The photo of the dead father and daughter in the Rio Grande.

The photo of the dead father and daughter in the Rio Grande.

There have been some comments that publications showing the photo have been disrespectful to the family of the dead.

Others have said that using such photos is essential to getting the story out, to illustrating an issue that is happening to many.

I know there are many examples of shocking photos going back in time that helped crystalise feelings towards events / wars / civilian issues.

What do you think? was it right to publish this photo?

And is there an issue that it is only poor people and usually non white people whose photos are published like this?

Mark_A
The entire controversy around that photo is a completely manufactured one, was it right to publish the Kevin Carter photo of the child and the vulture ? Robert Capa's Falling Soldier ? Any of the WW2 concentration camps survivors (and non-survivors) photos ?
Good point. We have the graphic pictures of a young Vietnamese girl running from a napalm explosion as well as the picture of a Vietnamese man the moment he was shot in the head with a pistol that was inches from his head. These date back to the late 1960s. I believe that how one perceives pictures such as this relates to their socio-economic and political experiences. The agenda and motivation of the photographer also comes in to play.

Personally, I see no added value to pictures such as this and my preference is that they not be published.
What kind of (news) pictures do you see added value in and what is that added value ?
I believe, that in today's political environment, the photographer and the publisher have ulterior motives.
There is nothing ulterior about them, publishers and photographers rarely hide their positions about what they are photographing. The media works best when pluralistic - composed of many outlets of different positions doing their best to argue for them (hopefully without resorting to factual dishonesty), the desire for a single "neutral" "media" is dumb beyond belief - ever looked at which countries claim to have that ? Ever looked at which countries have an inquisitory legal system rather than an adversarial one ?

Yes it would be very nice to have a stronger separation between reporting and editorial content, it would also be nice not to have channels I don't watch bundled in my cable package.
This also holds true for the Vietnamese photos. We were then and are now in a highly political environment therefore no added value.
What is a non highly-political environment ? When and where did such a thing exist ?
Added value would be missionaries in Mexico and other Central American countries providing food, education, and medical care.
Wanna see photos of missionaries feeding Salvadorans ? Have one of the Murdoch papers send a photographer there and take them, an agency like AP will probably rightly claim that this is PR rather than news unless they are so successful so that refugees will stop trying to swim across the Rio Grande. Also putting missionaries in charge of education probably qualifies as cruel and unusual punishment under the US constitution so good thing it's not in the US.
Ya just don't get it.
 
Also no one mentions the coyotes, and what they do to these children!! By allowing open boarders with no control of who comes in, this problem will continue. Congress and the president have to get together to fix this problem.
We don't have open borders and no one wants open borders but nice try.
Actually there are plenty of people who want open borders, go read social media, look it up on YT, listen to politicians, look at photos from all over the world including the US.





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--
"Teach me how to sacrifice
I'm told that I don't know a thing
But maybe with some time alone
We'll both learn what it means
I feel as though I owe you more
Than just these words of gratitude you read
So before it ends, my friend
I'll teach you how to, bleed...." -
 
Tell me...how many innocent people in the 30's were killed compared to today? Numbers please? Do you think more gun control is the answer? In London people are getting there heads cut off and stabbed daily...no guns allowed. Should we ban knives? How about banning cars? Maybe we should put goveners on cars in cities so they only do 5 MPG?
When was the last time someone killed 60 people with a knife and last time I checked they now have barriers up to stop people from driving into crowds. Will changing the laws stop every death no they won’t but it will stop some and to do nothing is morally bankrupt.
Look at the stats for the US, most of the gun crime is committed by people in the inner city, who are not law abiding gun owners, who will continue to NOT follow the added gun laws you would have put in place. A large % of those are gang and drug related, not exactly your stereotypical right wing Trump supporting citizen.

So you take gun crime stats, perpetrated by one group, and then blame another group and try to enforce stricter gun laws on them? If you want to address gun crime in a meaningful way, go address the liberals living in the big cities, im sure those criminals will be willing to listen.

Most gun crime is a product of left wing inner-city culture, people and policy. Expecting the law abiding folks to fix it is plain stupid.

--
"Teach me how to sacrifice
I'm told that I don't know a thing
But maybe with some time alone
We'll both learn what it means
I feel as though I owe you more
Than just these words of gratitude you read
So before it ends, my friend
I'll teach you how to, bleed...." -
 
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Also no one mentions the coyotes, and what they do to these children!! By allowing open boarders with no control of who comes in, this problem will continue. Congress and the president have to get together to fix this problem.
We don't have open borders and no one wants open borders but nice try.
Actually there are plenty of people who want open borders, go read social media, look it up on YT, listen to politicians, look at photos from all over the world including the US.
Sorry but we currently do not have open borders and there are no current elected officials advocating open borders.
 
Also no one mentions the coyotes, and what they do to these children!! By allowing open boarders with no control of who comes in, this problem will continue. Congress and the president have to get together to fix this problem.
We don't have open borders and no one wants open borders but nice try.
Actually there are plenty of people who want open borders, go read social media, look it up on YT, listen to politicians, look at photos from all over the world including the US.
Sorry but we currently do not have open borders and there are no current elected officials advocating open borders.
Never said we do have them, if we did you wouldn't see people demanding it. Duh?
 
Also no one mentions the coyotes, and what they do to these children!! By allowing open boarders with no control of who comes in, this problem will continue. Congress and the president have to get together to fix this problem.
Why? Trump said the wall is being built and Mexico is paying for it.
 
Also no one mentions the coyotes, and what they do to these children!! By allowing open boarders with no control of who comes in, this problem will continue. Congress and the president have to get together to fix this problem.
We don't have open borders and no one wants open borders but nice try.
Actually there are plenty of people who want open borders, go read social media, look it up on YT, listen to politicians, look at photos from all over the world including the US.
Sorry but we currently do not have open borders and there are no current elected officials advocating open borders.
Never said we do have them, if we did you wouldn't see people demanding it. Duh?
There are extremists on both sides. No reasonable person currently in office or running for office are advocating for open borders.
 
Tell me...how many innocent people in the 30's were killed compared to today? Numbers please? Do you think more gun control is the answer? In London people are getting there heads cut off and stabbed daily...no guns allowed. Should we ban knives? How about banning cars? Maybe we should put goveners on cars in cities so they only do 5 MPG?
We should ban unregistered cars on our streets.
 
So what do we think will be the effect of this image?

Will it persuade migrants not to risk the dangerous river crossing?
They will risk it even more because of the potential for fame. The image made the subjects famous.
Do you honestly think that dead 23 year old did any of what he did for fame?

They took a perilous journey. Applied for asylum. Got impatient and decided to swim. He had swam the little girl across. She jumped in the water after the father swam back for the wife. Didn't work out. I am not the smartest but that doesn't match up with your claim
Will it persuade US and Mexican politicians to show more care to the migrants around the border?
They will show even less care, like story of mom charged for death of fetus for getting in fight while pregnant.
Uhhhh.........that doesn't have much to do with the question asked
Will Trump be persuaded that immigration policy should change, one way or another?
He enjoys this footage. He'll see this as a sign his policies are working and will push full steam ahead.
Here I agree. Although no matter the circumstances your statement is probably true
 
Sorry but we currently do not have open borders and there are no current elected officials advocating open borders.
Never said we do have them, if we did you wouldn't see people demanding it. Duh?
There are extremists on both sides. No reasonable person currently in office or running for office are advocating for open borders.
But there's nothing extreme about wanting controlled or even closed borders. That's the default, it's why we have separate countries with separate names and have armed guards there. Why that's called extreme now shows how far to the left some people have moved.

The US does not need more people, 325 million and we "need" more? Nope. It's not like the majority we are bringing are actually helping us out, they are draining the systems, they NEED us. So the real argument is how much we should care about the welfare of strangers who want handouts.
 
So what do we think will be the effect of this image?

Will it persuade migrants not to risk the dangerous river crossing?
no
Will it persuade US and Mexican politicians to show more care to the migrants around the border?
no
Will Trump be persuaded that immigration policy should change, one way or another?
he is already persuaded that immigration policy should change one way or another, he and his supporters prefer one way while his opponents prefer another, at least publicly.
What do you think will be the effect of the publication of this image?
just keeping the topic afloat.
 
Sorry but we currently do not have open borders and there are no current elected officials advocating open borders.
Never said we do have them, if we did you wouldn't see people demanding it. Duh?
There are extremists on both sides. No reasonable person currently in office or running for office are advocating for open borders.
But there's nothing extreme about wanting controlled or even closed borders. That's the default, it's why we have separate countries with separate names and have armed guards there. Why that's called extreme now shows how far to the left some people have moved.

The US does not need more people, 325 million and we "need" more? Nope. It's not like the majority we are bringing are actually helping us out, they are draining the systems, they NEED us. So the real argument is how much we should care about the welfare of strangers who want handouts.
Why are you so sure they all want handouts?

Hate to bring this up but banning abortion and not making birth control affordable and readily available along with not making sex education mandatory sure points to wanting more people in the country.
 
Sorry but we currently do not have open borders and there are no current elected officials advocating open borders.
Never said we do have them, if we did you wouldn't see people demanding it. Duh?
There are extremists on both sides. No reasonable person currently in office or running for office are advocating for open borders.
But there's nothing extreme about wanting controlled or even closed borders. That's the default, it's why we have separate countries with separate names and have armed guards there. Why that's called extreme now shows how far to the left some people have moved.

The US does not need more people, 325 million and we "need" more? Nope. It's not like the majority we are bringing are actually helping us out, they are draining the systems, they NEED us. So the real argument is how much we should care about the welfare of strangers who want handouts.
actually not true in order to keep current growth at its current pace we need immigration because contrary to your ill formed belief immigration is a net positive which is why despite controlling all three branches of legislative government for two years the republicans passed no reform and built no walls. It is simply a shiny object to wave at their base. Heck even Trumps own economic adviser admitted we need immigration to continue growing the economy.
 
I shouldn't have mentioned .. domestic US gun killings as that lead us more into politics and away from photography.

Anyhow the thread is almost done so hopefully no harm done.

If the photographer had not been present, early in the discovery of the bodies the photo would not have been taken and would not have been published.

So there was some randomness at the very beginning of this story.

Mark_A
 
But there's nothing extreme about wanting controlled or even closed borders. That's the default, it's why we have separate countries with separate names and have armed guards there. Why that's called extreme now shows how far to the left some people have moved.

The US does not need more people, 325 million and we "need" more? Nope. It's not like the majority we are bringing are actually helping us out, they are draining the systems, they NEED us. So the real argument is how much we should care about the welfare of strangers who want handouts.
Why are you so sure they all want handouts?

Hate to bring this up but banning abortion and not making birth control affordable and readily available along with not making sex education mandatory sure points to wanting more people in the country.
Actually i believe that making abortion so easy to get makes people more careless with getting prego, since they know they can just kill it after the fact. Maybe if they know they don't have that option, they will be more responsible to begin with.
 
The photo of the dead father and daughter in the Rio Grande.

There have been some comments that publications showing the photo have been disrespectful to the family of the dead.

Others have said that using such photos is essential to getting the story out, to illustrating an issue that is happening to many.

I know there are many examples of shocking photos going back in time that helped crystalise feelings towards events / wars / civilian issues.

What do you think? was it right to publish this photo?

And is there an issue that it is only poor people and usually non white people whose photos are published like this?

Mark_A
People die every day, thousands of them. Women, children, men, grandparents, the weak, the strong, the list goes on and on. In fact, 151,600* people die each day. The ONLY reason this picture was published is that it fits the political narrative. Joseph Goebbels would be proud of how well the mass media has been used these past couples of decades.

*source https://www.ecology.com/birth-death-rates/
But many people die needlessly and news stories with photos could be used to prevent more needless dying by bringing attention to a horrible situation.

Some people need to be shocked with photos or see something first hand in order to sway their opinion and begin to take steps to stop the dying.
The media is supposed to be unbiased and just report on the facts; they don't do that. Regardless of your political beliefs, It should clearly evident that facts don't matter anymore. Pulling on heartstrings to shape and form beliefs is where it's at. Because we are visual creatures, photographs and video are very powerful.
The photo is not a fact are you saying it was staged after the image was taken they got up and walked away.
I didn't say that! In fact, you are twisting the truth just like the media.

What EXACTLY did I say, I said the media was biased. That is a far cry from you inferring that I said it was a staged event.

Done here.
Were is the false narrative in the image or the story of how the father and daughter drowned and the circumstances that lead to that drowning. If a news organizations had the image and decided not to publish isn’t that also a bias.
Real news media organizations and professional journalists are biased. They believe the public has a right and responsibility to be informed and to know the facts surrounding stories of public interest, no matter how disturbing or controversial those facts may may be.
 

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