Lumix G9: Any solution to video CAF problems?

Kawika Nui · Jan 24, 2019

Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Adrian Tung · Jan 25, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Thanks for doing the testing. Are you in Video mode (on the dial) and using the shutter button to shoot? Or are you using the video button to shoot?

I use the dedicated video mode.

Kawika Nui said:
I've tried using the shutter button to get the focus back and it works, but obviously it would be preferable to not lose focus in the first place.

I tested video again today, this time using the "custom" focus (a sort of diamond-shaped pattern of AF points). (I had previously used the "Center area" AF). Changing to "custom" didn't solve the problem; in fact in some cases it was worse if the camera got interested in something at the edge of the AF pattern.

I'm finding this very disappointing since I've had many different Panasonic cameras over the past years (GH3, GX6, GX7, GX85; FZ150, FZ300, ZS50, etc.) and NONE of them have been like this. Yes, there has been the occasional slight blur (quickly corrected) but not this back and forth from focus to slightly OoF.

I'm starting to think I got a defective unit; I may have to send it back.

Sorry can't help you with this one, when I use my G9 for video I typically either have Continuous AF with face detect, or go manual focus entirely so I have no experience with the other AF patterns.

Kawika Nui · Jan 25, 2019

Adrian Tung said:
Kawika Nui said:

Thanks for doing the testing. Are you in Video mode (on the dial) and using the shutter button to shoot? Or are you using the video button to shoot?

Click to expand...

I use the dedicated video mode.

Adrian Tung said:

I've tried using the shutter button to get the focus back and it works, but obviously it would be preferable to not lose focus in the first place.

I tested video again today, this time using the "custom" focus (a sort of diamond-shaped pattern of AF points). (I had previously used the "Center area" AF). Changing to "custom" didn't solve the problem; in fact in some cases it was worse if the camera got interested in something at the edge of the AF pattern.

I'm finding this very disappointing since I've had many different Panasonic cameras over the past years (GH3, GX6, GX7, GX85; FZ150, FZ300, ZS50, etc.) and NONE of them have been like this. Yes, there has been the occasional slight blur (quickly corrected) but not this back and forth from focus to slightly OoF.

I'm starting to think I got a defective unit; I may have to send it back.

Click to expand...

Sorry can't help you with this one, when I use my G9 for video I typically either have Continuous AF with face detect, or go manual focus entirely so I have no experience with the other AF patterns.

Thank you for taking the time to help me out and do some testing. Happy shooting!

G9 - frame from 4K video using Lumix 45-175mm@175mm with Ext Tele Conv

danieljcox · Jan 25, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Do you have the most current Firmware version 1.2 for the G9? I'm finding huge improvements to the video AF issue. Mine is actually working extremely well. Make sure you have the most current firmware update.

Adrian Tung · Jan 25, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
G9 - frame from 4K video using Lumix 45-175mm@175mm with Ext Tele Conv

Some thoughts now that we have some context to look at...

Perhaps in this situation the camera is struggling to find a target to latch onto, considering the relatively small subject and busy background immediately behind the subject. It's almost as difficult as a small bird in flight against busy background.

Not sure what the best settings would be for this, perhaps the bird shooters can give some advice.

Typically I deal with closer subjects where size and depth of field make it easy to distinguish subject from background, so I don't experience focusing issues such as yours.

Kawika Nui · Jan 26, 2019

danieljcox said:
Kawika Nui said:

Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Click to expand...

Do you have the most current Firmware version 1.2 for the G9?

Yes, I do. That was the first thing I checked.

danieljcox said:
I'm finding huge improvements to the video AF issue. Mine is actually working extremely well.

The beautiful photos on your site (BoF, etc.) are proof of that!

danieljcox said:
Make sure you have the most current firmware update.

I'm wondering if some Panny lenses don't work well with this camera? I've been using the 45-175mm, with latest (v. 1.2 also) firmware for the lens. That lens works beautifully with GH3, GX7, GX8 and GX85. Maybe I got a defective G9 unit.

Kawika Nui · Jan 26, 2019

Adrian Tung said:
Kawika Nui said:

G9 - frame from 4K video using Lumix 45-175mm@175mm with Ext Tele Conv

Click to expand...

Some thoughts now that we have some context to look at...

Perhaps in this situation the camera is struggling to find a target to latch onto, considering the relatively small subject and busy background immediately behind the subject. It's almost as difficult as a small bird in flight against busy background.

True, but I've never had this problem with GH3, GX7, GX8 or GX85. Nor with FZ150, FZ300 nor ZS50. The G9 was supposed to be better, and so far for me it has been worse. Also, the camera doesn't have to maintain focus on the surfer - the wave provides plenty of texture to easily focus on. (What's really hard is maintaining focus against a featureless background at some distance - like a pelican gliding over still water, especially with a little haze.)

Adrian Tung said:
Not sure what the best settings would be for this, perhaps the bird shooters can give some advice.

Typically I deal with closer subjects where size and depth of field make it easy to distinguish subject from background, so I don't experience focusing issues such as yours.

Kawika Nui · Jan 26, 2019

Here are sample frames from a video. In and out of focus; more out than in. These are all cropped to 800px height to make the surfer - and the focus problem - more clearly visible.

0.5sec - focus OK

1.0sec - OoF

4.9 sec - finally back in focus

5.9sec - OoF

6.3sec - back in focus

7.0sec - OoF

7.5sec - nicely focused on wave

jrsforums · Jan 26, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Here are sample frames from a video. In and out of focus; more out than in. These are all cropped to 800px height to make the surfer - and the focus problem - more clearly visible.

0.5sec - focus OK

1.0sec - OoF

4.9 sec - finally back in focus

5.9sec - OoF

6.3sec - back in focus

7.0sec - OoF

7.5sec - nicely focused on wave

I don’t do much video, but when I do I use back button focus (set at AF=ON) to set and adjust focus.

with the dof you show here, why would you use continuous AF? Particularly with tiny people and wide expanses of low contrast?

Kawika Nui · Jan 26, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

I seem to have solved the problem.

Set AF lever to AFS (Single).

Set Video AF to Continuous AF Off

Set Eye Sensor AF to On.

I'm an EVF shooter, so this works perfectly. Ended the problem.

Kawika Nui · Jan 26, 2019

jrsforums said:
Kawika Nui said:

Here are sample frames from a video. In and out of focus; more out than in. These are all cropped to 800px height to make the surfer - and the focus problem - more clearly visible.

0.5sec - focus OK

1.0sec - OoF

4.9 sec - finally back in focus

5.9sec - OoF

6.3sec - back in focus

7.0sec - OoF

7.5sec - nicely focused on wave

Click to expand...

I don’t do much video, but when I do I use back button focus (set at AF=ON) to set and adjust focus.

with the dof you show here, why would you use continuous AF?

Because if they get a long ride, they are coming toward the camera in a hurry. If they get a very long ride, they will practically fill the screen at the end of the ride.

And because CAF is supposed to work. If it works properly, why not leave it on and be ready for any moving subject? I might spot an osprey or a flight of pelicans coming toward me.

jrsforums said:
Particularly with tiny people and wide expanses of low contrast?

Adrian Tung · Jan 26, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Because if they get a long ride, they are coming toward the camera in a hurry. If they get a very long ride, they will practically fill the screen at the end of the ride.

And because CAF is supposed to work. If it works properly, why not leave it on and be ready for any moving subject? I might spot an osprey or a flight of pelicans coming toward me.

Just throwing this out but no idea how reliable it is... Have you tried the AF Tracking mode?

I just tested having it lock onto my lens cap and it seemed pretty "sticky", though I guess tracking a surfer is going to be a whole different scenario than waving a lens cap around in front of the camera.

Kawika Nui · Jan 26, 2019

Adrian Tung said:
Kawika Nui said:

Because if they get a long ride, they are coming toward the camera in a hurry. If they get a very long ride, they will practically fill the screen at the end of the ride.

And because CAF is supposed to work. If it works properly, why not leave it on and be ready for any moving subject? I might spot an osprey or a flight of pelicans coming toward me.

Click to expand...

Just throwing this out but no idea how reliable it is... Have you tried the AF Tracking mode?

I just tested having it lock onto my lens cap and it seemed pretty "sticky", though I guess tracking a surfer is going to be a whole different scenario than waving a lens cap around in front of the camera.

Tracking mode, according to most reviewers, does not work very well.

Anyhow, I solved the problem.

1. Turn off CAF in Video; set AF dial to AFS.

2. Turn on Eyepiece AF.

Problem solved as long as you shoot using the EVF for video, which is what I always do. (In fact that is one of the main reasons I went to mirrorless - can't stand shooting video outdoors in bright sun, using the screen.)

Thanks for your inputs!

Pete Berry · Jan 26, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Kawika Nui said:

Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Click to expand...

I seem to have solved the problem.

Set AF lever to AFS (Single).

Set Video AF to Continuous AF Off

Set Eye Sensor AF to On.

I'm an EVF shooter, so this works perfectly. Ended the problem.

G9 C-AF w/ C-AF on in menu and AF lever - 12-35/2.8-v1 @ 35mm f/2.8, 1/30, ISO 10,000, shooting 4K 60p. Rendered in 4K 30p (not slow-mo). The range about 2-20', but works very well in this very low-light situation. Used a mod large single area focus box - about 2/3 frame height. Panning around my cluttered studio lit by three much-dimmed ceiling spots, with corners barely visible. Auto WB (very good in G9) couldn't reach this very low color temp.

I thought the video IQ was pretty amazing with fine-grained noise and no macro-blocking at all in shadows - the usual curse of hi-ISO video - with very good color and lack of detail smearing which I wasn't expecting. In darkest areas able to reach a true 0,0,0 RGB black, which is the key to good color, and is generally over-run with noise by way short of this ISO.

And a couple of frame captures...

jrsforums · Jan 26, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Adrian Tung said:

Kawika Nui said:

Because if they get a long ride, they are coming toward the camera in a hurry. If they get a very long ride, they will practically fill the screen at the end of the ride.

And because CAF is supposed to work. If it works properly, why not leave it on and be ready for any moving subject? I might spot an osprey or a flight of pelicans coming toward me.

Click to expand...

Just throwing this out but no idea how reliable it is... Have you tried the AF Tracking mode?

I just tested having it lock onto my lens cap and it seemed pretty "sticky", though I guess tracking a surfer is going to be a whole different scenario than waving a lens cap around in front of the camera.

Click to expand...

Tracking mode, according to most reviewers, does not work very well.

Anyhow, I solved the problem.

1. Turn off CAF in Video; set AF dial to AFS.

2. Turn on Eyepiece AF.

Problem solved as long as you shoot using the EVF for video, which is what I always do. (In fact that is one of the main reasons I went to mirrorless - can't stand shooting video outdoors in bright sun, using the screen.)

Thanks for your inputs!

I am a bit confused by your “success”. Eye AF=on with AFS will acquire focus with each “activation”, much like pressing the half-shutter or back-button (with AF=on set). AFS will not continually refocus, but will hold current focus until reactivated. This is why I use back button as I can continually reactivate (reacquire focus) as the scene changes.

Maybe I a missing some other setting you have which makes this successful for you.

Kawika Nui · Jan 29, 2019

jrsforums said:
Kawika Nui said:

Adrian Tung said:

Kawika Nui said:

Because if they get a long ride, they are coming toward the camera in a hurry. If they get a very long ride, they will practically fill the screen at the end of the ride.

And because CAF is supposed to work. If it works properly, why not leave it on and be ready for any moving subject? I might spot an osprey or a flight of pelicans coming toward me.

Click to expand...

Just throwing this out but no idea how reliable it is... Have you tried the AF Tracking mode?

I just tested having it lock onto my lens cap and it seemed pretty "sticky", though I guess tracking a surfer is going to be a whole different scenario than waving a lens cap around in front of the camera.

Click to expand...

Tracking mode, according to most reviewers, does not work very well.

Anyhow, I solved the problem.

1. Turn off CAF in Video; set AF dial to AFS.

2. Turn on Eyepiece AF.

Problem solved as long as you shoot using the EVF for video, which is what I always do. (In fact that is one of the main reasons I went to mirrorless - can't stand shooting video outdoors in bright sun, using the screen.)

Thanks for your inputs!

Click to expand...

I am a bit confused by your “success”. Eye AF=on with AFS will acquire focus with each “activation”,

Right. And this stops the needless, random de-focusing and refocusing that the camera likes to do while shooting a moving subject that is maintaining a fairly constant distance (more or less infinity) from the camera (i.e., moving more or less across the field of view), as described in my original post.

jrsforums said:
much like pressing the half-shutter or back-button (with AF=on set). AFS will not continually refocus, but will hold current focus until reactivated. This is why I use back button as I can continually reactivate (reacquire focus) as the scene changes.

Maybe I a missing some other setting you have which makes this successful for you.

Kawika Nui · Jan 29, 2019

Pete Berry said:
Kawika Nui said:

Kawika Nui said:

Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Click to expand...

I seem to have solved the problem.

Set AF lever to AFS (Single).

Set Video AF to Continuous AF Off

Set Eye Sensor AF to On.

I'm an EVF shooter, so this works perfectly. Ended the problem.

Click to expand...

G9 C-AF w/ C-AF on in menu and AF lever - 12-35/2.8-v1 @ 35mm f/2.8, 1/30, ISO 10,000, shooting 4K 60p. Rendered in 4K 30p (not slow-mo). The range about 2-20', but works very well in this very low-light situation. Used a mod large single area focus box - about 2/3 frame height. Panning around my cluttered studio

Yes, the CAF works quite well for situations involving changing distances between camera and subject. However, my original post dealt with something quite different: the G9's habit of arbitrary and random de-focusing and refocusing while shooting a subject where there is little or no change of distance between camera and subject.

Pete Berry said:
lit by three much-dimmed ceiling spots, with corners barely visible. Auto WB (very good in G9) couldn't reach this very low color temp.

I thought the video IQ was pretty amazing with fine-grained noise and no macro-blocking at all in shadows - the usual curse of hi-ISO video - with very good color and lack of detail smearing which I wasn't expecting. In darkest areas able to reach a true 0,0,0 RGB black, which is the key to good color, and is generally over-run with noise by way short of this ISO.

And a couple of frame captures...

jrsforums · Jan 29, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
jrsforums said:

Kawika Nui said:

Adrian Tung said:

Kawika Nui said:

Because if they get a long ride, they are coming toward the camera in a hurry. If they get a very long ride, they will practically fill the screen at the end of the ride.

And because CAF is supposed to work. If it works properly, why not leave it on and be ready for any moving subject? I might spot an osprey or a flight of pelicans coming toward me.

Click to expand...

Just throwing this out but no idea how reliable it is... Have you tried the AF Tracking mode?

I just tested having it lock onto my lens cap and it seemed pretty "sticky", though I guess tracking a surfer is going to be a whole different scenario than waving a lens cap around in front of the camera.

Click to expand...

Tracking mode, according to most reviewers, does not work very well.

Anyhow, I solved the problem.

1. Turn off CAF in Video; set AF dial to AFS.

2. Turn on Eyepiece AF.

Problem solved as long as you shoot using the EVF for video, which is what I always do. (In fact that is one of the main reasons I went to mirrorless - can't stand shooting video outdoors in bright sun, using the screen.)

Thanks for your inputs!

Click to expand...

I am a bit confused by your “success”. Eye AF=on with AFS will acquire focus with each “activation”,

Click to expand...

Right. And this stops the needless, random de-focusing and refocusing that the camera likes to do while shooting a moving subject that is maintaining a fairly constant distance (more or less infinity) from the camera (i.e., moving more or less across the field of view), as described in my original post.

Kawika Nui said:

much like pressing the half-shutter or back-button (with AF=on set). AFS will not continually refocus, but will hold current focus until reactivated. This is why I use back button as I can continually reactivate (reacquire focus) as the scene changes.

Maybe I a missing some other setting you have which makes this successful for you.

Click to expand...

What stops it is turning CAF off. Eye AF has nothing to do with it. You do, however, lose control of when AF takes place, for example, if you take eye away and then look back.

If you only want to focus once, leave it on shutter half press. AF during video is only AFS, not AFF or AFC.

If you want control, put it on back button

Chris renato · Jan 29, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Check version your camera to update. Use only panasonic lenses to get dfd optimized.

Use fast lenses, zoom 2.8 or prime 1.7 below.

Avoid low light poor light situation.

Do use shoot pervy, it will be fast focus

kidding

colin finn · Apr 3, 2019

I had this problem too wth the video focus constantly shifting. I downloaded the latest firmware 1.2 and this has completely solved the problem.

NorCal Jim · Apr 3, 2019

Kawika Nui said:
Kawika Nui said:

Recently got a G9 and have been playing with it to get used to it and see how it performs.

I was surprised and disappointed to find major deficiencies with the video CAF (shooting mp4, 1080/60p). In a very simple shooting environment, the camera kept defocusing and refocusing for no reason. There is almost no movement toward or away from the camera, and the distance is close to infinity anyway. The video starts in focus, then arbitrarily moves out of focus and back a couple of times - all in a very short time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for fixing this?

Click to expand...

I seem to have solved the problem.

Set AF lever to AFS (Single).

Set Video AF to Continuous AF Off

Set Eye Sensor AF to On.

I'm an EVF shooter, so this works perfectly. Ended the problem.

I just started reading this thread and had to smile when I reached this post since I have similar good results using AF-S with my Olympus cameras. I enjoy the lightning fast AF-S and have avoided the AF-C. I have also run across the occasional YouTube video with hints on how to maximize AF in video. I still need to do some additional testing with my EM5ii & Pen-F but am encouraged with what I am seeing so far when making short topical video clips when I am in front of the camera.

Previously, I had great results from my Sony a5100 when I am in front of the camera for short videos (never loses focus). Of course, I need to keep it short so it won't overheat.

I am very interested in the Sony a6400 which significantly raises the AF bar and has some crazy sticky eye AF and focus tracking with no overheating issues. I have continued to depend on Sony for video but would love to consolidate my camera resources in MFT. I much prefer the handling of my Olympus cameras to Sony and only use Sony these days for video.

Jim

Lumix G9: Any solution to video CAF problems?

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