 8525 (digital cameras) read as follows:

(B) TELEVISION CAMERAS, DIGITAL CAMERAS AND VIDEO CAMERA RECORDERS

This group covers cameras that capture images and convert them into an electronic signal that is :

(1) transmitted as a video image to a location outside the camera for viewing or remote recording (i.e., television cameras); or

(2) recorded in the camera as a still image or as a motion picture (i.e., digital cameras and video camera recorders).

Many of the cameras of this heading may physically resemble the photographic cameras of heading 90.06 or the cinematographic cameras of heading 90.07. The cameras in heading 85.25 and the cameras in Chapter 90 typically include optical lenses to focus the image on a light-sensitive medium and adjustments to vary the amount of light entering the camera. However, photographic and cinematographic cameras of Chapter 90 expose images onto photographic film of Chapter 37, while the cameras of this heading convert the images into analogue or digital data.

The cameras of this heading capture an image by focusing the image onto a light-sensitive device, such as a complementary metal oxide semiconductor (CMOS) or charge-coupled device (CCD). The light-sensitive device sends an electrical representation of the images to be further processed into an analogue or digital record of the images.

richiebee said:

Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

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If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

richiebee said:

Lenses for "photographic cameras" and "colour video cameras" fall in the same category and are duty free. The cameras can be film or digital, or something else uninvented yet but as long as they take photographs and/or videos the lenses for them should be duty free.

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Where are you seeing this definition?

richiebee said:

If what you wrote is indeed how customs interprets the government tariff schedule it's time to see my MP because it's just wrong.

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I don't work in customs, I've asked my wife to clarify. It's a good thing you completely understand it though, eh?

richiebee said:

Interesting that 5 people upvoted your post without even looking at the tariff schedule or reading my quote from it. Fortunately, public opinion doesn't change the law.

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Indeed. Specifically, yours doesn't. Nor does man on the street's interpretation of it. I wouldn't attempt to understand the customs tariff, I know that. I've heard lots of stories in the 20 years my wife has been working as a broker.

richiebee said:

EDIT: Here is another example of this inconsistency. Canon RF lenses incur 2% duty. Let's say they can't be used on a film camera, that's why. But Rokinon 85mm f/1.4 Lens for Canon RF, Rokinon 14mm f/2.8 Lens for Canon RF, and Meike MK-50mm f/1.7 Lens for Canon RF are for the same mount and can't be used on a film camera either. But they are duty free.

Click to expand...

You know, it could simply be a misinterpretation of the tariff, by whoever programmed B&H's system. Presumably its an automated system that they simply bought off the shelf. Lots of such things exist, and like computer programs, they're rarely 100% correct. My wife has told me many stories over the years how, especially inexperienced raters don't follow through a classification to the end, and thus classify things incorrectly. I can't even imagine how difficult it would be to rate all products for B&H to use in an automated system.

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Very true.

There are many grey areas in tariffs.

The original discussion was about lenses, not cameras - I don't think that distinction between digital/film cameras was ever in doubt. I am still looking for the distinct codes that your wife says are separating lenses for film and digital cameras: I can't find it and I have been looking.

Any pointer she can give will be appreciated.

drynn said:

The original discussion was about lenses, not cameras - I don't think that distinction between digital/film cameras was ever in doubt.

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Actually the OP did argue the distinction between between film and digital cameras. Hopefully that’s all clear now.

drynn said:

I am still looking for the distinct codes that your wife says are separating lenses for film and digital cameras: I can't find it and I have been looking.

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90.02 is objective lenses

9002.11 is for cameras etc... so for all cameras, lenses are in 9002.11

9002.11.10 is for a bunch of things including photographic (defined as film) cameras, but NOT digital cameras, which we know are categorized separately. So lenses for film cameras come under here.... specifically 9002.11.10.10... 0%

Digital cameras aren’t listed there, so they would come under “Other” which is 9002.11.90.00... 2%.

Why wouldn’t digital cameras come under 9002.11.10.90? Because they’re not listed under 9002.11.10.

Understanding the tariff is something for trained people. My wife has been explaining it to me, and I understand what she’s telling me as she shows it to me, but it can not be easily read by someone who does not understand the entire format.

It’s a constantly evolving document - who knows, maybe next year, they’ll all be duty free.

richiebee said:

drynn said:

The original discussion was about lenses, not cameras - I don't think that distinction between digital/film cameras was ever in doubt.

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Actually the OP did argue the distinction between between film and digital cameras. Hopefully that’s all clear now.

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This (below) is what started it and what I have been referring to:-

"Recently I ordered my first Panasonic mirroless lens and was charged a 2% duty. I thought that was weird - no duties for DSLR lenses but 2% duty for mirrorless?.."

richiebee said:

richiebee said:

I am still looking for the distinct codes that your wife says are separating lenses for film and digital cameras: I can't find it and I have been looking.

Click to expand...

90.02 is objective lenses

9002.11 is for cameras etc... so for all cameras, lenses are in 9002.11

9002.11.10 is for a bunch of things including photographic (defined as film) cameras, but NOT digital cameras, which we know are categorized separately. So lenses for film cameras come under here.... specifically 9002.11.10.10... 0%

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Where do you get the definition that 'photographic' refers solely to film?

richiebee said:

Digital cameras aren’t listed there, so they would come under “Other” which is 9002.11.90.00... 2%.

Why wouldn’t digital cameras come under 9002.11.10.90? Because they’re not listed under 9002.11.10.

Understanding the tariff is something for trained people. My wife has been explaining it to me, and I understand what she’s telling me as she shows it to me, but it can not be easily read by someone who does not understand the entire format.

It’s a constantly evolving document

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Well that all depends on your definition of 'constant'. The current Chapter 90 is over six years old.

richiebee said:

- who knows, maybe next year, they’ll all be duty free.

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drynn said:

richiebee said:

drynn said:

The original discussion was about lenses, not cameras - I don't think that distinction between digital/film cameras was ever in doubt.

Click to expand...

Actually the OP did argue the distinction between between film and digital cameras. Hopefully that’s all clear now.

Click to expand...

This (below) is what started it and what I have been referring to:-

"Recently I ordered my first Panasonic mirroless lens and was charged a 2% duty. I thought that was weird - no duties for DSLR lenses but 2% duty for mirrorless?.."

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OP said this -

"The cameras can be film or digital, or something else uninvented yet but as long as they take photographs and/or videos the lenses for them should be duty free." clearly demonstrating that they do not believe there to be a distinction between film and digital cameras, which is clearly wrong.

drynn said:

Where do you get the definition that 'photographic' refers solely to film?

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Read these...

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62872138 and https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62872189

drynn said:

drynn said:

It’s a constantly evolving document

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Well that all depends on your definition of 'constant'. The current Chapter 90 is over six years old.

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Probably think beyond cameras.

robert1955 said:

Pov2 said:

richiebee said:

I had a discussion with my wife about this (she is a Canadian customs broker, who used to work in imports, now does consulting), and she says film camera lenses are duty free, but lenses designed specifically for other purposes including digital cameras, have 2% duty. End use doesn’t matter, so if it’s a lens that CAN be used on a film camera, it’s duty free and if it can only be used on a digital camera (an example would be Nikon Z mount lenses - there being no film cameras with a Z mount), the duty is 2%.

Remember that the customs tariff wasn’t designed specifically for this case. The definition of a photographic camera for the purpose of the tariff is one that takes film. Technically the kens should have been designed for use with film cameras to make it duty free but you would likely be able to successfully argue it as duty free if it CAN be used on a film camera even if it was designed for digital. Mount adapters (such as one that would allow a z mount lens on an f mount camera does not change the classification.

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Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job.

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Once again you go in full attack mode. This is not civil

robert1955 said:

Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited.

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But that link is dead, 404

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It's not dead. I just opened it. Here it is again: http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/trade-commerce/tariff-tarif/2019/menu-eng.html

robert1955 said:

robert1955 said:

It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

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We have now the company that does the background work for B&H and one person [admittedly unknown to us] saying you've not got it right. My money is on them, not you. Maybe you should take this up with Canadian customs.

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This is not decided by voting or betting. The tariff schedule was published before this discussion started. Just read it. It's very clear.

robert1955 said:

Show us the law then

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The link is above.

robert1955 said:

robert1955 said:

P.S. And if one thinks broadly tariffs exist to protect local manufacture. Canada doesn't manufacture photographic/video lenses or cameras. They should be duty free.

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'Should' does not come into it

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In the tariff they are duty free. The "should" only supports the logic.

robert1955 said:

Michael Fryd said:

Keep in mind that when it comes to the law, common sense does not always apply.

For instance, many digital still cameras also take video. Frequently, the recording time is limited to a maximum of 29 minutes and 59 seconds. The reason for the limitation is legal, not technical. If the camera can take a video of 30 minutes or longer, then it falls into a different legal classification and different import duties apply.

Click to expand...

That is a telling example. The EU has or used to have a duty on videocams, in which the definition was based on that time limit. The reason this rule got in was because at that time there was a lobby from European companies that made these cams in a EU country and felt they could not compete with the Japanese (it is so long ago that the Koreans, let alone the Chinese were not really involved. In the end, this duty did not save the local production. That did of course not mean the duty stopped: apart from bringing in money, it was could still be used as a bargaining chip

robert1955 said:

From a common sense perspective there isn't much difference between a camera whose firmware limits video recording to 29:59 and a camera without this firmware limitation. From a legal perspective the difference is quite significant.

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Yes, it was EU only thing. In another thread I read that this limitation was recently lifted. Regardless, why on Earth cameras distributed in North America, where this limitation was not applicable, were still restricted? Even the specific models that were intended for North America only. I think the Japanese wanted us to influence Europe to remove this restriction. If my information above is correct they succeeded.

Marek M said:

henryp said:

Pov2 said:

Thanks for responding promptly. Your profile says "no private messages",

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It also says For e-mail, PLEASE use: [email protected].

Member said:

so I suppose it's OK to post the order number here. It's 1057759841. The lens was Lumix G Vario 14-140mm f/3.5-5.6 II ASPH. POWER O.I.S. B&H #PA1414035562. This was the first time I was charged duty on a lens.

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When I put the lens into a shopping cart on our site and indicated Ontario as the destination it did tell me there's
Details of Duties & Taxes
Duties:$11.96
HST:$79.29
Brokerage:$1.00
Total:$92.25

We do not make these calculations internally, nor are they arbitrary (a poor and pejorative word choice IMO). We have engaged a company whose international reputation is pristine to handle these calculations for us.

Click to expand...

You mean a Customs Broker? There is no such thing as pristine reputation in brokerage, given the complexity and ambiguity of customs tariffs.

Lastly, and more importantly, by law in Canada it is the Importer and not the broker who is responsible for proper classification of imported goods. Customs broker is ONLY a facilitator. In case of mis-classification, it is the Importer who is on the hook.

You may not agree, I am in this business.

Member said:

Of course, they are not perfect so I will ask our liaison here to have them review this.

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In this case B&H is the importer on record. I don't think they are on the hook because they didn't underpay.

richiebee said:

richiebee said:

Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

Click to expand...

If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

Click to expand...

I should probably follow my own advice and not try to interpret the tariff... I could be wrong on this, but right at the top of Chapter 90, it says (and I've simplified by removing lots of text, but still make it possible for you to find...

"This chapter does not cover:

...

(h) ... television cameras, digital cameras and video camera recorders (heading 85.25)..."

Click to expand...

The notes explain where the things covered that are not covered in chapter 90. Digital cameras are covered in chapter 85, heading 85.25 etc. Chapter 90 covers lenses. You can search the whole document and find all occurrences of the word lens. Control+F in your PDF reader of choice, type "lens" and it will find all words that include "lens", including lenses.

These tariffs are written in simple language unlike other ambiguous laws that need interpretation. There are specific terms, nothing to interpret. If it says potato, it's potato; if it says tomato, it's tomato. If it says photographic or video camera, it's photographic or video camera. In my case it's both because the camera can take video. But it's all covered in the same heading. Unambiguously.

Pov2 said:

richiebee said:

richiebee said:

Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

Click to expand...

If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

Click to expand...

I should probably follow my own advice and not try to interpret the tariff... I could be wrong on this, but right at the top of Chapter 90, it says (and I've simplified by removing lots of text, but still make it possible for you to find...

"This chapter does not cover:

...

(h) ... television cameras, digital cameras and video camera recorders (heading 85.25)..."

Click to expand...

The notes explain where the things covered that are not covered in chapter 90. Digital cameras are covered in chapter 85, heading 85.25 etc. Chapter 90 covers lenses. You can search the whole document and find all occurrences of the word lens. Control+F in your PDF reader of choice, type "lens" and it will find all words that include "lens", including lenses.

These tariffs are written in simple language unlike other ambiguous laws that need interpretation. There are specific terms, nothing to interpret. If it says potato, it's potato; if it says tomato, it's tomato. If it says photographic or video camera, it's photographic or video camera. In my case it's both because the camera can take video. But it's all covered in the same heading. Unambiguously.

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LOL. Just keep believing.

richiebee said:

richiebee said:

richiebee said:

Pov2 said:

Sorry, but it is sad that a customs broker doesn't seem to know her job. Read my OP, there is a link to the official document that I also cited. It clearly states "Lenses..." "For photographic cameras" and "For colour television cameras or colour video cameras". It never mentions film anywhere besides "cinematographic films (motion picture films), animated films" where "film" has a different sense.

Click to expand...

If you don't work in customs clearance, I'd suggest you don't attempt to interpret the customs tariff. If you do, you shouldn't be asking the question on a camera forum.

Click to expand...

I should probably follow my own advice and not try to interpret the tariff... I could be wrong on this, but right at the top of Chapter 90, it says (and I've simplified by removing lots of text, but still make it possible for you to find...

"This chapter does not cover:

...

(h) ... television cameras, digital cameras and video camera recorders (heading 85.25)..."

Click to expand...

...my wife adds -

Digital cameras are classified in Chapter 85 of the Customs tariff, photographic cameras are classified in chapter 90.

The explanatory notes for heading 8525 (digital cameras) read as follows:

(B) TELEVISION CAMERAS, DIGITAL CAMERAS AND VIDEO CAMERA RECORDERS

This group covers cameras that capture images and convert them into an electronic signal that is :

(1) transmitted as a video image to a location outside the camera for viewing or remote recording (i.e., television cameras); or

(2) recorded in the camera as a still image or as a motion picture (i.e., digital cameras and video camera recorders).

Many of the cameras of this heading may physically resemble the photographic cameras of heading 90.06 or the cinematographic cameras of heading 90.07. The cameras in heading 85.25 and the cameras in Chapter 90 typically include optical lenses to focus the image on a light-sensitive medium and adjustments to vary the amount of light entering the camera. However, photographic and cinematographic cameras of Chapter 90 expose images onto photographic film of Chapter 37, while the cameras of this heading convert the images into analogue or digital data.

The cameras of this heading capture an image by focusing the image onto a light-sensitive device, such as a complementary metal oxide semiconductor (CMOS) or charge-coupled device (CCD). The light-sensitive device sends an electrical representation of the images to be further processed into an analogue or digital record of the images.

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Very interesting! Is this from the World Customs Organization? I have troubles finding these. They are available for purchase, probably that's why.

I also found this article: "When Classifying Parts Using HTS Codes, Read the Notes!"

In what world a digital photocamera is not a photographic camera? In our modern world. Looks like customs brokers use these definitions, although they don't really make sense. And these definitions are not country specific if they come from the World Customs Organization. They are not present in the Canadian tariff schedule. I have an impression that whoever wrote Canadian tariffs wasn't aware that a digital camera is not a photographic camera. Why impose tariffs if there is no local production.

Please say thank you to your wife, and I apologize for doubting her credibility.

richiebee said:

drynn said:

The original discussion was about lenses, not cameras - I don't think that distinction between digital/film cameras was ever in doubt.

Click to expand...

Actually the OP did argue the distinction between between film and digital cameras. Hopefully that’s all clear now.

richiebee said:

I am still looking for the distinct codes that your wife says are separating lenses for film and digital cameras: I can't find it and I have been looking.

Click to expand...

90.02 is objective lenses

9002.11 is for cameras etc... so for all cameras, lenses are in 9002.11

9002.11.10 is for a bunch of things including photographic (defined as film) cameras, but NOT digital cameras, which we know are categorized separately. So lenses for film cameras come under here.... specifically 9002.11.10.10... 0%

Digital cameras aren’t listed there, so they would come under “Other” which is 9002.11.90.00... 2%.

Why wouldn’t digital cameras come under 9002.11.10.90? Because they’re not listed under 9002.11.10.

Understanding the tariff is something for trained people. My wife has been explaining it to me, and I understand what she’s telling me as she shows it to me, but it can not be easily read by someone who does not understand the entire format.

It’s a constantly evolving document - who knows, maybe next year, they’ll all be duty free.

Click to expand...

I can confirm that my lens was classified as "Other" with Harmonized code 9002119000. The only way to retrieve the customs declaration was to scan the huge barcode on the shipping label.

Did B&H ever come back to you?

drynn said:

Did B&H ever come back to you?

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No.

Pov2 said:

In what world a digital photocamera is not a photographic camera? In our modern world.

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I suspect changing a descriptor/definition in the tariff is hard once it has been established, and would have been harder at the time digital cameras were invented, and word processing/document handling was a lot more primitive than it is now. It is understandable that they need to be classified separately since film has (or at least had) a different service industry revolving around it than digital has. It's not just about the camera. Who knows what they were thinking when digital cameras were added to the tariff... would it be a fad that just fizzles out? In any event, the name photographic camera was defined before digital was a thing. When they added digital cameras, I suspect they believed that it would be too hard or unnecessary to change the term "photographic camera". Remember, it is for classification purposes only - not a literal definition.

Pov2 said:

Looks like customs brokers use these definitions, although they don't really make sense. And these definitions are not country specific if they come from the World Customs Organization. They are not present in the Canadian tariff schedule. I have an impression that whoever wrote Canadian tariffs wasn't aware that a digital camera is not a photographic camera. Why impose tariffs if there is no local production.

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Good question. As I understand it, it requires an importer who does more than a certain value of importing of a product classification in question to make a challenge to the tariff/duties. I believe it is over a $1million, but I don't know the exact threshold value. As mirrorless only lenses become more popular, that challenge may be possible, and a change may be made to make them duty free. I suspect the major manufacturer distributors could make that challenge if they are paying enough in duties to make it worth the challenge.

Pov2 said:

Please say thank you to your wife, and I apologize for doubting her credibility.

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I appreciate your apology. My wife deals with this all the time, and even though she's virtually always right, she rarely gets an apology. I did pass on your apology, and she just laughed - "I get that all the time, NBD!"